2008.06.20 19:00 - Structure vs. Spontaneity

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    That evening, when I came to the Pavilion, I found Terri waiting there. Adams soon came in as well.

    Pema Pera: Hi Terri!
    Terri Holrych: this is nice i like the windchimes a lot
    Adams Rubble: Yes
    Terri Holrych: hi pema
    Adams Rubble: Hi Pema
    Pema Pera: Hi Adams
    Pema Pera: Hi again, Terri
    Terri Holrych: looks like i missed a lot
    Terri Holrych: this is so sweet
    Pema Pera: It’s a nice place, that Dakini built for us, don’t you think?
    Terri Holrych: wow she is so talented
    Pema Pera: she and Storm really know how to sculpt the area, in many ways
    Terri Holrych: :)
    Terri Holrych: i am practicing
    Pema Pera: and Moon and Fael also have made great contributions
    Terri Holrych: i built a litle thing
    Terri Holrych: just for practice
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hi there
    Terri Holrych: its like a summer camp
    Adams Rubble: Hi Fred
    Terri Holrych: for dharma
    Pema Pera: Hi Fred!
    Terri Holrych: not nearly this sweet tho
    Terri Holrych: hi fried
    Terri Holrych: :)
    Pema Pera: It’s a matter of having the time and energy and interest to invest in learning the skills and practicing them. I’d love to learn — just don’t have the time right now
    Terri Holrych: i stay up all nite
    Pema Pera: It must be so nice to have all those skills in your fingertips, so to speak
    Terri Holrych: lol when i start building a i cant stop
    Terri Holrych: i mean its addictive
    Terri Holrych: or zenlike
    Terri Holrych: i dunno which
    Pia Iger: Hi, all.
    Terri Holrych: hi pia
    Pema Pera: Hi Pia!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: g’evening
    Adams Rubble: Hi Pia

    Fred and Pia showed up, followed by Dakini.

    Terri Holrych: hi Dakini
    Dakini Rhode: hi!
    Adams Rubble: Hi Dakini
    Pia Iger: Hi,Dakini,
    Pema Pera: Greetings, Dakini!
    Terri Holrych: :)
    Dakini Rhode: may i join you for a few minutes?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hi dakini
    Pema Pera: what a question!
    Pema Pera: haha
    Dakini Rhode: haha well the question was about the “few minutes”
    Pema Pera: you should have heard all the praise you have gotten about this building, the last 24 hours
    Terri Holrych: its so pretty
    Dakini Rhode: oh my don’t tell me
    Terri Holrych: u are so talented
    Pema Pera: we are (reluctantly) willing to let you go any time Dakini!
    Terri Holrych: lets give her an ego
    Dakini Rhode: I’m so glad ppl like it
    Terri Holrych: haha
    Terri Holrych: :)
    FX1-Black V1.0 (High Prim)_v4: Must clear coffee cups before making another.
    Dakini Rhode: i’m just incredibly tired tonight, but wanted to say hi
    Terri Holrych: hi
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. i just woke up from a nap…
    Dakini Rhode: hi all around
    Pia Iger: I know what you mean.
    Terri Holrych: well i’ll send u some energy
    Dakini Rhode: meh. I’ve been running from meeting to meeting all day
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: terri:- i could guess, or wait for the blog post, but what were you talking about practicing?
    Adams Rubble: It’s been a long day in SL
    Terri Holrych: :(
    Terri Holrych: what kind of meetings
    Dakini Rhode: here, there, and everywhere
    Dakini Rhode: RL / SL

    The conversation moved to SL activities.

    Terri Holrych: i was practicing moving dirt on SL
    Terri Holrych: i learned how to dig a hole
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: great! I am prety sure I don’t have one of those in my inventory
    Pia Iger: what for?
    Terri Holrych: to put a lake there
    Terri Holrych: but it looks weird
    Terri Holrych: lol
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh. i was happy w/ the hole
    Terri Holrych: um ok
    Terri Holrych: i love the windchimes
    Terri Holrych: they are so pretty
    Dakini Rhode: we have Adams to thank for those
    Terri Holrych: thanks Adams
    Windchime Bronze 12: Friedrich Ochsenhorn picked the option ‘Sounds’.
    Windchime Bronze 12: Friedrich Ochsenhorn picked the option ‘Sound 1′.
    FX1-Black V1.0 (High Prim)_v4: Must clear coffee cups before making another.
    Adams Rubble: :)
    FX1-Black V1.0 (High Prim)_v4 whispers: Coffee Machine ready for use.
    Terri Holrych: haha
    Terri Holrych: wow

    And on to avatars.

