2009.03.08 19:00 - People and the Fabric of Time

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    The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

    doug Sosa and I began with a discussion of  each other and RL common interests before he had to leave.   The conversation continues after the arrival of Riddle Sideways discussing his thoughts on the fabric of time.


    stevenaia Michinaga: welcome doug
    stevenaia Michinaga: welcome
    doug Sosa: hm, getting settled. Where is folks?
    doug Sosa: and hi steve.
    stevenaia Michinaga: this is it, quite a turn out for the earlier meeting, perhaps everyone is PaB'd out
    stevenaia Michinaga: how are you?
    doug Sosa: i am ok. many involvements. I am not quite used to such a pace. Yourself?
    stevenaia Michinaga: what do you do in your spare and not so spare time
    stevenaia Michinaga: I keep my pace nice and consistent
    doug Sosa: hm. How to answer meaningfully. http://humanitieslab.stanford.edu/SSC/41 
    doug Sosa: i like that consistent approach, but then i like spontaneity.
    stevenaia Michinaga: hmm, makes things easier
    doug Sosa: so, right now, politics, the economy, the various ways of understanding it, trying to track closely.
    doug Sosa: trying to paint, play some bach, read a novel every fifteen minutes :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: that many balls in the air should keep you running
    doug Sosa: or let them float by!
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
    stevenaia Michinaga: my cousin is looking at Stanford for grad work
    doug Sosa: what field?
    stevenaia Michinaga: not sure, business perhaps, seems they have made her a difficult offer to refuse
    doug Sosa: difficult?
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, lots of perks, hard to refuse
    stevenaia Michinaga: hard
    doug Sosa: or easy to accept.
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, that too
    doug Sosa: i love blending in PaB with such an intense schedule
    stevenaia Michinaga: my other cousin visits the hoover institute for research often
    doug Sosa: somewhat strange place, Hoover. National Security and all that.
    stevenaia Michinaga: it is certainly a nice campus, I have a client in Mountainview
    doug Sosa: the campus is amazing. What kind of client?
    stevenaia Michinaga: well he goes there to research himself as they have files on him there :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: my client is another relative who I am doing some work for on their house
    doug Sosa: strange, what would he want to know? Obviously what other s know of him
    doug Sosa: I also love houses, if i were to do it again i'd be an architect builder.
    stevenaia Michinaga: not sure, he runs in socialist circles
    doug Sosa: love it, "runs in circles"/
    stevenaia Michinaga: hehe
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes architecture can be very enjoyable
    doug Sosa: an endless project, that's what i like. building any house to include a garden, a theater, a pool..
    doug Sosa: Right now i just want walls, walls to put diagrams on.
    stevenaia Michinaga: I have had some clients like that
    stevenaia Michinaga: interesting that some of what you do is graphical and you paint?
    stevenaia Michinaga: paint?
    doug Sosa: yes.
    stevenaia Michinaga: how do you find that?
    stevenaia Michinaga: words vs images
    doug Sosa: well, the act of painting is wondrous. and people seem to like what i do. I tried
    doug Sosa: a few years ago doing cartoons where the characters said very wise things, like to took some sections of plato and some of Confucius and did them as cartoon strips.
    doug Sosa: but i never learned to type well :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: same here
    stevenaia Michinaga: so your work is analysis?
    doug Sosa: one part of it. then there is consulting - which means trying to create very good strategic conversations.
    doug Sosa: That lets me think about anything.
    stevenaia Michinaga: :) nice
    doug Sosa: I am concerned that land and real estate are so locked up that in this difficult economy we cannot experiment.
    doug Sosa: With interesting new small buildings.
    stevenaia Michinaga: I am on regional planning commission, trying to do creative things but the market has always resisted
    doug Sosa: Ah, silicon valley region?
    stevenaia Michinaga: affordable housing types that no one wants to build, no Pennsylvania
    stevenaia Michinaga: is there affordable housing in Silicon Valley...grins?
    doug Sosa: Ah. A few years ago we got a developed in a conversation with a town and his designs got more interesting, so local people said "if you build that i will buy one." it got more complex and more people liked them, and finally the whole project was sold before breaking ground on the first house.
    doug Sosa: No, basically none.
    stevenaia Michinaga: and nothing was built?
    doug Sosa: Oh yes, all were built, but no marketing costs, and the buyers were involved.
    stevenaia Michinaga: how many units, roughly?
    doug Sosa: the "none" was silicon valley. the project was on Whidbey Island.
    doug Sosa: about 40.
    doug Sosa: The market was artists, musicians, tiny new families, retired people. the concept was small but attractive.
    stevenaia Michinaga: with housing prices and developers not being about to get funds, some interestingly creative things are beginning to happen here,
    doug Sosa: Also divorced folks. The tradeoff was smaller house larger lot, including paths, trails.
    doug Sosa: Today's NYT had a few interesting articles about detroit and cleveland, the one dollar house, people moving in, brining friends, making small communities. i like it.
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, a concept called "cottage housing" in groups with smaller nicer units w/ common green space is being worked on here density increases allowed
    doug Sosa: got a link to "interesting things"?
    stevenaia Michinaga: more local stories of developers working with "union development funds" to get projects moving in return for using Union labor
    stevenaia Michinaga: local bridge authorities funding development projects
    doug Sosa: Ha, i once consulted with the bricklayers union. i had a good time. I will google cottage housing, and right now i've got to go off to our local theater, so need to say bye.
    stevenaia Michinaga: seems new restaurants are springing up in downtowns even now
    stevenaia Michinaga: ok, will send you a link, it's a west coast concept http://lvpc.org/pdf/cottageHousingDev.pdf
    doug Sosa: lots of great young chefs. Bye

