2009.07.23 13:00 - Remain in Light

The Guardian for this meeting was Pila Mulligan, sitting in for Scathach (and she was covering for Storm.) The comments are by Pila Mulligan.

    Pila Mulligan: hi Scathach
    Scathach Rhiadra: Hello Pila
    Scathach Rhiadra: ah, can I ask a favour Pila?
    Pila Mulligan: certainly
    Scathach Rhiadra: I am replacing Storm this session, but something has come up in RL, could you stay for the session?
    Pila Mulligan: yes, I'm happy to do so -- please follow whatever schedule suits you best
    Scathach Rhiadra: thank you, it was unexpected caller in RL, I have not claimed the log yet, do you want to?
    Pila Mulligan: yes, I will
    Pila Mulligan: one of those realities of rl :)
    Scathach Rhiadra: great, and thanks again. yes, I don't usually get visitors at this time of the evening, well not unexpected anyway!
    Pila Mulligan: ah, yes it is morning here, so I forgot the time there -- have a nice evening
    Scathach Rhiadra: and you have a great day, Namaste
    Pila Mulligan: aloha Scath
    Pila Mulligan: :)

after Scathach's departure, time passed quietly -- the log looked like it may be pretty empty, so Pila turned to Wiki for additional content about the history of this particular day:

     From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    July 23 is the 204th day of the year (205th in leap years) in the Gregorian calendar. There are 161 days remaining until the end of the year.
    1840 - The Province of Canada is created by the Act of Union.
    1903 - The Ford Motor Company sells its first car.
    1952 - overthrow of King Farouk of Egypt.

then Shyama arrived

    Pila Mulligan: hi Shyama
    Shyama Sheryffe: has the meeting ended
    Pila Mulligan: it is just now starting :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: i was here alone and decided to fill the log with historic events for 7/23
    Shyama Sheryffe: oh
    Pila Mulligan: 1982 - The International Whaling Commission decides to end commercial whaling by 1985-86.
    Pila Mulligan: but we can find a more interesting topic :)

    Shyama Sheryffe: is this a historic date ?
    Pila Mulligan: not so far :)
    Pila Mulligan: unless you are in Canada
    Pila Mulligan: seems today was the date the province of Canada was created
    Pila Mulligan: 1995 - Comet Hale-Bopp is discovered and becomes visible to the naked eye nearly a year later.
    --BELL--
    Shyama Sheryffe: what happens in Canada ?
    Shyama Sheryffe: oops
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: 1840 - The Province of Canada is created by the Act of Union  -- but it looks like it is not a holiday there
    Pila Mulligan: although it is in Egypt I see
    Pila Mulligan: the overthrow of King Farouk
    Pila Mulligan: 1952
    Shyama Sheryffe: how do u know all this ?
    Pila Mulligan: wikipedia :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/July_23
    Pila Mulligan: they have a page for each day of the year -- events, birthdays, deaths, holidays
    Shyama Sheryffe: i thought u had a encyclopedic memory..lol
    Pila Mulligan: nope :)
    Pila Mulligan: I have a swiss cheese memory :)
    Pila Mulligan: any ideas for a topic?
    Shyama Sheryffe: hm..nothing special in my mind
    Pila Mulligan: may I ask where you are in rl?
    Shyama Sheryffe: scandinavia, europe
    Pila Mulligan: I am in Hawai`i
    Shyama Sheryffe: wow
    Shyama Sheryffe: warm
    Pila Mulligan: so it is evening there, morning here
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Shyama Sheryffe: always
    Pila Mulligan: usually
    Pila Mulligan: it is about 10:30 am here
    Pila Mulligan: nice day

Shyama asks a question that shows cultural insight simply by the word she uses – ‘huna’ (as in kahuna)

