2009.04.21 07:00 - Appreciate Humongous Diversity

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Riddle Sideways. The comments are by Riddle Sideways.
    [2009.05.03] This is a repost (I swear it is) of what I posted and later commented, but the server lost it.  Hope I can think up the comments now that it flushed out of my memory.

    Aurel was already there when I entered.

    aurel Miles: hello
    Riddle Sideways: good Morning
    Riddle Sideways: My computer and I are trying to wakeup
    aurel Miles: I'm in Eastern Canada - so I'm awake
    aurel Miles: but not to worry
    aurel Miles: I am answering ims
    Riddle Sideways: sometimes I see couples or even a group of 3-5 at a table all on cel phones
    aurel Miles: pardon?
    Riddle Sideways: reference to us both SL sitting quietly together
    Riddle Sideways: but really doing other tech
    aurel Miles: oh
    aurel Miles: I see the paralell.
    Riddle Sideways: went to a concert this weekend and my neighbor and person in next row were both txt'ing
    Riddle Sideways: during explanation of the next song
    aurel Miles: but for me, one of the reasons I like SL is because I can function the way I normally would without getting impatient
    aurel Miles: I find it hard to sit through a concert without writing
    aurel Miles: I used to review them
    aurel Miles: there is an interesting book out on the subject of exactly this
    Riddle Sideways: ah, I think that might be different
    aurel Miles: of course the author is quite ageist
    aurel Miles: actually it's not much different
    aurel Miles: at least, not to me
    aurel Miles: the author's premise was that this generation is growing up with differently wired brains than previous generations
    Riddle Sideways: which might be a good/bad thing
    aurel Miles: like all things, in my opinion, it is
    aurel Miles: i tend to see it as good.
    aurel Miles: but i see everything as good
    aurel Miles: i mean
    aurel Miles: not to sound like a pollyanna
    aurel Miles: but investing the actual idea or observation with my own judgements
    aurel Miles: is not something that interests me
    aurel Miles: i am interested in how the author was able to decide it is generational
    aurel Miles: i am not of the generation he refeers to
    aurel Miles: but my brain works that way
    aurel Miles: i grew up with a father who never watched tv without reading
    aurel Miles: and i think it started there
    Susi and Pema enter
    aurel Miles: Hi Susi
    aurel Miles: i think it's good to broaden out
    aurel Miles: however you do it
    Riddle Sideways: yes, my father always read with the tv on
    Susi Alcott: hi Riddle and aurel
    Pema Pera: Hi Aurel, Riddle, Susi!
    Susi Alcott: Hi Pema.
    Small review for Susi and Pema.
    Riddle Sideways: the observation of that there are many people re-wiring their brains to multitask through tech is prolly good
    Susi Alcott: (rl phone
    aurel Miles: Hi Pema
    aurel Miles: it makes me a more careful listener
    Riddle Sideways: the observation that the next generation is such and such is bad
    aurel Miles: that bothers me
    Riddle Sideways: hi Pema
    aurel Miles: that has always bothered me
    aurel Miles: we, as a society, spend so much time trying to set up these stupid barriers -
    aurel Miles: and then justifying them
    aurel Miles: every time we seem to be getting a handle on that, a new one pops up
    aurel Miles: ageism
    aurel Miles: prejudice against weight.
    the gentle reader should stop here and make a list of all the prejudges, bigotrys, discriminations, etc.  Make that long long list.  Try hard to remember all of them.  Watch yourself.  Which ones are thought of first and which are last (or not even thought of today).
    Riddle Sideways: few years ago, I went on a hunt of the trend of sensation authors to sell books off trendy ideas
    aurel Miles: or looks
    Moon Fargis: ^^/
    aurel Miles: it's all bigotry
    Riddle Sideways: hi Moon
    aurel Miles: Hi Moon
    Riddle Sideways: sorry moon, no candy today
    aurel Miles: and the fact that we keep making up new ones just makes me sad.
    Pema Pera: Hi Moon!
    Susi Alcott: Hi Moon.
    Moon groans loudly that I have no candy today.
    aurel Miles: Anyhow - I like that about SL
    aurel Miles: i like being able to read and write 2 or 3 things at once
    Riddle Sideways: around the turn of the other century there was a trend to believe different races had differing brain sizes
    aurel Miles: voice seems kind of dictatorial to me especially since i usually have music in the background
    aurel Miles: true
    aurel Miles: but they also thought we saw by sending rays out of our eyes
    aurel Miles: and that sperm was made of little tiny peoplke
    aurel Miles: people
    aurel Miles: no egg involved
    aurel Miles: which is why we say "she is having his baby"
    aurel Miles: and other things like that
    Pema Pera: so maybe some things have improved then :-)
    aurel Miles: sure - they always are, aren't they?
    Pema Pera: the fact that we can talk so openly about ageism, etc, seems like a good thing

    yes it truely is...

    And yet...
    In my span of years I have heard and said that sort of phrase so many times.
    Things have been improving more and more. Why aren't things all better now.  They must have been in really bad shape. Most think we have not improved enough yet.

