2008.08.27 07:00 - Dogs Like to Bark

Hey There, this is Cal and here's what we talked about in this session.

Hello there, we're in the same boat...

Connected
Adams Rubble: Hi Cal :)
Caledonia Heron: hey Adams :)
Caledonia Heron: [rezzing]
Adams Rubble: Sl is very annoying this morning :)
Caledonia Heron: yeah, having a bit of trouble getting in
Caledonia Heron: sec, it's settling in
Caledonia Heron: I see your grey form but no details
Adams Rubble: That is good because I have been going into various forms of undress since I got here
Adams Rubble: Hi Maxine :)
Caledonia Heron: lol , and here I thought it was a form of being :)
Adams Rubble: hehe
Caledonia Heron: hey Maxine :)
Maxine Walden: hi, guys, having a bit of lag getting in
Caledonia Heron: we too
Adams Rubble: Yes, things are bad today :)
Maxine Walden: all in the same boat

The many worlds we've inhabited over time, they are as virtual as the one we meet in today...

Caledonia Heron: we'll sit very still today :)
Maxine Walden: right
Adams Rubble: Like doing email in the late 1980s
Caledonia Heron: lol, remember bitnet ?
Caledonia Heron: gosh, seems like the stone age
Adams Rubble: missed that one
Maxine Walden: was that an age ago?
Caledonia Heron: a darpa system....
Caledonia Heron: if I remember correctly
Maxine Walden: I'm not familiar with the really early stuff; was in a different world then
Caledonia Heron: lol, funny to think of how many worlds we've inhabited along our way
Adams Rubble: Yes
Maxine Walden: isn't it, many worlds and at the time, seemed like only one or so
Caledonia Heron: coffee - 2 secs
Adams Rubble: My computer life has gone through many transformations
Maxine Walden: has it, software wise or...?
Caledonia Heron: b
Adams Rubble: software, hardware, usage...

In a previous technology galaxy, far far away...

(and on the cozier comment, I notice sometimes that when people move-in closer to one another when talking this has a real, concrete effect of connectedness for me and yet we are still in the very same city/chair/wherever we are in RL. )

Caledonia Heron: that's cozier :)
Maxine Walden: transformations
Caledonia Heron: eras for sure
Caledonia Heron: I remember I was running a reference dept and a physics nobel laureate came with two post-docs to learn how to use the new-fangled fax machine
Maxine Walden: interesting to try to just 'be' aware that we may be going again into different worlds
Adams Rubble: :)
Caledonia Heron: hilarious, literally in white coats
Adams Rubble: whoa
Maxine Walden: Wow, what an interesting memory!!

Engaging with our friends who may be in different places in their lives...

Caledonia Heron: yes, for sure Maxine, different worlds, different dreams, friends, hopes :)
Maxine Walden: yes, and to be able to just stay in the moment, not sure what world comes next...very intriguing
Adams Rubble: Keep reinventing our work habits
Maxine Walden: yes, work habits and some of our living habits too, perhaps
Caledonia Heron: we can practice (like 9sec) to be in the moment, and another thing when engaging with other people who have vested perspectives
Maxine Walden: indeed
Maxine Walden: I just last evening had an experience with an old colleague, longtime colleague, who to my mind is caught in the same patterns/concerns for the past decade, and it was interesting
Adams Rubble: I am finding this interesting. I am in very calm waters right now. It is interesting to compare this to the changing world of technology. To be too calm is to fall behind
Adams Rubble: We are on a similar thread Maxine
Caledonia Heron: calm and complacent are different imo
Maxine Walden: to see that I am in a really diffeent pace, not as concerned as he is and I was...yes, Adams seems so
Adams Rubble: yes Cal
Adams Rubble: But with technology we must always keep one eye on the changes
Caledonia Heron: yes, you can notice being in different places than firends, resisting the urge to "fix" them :) by being ourselves we can offer a window to a way of looking at things I think
Adams Rubble: yes cal
Caledonia Heron: lol, those old tired sayings like "lead by example" come into play
Adams Rubble: :)

A little meta-discussion...

