2009.03.06 13:00 - Metaphorical Butt-Kick

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Solobill Laville. The comments are by Solobill Laville. I'll attempt to go through and add comments asap...

        Solobill Laville: Hi, Tarmel! :)
        Tarmel Udimo: hey Solo, long time no see:-)
        Tarmel Udimo: Very nice outfit!
        Solobill Laville: :) Thanks
        Solobill Laville: How have you been?
        Tarmel Udimo: very good
        Tarmel Udimo: thought I was coming down with a cold, but seem to be fighting it off
        Solobill Laville: Oh, great!
        Tarmel Udimo: how about you?
        Solobill Laville: Very well! Busy, but managing to stay balanced
        Solobill Laville: Nice necklace...reminds me of Venice
        Tarmel Udimo: oh ty, came with another outfit and I like it so wear it all the time
        Tarmel Udimo: have you been to Venice?
        Solobill Laville: Yes, once
        Tarmel Udimo: liked it?
        Solobill Laville: Yes, it is I think the most romantic city in the World, in my experience
        Solobill Laville: I was there off-prime tourist season though
        Tarmel Udimo: yes?
        Solobill Laville: I hear it can get crowded and a bit "odorous" in the summer ;)
        Tarmel Udimo: and was it romantic?
        Solobill Laville: Oh, cobblestone sidewalks, intimate restaurants
        Solobill Laville: No cars...canals...bridges
        Solobill Laville: San Marco square
        Solobill Laville: yes
        Tarmel Udimo: ahh so the architecture and ambience was romantic but was the hreat pounding?
        Tarmel Udimo: heart
        Solobill Laville considers
        Solobill Laville: The environment greatly contributed to a pounding heart, yes
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Wol Euler: hello solo, tarmel
        Tarmel Udimo: hey there Wol-e
        Solobill Laville: :) Ms. Euler!
        Wol Euler: evening all!
        Wol Euler: morning to you, tarmel, of course
        Tarmel Udimo: yep, was up at 6:00am so now latish morning
        Wol Euler: o.O
        Tarmel Udimo: I was just putting solo on the spot and he's managed to avoid the question very nicely
        Wol Euler: oooh, tricky.
        Solobill Laville: Hello, Fefonz! :)
        Wol Euler: hello fefonz
        Tarmel Udimo: hey fefonz
        Fefonz Quan: Hey Tarmel, Solo, Wol :)
        Solobill Laville: It was the last pre-children vacation with my wife and we had a lovely time, Tarmel ;)
        Tarmel Udimo: that's more like it:-)
        Tarmel Udimo: hello Anonymous1
        Anonymous1: hello everybody
        Solobill Laville: Hello, Anonymous1! :)
        Wol Euler: hello Anonymous1
        Anonymous1: whats up!
        Fefonz Quan: hi Anonymous1
        Wol Euler: clouds...
        Wol Euler: the bankruptcy rate
        Wol Euler: :)
        Anonymous1: what am i suppost to do here?
        Tarmel Udimo: yes everyone with kids talks about PC life with wismy solo
        Solobill Laville: We are part of a group that explores "what is real"
        Wol Euler: we are a meditation group, Anonymous1
        Solobill Laville: We all meet here to discuss our experiences, to create a shared vocabulary and an experiential library of sorts.
        Solobill Laville: Many times, it's about communicating those things in a way that the people you're with get your intent, get where you're coming from which is in the best case an open honest place.
        Solobill Laville: *Cal Heron
        Solobill Laville: Have you been here before Anonymous1?
        Anonymous1: no
        Anonymous1: i dont know how to play this game very well
        Solobill Laville: ok, there's no expectations really
        Fefonz Quan: brb
        Wol Euler: its not a game in the usual sense Anonymous1. There are no points, no score, no winning, no losing ...
        Solobill Laville: We use Sl more as a platform to communicate
        Anonymous1: i gotta it!
        Solobill Laville: I can give you a notecard or two about the group if you're interested
        Anonymous1: i just star this game 2 day ago...
        Fefonz Quan: back (with tea :))
        Anonymous1: ok
        Solobill Laville: wb, Fef
        Wol Euler: ah well, lost another one to Mara
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Fael Illyar: Hi Everyone :)
        Wol Euler: hello faeil
        Tarmel Udimo: :-)
        Solobill Laville: Hi, Fael! :)
        Tarmel Udimo: hi fael
        Fefonz Quan: Hi Feal :)
        Solobill Laville: Maybe we need to develop a PaB game for newbies
        Fael Illyar: game?
