2008.09.22 01:00 – Sleep deprivation as a result of ??

The guardian on call for this session was Gaya. Please add comments if willing.

Fael Illyar: Hi Claire :)
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Fael Illyar: Hi Adams :)
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Adams Rubble: Hello everyone :)
Claire Beltran: hello
Adams Rubble: What is the topic?
Fael Illyar: no topic, silent meeting today :)
Gaya Ethaniel nods

---

Adams Rubble: Ah, it is the middle of the night for me and I woke up with some things on my mind :)
Gaya Ethaniel: oh
Fael Illyar: Ah, not sleeping well then.
Adams Rubble: One is for Fael :)
Fael Illyar: Oh, for me?
 Adams Rubble: In response to a comment you made Fael at the 1 pm session yesterday
Adams Rubble: Racism of course comes from the "self"
Adams Rubble: If people of a country have race issues, then it is good for politicians to talk about them although in the case of my country much of the talk until now has been to scare people and divide them. It is good there is something different this time
Adams Rubble: So please bear with our country as we try to right some things that are wrong :)
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Gaya Ethaniel: (what American does does affect the world so we observe with interests that's all Adams)
Adams Rubble: yes
Fael Illyar: well, my point was not that the topic of racism is unimportant. It was actually that people tend to talk of the effects instead of causes.
Gaya Ethaniel: Treating causes of racism... takes a long long time
Fael Illyar: even when everyone is already clear about what the effects are.
Faenik: なるほど^^
Fael Illyar: of course. Hence, I can't find a conversation about the effects of much interest.
Gaya Ethaniel: Looking at effects can be helpful though Fael
Gaya Ethaniel: Some causes are not obvious
Gaya Ethaniel: Especially for issues as complex as racism
Fael Illyar: yes, and if the conversation actually helped find those, I'd consider it interesting
Gaya Ethaniel: ah
Adams Rubble is not offended that Fael would not find all the subtleties of the politics of my country interesting
Adams Rubble knows nothing of politics in fael's country
Fael Illyar: Not that I find most of my own country's politics interesting either.
Adams Rubble: Please do not be offended by my next question
Adams Rubble: Isn’t Pema supposed to be here now?
Gaya Ethaniel: <= GoC
Adams Rubble: Gaya is GOC?
Gaya Ethaniel nods. Monday 1 AM yes
Fael Illyar: some laws they're pushing for grab my interest because they'd affect me as well so I kind of get interested in whatever they're pushing for even if it's utter crap... well, especially when it's that.
Gaya Ethaniel smiles wearily
Fael Illyar: for example attempts at laws at making Finland closer to police state. (sneaky ones)
Adams Rubble: At 4 am in the morning politics is of limited interest to me too
Gaya Ethaniel sighs... 4 am
Fael Illyar: ... I'll drop the ball :)
Fael Illyar was about to begin a lecture.
Gaya Ethaniel wonders what the other point Adams wants to discuss is

---

Adams Rubble: Oh just life and death and whether it is real or not :)
Gaya Ethaniel: ah...
Fael Illyar somehow felt Adams was confused when she appeared.
Faenik loves wells!
Adams Rubble: Adams crashed here last night
Adams Rubble: last
Gaya Ethaniel: That's rather a difficult question... have you seen 'What Dreams May Come'?
Adams Rubble: No I just talked to Avastu
Gaya Ethaniel: ah ok
Adams Rubble: What is that?
Faenik: why not?
Gaya Ethaniel: It's a film... about life/death and so on that got me thinking a lot... Robin Williams is in it.
Gaya Ethaniel: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/What_Dr...ay_Come_(film)
Adams Rubble: I will have to look it up
Gaya Ethaniel: (reading the plot details Adams will spoil but...)
Gaya Ethaniel: What are your thoughts so far?
Adams Rubble: Avastu came to last night's session
Adams Rubble: Pema's comment at yesterday's guardian meeting was on my mind
Adams Rubble: That birth and death are an illusion
Adams Rubble: Nisargadatta says that too
Gaya Ethaniel listens
Adams Rubble: But Nisargadatta set me off to find the person who was there at birth and will be there at death
Adams Rubble: And I think I have found that person
Gaya Ethaniel remembers
Fael Illyar: have you tried asking questions to Z self yet?
Fael Illyar: oh, phone
Adams Rubble: Avastu said that the knowledge of birth and death are illusions and that *** is an illusion
Claire Beltran: Nisargadatta?
Adams Rubble: Now the implications of that are that I can't be that person who was there at birth and will be there at death
Adams Rubble: That I must be ***
Adams Rubble: And accept the illusions
Adams Rubble: That is what has me awake in these wee hours
Gaya Ethaniel: Just be aware of the illusions... let the illusions be
Adams Rubble: Claire, Nisargadataa was Avastu's teacher
Claire Beltran: Avastu?
Claire Beltran: Sorry, I'm terribly inept in ways ^^;
Adams Rubble: No Claire, you just weren't here a month ago
Adams Rubble: sorry, in my sleepiness I have ignored you
Adams Rubble: Nisargadatta wrote a book called "I am that"
Gaya Ethaniel: (Avastu is a regular at PaB Claire)
Adams Rubble: He was a humble, uneducated person from a Hindu background
Adams Rubble: Who found some truths and many people are looking at them
Adams Rubble: Avasru has another place and I can't think of the name
Adams Rubble: Something Center
Faenik loves wells!
Gaya Ethaniel: And you're finding it difficult to 'accept the illusions' Adams?
Adams Rubble: Nonduality Center I sent you a landmark
Adams Rubble: I am just a bit confused Gaya and it seemed terribly important to talk to Pema :)
Adams Rubble: So I booted up the nold laptop and here I am
Gaya Ethaniel: Pema said that confusion is a often a sign of upcoming realisation
Gaya Ethaniel: He was on his email just a little while ago. Suggest you email him
Adams Rubble: Yes, when I wake up :)
Gaya Ethaniel: ah
Gaya Ethaniel: Perhaps he trusts you are able to realise on your own and so he's not here
Adams Rubble wonders if Pema knows she is here :)
Adams Rubble: hehe
Gaya Ethaniel smiles
Adams Rubble: Now that I have spread chaos and confusion, I think I will go back to bed :)
Gaya Ethaniel smiles and nods
Adams Rubble: hehe
Gaya Ethaniel: Good night Adams. Until next time
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Adams Rubble: Night all :)
Faenik: indeed?
Claire Beltran: nini ^-^/
Gaya Ethaniel must go and get some breakfast...
Gaya Ethaniel: Nice to see you both Claire and Fael. Good day
Gaya Ethaniel: _/!\_
Fael Illyar: See you later Gaya :)