    Dakini Rhode: have ppl seen the new default avatars?
    Pema Pera: ?
    Adams Rubble: I don;t know what they are
    Terri Holrych: i havent tried them on
    Windchime Bronze 12: Friedrich Ochsenhorn picked the option ‘Volume’.
    Terri Holrych: but i read the blog
    Windchime Bronze 12: Friedrich Ochsenhorn picked the option ‘100%’.
    Dakini Rhode: when we were new, we could choose from a few primitive avatars for our look
    Terri Holrych: is this one i have ok
    Dakini Rhode: SL just came out with a lot of attractive default avatars
    Dakini Rhode: they should all be in our library
    Terri Holrych: i got a custom skin
    Dakini Rhode: under “clothing”
    Pia Iger: yes. I read it on website too.
    Terri Holrych: i have so many outfits already
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: as someone who hasn’t modified my apperance much, i must say its quite weird running into a doppleganger
    Terri Holrych: that i made
    Pema Pera: it works retroactivly?
    Pema Pera: so we get it into our libraries too?
    Adams Rubble: Hi Taigh
    Taigh String: hello
    Terri Holrych: what
    Pema Pera: Hi Taigh
    Pema Pera: come join us
    Pema Pera: Have you been here before?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: enough to make me want to spend some time in front of the mirror
    Pia Iger: Hi, Taigh.
    Terri Holrych: hi taigh
    Taigh String: hello everyone
    Taigh String: namaste
    Taigh String: :)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: Hey!
    Terri Holrych: whats a doplleganger again
    Dakini Rhode: hello Taigh!
    Taigh String: hello

    Taigh had joined us, and I pointed to the PaB blog.

    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: a clone
    Pema Pera: Taigh, is this your first time here in this group?
    Taigh String: yes
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (i spelled it wrong though)
    Taigh String: I have been traveling
    Taigh String: and am weary
    Pema Pera: this is a Play as Being meeting, http://playasbeing.wordpress.com/
    Pema Pera: is our web site
    Terri Holrych: where did u go taigh
    Pema Pera: so if you like to know more details, it’s all there :)
    Taigh String: thank you pema
    Terri Holrych: gee i wouldnt want to be a clone
    Pema Pera: we get together here four times a day
    Terri Holrych: lol
    Taigh String: well I am new here, to 2nd life, and have been wandering aimlessly
    Pema Pera: 1 and 7, am and pm
    Terri Holrych: aww i am new too
    Pema Pera: and we don’t use voice here normally
    Taigh String: thats fine
    Pema Pera: oldfashioned typing :)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: *doppleganger. I actually have a unique name in RL, which is catching on with kids, and I am starting to hear it more often, not directed to me
    Taigh String: i needed solace, it sounded peaceful
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: a little similar to running into another default avatar, for me
    Terri Holrych: well i spent 2000 lindens on the skin and shape
    Terri Holrych: that i have
    Terri Holrych: lol
    Terri Holrych: greedy of me i know
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: looks good
    Terri Holrych: thanks
    Terri Holrych: i am so vain
    Terri Holrych: hey taigh
    Taigh String: yes
    Terri Holrych: where ya goin
    Terri Holrych: ;p
    Taigh String: looking around
    Taigh String: :)
    Terri Holrych: okee
    Pema Pera: bye Taigh!

    Taigh was about to leave, but had another question about the area.