    Riddle Sideways joins me followed by Corvuscorva Nightfire.  Riddle was working though issues of TIME, movies and books and a most interesting description of the fabric of TIME

    stevenaia Michinaga: hello Riddle
    Riddle Sideways: hello
    stevenaia Michinaga: Doug Sosa just left
    stevenaia Michinaga: have a seat
    Riddle Sideways: was wondering if you had been by self all along
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: we were just discussing common interests
    Riddle Sideways: I have a clock in this room that has not been turned ahead
    stevenaia Michinaga: ahead?
    stevenaia Michinaga: to DST
    Riddle Sideways: do to a Bush thing California springs ahead last night
    stevenaia Michinaga: thought there was DST before Bush
    Riddle Sideways: funny, I am trying to catch up with the TIME studies here
    stevenaia Michinaga: grins
    Riddle Sideways: there was but it would have been next week
    Riddle Sideways: am being overpowered by TIME twists and turns on several other channels too
    Riddle Sideways: am reading Watchman
    Riddle Sideways: before going to the movie
    stevenaia Michinaga: the movie got bad review :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: I usually go to those movies
    Riddle Sideways: there is a major section where time is being messed with
    stevenaia Michinaga: what do you mean by TIME twists
    Riddle Sideways: the reviewers might not know what they are seeing
    stevenaia Michinaga: in the movie?
    Riddle Sideways: Dr. Manhattan knows many things about the future
    stevenaia Michinaga: I read about his abilities
    Riddle Sideways: there is an odd sequence with him coming to pick up leading lady
    Riddle Sideways: because they have to be on mars for the conversation they will have
    Riddle Sideways: she keeps saying that if he knows the conversation then he knows his decision
    Riddle Sideways: and could tell her now
    Riddle Sideways: but he can't tell her until they have the conversation
    stevenaia Michinaga: isn't time now PPF fun in the hands of a good writer
    Riddle Sideways: yes
    stevenaia Michinaga: you live in CA?
    Riddle Sideways: yes
    Riddle Sideways: 2nd... what I do watch on tv is recorded and time-shifted
    Riddle Sideways: therez a hand to drawto
    Riddle Sideways: so I sometimes watch yesterdays stuff
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods, some of that in Hulu now to
    stevenaia Michinaga: on web
    stevenaia Michinaga: save the costs of tivo :)
    Riddle Sideways: yes
    Riddle Sideways: am listening to audible book "Wheel of Time" series
    stevenaia Michinaga: unfamiliar with that
    Riddle Sideways: they point to cycles of repeated patterns, lives, etc.
    Riddle Sideways: Robert Conrad, I think
    Riddle Sideways: same as happened 1000 years ago
    Riddle Sideways: 2 of the main characters are holding memories of several people in their heads
    stevenaia Michinaga: looking on itunes, lots of music with that title :)
    Riddle Sideways: for long I have been struggling with placing time in dimensional context
    Riddle Sideways: we are looking at not looking at time as a one dimensional aspect
    Riddle Sideways: yet, if I look deeply at my time-line
    Riddle Sideways: and see it is not your time-line
    Riddle Sideways: but we are close
    Riddle Sideways: this evening we overlap
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes
    Riddle Sideways: I think we weave a blanket of threads
    Riddle Sideways: if 12 of us overlapping here
    Riddle Sideways: we make a small scarf
    stevenaia Michinaga: for a moment
    Riddle Sideways: with you in your blue period and my black thoughts, we make a colorful mat
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, that we are
    Riddle Sideways: so what happens when the mat/scarf/napkin is folded up to be put away?
    stevenaia Michinaga: or, unwoven the threads remain
    stevenaia Michinaga: the pattern is what no longer exists
    Riddle Sideways: and if we stop / halt the ppf line
    stevenaia Michinaga: not the content
    stevenaia Michinaga: the we have a snapshot
    stevenaia Michinaga: then
    stevenaia Michinaga: how else can it be halted, except to observe it from another time?
    Riddle Sideways: to loosen the hold on the thread
    Riddle Sideways: to step in a unique direction
    Riddle Sideways: to encompass all not just now
    Riddle Sideways: 3 ways
    Riddle Sideways: hard to do
    stevenaia Michinaga: all at once?
    Riddle Sideways: hi Corvi
    stevenaia Michinaga: hi corvi
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi, Riddle, Steve
    Riddle Sideways: thatz better, you had missed the pillow
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
    stevenaia Michinaga: we were just discussing... time moments? would you like to clarify? Riddle
    Riddle Sideways: wish I could
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, you looked a bit off there Corvi
    stevenaia Michinaga: ...grins
    Corvuscorva Nightfire giggles and tosses the pillow at Steve
    Riddle Sideways: confusion will be my epitaph
    stevenaia Michinaga: haven;t heard that line in decades
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Riddle Sideways: am wrestling with my own time problems
