2009.04.08 01:00 - God and Talking with Trees

    Table of contents
    No headers

    The Guardian for this meeting was Tarmel Udimo. The comments are by Tarmel Udimo. I was alone for a little while when Sophia showed up. We lunched into a topic pretty much straight away.

    sophia Placebo: morning tarmel
    Tarmel Udimo: evening Sophia
    Tarmel Udimo: How are we today?
    sophia Placebo: great ty ,you?
    Tarmel Udimo: great too
    Tarmel Udimo: was there anything PaB you'd like to discuss?
    sophia Placebo: not really
    Tarmel Udimo: I notice you are a member of some interesting groups
    sophia Placebo: which one interests you ?
    Tarmel Udimo: The photoshop one amoung others
    Tarmel Udimo: there are also several ones about Islam
    sophia Placebo: :) photoshop is a hobby, and islam is my religion
    Tarmel Udimo: ok
    Tarmel Udimo: born into it or converted?
    sophia Placebo: born and converted too :)
    Tarmel Udimo: :)
    sophia Placebo: i live in a kinda atheist state and some buddha state, though i knew nothing about these back then
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: its what fits
    Tarmel Udimo: and of course sometimes this changes, deepen, evolves
    Tarmel Udimo: whatever works
    Tarmel Udimo: so was the conversion gradual?
    Tarmel Udimo: I am assuming you are saying you were born into it, but then also have taken it on as well?
    sophia Placebo: yes
    sophia Placebo: i was raised as muslim, but at age 10 we suppose to start praying 5 times a day , so i start questioning to whom im praying and why, is there a god if there is one what does he wants from me
    Tarmel Udimo: understand that's exactly how i felt, I was catholic, well my dad was and my mum was anglican, but yes I wanted to have all those answers too:)
    Tarmel Udimo: so then what happened?
    sophia Placebo: well i got to answer 2 questions : is there a god , then how i know him
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    sophia Placebo: the first question : i assume that the possibility is 50% for both existence of a god and no existence
    sophia Placebo: i can't prove niether of them and as i read in home library no one could prove that
    sophia Placebo: the both assumptions were equal
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: and how do you know God?
    sophia Placebo: i assume that if there was no god then whatever path i take in this life would not harm me, so what if i take the choice that there is a god
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    sophia Placebo: in quranic verses and in our teaching, god never is away from you, that's why when you are in a very hard situation and no one near you, you feel this fine sensation, but persistant one that there is some hope, some power can help you
    sophia Placebo: basically that's how i kept feeling there is a god, not the teachings but the sensation itself
    sophia Placebo: i was into science readings more than into religous one, the more i read the more the idea of no god seem hard to prove, unless you know every small detail of this universe, i can't take the no god assumption
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: this 'fine sensation' you describe - I call Being or 'arising'
    Tarmel Udimo: which is continually 'arising' at every moment
    Tarmel Udimo: I find it difficult to use the word god in that context now
    Tarmel Udimo: as I still associate the word God with a Creator or a higher power

    A new visitor, Suryavarman Jayaram showed up...he had a good feeling and seemed to fit right in.

    sophia Placebo: hello surya
    Tarmel Udimo: hi Surya
    Tarmel Udimo: ahh made it - landed
    sophia Placebo: well i couldn't not
    Suryavarman Jayaram: HI
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Are you on air?
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I hope I am not interrupting you
    Tarmel Udimo: no not at all please join us
    Tarmel Udimo: have you been here before?
    Suryavarman Jayaram: no
    Tarmel Udimo: may I give you a note card?
    Suryavarman Jayaram: sure
    Tarmel Udimo: and to tell you, we record our sessions so hopefully that's ok
    Tarmel Udimo: as well every 15mins we stop for 90secs of silence
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I love silence
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I enjoy it very much...
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I am from USA... so I am concerned I dont't know much about Beijing daily life
    Tarmel Udimo: this is Play as Being:-)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Oh... Being
    Suryavarman Jayaram: It's so wonderful
    Tarmel Udimo: nods

    Sophia and I continued for a while...