    Terri Holrych: i thought maye i skeered ya
    Taigh String: who is the person guarding the entrance?
    Terri Holrych: lol
    Taigh String: no not at all, you all seem very nice
    Terri Holrych: guarding?
    Taigh String: well, standing there
    Terri Holrych: where
    Taigh String: where I transported, near the statue
    Pema Pera: btw, Taigh, do you mind if we include these conversations in our blog — just wanna check
    Taigh String: oh, I suppose thats fine
    Taigh String: am I interrupting
    Pema Pera: thanks :)
    Taigh String: ?
    Pema Pera: not at all
    Pema Pera: people always coming and going here
    Dakini Rhode: not sure where you transported, Taigh
    Terri Holrych: it was prolly just someone adoring the statue
    Taigh String: near the statue, over there
    Terri Holrych: the giant buddha?
    Dakini Rhode: the kuan yin statue?
    Taigh String: yes
    Terri Holrych: o
    Dakini Rhode: then, which buddha?
    Dakini Rhode: hmmm
    Taigh String: hmm, well Im not sure, I guess there is more than one
    Dakini Rhode: anyway, no guards…
    Terri Holrych: there is one dot on my map not in our group
    Taigh String: I came right over when I saw there was a group
    Taigh String: I thought you might be meditating
    Taigh String: :)
    Terri Holrych: probably just chilling over there
    Dakini Rhode: we meditate at the zendo every day
    Dakini Rhode: at 6PM
    Taigh String: Im going to look around…
    Dakini Rhode: near where that one dot is
    Taigh String: familiarize
    Dakini Rhode: kk
    Taigh String: yes, thats where I came in
    Dakini Rhode: ah!
    Terri Holrych: ttyl

    The talk then went into various directions.

    Dakini Rhode: has a bit of a cough
    Terri Holrych: oh i hope u feel better
    Dakini Rhode: why not to use voice…
    Dakini Rhode: Taigh does…
    Dakini Rhode: not i
    Terri Holrych: oh i couldnt hear him i have mine turned off
    Terri Holrych: i only turn it on for lectures or stuff
    Terri Holrych: there is a buddhist monk on SL now
    Terri Holrych: Kusala
    Terri Holrych: he’s neat
    Terri Holrych: fried is ur face black or am i dreaming
    Pia Iger: did you talk with him?
    Terri Holrych: yes
    Terri Holrych: he invited me into his group
    Terri Holrych: and took me to his virtual temple with some other students
    Terri Holrych: and gives notecards every day
    Terri Holrych: called the daily dharma
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i have a beard…
    Terri Holrych: usually from the dhamma pada
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: which, i learned is a tatoo on this skin that i can’t easily change
    Terri Holrych: oh fried ur whole head looks black but its prolly my year old laptop
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: blah. one of these weeks i’ll manage to shave.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i cna’t believe i have to worry about that here!
    Terri Holrych: rofl
    Terri Holrych: LMAO
    Terri Holrych: goes right along with Pemas paper
    Terri Holrych: LOL
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, thank dakini for the incense too - i am sure i stink too

    Solo walked in.

    Terri Holrych: hi solobill
    Solobill Laville: Hello all
    Terri Holrych: omg fried
    Adams Rubble: Hello Solobill
    Pema Pera: Hi Solo!
    Solobill Laville: :)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: Hey!
    Pia Iger: Hi, Solo
    Pia Iger: what are the blue/white spiral outside?
    Pema Pera: Storm is marking off river flow
    Terri Holrych: cute things
    Pema Pera: where the river will be
    Pema Pera: to change the landscape accordingly
    Terri Holrych: ooh
    Pia Iger: oh.
    Pema Pera: he created the moat around the pavilion yesterday
    Pia Iger: something to look forward too. I like the moat
    Pema Pera: so now our bridges have a meaning :)
    Dakini Rhode: if you will excuse me…. i’m very sorry i cannot keep my eyes open tonite
    Terri Holrych: i thought they were those things in shinto shrines that hang from trees
    Taigh String: lots of interesting things here
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: surveying? i would love to watch him build someday
    Solobill Laville: G’night, D!
    Dakini Rhode: nite :-)
    Adams Rubble: Bye Dakini, Have a good sleep :)
    Pia Iger: night, D.
    Dakini Rhode: ty
    Pema Pera: Night, Dakini!
    Terri Holrych: gnite dakini

    Dakini took off, and so did Taigh.

    Taigh String: thank you all for your hospitality
    Terri Holrych: :)
    Pia Iger: Adams, you spent whole day in SL?
    Adams Rubble: Not the whole day…off and on
    Terri Holrych: i do it all the time while i work my other job
    Terri Holrych: im baaadddlllyy addicted
    Pema Pera: I have to leave too
    Terri Holrych: but i would die of boredome
    Pia Iger: I only can do it a few hours.
    Terri Holrych: ok
    Pema Pera: good seeing you all here in this new place!
    Solobill Laville: Pema, I think I have the log you’re looking for
    Adams Rubble: bye Pema
    Terri Holrych: loves it Pema
    Terri Holrych: peace
    Pema Pera: wonderful!