Maxine Walden: just need to mention it may be my computer, but each of you is a flashing figure on my screen, maybe this is my 'different world' of the moment, at least my computer would say so
Caledonia Heron: ok, thx Maxine - maybe relog?
Adams Rubble: SL is not very good today. I always find if I zoom in the flashing discontinues
Maxine Walden: so I can keep my awareness of your avatars in the midst of flashings...another challenge but not difficult
Caledonia Heron: we're ready for our closeup Maxine :)
Adams Rubble: I get the flashing at the Zen Retreat meditation and just ignore it
Maxine Walden: thanks, Adams, I will try that, oh, yes, it cleared, thanks, up close as I never have been
Adams Rubble: lots of people there
Adams Rubble: :)

On the state of our 9sec experiences and dog whispering ...

Caledonia Heron: what's been going on with y'alls 9sec?
Adams Rubble: I am calm. Nothing too much. Had some empathy for my neighbor's dog today
Caledonia Heron: [I know you keep blogs, only have so many cycles...sorry]
Adams Rubble: Pema has me doing the APAPB exercise that he gave to Doug
Caledonia Heron: lol, like homework huh?
Adams Rubble: :)
Maxine Walden: Adams, remind me of that suggestion of Pema's
Adams Rubble: empathy is the wrong word, probably compassion for the little dog brain that can only bard at the presentation of appearance
Caledonia Heron: I think the exercise is to ... appreciate the presence of appearance as a presentation by Being .... yes Adams?
Adams Rubble: yes
Adams Rubble: Slightly different way of seeing
Maxine Walden: ah, yes, thanks, the A stands for appearance
Adams Rubble: interesting Shakespearean typo---bark at presentation
Caledonia Heron: ah, now that is interesting.... a dog imo is near the essence of "be", probably all animals other than humans :)
Caledonia Heron: everything "is"
Adams Rubble was wondering about dog seeing exercise dsbs
Adams Rubble: But this dog is disturbed Cal
Caledonia Heron: how so? and maybe that's his "is"
Adams Rubble: This dog can bark for four hours straight. he barks at anything and everything
Maxine Walden: right, frustrating for us, but maybe not for him, the dog
Caledonia Heron: lol, care to branch into dog psychology Maxine ? :)
Adams Rubble: :)
Caledonia Heron: needs not being met ... etc
Adams Rubble: yes Cal
Maxine Walden: yes, dogs seem quite expressive of needs, wishes for the pack etc, at least in my limited experience
Caledonia Heron: yes agreed, it's all about the pack

Compassion and appreciation...

Adams Rubble: It is a sign of my calmness that I am able to listen to the dog and feel compassion for his inability to appreciate the presentation of being
Caledonia Heron: to include it and not rise against it?
Adams Rubble: yes Cal
Maxine Walden: and who's alpha and where one is in the pack...yes, Adams, sounds as if calmness is quite wonderful to experience
Adams Rubble: To accept it as part of what is around me
Maxine Walden: right
Caledonia Heron: to be ok with what's so is huge imo.... releases struggle, effort
Adams Rubble: Yes, must wasted energy
Adams Rubble: Of course, this may change when I go back to work next week. hehe
Caledonia Heron: lol ... true enough

Mo' meta-talk...

Maxine Walden: may I ask? What is 'imo'? What does that refer to?
Adams Rubble: in my opionon
Caledonia Heron: short for "in my opinion"
Maxine Walden: ah, thanks
Caledonia Heron: a qualifier of sorts :)
Adams Rubble: Cal spells better
Caledonia Heron: sometimes :)
Adams Rubble: :)
Maxine Walden: great condensation of the term
Caledonia Heron: yes, helps to stick to what you really want to express

Looking for more descriptors of direct experience I ask Maxine about 9sec...