    Shyama Sheryffe: do u know anything about huna tradition in Hawaii ?
    Pila Mulligan: yes, i do
    Shyama Sheryffe: could u tell something about it
    Pila Mulligan: huna noeau = hidden arts
    Pila Mulligan: may we start with how you became aware of it?
    Shyama Sheryffe: is it shamanism ?
    Pila Mulligan: it could be called that, by some anthropologists, I suppose
    Pila Mulligan: it relates to natural skills
    Pila Mulligan: but it is not hocus pocus
    Shyama Sheryffe: like healing ?
    Pila Mulligan: more like medicine, yes
    Pila Mulligan: the old Hawaiian martial art was called lua
    Pila Mulligan: and masters of lua had to be expert at setting bones
    Pila Mulligan: because their practice was in breaking bones
    Pila Mulligan: there are people today with the same skill
    Pila Mulligan: the bones they set will heal in a few days
    Shyama Sheryffe: is there a philosophy behind huna ?
    Shyama Sheryffe: or is it only healing
    Pila Mulligan: well, there are different forms of huna
    Pila Mulligan: la`au lapa`au is the healing side
    Pila Mulligan: using herbs, massage and energy
    Pila Mulligan: it has expertise that could be called a philosophy, as far as I can tell
    Pila Mulligan: http://www.herbcompanion.com/health/...ian-style.aspx
    Pila Mulligan: this was the first website i found just now, I have not read it but it has a picture of one of my favorite places :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: is that the mountain ?
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Shyama Sheryffe: very beautiful
    Pila Mulligan: I see the article refers to Uncle Harry Mitchell frm Maui and Papa Kawika Ka'alakea from Hawaii Island -- I had the pleasure to get to know them both before they died – this looks like a nice article
    Pila Mulligan: both Uncle Harry and Papa Kawika were remarkable healers
    Shyama Sheryffe: ty, i will read it
    --BELL--
    Pila Mulligan: another very competent healer from Maui was Kalua Kaiahua --
http://www.punawelewele.com/halepai/...e/aukake1c.htm
    Pila Mulligan: there's a web story about Kalua
    Shyama Sheryffe: may i ask what is ur approach Pila
    Pila Mulligan: he was named after the martial art (Ka= the, lua = the martial art)
    Pila Mulligan: my approach to huna?
    Shyama Sheryffe: to life..lol
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: ah, i am happy :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: seems the easiest thing to do
    Shyama Sheryffe: yes..u live in Hawaii
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it may help
    Pila Mulligan: lots of people here are happy
    Pila Mulligan: warm climate and warm culture
    Shyama Sheryffe: yes..

    Pila Mulligan: but I also do Chinese meditation and tai chi
    Pila Mulligan: do you have any practices?
    Shyama Sheryffe: i study eastern religions
    Pila Mulligan: nice, I also did that, and still do some
    Shyama Sheryffe: and meditate
    Pila Mulligan: do you have any favorites?
    Shyama Sheryffe: is tai chi from taoism ?
    Pila Mulligan: it is, insofar as it is Chinese and related to taoism
    Pila Mulligan: but it is not exclusively taoist
    Pila Mulligan: it is more like a healing exercise
    Pila Mulligan: like yoga
    Shyama Sheryffe: nods
    Shyama Sheryffe: and i ching ?
    Pila Mulligan: I like the healing aspects of practices
    Pila Mulligan: yes, I ching also
    Shyama Sheryffe: is it taositic ?
    Pila Mulligan: do you study these things?
    Shyama Sheryffe: yes i read alot
    Pila Mulligan: I ching is foundational to Chinese culture, it relates to all of it
    Pila Mulligan: Confucianism, taoism just about all traditional chinese ideas relate in some way to i ching
    Shyama Sheryffe: so its older than taoism ?
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Shyama Sheryffe: do u believe in it ?
    Pila Mulligan: i ching is attributed to Fu Xi, maybe 5000 years ago
    Shyama Sheryffe: i ching
    Pila Mulligan: ‘believe in’ it is a wide question, but yes I do
    Pila Mulligan: within limits
    Pila Mulligan: it is an excellent teaching tool
    Pila Mulligan: I do not use it as an oracle, that is a lesser role if you ask me
    Shyama Sheryffe: i have tried it sometimes and it was so fitting
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it has that element of being timely
    Shyama Sheryffe: how do u use it then ?
    Pila Mulligan: I begin my day (usually at 4:00 am) with a silent meditation, then an i ching meditation, then tai chi -- takes about an hour
    Pila Mulligan: so I use it as a daily meditation
    Pila Mulligan: and it keeps its timeliness each day, it seems :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: so u pick a page and meditate on it ?
    Pila Mulligan: I use the coin method to select the gua
    Pila Mulligan: gua = the chapter(s)
    Pila Mulligan: today it suggested i do yoga, so I did yoga
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: so u follow it ?
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Shyama Sheryffe: cool
    Pila Mulligan: not obsessively, but respectfully
    Pila Mulligan: it is usually most helpful
    Shyama Sheryffe: has it anytime said anything wrong ?
    Pila Mulligan: it gives a great insight into what Chinese call wu wei
    Pila Mulligan: not noticeably wrong, no
    Pila Mulligan: it has often been very right
    Shyama Sheryffe: or not fitting ?
    Pila Mulligan: it may have gone over my head sometimes, but I have never regretted paying attention to it