    Riddle Sideways: I read (actually very well written) expose about how scientist can get their grants if they include global warming in their therory
    Pema Pera: writing grants: the art of begging.
    [insert any phrase above ("green", "war effort", "anti-terrorism", etc.]
    aurel Miles: Pema turned my attention to the idea of collective subjectivity in science and I like that a lot
    aurel Miles: it humanizes things for me
    Riddle Sideways: a good beggar knows the crowd
    Pema Pera: objectivity is a special kind of shared subjectivity . . . .
    aurel Miles: i have a tendency to take authorities at their word sometimes and that is not a good idea
    Now there is another subject we could all take off on with lots and lots of examples / horror stories.  (Like the treatment my 89 year old mother did NOT get over the last 2 weeks by doctors, nurses and hospital authorities)
    Pema Pera: there was another good article titled "if global warming only had a moustache"
    Pema Pera: if we can have a photograph of one bad guy to blame
    Pema Pera: we can spend trillions of dollars to get that guy
    Riddle Sideways: true
    Pema Pera: but global warming for decades was just too abstract to fight
    Pema Pera: "warm on global warming" naaah
    aurel Miles: Bin Laden
    Pema Pera: *war*
    Moon Fargis: ep.. have to go, sory, see you ^^/
    Susi Alcott: sry gotta go
    Pema Pera: "war on global warming" just doesn't sound right
    Pema Pera: bye Moon!
    Riddle Sideways: sorry susi
    Pema Pera: bye Susi
    Susi Alcott: _/!\_
    aurel Miles: oops
    aurel Miles: bye
    Riddle Sideways: is it that war has to have a face,or
    Riddle Sideways: the presenters have to have a face on the target
    aurel Miles: I always thought it was the other way around
    aurel Miles: they need a specific monster
    read: The News Media giant industry.
    Pema Pera: yes
    Pema Pera: hate target
    aurel Miles: but it has to be a strange monster
    aurel Miles: not a recognizeable human
    Pema Pera: tribalism: the other to fight
    aurel Miles: but someone they can say is "not like us"
    Pema Pera: yes
    Riddle Sideways: I have spent so many years with people not like me
    Riddle Sideways: spent so many years trying really hard not to see differences
    aurel Miles: i need to attend to something in the round world
    aurel Miles: sorry to pop off
    aurel Miles: see you soon!
    Pema Pera: bye Aurel!
    Riddle Sideways: ok
    Riddle Sideways: bye Aurel
    aurel Miles: enjoy Japan Pema!
    Pema Pera: two of us left in flatland . . . .
    aurel Miles: nice to meet you Riddle!
    Pema Pera: thank you Aurel
    Riddle Sideways: yes
    Pema Pera: I'm at the airport
    Pema Pera: at JFK in New York
    Pema Pera: about to fly to Tokyo
    Pema Pera: just in time for a PaB session :-)
    Riddle Sideways: was in jfk last week
    Pema Pera: yes, I remember your reports :)
    Riddle Sideways: good you could make it
    Pema Pera: 14 hour flight so I'll have to miss two PaB sessions . . ..
    tech talk ahead
    Pema Pera: still no internet on fligths
    Riddle Sideways: do you use a satellite modem?
    Pema Pera: no, an assortment
    Pema Pera: T-mobile, verizon, Japanese e-mobile, you name it
    Riddle Sideways: wifi everywhere
    Pema Pera: I have a plug-in cell phone type card for the US and one for Japan
    Riddle Sideways: I travel in the woods a lot
    Riddle Sideways: no wifi in rural
    Pema Pera: unless you have satellite :)
    Eos enters and I stop the tech talk before it gets rolling.
    Riddle Sideways: new subject...
    Pema Pera: Hi Eos!
    Riddle Sideways: thanks for the long email about illusions
    Riddle Sideways: am still studying it
    Pema Pera: oh, yw, I hope it was not too long and complex
    Riddle Sideways: hi Eos
    Eos Amaterasu: Hi Riddle
    Riddle Sideways: Pema, It is the right kind of complex
    Riddle Sideways: the kind that I read a few lines and dream off on many paths
    Pema Pera: can you share a path (or two)?
    I knew Pema would want to hear a specific point elaborated upon.
    I avoid that and go on with talk about the common process.

    Riddle Sideways: I am really thinking about the many paths right now
    Riddle Sideways: too bad Aural left
    Riddle Sideways: there is something about seeing the many paths
    Riddle Sideways: about to step
    Riddle Sideways: and so many forks, twists andd options ahead
    Riddle Sideways: putting aside good/bad
    Riddle Sideways: just seeing
    Riddle Sideways: there was a discussion sunday on time and/in dreams
    Riddle Sideways: that SL kicked me from
    Riddle Sideways: but, I was hearing many people making no diff between waking and dreaming time units
    Riddle Sideways: most seemed sure that time lengths are not uniform nor measurable in either
    Riddle Sideways: our memories / emotions mess with our judgements of time
    Riddle Sideways: so the length of time I/we can spend looking at all the possible paths may be seconds or hours
    Riddle Sideways wonders why I just go rambling in these sessions?
    Maybe, it is because I had 2-3 dialogs going :)
    The main point that I wanted to get to and though was:
    that moment of standing at the intersection of multiple possible paths ahead is of zeroeth time.  It should be throughly enjoyed as such.