Caledonia Heron: Maxine - what is 9sec like for you?
Maxine Walden: Not sure if I am doing the 9 sec precisely as I am trying the YSBS and variations, not by the clock so much.
Caledonia Heron: sure, true for many I suspect ... true for me
Maxine Walden: But those experiences are quite interesting, expanding, surprising, humbling
Adams Rubble: I have been off the clock so to speak too, Maxine
Caledonia Heron: are they personal revelations in nature, such as Adams perhaps?
Caledonia Heron: [stop me if too personal]
Maxine Walden: yes, in a manner of speaking, not too personal at all. I am probably going through some changes in my life
Maxine Walden: in terms of where I hope to put a lot of my energy, and so the revelations have to do with old patterns, new possibilities, how easy/difficulty it might be to change...things like that
Caledonia Heron: interesting, so noticing past mo, choosing future mo
Maxine Walden: yes, precisely
Caledonia Heron: so perhaps a useful tool to move "forward" ... (somewhere) :)
Maxine Walden: and of course there is loss in the consideration of change, but that is OK once I can identify it as such
Adams Rubble: Always a goal of mine to be a better person, to try to be more compassionate
Caledonia Heron: change can be hard sometimes, I think people resist change
Caledonia Heron: better people is a good thing in the world :)
Adams Rubble: And I too feel myself moving
Maxine Walden: going from the known past into the unknnown future is a challenge, I find because the known is what is being given up without knowing what it to come
Caledonia Heron: a leap to another place where you can't see all the consequences
Adams Rubble: Funny, I do not feel I have, or am, giving up anything that it important
Maxine Walden: right, not sure what it is to come
Maxine Walden: that is an interesting point, Adams, because I agree that what is being given up may not be important, but has been familiar
Maxine Walden: and in that way an old companion
Adams Rubble: This is a very interesting thread
Caledonia Heron: familiar and it works to a certain degree so maybe a bit harder to pry loose :)
Adams Rubble: I don't think I have thought about it
Maxine Walden: yes, harder to pry loose, Cal

Maxine has to go and a bit more about compassion...

Caledonia Heron: before we get too far away from your comment Adams about being more compassionate....
Maxine Walden: afraid I am going to have to go, some RL things I ned to look to before going to work; but it is difficult to leave such good friends and conversation
Adams Rubble: Yes, we are on to something Maxine. We'll have to try to pick this up sometime
Caledonia Heron: I thought I would mention that I am not trying to be more compassionate per se, but can tell in my interactions with others that a great deal of openess of myself - that feels like compassion at the level, (silly to write), at the human experience level - that makes a difference in how people respond to me ... like they are more free to be openly compassionate also
Maxine Walden: another choice, another loss. See you both again soon
Caledonia Heron: bye Maxine :)
Adams Rubble: I would like to say, if I can before maxine leaves, that I think
Adams Rubble: oh well
Caledonia Heron: oops, rats, she's gone!
Adams Rubble: Maybe she'll read this

How we complement each other....

Adams Rubble: I think I have always known down deep what is important
Caledonia Heron: yes, it's in the bedrock :)
Adams Rubble: The question for me, is how to keep the daily annoyances from distracting me
Adams Rubble: and PaB has given me numerous tools to do that while I try to figure out how to open the proverbial door that Pema keeps referring to
Adams Rubble: Yes Cal. Compassion comes naturally as our "self" becomes less intrusive
Caledonia Heron: yes, perhaps ... I have trouble parsing this "self" stuff ...
Adams Rubble: Ah, I am VERY good at THAT :)
Caledonia Heron: lol, good - we complement :)
Adams Rubble: :)

Observations...