    Shyama Sheryffe: wu wei ?
    Pila Mulligan: wu wei is a popular expression often interpreted as non-action
    Pila Mulligan: it is a little deeper than that however
    Shyama Sheryffe: meditation ?
    Pila Mulligan: it is closer to being in harmony with nature
    Pila Mulligan: no, as a kind of guide
    Pila Mulligan: not acting, as an alternative to acting
    Pila Mulligan: sometimes it is appropriate not to act, and that is more often than we may think
    Shyama Sheryffe: hm..witnessing
    Pila Mulligan: more going with the flow, letting events happen
    Shyama Sheryffe: nods
    Pila Mulligan: but this involves a much lesser known idea called the dao of i, or the way of change
    Pila Mulligan: the flow of events is described by the dao of i
    Pila Mulligan: and there is a natural cycle and progression -- events are interrelated
    --BELL--
    Shyama Sheryffe: does the wu wei mean that u dont play any part in the world, being passive ?
    Pila Mulligan: no, it is more not interfering with nature
    Pila Mulligan: changes from moment to moment or day to day or year to year are interrelated, and the dao of i reflects the way those changes are related and helps us appreciate the natural flow of things -- and from that view we can see wu wei, the predominantly non-action side of being in harmony with nature
    Pila Mulligan: it seems passive only by comparison to what seems to be the rat race of daily life
    Pila Mulligan: but it is actively conscious, and sometimes action is needed as well
    Pila Mulligan: so it is modest action that keeps us in the dao of i, in the natural changing flow of interrelated events
    Pila Mulligan: ‘i’ is the same is as in i ching = change
    Pila Mulligan: ‘dao’ is same as tao = way
    Shyama Sheryffe: things change yes
    Pila Mulligan: so dao of i = way of change
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: and they change in cycles usually
    Shyama Sheryffe: like in buddhism..nothing is permanent
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Pila Mulligan: dynamic nature
    Shyama Sheryffe: i somehow fancy more taoism than buddhism
    Pila Mulligan: I am intimidated by the intellectual side of buddhism, it exceeds my mental capacity
    Shyama Sheryffe: in buddhism there seems to be so many rules
    Pila Mulligan: it is stunningly complete
    Pila Mulligan: and takes years of study
    Pila Mulligan: i am not up to it :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: mine too..lol
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: but the way tai chi moves
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it is natural
    Shyama Sheryffe: there is something .. touching
    Pila Mulligan: and healing
    Pila Mulligan: it is the chi :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: nods
    Pila Mulligan: the breath energy

    Pila Mulligan: do you do tai chi?
    Shyama Sheryffe: im gonna try to begin it
    Shyama Sheryffe: i have a video
    Pila Mulligan: let it teach itself to you :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: a good teacher helps, but like yoga it is also self-teaching
    Pila Mulligan: because it is so natural
    Pila Mulligan: what video do you have, may I ask?
    Pila Mulligan: I ask because there are several styles
    Shyama Sheryffe: yes, i’ve done some yoga
    Shyama Sheryffe: but tai chi seems interesting as it has the silence and movement together
    Pila Mulligan: yes, quiet movement
    Pila Mulligan: slow, too
    Pila Mulligan: and all, like yoga, in tune with breathing
    Shyama Sheryffe: ah, this is for beginners..let me see if i find it
    Shyama Sheryffe: its just called the introduction
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: the most common style is probably yang
    Shyama Sheryffe: i think it is a swedish production
    Pila Mulligan: Yang Style comes form the Yang family in China
    Pila Mulligan: you will be able to tell if it helps you
    Pila Mulligan: it if does, you should be able to feel it
    Shyama Sheryffe: hm is it for men, Yang?
    Pila Mulligan: no, Yang is a family name :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: ok
    Pila Mulligan: Master Yin was a great I Ching master, but he was a man :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: lol
    Pila Mulligan: yin and yang are not just men and women :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: nods