    Pema Pera: I love the idea of many paths, and the dream like dimension of them
    Pema Pera: the key toward a balanced life seems to be appreciation of the humongous diversity without being paralyzed by it
    Pema Pera: smiling and letting go, yet also being totally engaged
    Pema Pera: Eos wrote something like that too, recently
    Pema Pera: and your New York report had that flavor, Riddle :)
    Eos Amaterasu: relaxation in fullness, in energy
    Eos Amaterasu: not being hungry or anxious about the many, but not rejecting it(them) either
    Riddle Sideways: totally emersed in our playing
    Riddle Sideways: not looking forward to the next meal
    Eos Amaterasu: play has quality of both involvement and transparency
    Pema Pera: ah, here was Eos' quote, from last week, found it again:
    Pema Pera: Eos Amaterasu: as they say, your vision should be as vast as the sky, and your conduct as fine as dust
    Riddle Sideways: ooo like that
    Eos Amaterasu: that's classic saying from meditation masters for centuries (bowing to them :-)
    Pema Pera: yes, and always good to be reminded!
    Pema Pera: and Riddle, I'm serious, I really hope you will tell us about some of the paths you're meandering on, dreamwise or not, in response to my illusion of illusion essay
    Pema Pera: it was a tricky topic to write about, and I'd love to follow it up further, hearing how others see that kind of balance between what is really here and what we impute to be here
    Pema Pera: what is here is so much more real that we ever can think/see/believe
    Pema Pera: and yet it is all open and empty too . . . .
    Pema Pera: so outside all our categories of thought and judgment
    Eos Amaterasu: what is here (including "I") is more a potency, ability to be, than something fixed
    Riddle Sideways: and I would like to read Pema's goings down those paths too
    Riddle Sideways: much of your writing
    Riddle Sideways: is to convince us to let go
    Riddle Sideways: to get us up to the edge
    Riddle Sideways: Pema should write of what is off his edges
    Riddle Sideways: I will write about what is off mine
    Pema Pera: yes, I'm equally trying to let myself go and get up & off my edge :-)
    Pema Pera: it is so nice to explore together
    Pema Pera: helping an complementing each other
    Pema Pera: and ourselves
    Riddle Sideways: yes, most of us in this group are/have been out there
    Riddle Sideways: and find solise in the company of others
    Riddle Sideways: I never really needed to be told it was okay that the world is different through mine eyes
    Riddle Sideways: but it helps
    Riddle Sideways: to hear that others take a deep breathe at 15 minute spans
    Riddle Sideways: to know the universe while in the mundane
    Riddle Sideways: while shuffling and avoiding shuffling the dust particles
    Riddle Sideways: to already know you are the universe
    Riddle Sideways: and are but dust too
    Riddle Sideways: play is a good word for us to start getting the point across
    Riddle Sideways: but it goes beyond
    Riddle Sideways: after 'playing' (need another word) with working hypothesis for a while
    Riddle Sideways: we start using it
    Riddle Sideways: then we are the working hypothesis
    Riddle Sideways: looking into why it is not fact
    Riddle Sideways: proven
    Eos Amaterasu: play with the little gap every 15 min, then you are it?
    Riddle Sideways: or... 'BE' the little gap
    Eos Amaterasu: going _to_ the gap, then find you're coming _from_ the gap
    Eos Amaterasu: and everything, all the little dust details, arise from/in it as well
    Eos Amaterasu: big bang, big gap :-)
    Pema Pera: (sorry, have to leave now, great talking with you, as always!)
    Riddle Sideways: that there is and is no diff
    Riddle Sideways: ok, bye pema
    Pema Pera: bye for now
    Eos Amaterasu: Thnx, bye
    Riddle Sideways: have the goo flight
    Pema Pera: thanks!
    Riddle Sideways: *good
    Eos Amaterasu: Going to Japan?
    Riddle Sideways: yes
    Riddle Sideways: yes, the Big Bang was a big/small gap
    Riddle Sideways: or 'that' big bang was among the big gaps
    Riddle Sideways: sometimes picturing string therory helps
    Eos Amaterasu: :-)
    Riddle Sideways: sometimes listening helps
    Eos Amaterasu: attending, yes....
    Eos Amaterasu: it's also a bit contagious; it communicates to others a bit, even though it's held personally
    Riddle Sideways: and the opposite too.
    Eos Amaterasu: I must return to RL , thanks Riddle!
    Riddle Sideways: no no thank you
    Riddle Sideways: it was very nice
    Eos Amaterasu: Yes, ciao!
    Riddle Sideways: bye
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