Caledonia Heron: the other night there was a potentially embarrasing situation within a goup (embarassing to me!) and I openly said what I had meant by my comment and the tension was diffused and the conversation got really good after that
Caledonia Heron: examples like that - where if you show up honestly, social awkwardness melts and people show up also
Caledonia Heron: I really thought I could have left the group mortified to ever see them again and yet instead it was so totally cool
Adams Rubble: Your flexibility in addressing those situations is an asset :)
Caledonia Heron: sure, when I think to choose it
Caledonia Heron: and, that's how 9sec is showing up for me in my interactions with people ... one example anyway
Adams Rubble: hmmm. Yes, we are all sort of moving along in a kind of parallel, sometimes touching, sometimes taking wider paths
Caledonia Heron: yeah, think of the multiplier effect where we "be" when interacting with others, then they do it, and then that 3rd group does it.... holy smokes, it's a "be" revolution!! :)
Adams Rubble: yes
Caledonia Heron: so the "be" I see when on my own, is intersecting with the "be" I am when with others
Caledonia Heron: lol, or not :)
Adams Rubble: which is what we all wish for :)
Caledonia Heron: I don't know, maybe
Caledonia Heron: it's different for everybody I'd guess
Caledonia Heron: these are observations, not wishes or wants, ... it's what's going on for me
Adams Rubble: Ah, I see. hmmm. Yes, that is a difference :)
Adams Rubble: Maybe that's part of the "self" stuff or maybe not
Adams Rubble: Fael gets annoyed when I say something like that
Caledonia Heron: maybe - it seems bigger than self ... it's wide open like the sky, showing up honestly with people with no funny business
Adams Rubble: :)
Caledonia Heron: she does? how come?
Caledonia Heron: maybe it has to do with definitions of self or something
Adams Rubble: Bascially I said I had no idea of what I was talking about :)
Caledonia Heron: LOL
Caledonia Heron: join the club :)
Adams Rubble: :)

Comparisons with technology...

Adams Rubble: I thought there was something relevant in our comparisons with our approaches to technology at the start
Caledonia Heron: what do you mean?
Adams Rubble: I was comparing my state of calm with the way I sometimes feel when everything is finally working smoothly with technology
Adams Rubble: Then something new comes along and messes it all up for a while
Caledonia Heron: mmm, yes, a ripple in the pond
Adams Rubble: I feel there is something relevant there but don't know what it is
Caledonia Heron: it appears a relevant analogy ... to compare the stasis of a stable technology setup with calmness
Adams Rubble: Maybe it has to do with the fact that first everything is upset but then out of that often comes new ways of working which do the job in a better way...or more possibilities
Caledonia Heron: sure, I can see that - it opens up a new way, more options, different perspectives
Adams Rubble: Everything is going to be changing when I go back in September :)
Caledonia Heron: at your work?
Adams Rubble: yes
Adams Rubble: I'll need all the inner calm I can muster :)
Caledonia Heron: sure, that may be useful as you approach the changes, and deal with everyone else dealing with changes
Caledonia Heron: to sort of see the big picture
Adams Rubble: Often, it's not the technology, it is the reactions of others to it
Adams Rubble: organized chaos
Caledonia Heron: yeah, and the miscommunications that arise, different motives
Adams Rubble: yes, especially the motives...yes both
Caledonia Heron: a lot depends on the cohesiveness of the team as to how change is dealt with.... fractionated teams have rockier transitions
Adams Rubble: I'll be dealing with other "teams" :)
Adams Rubble: This is helping, thanks. Good to frame the problem
Adams Rubble: identify the problems
Caledonia Heron: I'm glad for that ... it can be a little hazy sometimes, right up until the moment it coalesces

Procrastinating or percolating?...

Adams Rubble: I feel like I am cheating this week because my knee is much better and I am enjoying all this time at home :)
Caledonia Heron: not cheating at all - you deserve it and you will be a better worker for it :)
Adams Rubble: Yes, usually when I take off I am working on projects. Now mostly on PaB and being "calm"
Adams Rubble: :)
Caledonia Heron: good! so often time-off is still time-on.... checking email, catching up .... I try to drop the whole thing, sometimes easier than others :)
Adams Rubble: I have a few small things to do but I am mostly procrastinating :)
Caledonia Heron: or percolating :)
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: Yeah!
Caledonia Heron: some ideas have to be brewed :)
Adams Rubble: yes

Until we meet again...

Adams Rubble: Thanks for a truly helpful discussion :)
Caledonia Heron: I'm going to prep some work - I'm glad we talked today - I always enjoy it :)
Adams Rubble: Bye Cal :)
Caledonia Heron: and to you - I appreciate it :)
Caledonia Heron: bye, see you soon :)
Adams Rubble: Yes :)