    sophia Placebo: i couldnt see this sensation tied me up with something that is not being by itself
    Tarmel Udimo: not sure what you meant Sophia?
    Tarmel Udimo: that God =being?
    Suryavarman Jayaram: No..
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Being "is" Being, you are being
    Tarmel Udimo: yes that's where we are coming from
    Tarmel Udimo: I was asking Sophia to explain what she meant
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I could feel that... but didn't think it.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Sorry. Where is Sophia now? Did she leave?
    Tarmel Udimo: yes crashed i think:)
    Tarmel Udimo: it happens
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Perhaps she will return to answer
    Tarmel Udimo: hehehe perhaps
    Suryavarman Jayaram: What country do you come from?
    Tarmel Udimo: I am in Australia
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I am in US
    Tarmel Udimo: yes
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Is this your landmark?
    Tarmel Udimo: this pavilion belongs to the Kira Institute
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I see..
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Sophia has returned. Please resume research.
    sophia Placebo: major crash
    Suryavarman Jayaram: It is not necessary for Being to speak or think.
    Tarmel Udimo: WB Sophia
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I'll be silent
    sophia Placebo: ty
    Tarmel Udimo: feel free Surya, that's what we're here for:)
    Tarmel Udimo: sophia Placebo: i couldnt see this sensation tied me up with something that not is being by itself [1:53] Tarmel Udimo: not sure what you meant Sophia?
    sophia Placebo: the feeling as it arise is as strong as in hard times when you feel alone, for example in physical weakness , i dont see that feeling arise from my hands , i dont see it arise from the ground under me , i dont see it arise from anywhere, though it is near all that
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    sophia Placebo: it is pure , not co arising or co dependant
    Tarmel Udimo: separate to us or us?
    sophia Placebo: what do u mean?
    Tarmel Udimo: is it part of us - ie us or a seperate 'entity'?
    sophia Placebo: both
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: this is not a test:-)
    Tarmel Udimo: sorry if sounds that way, just trying to get a handle on where you're coming from...
    sophia Placebo: :) np

    And then the conversation took off in another direction....

    Tarmel Udimo: how about you Surya?
    Tarmel Udimo: we've been talking about Being & God
    Suryavarman Jayaram: When I was younger, I experience a duality; that is Being was there (outside myself) and I was here. Now I experience no separation.
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: you will enjoy our sessions:-)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I have been meditating for over 30 years... always looking for enlightenment, not realizing that "it" was always "here" and "now"
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: yes understand
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I can feel it (your understanding) here.
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I used to think "space" separated "objects" like "you" and "me," but recently I discovered that space it the "connector" that connects us, not separates us.
    Tarmel Udimo: hummm
    Tarmel Udimo: how did you make that discovery?
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I learned it from a tree that I share space with.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: (sorry if I sound crazy)
    Tarmel Udimo: not crazy at all, I often learn things from trees:)
    Tarmel Udimo: I happen to think they are very savy beings
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I have listened to all forms of nature since I was a child.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: When I used to run past this tree every day for years, I alway expressed my joy and appreciation for it "presence" and beauty
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I would also bless its form
    Suryavarman Jayaram: One day as I looked at the tree, I realized that its spaces between the leave were just as important
    Suryavarman Jayaram: At that moment, I realized that I was not separated from forms, I was the spaces between forms.
    Tarmel Udimo: will need to think about this
    sophia Placebo: intresting
    Suryavarman Jayaram: May I suggest ... please don't "think"
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Thinking is useful for practical appliations, but cannot reach what I am trying to describe.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Thinking is like an object. It is a mental construct.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I experience Being (the tree, the spaces, whole) not by thinking.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Even my words, are surface expressions of our Being.
    Tarmel Udimo: no understand, I should have been more specific I will have to drop it into my innerself and mull it over that way

