2009.07.17 07:00 - Fish and building

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    The Guardian for this meeting was quen Oh. The comments are by quen Oh.

    I first sat alone for a while watching the fish... And then Mickorod appeared.

    quen Oh: hello Mickorod
    quen Oh: how are you?
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Quen
    Mickorod Renard: fine thanks,,and you?
    quen Oh: fine
    quen Oh: was watching the fish
    Mickorod Renard: u seem very alone?
    quen Oh: was on my own yes
    Mickorod Renard: oh yes,,how lovely
    Mickorod Renard: re they yours or storms?
    quen Oh: mine
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    quen Oh: ;-) brought them with me, they appreciate being in the water
    Mickorod Renard: i remember a friend having some and we had a right job getting them in a pool,,on sl when we were novices
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    quen Oh: hehe in rl the problem is catching a fish, but in sl we have totally different challenges
    quen Oh: how to create fish..
    Mickorod Renard: well,,I am unusually available at the moment..school broke up for summer vacation today
    quen Oh: nice
    quen Oh: here too
    Mickorod Renard: great
    Mickorod Renard: I have 7 weeks hol now
    quen Oh: are you teaching or a student?
    Mickorod Renard: I am teaching , although stricktly speaking not qualified but more so from a technical aspect
    Mickorod Renard: design /technology
    quen Oh: what is it that you teach?
    quen Oh: ah nice
    quen Oh: I teach architecture / building techniques
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,it must be one of the most fun subjects
    quen Oh: not far apart
    Mickorod Renard: wow,,thats cool too
    Nymf joined us staring at the fish.
    quen Oh: hello Nymf welcome
    Mickorod Renard: hi Nymph
    Nymf Hathaway: Hello you two :)
    quen Oh: how are you?
    Nymf Hathaway: Doing well, thank you...and you two?
    Mickorod Renard: how are u nymf?
    Mickorod Renard: oops,,too slow
    Nymf Hathaway: Never :)
    Mickorod Renard: i am fine,,and happy I have broken up for hols
    Mickorod Renard: 7 weeks,,yipeeee
    Nymf Hathaway: You mean you have a seven week break?
    quen Oh: that is long btw
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,I bet I get fed up after 4
    Nymf Hathaway: yes...but lovely to be aware of :)
    Mickorod Renard: ;)
    Nymf Hathaway: Spoiled even :)
    Mickorod Renard: will miss my work
    Mickorod Renard: but I have lots to do
    quen Oh: so what will you do after 4 weeks?
    Nymf Hathaway: :) fishing?
    quen Oh: hehe
    Mickorod Renard: climb up the wall
    quen Oh: yes, I brought the fish today
    Nymf Hathaway: Smiles
    quen Oh: catch if you can
    Nymf Hathaway: yes I see those, nice Quen
    Nymf Hathaway: has eaten a haring (raw) with unions just yet :)
    quen Oh: you must be dutch Nymf
    Nymf Hathaway: smiles, soooo true
    quen Oh: hallo Nymf, lekker he, zo'n Hollandse Nieuwe? (sorry bit of dutch)
    Nymf Hathaway: smiles... I didn't even know
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    Mickorod Renard: when I went to amsterdam last it was dificult to find anyone speaking dutch
    Nymf Hathaway: hahhahahha
    Mickorod Renard: everyone spoke english
    Nymf Hathaway: doesn't surprise me
    Nymf Hathaway: be right back
    quen Oh: maybe because you spoke english?
    Mickorod Renard: perhaps
    quen Oh: we tend to adapt quickly to foreigner's languages
    Where architectural fascinations come in:
    Mickorod Renard: so quen..do you have a favorite style of architecture?
    quen Oh: I have some friends finding it almost impossible to learn Dutch as no one is actually speaking Dutch with them as soon as they here their accents
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,i learnt some with some holiday makers once
    Mickorod Renard: forgot it now
    Nymf Hathaway: back and reading
    Mickorod Renard: do you have favorite buildings?
    quen Oh: no I have not style, I like contemporary as well as some older architecture provided it is well made and balanced, but in my own practice I always try to make authentique contemporary and try to avoid it being trendy
    quen Oh: and you have you favourite design styles? or designers?