    We talk about making chat logs

    Solobill Laville: I just dont’ know how to find old logs…
    Solobill Laville: anyone?
    Terri Holrych: im going to explore
    Terri Holrych: logs?
    Pema Pera: do you have chat log saving enabled by default?
    Solobill Laville: Chat logs / chat histories
    Pema Pera: into one big file?
    Solobill Laville: THAT, is a good question…
    Terri Holrych: oh i didnt know we could save chat
    Solobill Laville: dunno
    Solobill Laville: :)
    Solobill Laville: I can look on-line for a tutorial
    Pia Iger: he is kidding
    Terri Holrych: or u could copy and paste
    Terri Holrych: ?
    Pema Pera: if you go to preferences, Solo
    Pema Pera: and then to communication,
    Pema Pera: can you open that window?
    Solobill Laville: yep
    Pema Pera: it says in the middle, on a blue button “change path”
    Pema Pera: do you see that?
    Solobill Laville: yep
    Pema Pera: Follow that is the name of the file in which all your chats are logged
    Solobill Laville: Wow!!!
    Pema Pera: if you open that file — don’t have to do ir right now
    Terri Holrych: kool
    Solobill Laville: OK, will do
    Terri Holrych: now i can log too
    Pema Pera: then you get everything you have ever said since you started logging
    Solobill Laville: Jeepers!
    Pema Pera: and you can select the Tuesday 1 pm log
    Pema Pera: part
    Terri Holrych: could be incriminating LOL
    Pema Pera: I strongly suggest that once a month or so you rename the file
    Terri Holrych: kool
    Solobill Laville: Uh, yes, good advice
    Pema Pera: so that if you accidentily delete it
    Pema Pera: you don’t lose your whole SL history :)
    Solobill Laville: Thanks for the tip!
    Terri Holrych: thanks
    Pema Pera: as soon as you rename it a new file will be created with the same old name
    Pema Pera: but better to do this renaming in between SL sessions, not during
    Pema Pera: okay, bye all!
    Solobill Laville: OK
    Terri Holrych: peace yall
    Solobill Laville: Bye
    Adams Rubble: bye
    Terri Holrych: bye
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: cya
    Pia Iger: bye.
    Pema Pera: oh!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: saving logs w/ timestamps is probably a good idea too
    Pema Pera: can someone send me the log of the rest of teh session?
    Pia Iger: sure.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: they are easy to remove, but impossible to reconstruct not saved initially
    Pema Pera: Thank you, Pia!
    Pia Iger: true.

    I left, and later Pia would send me the rest of the chat log. The comments are mine.

    Solobill Laville: Thanks for the lm to Assisi Adams
    Solobill Laville: it was a great field trip!
    Adams Rubble: you are welcome-did you all go last night?
    Solobill Laville: oh, yeah
    Adams Rubble: It is quite a reconstruction
    Solobill Laville: We have a great pic in the cathedral for the log
    Adams Rubble: I can’t wait to see
    Solobill Laville: ;)
    Pia Iger: I enjoy the trip with group.
    Solobill Laville: It was a first: PaB field trip!
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Pia Iger: Yeeeh.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: did you have to get permission slips signed?
    Adams Rubble: hehe
    Solobill Laville: I did
    Adams Rubble: hehe
    Pia Iger: ??
    Pia Iger: who sign?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (kidding - you need them for all school field trips in the US)
    Solobill Laville: yes :)
    Solobill Laville: But I did bring my backpack!
    Pia Iger: oh. even went with teacher?
    Solobill Laville: yep
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yes. we are a very litigious society…
    Solobill Laville: excacltly what I was typing, Fred
    Solobill Laville: too true, sadly

    From school children’s trips back to Adams’ blog, and onto twitter.