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: like daylight savings...?
    Riddle Sideways: sorry, I love king crimson
    Corvuscorva Nightfire grins.
    stevenaia Michinaga: I do to
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: that's certainly nothing to be sorry about.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: i hope
    Riddle Sideways: some of my clocks are right twice a day
    Corvuscorva Nightfire snickers.
    stevenaia Michinaga: hello Neelix
    Riddle Sideways: half are not set to tomorrows work time
    stevenaia Michinaga: have a seat, have you been here before?
    stevenaia Michinaga: hmmmm, exit stage right
    Riddle Sideways: another moment
    Riddle Sideways: characters enter and exit
    Riddle Sideways: yes there is a timelessness
    Riddle Sideways: seems to be just out of my reach
    stevenaia Michinaga: there is always that
    Riddle Sideways: another part of Watchmen (corvi, I am reading it) has
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: love that!
    Riddle Sideways: the kid reading history, the newspaper guy reporting history
    Riddle Sideways: and many people buying the history reports
    Riddle Sideways: todays news is tomorrows history
    Riddle Sideways: yet it repeats
    Riddle Sideways: many times I could just read the same newspaper again
    stevenaia Michinaga: like Groundhog Day?
    Riddle Sideways: and every day the paperboy brings more - pink floyd
    Riddle Sideways: like Groundhog Day
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: hahah
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: i love Alan Moore
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: I have loved his stuff since the Swamp thing.
    Riddle Sideways: have gotten into him just lately
    Riddle Sideways: V was my first
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: He's such a good writer.
    Riddle Sideways: ever find yourself wondering which dialog bubble comes first
    Riddle Sideways: very much like SL chat
    Corvuscorva Nightfire laughs.
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes and lag
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: yeah
    Riddle Sideways: yes, the lag
    Riddle Sideways: I was describing our time-lines as threads
    Riddle Sideways: into a large mat, napkin or sharve
    Riddle Sideways: my line is lagging beside yours
    stevenaia Michinaga: and a meeting as a weave
    Corvuscorva Nightfire smiles.
    Riddle Sideways: the lag of transmission makes that seem even more possible
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: mmm
    Riddle Sideways: your time line is not the same
    Riddle Sideways: due to a lag
    Riddle Sideways: yet we still weave
    Riddle Sideways: by the time I type this and get it sent
    Riddle Sideways: we all have gone on
    Riddle Sideways: someplace
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods, thoughtfully.
    stevenaia Michinaga: not to far
    stevenaia Michinaga: just a bit ahead
    Riddle Sideways: there are little bits (pun intended)
    Riddle Sideways: where we each get to be ahead/behind
    Corvuscorva Nightfire rolls her eyes.
    Riddle Sideways: a pun ill do that
    Riddle Sideways: and between us there are missing letters
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods, laughs.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: same one
    stevenaia Michinaga: Is it an hour earlier then yesterday, or an hour later? scratches head
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: later..
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: it would have been 10:22 now
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: our time
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: 7:22 sl
    Riddle Sideways: to repeat... does anybody really know what time it is
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: urk!!!!
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods to Pema and laughs.
    stevenaia Michinaga: does anybody really care
    Riddle Sideways: ty
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: oh god
    stevenaia Michinaga: listens for chorus
    Riddle Sideways: the cycle of all the days comes and goes.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire holds my head in my hands as the two of you sing....smiles.
    stevenaia Michinaga: PaB breaks out in song
    Riddle Sideways: there.... song is over
    Corvuscorva Nightfire grins.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: laughs a little.
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: honestly if i didn't sing off key and out of tune i'd've joined you.
    stevenaia Michinaga: on that note, I think it; time for me to call it a night
    Riddle Sideways: does it really bother you that there was no 2:34am this morning
    stevenaia Michinaga: I think I sept through that
    stevenaia Michinaga: slept
    Riddle Sideways: I need to go too
    stevenaia Michinaga: which is the point of it I suppose
    Corvuscorva Nightfire: gnight all
    Riddle Sideways: I go to think this stuff through
    stevenaia Michinaga: thanks for coming, I don;t see you much at this hour
    Riddle Sideways: no I usually busy
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
    Riddle Sideways: elsewise
    Corvuscorva Nightfire nods.
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