        Wol Euler: ooh great idea!
        Wol Euler: with points.
        Wol Euler: and buried treasure
        Solobill Laville: A Being gun, perhaps?
        Tarmel Udimo: hahashahaha
        Fefonz Quan: each 9-sec you get one point
        Solobill Laville: Ooh, points and buried treasure is much better
        Tarmel Udimo: if you last for 15mins you get many more points
        Wol Euler: exchange your treasure for a karmic upgrade
        Solobill Laville: And in the last 10 minutes we can have a "Mara dance party"!
        Wol Euler: :)
        Tarmel Udimo: grins
        Fefonz Quan: :)
        Solobill Laville: Any topics to share?
        Fefonz Quan: maybe
        Wol Euler raises an eyebrow
        Fefonz Quan: thought lately about the heart part in our practice
        Wol Euler: mm?
        Fael Illyar: umm... part?
        Fefonz Quan: we talk a lot about being, about pheno, about appearances, and i fell that i need sometimes
        Tarmel Udimo: can there be a seperation?
        Fefonz Quan: feel*
        Wol Euler: do you mean that there is not enough "heart" in the sessions?
        Fefonz Quan: to get back to the more emotional, human in a way part of the path
        Fefonz Quan: how or is is connecting us more to people around us,
        Fefonz Quan: making us more compasionate and kind
        Solobill Laville: Perhaps it is always there, Fef, but we lose sight of it in the stratosphere of conceptualizing a lot of this stuff
        Fefonz Quan: didn't mean to say that Wol
        Fefonz Quan: yes, Solo
        Fefonz Quan: maybe i'm talking about my practice Wo, wouldn't blame the "sessions" at all
        Fael Illyar: The heart is in everything we do but we can also choose to just express the heart too.
        Fefonz Quan: how Fael?
        Tarmel Udimo: its strange but I find by staying present in being so to speak one sees celarly and feels clearly what is called for and as fael says sometimes its just heart stuff
        Solobill Laville: That is not strange at all Tarmel...I think it is a very natural occurence
        Solobill Laville: Ultimate naturalness actually :)
        Fael Illyar: I love you Fefonz :)
        Solobill Laville: :)
        Fefonz Quan: :)
        Fael Illyar: (was that expressive enough?)
        Tarmel Udimo: grins
        Solobill Laville: Fefonz, may I ask, does faith play any role in your practice?
        Wol Euler smiles
        Fefonz Quan like expressiveness
        Fael Illyar: I guess I mean this with expressing just the heart :)
        Fefonz Quan: faith is a complicated word for me
        Solobill Laville: Can you simplify it?
        Fefonz Quan: faith, like a faith in god is not a concept i follow, since i believe in experiennce and not pre-assumptions
        Fefonz Quan: but faith in the way that i have faith that i am walking in the right directin, yes
        Fefonz Quan: direction*
        Fael Illyar: to me God is not a pre-assumptions. Merely a term for something that's rather difficult to describe.
        Solobill Laville: That is the faith I meant
        Solobill Laville: (the latter)
        Fefonz Quan: though this needs checking every once in a while
        Fael Illyar: (if not downright impossible to describe)
        Fefonz Quan nods
        Chiaiu Chiung: hi all
        Wol Euler: hello chiaiu
        Solobill Laville: That faith in "right direction" is very important, imho
        Solobill Laville: Hi, Chiaiu! :)
        Fefonz Quan: and one of the checkings is what i'm doing now
        Fefonz Quan: Hi Chiaiu :)
        Tarmel Udimo: Hi Chiaiu
        Tarmel Udimo: being able to express arsing feelings which are different to emotions needs trust
        Fefonz Quan trying to avoid blind faith
        Tarmel Udimo: *Arising
        Fael Illyar: blind faith is best avoided by seeing :)
        Fefonz Quan: can you say more about the different between feelings and emotions?
        Tarmel Udimo: its more about how it arises
        Solobill Laville humbly must excuse himself...last accepted to a one-day retreat, bye all (I have claimed the log)
        Wol Euler: oooh, ecellent!