    Tarmel Udimo: because while I am 'understanding' what you mean I am not for the moment experiencing it, which is why I said I will need to think, but its not the right word
    Suryavarman Jayaram: This conversation with a part of a whole, "you" "sophia" and "me" are one in the same.
    Tarmel Udimo: we are on the same page, it was a bad choice of word:)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: :-)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I also get used to using the language taught to me by my society. Most society will not understand what we are saying (beyond the import and meaning of words)
    Tarmel Udimo: nods true
    Tarmel Udimo: a tree has been trying to teach me something but it has has been difficult to grasp
    sophia Placebo: i g2g , nice to meet you both
    Tarmel Udimo: sorry Sophia
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Thank you Sophia
    Tarmel Udimo: we have been talking too much:)
    sophia Placebo: not at all tarmel, i'm a listener by nature i guess
    sophia Placebo: bye now
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I feel I may have interrupted ...
    Tarmel Udimo: the tree has been trying to tell me how it was created but I haven't quite grasped it yet:)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I hope Sohpia will return.
    Tarmel Udimo: yes she is a part of the group and comes to sessions
    Suryavarman Jayaram: :-)
    Tarmel Udimo: nice to meet you Surya, hopefully you'll come back to the sessions
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I shall return too
    Tarmel Udimo: I think you will meet very like minded people here
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Not because of anything I need to say, but because the "presence" here is very deep and light and peaceful.
    Tarmel Udimo: yes it is like that and we try to keep it that way:)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: May I share a short story (2 minutes) that capture the essence of grasping the creation of tree.
    Tarmel Udimo: please do:)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: If not, I'll return
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Ok
    Suryavarman Jayaram: When I was young man, I wanted enlightenment more than anything else it the world.
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Always watching outside myself for it, expecting one day it would come.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Then, one day..
    Suryavarman Jayaram: While in meditation, I saw myself as a sour green apple (un-enlighteed)... wanting to be a juicy, ripe, red apple (enlightended).
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I suddenly realized (without "trying") that every moment, everything, has a state of perfection within itself.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: even green apples.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: At that moment, I felt so blissfully happy to be a perfect green apple.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: If ever I become a red apple, that will be fine, but I AM where I AM.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: It feels so perfect.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: This realization came without looking outward, or "grasping" -- as in pondering the tree.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: The tree [ you ] will tell you all you need to know about it, when you stop thinking and become aware of the tree.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I don't know if that will work for you. But it makes sense to me.
    Tarmel Udimo: yes it does
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I apologise if it sounds like I know. I just wish to share what happened to me. Maybe those vibration speak to you.
    Tarmel Udimo: yes ty
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Thank you for such wonderful moments of Silence.
    Tarmel Udimo: I know i just need to go back and be close to the 'tree' because what the tree is communicating comes across in its prescence
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Yes
    Suryavarman Jayaram: That is what I feel too
    Tarmel Udimo: and yes it will just happen but sometimes we also need to strive, which is part of the unfolding
    Suryavarman Jayaram: The tree [ and its spaces ] has been like a portal through which my Being touches Being
    Tarmel Udimo: yes that's a very good way to describe it
    Suryavarman Jayaram: However, I can use anything... a frog, a stone, or whatever. All have their own manifest Being and touch other parts of Being.
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Tarmel Udimo: I think that's what the tree was describing was its treeness
    Suryavarman Jayaram: :-) nod
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Before the bell... you spoke the word "unfolding"
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: It made me thing of Tolle's words: "You are here to enable the divine purpose of the universe to unfold."
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: You and the tree are doing just that.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: So wonderful... so beautiful
    Tarmel Udimo: yes, except i no longer use divine or purpose:)
    Suryavarman Jayaram: hehehe
    Tarmel Udimo: hehehe
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I understand your meaning
    Tarmel Udimo: nods
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I am smiling inwardly, because this medium called "Second" Life feels so much like the "only life." The quality of peace your presence bring to this space is so settling and peaceful.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Thank you.
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I must sleep now.
    Tarmel Udimo: good night Suyra
    Suryavarman Jayaram: I do hope Sophia returns.
    Tarmel Udimo: she will
    Suryavarman Jayaram: Peace
    Tarmel Udimo: not tonight perhaps
    Tarmel Udimo: waves goodbye


    Tag page (Edit tags)
    • No tags
    You must login to post a comment.
    Powered by MindTouch Core