    Mickorod Renard: ok
    quen Oh: I have hundreds of favourite buildings
    Mickorod Renard: not really,,although I like medieval style stuf
    quen Oh: really? interesting
    Mickorod Renard: thats proberbly down to my childish side
    Nymf Hathaway: In Gent an ugli medievel building can be found, horrifying ugli
    quen Oh: ah which one Nymf?
    Nymf Hathaway: hmmm the castel or burcht in the centrum
    Nymf Hathaway: It is used for torture...now a museum about torture in those centuries, forgot the name though :(
    quen Oh: why do you find it horrifying Nymf, if I may ask?
    Nymf Hathaway: Because it is really dark
    Nymf Hathaway: the stones they used and the way it is build
    quen Oh: ah it is not only the appearance but too the torture history of the building?
    Nymf Hathaway: as well
    Mickorod Renard: I suppose some reason why I like medieval or very old is because I can relate to the hand skills needed to make things without modern machinery and adhesives etc
    Nymf Hathaway: oh I fully agree with you there Mickorod
    quen Oh: this particular fortress was made beginning of the medieval times
    Nymf Hathaway: in Gent you mean? yes that sounds plausible
    Mickorod Renard: I like some of the gothic style too
    quen Oh: what is funny about the fortress is that is was restored in a fantasy way in the 19th centurey
    Mickorod Renard: wow
    Nymf Hathaway: really? hahhaha
    quen Oh: it was probably more functional and spartanic in originally
    quen Oh: gothic can be really nice
    Nymf Hathaway: yes that would fit my feeling of the building indeed... spartanic
    quen Oh: have you ever visited St. Denis above Paris Mickorod?
    quen Oh: it is where gothic was 'invented', the light, the verticality, the shining
    Mickorod Renard: lol,,a long time ago,,I am trying to remember now u mentioned it
    Nymf Hathaway: France is a whole other world in buildings from the former centuries... wonderful castles
    quen Oh: it also the church where the french royal family is buried
    Mickorod Renard: I spent lots of time in st denis region,,it was cheap area then
    Mickorod Renard: I recently came back to the uk after living 8 years in france
    Nymf Hathaway: wow
    Mickorod Renard: was submerged in old french buildings
    Nymf Hathaway: yes I can imagine
    Nymf Hathaway: I love the villages
    quen Oh: nice Mick, so you must be fluently in french!
    Mickorod Renard: yes, some are nice,,some are very dead too
    quen Oh: have you also visited the cloister of Longfaye?
    Mickorod Renard: noooo..my french is discusting
    Nymf Hathaway: as everywhere...all villages run empty due to cities
    quen Oh: that one really got to me, it is very serene and beautiful
    Mickorod Renard: wheres longfaye?
    Mickorod Renard: scuse my ignorance
    quen Oh: sorry I meant Fontenay
    Mickorod Renard: ahh yes
    quen Oh: funny my brain hussled the letters
    quen Oh: lol
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Mickorod Renard: I unfortunately have forgotten most of what I found facinating once
    quen Oh: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Abbey_of_Fontenay
    Mickorod Renard: maybe overdosed on it
    quen Oh: really wonderful there, especially the church with open doors, no furniture
    Mickorod Renard: was that where henri and his wife are buried?
    Mickorod Renard: nice dove cote
    Nymf Hathaway: Nice :)))
    quen Oh: that would be St. Denis I suspect
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,thats the place,,i see a pici of the dovecote on ur link
    quen Oh: :-) a little later built than the fortress in Gent Nymf
    quen Oh: but well, for totally different purposes, and very elegantly and purely restored
    Nymf Hathaway: well their taste was much better by than :)
    Nymf Hathaway: I like Floris his castle as well Muiderslot it is called, near amsterdam
    Mickorod Renard: I used to go a visiting places in france by theme
    quen Oh: this was about taste perhaps, the fortress was about military protection and fortifying
    Mickorod Renard: like ,,richard the lionheart theme
    Mickorod Renard: or templars
    Nymf Hathaway: Ture Quen
    Nymf Hathaway: true
    quen Oh: nice Mick
    Nymf Hathaway is very interested in the history of the Celts
    quen Oh: Fontenay was founded by Bernard de Clairvaux, very familiar with the Templar knigths I thought
    Mickorod Renard: I recently visited the monoliths at carnac in brittany too.as well as some others
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,the templars were very influencial in building projects
    Mickorod Renard: I lived in the Cathar region of France,,down south..and that was the last hold out in france for the tremplars
    Mickorod Renard: templars
    quen Oh: Bernard gave them the church's recognition
    quen Oh: they had some bad times later indeed.. many were killed by the french king
    Nymf Hathaway: Needs to log off, wishing you both a friendly evening and thanks for the thoughts :))
    Mickorod Renard: I wonder sometimes why a steel frame is not used more widely in house construction?