Eos arrives

    Pila Mulligan: hi Eos
    Shyama Sheryffe: well its nice that u r an expert, so i can ask u advise
    Pila Mulligan: I'm happy to talk with you Shyama  – as for expert, I may defer
    Pila Mulligan: i am still learning
    Shyama Sheryffe: hi Eos
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: aloha `oe
    Pila Mulligan: we've been chatting Chinese stuff
    --BELL--
    Pila Mulligan: how are you Eos?
    Shyama Sheryffe: What does taoism tell about the purpose of life ? wu wei ?
    Pila Mulligan: I think the first lesson of taoism is to look to nature
    Eos Amaterasu: Pretty good, Pila... just got home... wu-ing and wei-ing :-)
    Pila Mulligan: if we have questions, nature may have answers -- but not all questions have answers :)
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: that question about the Meaning of Life, I like Monty Python :)
    Eos Amaterasu: I'm appreciating the truth of that more and more (re nature)
    Pila Mulligan: more seriously, being happy is a nice answer
    Shyama Sheryffe: what is their answer,  Monty Python
    Pila Mulligan: Monty Python is a British humor group that did a movie named The Meaning of Life -- a comedy
    Eos Amaterasu: Life's bottom line is not a single digit
    Pila Mulligan: it was very funny
    Shyama Sheryffe: ah..
    Pila Mulligan: but happiness is a good answer
    Shyama Sheryffe: agrees
    Shyama Sheryffe: very good
    Eos Amaterasu: Since we come out of nature, perhaps one approach is to rest in nature's lap
    Pila Mulligan: nature is full of reality, and as Eos just said, it is not just a simple place
    Eos Amaterasu: which is kind of resting in the question
    Pila Mulligan: yes, that is kind of the idea of wu wei, lap resting
    Shyama Sheryffe: and the question falls away...
    Pila Mulligan: like in the huna tradition of Hawai`i, that we talked about earlier, things are not so much hidden as they are unexpected
    Pila Mulligan: it is our expectations that can be confusing
    Eos Amaterasu: I think the 9 secs practice is a bit of letting go, not immediately grasping on, answers or intentions or anything
    Pila Mulligan: a lap pause :)
    Eos Amaterasu wonders how far this metaphor (?) will be taken
    Pila Mulligan: several laps at least
    Eos Amaterasu: argh!
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: actually that is a lovely image used in the Dzogchen and Mahamudra traditions:
    Eos Amaterasu: that realization is like the child luminosity returning to the mother luminosity
    Eos Amaterasu: like a child jumping back into its mother's lap
    Pila Mulligan: and that reminds me of my favorite verse from the bible -- when I was a child I spoke as a child I understood as a child I thought as a child; but when I became a man I put away childish things.
    Pila Mulligan: I think part of the message there is to be able to see face to face
    Pila Mulligan: not just thru a glass darkly

Shyama departs

    Shyama Sheryffe: ah, getting late, im off to bed
    Pila Mulligan: nice to visit with you Shyama
    Eos Amaterasu: Bye Shayama
    Pila Mulligan: bye for now
    Shyama Sheryffe: ty Pila, very enlightening conversation
    Pila Mulligan: it was fun
    Pila Mulligan: thank you
    Shyama Sheryffe: yes :)
    Shyama Sheryffe: goodnight both
    Pila Mulligan: aloha
    Eos Amaterasu: <^_^>