    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so Adams, i was peeking at your blog - you’re working hard!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: very impressive
    Adams Rubble: Thanks
    Adams Rubble: I have spurts and stops
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: how do you take notes? do you carry around a small notebook and pen everywhere?
    Adams Rubble: No I use the computer…three computers :)
    Pia Iger: interesting.
    Adams Rubble: one here, one there and one someplace else :)
    Pia Iger: so you can write everywhere.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: it has occured to me that we are culturally recreating twitter
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Pia Iger: twitter?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: a popular web services here in the us, where people share short, stream of consciousness blurbs with the world
    Adams Rubble: My blof IS a bit like stream of consciousness
    Adams Rubble: blog
    Pia Iger: Fred, do you do research of on-line behaviors?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: investigative research ;-)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sorta. i dabble.

    The conversation went to the guide lines that Fred had mentioned in the guardian email group.

    Pia Iger: I like your points of our meeting guidelines, etc.
    Pia Iger: I think it would be better for us to have some structure in meetings.
    Solobill Laville: I wonder…
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh, thanks. i didn’t personally develop those. the peer support group Icarus worked hard on them
    Solobill Laville: Sometimes I think yes, more structure
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: they aren’t meant to be formal, just an easy way for the faciliator to redirect the meeting if it starts going astray
    Solobill Laville: But it is also nice to follow the threads we create here
    Adams Rubble: I didn;t they were so much structure as guidelines for inclusion and sensitivity to participants
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: thanks. yeah, they weren’t agendas, just guidelines and points of departure
    Adams Rubble: Much like Pema and Storm do already, and others
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, I can attest that in those groups, i saw them come in handy often
    Solobill Laville: Fred, did you post something about that?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but yes, they are quite masterful about that
    Adams Rubble hopes she didn’t leave anyone out
    Pia Iger: I just think we spent a good hour here. maybe it helps for us to deepen conversation, or focus.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: solobill - sorry, this is what we are talking about: http://theicarusproject.net/community/meeting-preramble
    Solobill Laville: thx
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: the project happens to relate, IMHO, but their meeting guidlines were what I was sharing, and thinking could apply, as pretty much is, directly here
    Solobill Laville: Oh, I did read this
    Solobill Laville: THis was more of a vision for listening and being open
    Adams Rubble: We’ll be discussing it on Sunday I understand
    Solobill Laville: in a supportive group setting, no?
    Adams Rubble: yes
    Solobill Laville: Or are there other guidelines?
    Solobill Laville: OK
    Solobill Laville: These are really remarkable, Fred
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: that’s what i was talking about. i guess there have been meetings with mild tension
    Adams Rubble: yes they are
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: not at any i have been at
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and, I suggested these. I too, need to review them often
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i find them personally helpful
    Adams Rubble: I put them on a notecard
    Solobill Laville: I think that haveing a “beginner’s mind” really helps me
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: aww - that’s inspirational. thanks! The Icarus folks will be really flattered
    Solobill Laville: ;)

    Pia brings up another possible way to focus the discussions in the group.

    Pia Iger: Also Pema is thinking to have 2 or 3 people talk in first 30min , then group discussion.
    Pia Iger: so we can really go deeper in one subject, so to speak.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. just when the slots are starting to fill out, the responsibility grows ;-)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sorry, was that cynical?
    Pia Iger: we need that cynical!!
    Pia Iger: :0
    Solobill Laville: Pema can pilot it, Fred!
    Solobill Laville: the bleeding edge…
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: more power to him/us! This community has shown remakrable growth, so i wont underestimate it
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i just have some experience with how hard it is to get folks to commit to presenting/speaking/being on the spot
    Solobill Laville: No, it should be completely voluntary
    Pia Iger: yes, people suppose to volunteer.
    Adams Rubble: I see it both ways
    Pia Iger: how?
    Adams Rubble: that there is real value in the free form we have had
    Adams Rubble: and that structure might provide more depth to the discussion
    Adams Rubble: spontanaity (sp) on the one hand
    Adams Rubble: and less wasted time on the other
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i agree, on the both ways. spontenaity is beautiful, but sometimes it scatters in the wind. bredth vs. depth sometimes, too.
    Solobill Laville: Perhaps we’re growing towards a topical session structure
    Solobill Laville: different things at different times
    Solobill Laville: or different guardians
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: meta meta meta. we can always return to the present and eternal if we prefer
    Pia Iger: yes, different session, different format.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: now that we have brought up the spector of “wasted” time ;-)
    Adams Rubble: of course different people show up at different times and it is hard to anticpate their needs at that time
    Adams Rubble: at any one time
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: for me, its less the structure vs. unstructure, than the repitition.
    Solobill Laville: I think that may get back to Fred’s Icarus code of conduct perhaps
    Adams Rubble: you see too much repitition?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: there is beauty in repitition too, and the zen of recovering similar ground
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: not exactly

    Fred talked about his PaB experience.