    Mickorod Renard: bye nymf
    quen Oh: you too Nymf, nice meeting you!
    quen Oh: bye Nymf
    Nymf left.
    quen Oh: there are steel frames in houses Mickorod
    Mickorod Renard: its not popular in the uk
    Mickorod Renard: except for comercial units
    quen Oh: only one thing is that you have to carefully isolate it, as it transports cold easily inside, which can bring in condensation of moist inside too
    Mickorod Renard: but i fancy building my next home
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,I can imagine
    Mickorod Renard: I like the idea that I cuold make a place as a shell..then fill in how I want whenever,,and change it whenever
    quen Oh: and another thing which can be important constructing houses is that you when building more than one together, want to make they soundproof, so concrete or brick construtions are more likely to get used when building next or on top of each other
    quen Oh: interesting indeed Mick
    Mickorod Renard: yes..and some consideration to electric storms too I guess
    quen Oh: have you ever visited Villa Savoye above Paris?
    Mickorod Renard: no
    quen Oh: built by Le Corbusier
    Mickorod Renard: whats that like?
    quen Oh: he used a concrete frame construction, to have as much freedom in facade and plan as he wanted
    quen Oh: one sec, give you a link
    Mickorod Renard: thats the idea I like,,but with say 4 upright girders supporting the roof
    quen Oh: http://www.bc.edu/bc_org/avp/cas/fnart/Corbu.html
    Mickorod Renard: then fill inbetween with glass and brick
    quen Oh: so you want a dominant shell like roof?
    quen Oh: instantly another famous Corbusier comes to mind
    Mickorod Renard: yes..but just seen ur link,,its fantastic
    quen Oh: but there the roof is shell-like, but the wall are impressive too
    Mickorod Renard: and I like the idea of at least one facade with cloisters too
    quen Oh: http://images.google.nl/images?q=ronchamp&oe=utf-8&rls=org.mozilla:nl:official&client=firefox-a&um=1&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&hl=nl&tab=wi
    quen Oh: his famous church
    quen Oh: Chapel of Ronchamp
    quen Oh: have you thought about sustainability too Mich?
    quen Oh: Mick*
    Mickorod Renard: mmm..not sure about the ronchamp
    quen Oh: I mean if you have an impressive roof you could use it for waterheating and solar panels
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,i would like to have solar power in as much areas pos
    Mickorod Renard: yes exactly
    quen Oh: waterheating is more efficient for warming I think
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    quen Oh: well and than there is transpansparent glass solar roof
    quen Oh: so you get light, but in summer not the heat
    Mickorod Renard: but now with led type lighting,,maybe interior lighting could be provided by stored solar power and maybe wind power generating too
    quen Oh: shell-like like this perhaps? http://www.housedesignnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/shell-house-by-kotaro-ide-facade.jpg
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,keep the construction simple,,but create the roof and walls out of solar panels and windows etc
    quen Oh: yes, led lighting makes a difference
    quen Oh: or you can make a house inside a wintergarden of solarpanelled glass!