    Pila Mulligan: it was a vacant session the first half hour
    Pila Mulligan: I started filling the log with events for 7/23 from Wikipedia :)
    Pila Mulligan: today is Revolution Day in Egypt, for example
    Eos Amaterasu: Hmm, making the moment bigger?
    Pila Mulligan: making it full of history :)
    --BELL--
    Eos Amaterasu: Which revolution was that in Egypt (or is it about the future?>)
    Pila Mulligan: the overthrow of King Farouk
    Pila Mulligan: 1959?
    Pila Mulligan: 1952*
    Pila Mulligan: 1840 - The Province of Canada is created by the Act of Union   1903 - The Ford Motor Company sells its first car
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: paragraph break before 1903*
    Eos Amaterasu thinks that a good chat editor would let participants edit their lines in a 15-second window
    Eos Amaterasu: and then it would become history
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: we could do that ourselves with patience :)
    Pila Mulligan: i am still learning that
    Pila Mulligan: take time to fix, not just type fast
    Pila Mulligan: but I agree
    Pila Mulligan: it would be a cool script
    Eos Amaterasu: that's true: the chat editor could force a 15 sec (after the 9 sec :) pause
    Pila Mulligan: we would go at tai chi pace then
    Pila Mulligan: v e r r r y   s l o o o w l y
    Eos Amaterasu: every line would have a 9 second tax
    Eos Amaterasu: wu wei sounds like a question :-)
    Eos Amaterasu: how do you pronounce it, by the way?
    Eos Amaterasu: wu why? wu way?
    Pila Mulligan: woo way
    Pila Mulligan: there is a nice New York Times commentary today on the Dalai Lama -- http://happydays.blogs.nytimes.com/2...tor-is-within/
    Eos Amaterasu: how do you find wu wei in your life, PIla?
    Pila Mulligan: not to cut off the wu wei question :)
    Pila Mulligan: this was what we talked about earlier
    Pila Mulligan: wu wei is deeper for me than just non-action
    Pila Mulligan: making a note card :)
    Eos Amaterasu: non-action is probably as full of surprises as resting in we wei's lap
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it is a dynamic idea -- it requires consciousness as a consistent activity :)
    Eos Amaterasu: thnx for the catch-up note, Pila
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    --BELL--
    Eos Amaterasu: Finding non-action in action is the thing
    Pila Mulligan: yes, the harmonious moment
    Eos Amaterasu: it probably helps to be coming from non-action to the extent there is contrast
    Pila Mulligan: well, there is a lot of contrast, for most people, in our cultures
    Eos Amaterasu: so that as things arise they do so from empty/fullness
    Pila Mulligan: our cultures are very fast paced usually
    Eos Amaterasu: I think that's one of the key benefits (maybe even tricks) to practices such as APA
    Pila Mulligan: so just to catch the train we usually hustle
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Pila Mulligan: the faster you go the slower it gets
    Eos Amaterasu: you think you're falling into the gaps
    Pila Mulligan: we can get there like the turtle, maybe even first
    Eos Amaterasu: but sometimes you find things rising out of the gaps
    Eos Amaterasu: without having lost that "gap"y quality :-)
    Pila Mulligan: I think the idea may be to keep things smooth
    Pila Mulligan: and to do so with the least effort
    Pila Mulligan: while staying conscious
    Eos Amaterasu: sudden turns are also in there (witness Gretzky, Zidane, Bird....)
Pila Mulligan: MJ
    Pila Mulligan: MJ had the best sense of timing of any athlete I've seen
    Pila Mulligan: Michael Jordan
    Pila Mulligan: he had timing down pat
    Eos Amaterasu: yes: wu wei, neh?
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Pila Mulligan: actually
    Pila Mulligan: shooting the unaimed basket
    Pila Mulligan: that is the dao of i
    Eos Amaterasu: in some vocabularies this is called becoming a force of nature
    Pila Mulligan: he could tell when the game was flowing against him and he rode it
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it may seem that is what happens
    Eos Amaterasu: aligned with your highest and best intentions, which are also that of the ground you come from
    Pila Mulligan: he could tell when the nature of the game shifted and he surfed it with strong chi
    Eos Amaterasu: Ideally that's what a leader does
    Pila Mulligan: there is a chinese term 'dragging your wheels'
    Pila Mulligan: that is to avoid letting the ground get out form under you :)
    Eos Amaterasu: nice image!
    Pila Mulligan: yes, a good leader needs timing
    Pila Mulligan: so MJ would drag his wheels when the flow was contrary, then let them loose when the time came
    Pila Mulligan: and he was almost always right on
    Eos Amaterasu: Hm, that's really great
    Eos Amaterasu: so you churn into your actual experience, rather than trying to avoid it
    Eos Amaterasu: and if you churn with empty hands/wheels
    Eos Amaterasu: you get into the whole field
    Pila Mulligan: yes, that is where wu wei likes to stay, in the whole field
    Eos Amaterasu: and feel the "shur" (art of war)
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: and a great deal of it is done with breathing :)
    Eos Amaterasu: What would you suggest re breathing in terms of the 9 secs, if anyting?
    Pila Mulligan: do it :)
    Eos Amaterasu: he heh
    Pila Mulligan: a deep breath takes me about 20 seconds
    Pila Mulligan: so do a full breath, however long it takes
    Pila Mulligan: the doctor always gets impatient with the stethoscope when s/he tells me to take a breath :)
    Eos Amaterasu: You also kind of perceive with your breath (especially the "per" part)
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Pila Mulligan: that is the light of the breath
    Pila Mulligan: it is the connection to the interrelatedness, the light
    --BELL--
    Eos Amaterasu: hmm, it just got sunny/lighter here in RL (cloudy day)
    Pila Mulligan: sometimes breathing is heavy or dark and not easy, like a 'contrary' phase in the basketball game context, so then you drag your wheels and work more at just the breathing -- then sometimes it is light and easy and you just go with the flow
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: a nice moment of light
    Eos Amaterasu: Thnx for the presence, Pila - must go make supper
    Pila Mulligan: have a nice evening Eos, it is always fun with you
    Eos Amaterasu: "Remain in Light" (Talking Heads album)
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: aloha `oe