    Adams Rubble: How long have you been in PaB Fred?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: technically, i guess since the start - april 1, but i would say I am a part timer
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, cut it in half or thirds?
    Adams Rubble: I imagine that each of newbies go over the same ground
    Solobill Laville: yes
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: actually, i ahve only really been aiming for a pause an hour, so quarters
    Adams Rubble: of us
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: dont get me wrong, i dont mind that one bit
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, it would be nice to build on our shared wisdom/experience. and we do
    Solobill Laville: I agree Fred
    Adams Rubble: I just haven’t experienced the repitition yet
    Adams Rubble: silliness
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, i will admit that i started getting a bit restless, and found the posts of meetings i wasnt out less compelling
    Solobill Laville: and with that agreement, good night to you all!
    Adams Rubble: I can understand that
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: gnight!
    Pia Iger: good night, Solo.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, i get restless easily.
    Adams Rubble: goodnight Solo
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: something i can/should work on here, if i decide to
    Solobill Laville: bye for now!

    Solo left.

    Adams Rubble: Of course, one can bring up new topics
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (i should probably get going soon too)
    Adams Rubble: and they probably wou;d get discussed
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: no doubt.
    Adams Rubble: Yes I am very tired and should go to bed
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: anyway PaB has been an incredible experience for me
    Adams Rubble: Yes, me too
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: it has really helped me reorient my perspective around some fundamental concerns in my life

    Always glad to hear how PaB has made a difference!

    Pia Iger: oh, that is interesting,
    Pia Iger: we can talk about that next time.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, as far as new topics are concerned, i am somewhat unsure if they are appropriate
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i dont ussually hang out with this many buddists ;-)
    Adams Rubble: One way to find out is to bring them up and see if they get discussed :)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: :-)
    Adams Rubble: You did have a bit of trouble with us all the other night though
    Pia Iger: I did not notice?
    Adams Rubble: I think we had trouble grasping the subject (no pun intended)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: not sure if i did either… what kind of trouble did i get into this time
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh, right
    Adams Rubble: tghen it began to get out of hand
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yeah… that night i was trying to broach the topic of inter-subjectivity
    Adams Rubble: yes and we did not understand yet
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, didn’t quite make it to the ‘inter’ part
    Adams Rubble: :)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. well, at least i tried.
    Pia Iger: It shows how “being” interpreted differently by individuals.
    Adams Rubble: It might have gone differently with a different group
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so,there i am, wondering if it was a topic best left for another group
    Adams Rubble: you should keep trying
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: its not like being and suchness have been exhusted
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ;-)
    Adams Rubble: no different people, not group
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, thanks for the encouragment
    Pia Iger: not at all, I think we can explore all kinds of topics/
    Adams Rubble: yes, I agree

    A brief discussion of philosophy.

    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: this is where i hav been getting my philosophy fix, but that’s not why everyone is here
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i really need to take the icaurs guidlines to heart!
    Adams Rubble: I must confess I am very poor when it comes to philosophy
    Adams Rubble: Fred, we all do
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i disagree ;-)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but anyway, its a first love of mine
    Pia Iger: to me, Philosophy, religion, spritual has some common ground.
    Adams Rubble: yes they do Pia
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and the style i was trained in, wested analytical, is somewhat at odds with the style of discourse in this lovely place
    Pia Iger: I like to hear different voices here.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i mean, i have dabbled in other traditions too, but i spent years with aggressive, argumentative, thinkers
    Adams Rubble: see you lose me quickly with philosophical vocabulary
    Pia Iger: So bring it on. we like to hear your angles. Pls come often.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. for me, “virtual worlds as phenomenological laboratories” was the bait ;-)
    Adams Rubble: Now I must go. Pia are we done as far as the log is concerned?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: that’s how PaB was described, at one point
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: cool - one of you have it?
    Pia Iger: Yes.Adams.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: great. G’night!

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