    Mickorod Renard: very interesting,,but I would think complicated in construction and to get stuf to fit
    Mickorod Renard: I like the idea of living in a wintergarden,,the uk is not the hottest of places
    quen Oh: trying to remember the name of a spectacular project I visited in germany
    quen Oh: one sec
    Mickorod Renard: and here plants could liven up the air and invironment
    quen Oh: indeed, you could live outside way longer in that concept
    quen Oh: and control your environment better
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    quen Oh: and have tropical plants even
    Mickorod Renard: yes..make the home part of an environment
    Mickorod Renard: I like simple too
    quen Oh: pfff i hate when I can see a picture in my mind, but forgot the name grrrr
    Mickorod Renard: I have seen some modern hoes that have hundreds of miles of cabling wiring up this and that,,too complicated
    Mickorod Renard: no worries
    quen Oh: this is a similar concept, but for a school
    quen Oh: http://cms.ifa.de/en/exhibitions/exhibitions-abroad/architecture/ecologydesignsynergy/material/alterra/
    quen Oh: not what I meant
    quen Oh: IBA Emscher Park! remember it now, one sec will google
    Mickorod Renard: lovely atrium,,lil big for me..he he
    Mickorod Renard: but u know what,,I have been suggesting atriums to lots and now I can see how well it wud fit in our school
    Mickorod Renard: what an excelent idea
    quen Oh: atriums are really nice for public buildings, especially when you want light, and sustainability
    quen Oh: I once made a plan for 120 senior appartments around a huge wintergarden
    quen Oh: it was part of a bigger complex
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,we have issues in bad weather with keeping kids in at lunch and play time,,atrium is the way forward
    quen Oh: for a house you could make a glass box where your house is underneath, or partly underneath
    Mickorod Renard: sounds a lovely concept u had for the appartments
    quen Oh: depending on the location, the view etc.
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,maybe sleeping below,,and atrium /sitting on first floor
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    quen Oh: it was meant to be a study to explore the possibilities programmatic only, but the concept and my first sketch design got to them, so they waved the architects selection process ;-)
    Mickorod Renard: wow
    Mickorod Renard: so was it built?
    quen Oh: I have also done a houseboat, which generated it's own heating, energy and had it's own clean-water cycle system
    quen Oh: they are now building it, only I left the firm when we bagged the project for us
    quen Oh: because the director was going to take over, and we were not on the same line (he replaced the old director after I joined)
    Mickorod Renard: still,,nice that u will be able to see your creation
    quen Oh: he was never expecting it to become a real project, but when it did, he was flabbergasted by the magnitude of it, so obviously he took over, as he was the boss
    Mickorod Renard: I made some metalwork features for some buildings in a town in france..its nice to see them and say,,'I did that@
    quen Oh: indeed it is :-)
    quen Oh: nice the concept is being built, not so nice that the design is not my liking, I mean the way it is detailed and worked out
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,oh well..thats the way life is
    quen Oh: could have been more pure, more space and well more sustainable...
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    quen Oh: glad I sensed which direction it was going in time, so not much annoyance
    Mickorod Renard: this is the problem when others play with someone elses idea's
    quen Oh: it is simply the problem when you are hired in a firm and not partner
    Mickorod Renard: yes true
    quen Oh: ;-) but well, to get an assignment like that on personal title is not easy *grins
    Mickorod Renard: are you more comfortable now?..in your work?
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    quen Oh: but if you could, it would mean you can start to build too your own firm exactly how you want
    quen Oh: well, I started on my own last year, just in time for the recession *grins
    Mickorod Renard: yes..a better direction I think
    quen Oh: now we are facing a lot of plans put in the fridge or on hold
    quen Oh: but well, if we sit out the difficult times, i am sure the good ones will come... we cannot stop building indefinitely
    Mickorod Renard: yes, but it wont last forever,,lean times,,but when its over you must be ready to grab what u can
    Mickorod Renard: snap
    quen Oh: it is the banks which are no longer giving out the large loans people and firms need to invest for building projects
    quen Oh: exactly :-)
    quen Oh: well, I am still young, so I am sure my chances will come
    Mickorod Renard: do you play around building stuff in SL?
    quen Oh: I play around indeed
    Mickorod Renard: oo?
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    quen Oh: I made the MICA building, where they have seminars and meetings
    Mickorod Renard: wow, amazing
    quen Oh: and made a pavillion for lectures, but the guy wanting to use that found in the end he had not enough time to actually use it
    quen Oh: so well, I am sort of 'living' there now
    quen Oh: the buildings are both in my picks
    Mickorod Renard: I have built a house for my lad on Sl..I should use it on my own land now he doesnt use it
    quen Oh: and you? are you designing?
    quen Oh: hehe
    quen Oh: ah nice
    Mickorod Renard: not really
    Mickorod Renard: I play occasionally
    quen Oh: lot of things are ghost-places in SL, too bad
    Mickorod Renard: but I like understanding how to do what seems a mystery
    Mickorod Renard: I will have a look
    quen Oh: lol always nice to understand mysteries ;-)
    quen Oh: on the other hand, than the mystery will go
    Mickorod Renard: I like trying to make water falls look like water falls
    quen Oh: ah yes, that is a challenge
    Mickorod Renard: stuff like that
    quen Oh: made one, for MICA, inside
    Mickorod Renard: yes?
    quen Oh: well, more like a water wall
    Mickorod Renard: have you got spray at the bottom too?
    quen Oh: wanted to divide room, but also keep it a bit transparant and natural
    quen Oh: yes
    Mickorod Renard: makes all the diference
    quen Oh: problem with waterfalls I found is that transparent over transparent in SL disappears
    quen Oh: indeed
    Mickorod Renard: grin
    quen Oh: and good textures are important
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    quen Oh: also some things disappear when you move away
    quen Oh: so you are designing waterfalls?
    quen Oh: what do you design in rl?
    Mickorod Renard: I cant help clicking on peoples buildings etc,,to see if I can borrow anims and textures etc
    quen Oh: except your own house ;-)
    quen Oh: haha
    quen Oh: smart way to learn things here
    Mickorod Renard: I dont do much serious stuff in Rl..I do show students how to use machines and cad cam .etc
    quen Oh: I am not sure if I am protective about my scripts and so
    quen Oh: lol
    quen Oh: nice
    quen Oh: the educational possibilities are numerous in SL, aren't they?
    Mickorod Renard: and how to work with wood ,plastic and metal
    Mickorod Renard: yes they are,,
    Mickorod Renard: I never lock my creations
    Mickorod Renard: I dont think mine have been that good
    quen Oh: one of the things I liked of MICA, it is where international astrophysicists meet to exchange ideas, knowledge, discuss, have lectures, build models and so on
    quen Oh: very nice to see them pioneering in these things
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,a great platform for those using it,,but also for those to see who has built and designed it
    quen Oh: well lol, I doubt that, most people build themselves in here
    quen Oh: it is a dream, anyone can build safely here
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,but there are some designs that are a cut above home built
    quen Oh: only risk is to accidentally delete your own stuff
    Mickorod Renard: yes..he he he
    quen Oh: ah yes, there is great variety in the builds and the quality
    quen Oh: some things are really innovative and adapted to sl, others mere traditional copies of rl
    Mickorod Renard: I accidentaly surrended my land last month,,fortunately it was so odd that my landlord suspected it was a mistake
    Mickorod Renard: and contacted me before taking it back
    quen Oh: well and then there are the boxes, with text and pictures on it, working as 'buildings' :-)
    quen Oh: ah nice! hehe
    quen Oh: yes, you can loose land here
    Mickorod Renard: whats these boxes?
    quen Oh: a lot of places people simply make a box to live in, or to start a store
    Mickorod Renard: I see
    quen Oh: and they put big plates with texts on it
    Mickorod Renard: ohh
    quen Oh: the most simple build in SL
    Mickorod Renard: I havnt been looking around that much lately
    quen Oh: it was why I entered SL, to see what a world could look like when all build their own dreams
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,I guess the b house I did for my lad was an extesion of some boxes,,but I like to keep prims down
    quen Oh: :-) another art of building here, to be minimal with prims
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,dream world,,but I am horrified at what some seem to desire
    quen Oh: lol indeed, it can be a little shocking to see some things
    quen Oh: well, I am sorry, I need to go
    quen Oh: was very nice talking with you Mickorod!
    Mickorod Renard: ok Quen..nice to have spent time with you
    quen Oh: likewise, really! :-)
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,we must chat again
    quen Oh: and you can show me your waterfall!
    quen Oh: and your house
    Mickorod Renard: ok,,its a deal
    quen Oh: ok, nice, bye then
    Mickorod Renard: bye
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