        Fefonz Quan: Bye Solo :)
        Fael Illyar: See you later Solo :)
        Wol Euler: bye solo, have a great time, be restful and enlightened
        Chiaiu Chiung: bye solo
        Tarmel Udimo: bye
        Solobill Laville: :) bye!
        Tarmel Udimo: its like a feeling state that arises from the center of me
        Tarmel Udimo: and usually assocaited with a feeling openess and vulnerabilty
        Tarmel Udimo: hwre as emotions are well we all experience them
        Tarmel Udimo: its difficult to be that open...
        Fefonz Quan: (just prefer that posture for my knees)
        Wol Euler: :)
        Tarmel Udimo: you can change by clicking on the mat
        Tarmel Udimo: move over chiaiu
        Fefonz Quan: So you are taking about openness Tarmel
        Tarmel Udimo: ahhh okay
        Tarmel Udimo: see about mat
        Tarmel Udimo: yes
        Fael Illyar: seems I need to go afk for a while...
        Wol Euler: hb
        Tarmel Udimo: when can get swept up in emotions but this 'feels' different its like my whole being is responding and yet remaining objective
        Tarmel Udimo: One
        Fefonz Quan: adn what you describe is connected to our practice?
        Tarmel Udimo: it doesn't happen very often
        Wol Euler: it sounds almost as though you mean "love" when you say "feeling"
        Wol Euler: (in the sense that we were trying to define love last friday)
        Tarmel Udimo: you could call it love in which case it is non human or very human
        Tarmel Udimo: but it relates to the practice because it is triggered by clarity
        Wol Euler: hello ari
        Chiaiu Chiung: hi arisia
        Fefonz Quan: hello arisia
        Tarmel Udimo: hi arisia
        Arisia Vita: Hi to all
        Tarmel Udimo: its the missing link that I think you are talking about fefonz
        Fefonz Quan: So if i understood you Tarmel you say that the practice helps you to open your heart in a way
        Tarmel Udimo: yes
        Wol Euler nods.
        Tarmel Udimo: in a non senitmental way
        Fefonz Quan: missing would be a little harsh
        Fefonz Quan: but that is the link i talk about, yes
        Tarmel Udimo: if taken as a critism and not a pointer:-)
        Fefonz Quan: i do know what you're taking about Tarmel, having expreienced it myself
        Tarmel Udimo: yes?
        Fefonz Quan: (i hope)
        Tarmel Udimo: of course you do:-)
        Fefonz Quan: but sometimes i feel that it is easy to feel like that on the cushion, but maintaining it while going on daily life
        Fefonz Quan: is the tricky part
        Wol Euler thinks about the "world's worst buddhist" link that Gen posted in the e-mail forum today
        Tarmel Udimo: yes interestinly enough taking the pressure off 'working' on it in daily life has allowed it to arise more often in daily life:-)
        Tarmel Udimo: yes I read that too
        Tarmel Udimo: it was fun and a much needed insight
        Fefonz Quan: i just started, then interrupted...
        Wol Euler nods
        Fael Illyar: Ah, Hi Ari :)
        Fefonz Quan: Wb Fael :0
        Tarmel Udimo: one needs a good rangle once in a while
        Fael Illyar is no longer afk.
        Fefonz Quan: :)
        Wol Euler: wb fael
        Arisia Vita: Hi Fael
        Tarmel Udimo: and a few emotional explosions
        Fefonz Quan: where there any in the article ?
        Tarmel Udimo: wol?
        Wol Euler: I too didn't get to the end, sorry :)
        Tarmel Udimo: ahhh
        Wol Euler: reading in the office, didn't think to finish it when I got home
        Tarmel Udimo: yes there was a bit of SHOUTING
        Arisia Vita: Hi Anonymous2
        Fefonz Quan: shouting may be very liberating
        Chiaiu Chiung: hi Anonymous2
        Tarmel Udimo: basically her friend was killing her with kindness and she just needed a good rave and rant and for that to be okay without the buddhist overtones ...
        Tarmel Udimo: hi Anonymous2
        Wol Euler: are you OK, Anonymous2?
        Fefonz Quan fefonz exercised shouting in a workshop once, a great experience
        Wol Euler: right-click on a cushion and select "sit" to join us
        Fael Illyar: Yes, everyone has different needs. She needed shouting, not comforting :)
        Tarmel Udimo: yes
        Fefonz Quan: yes, many times people confuse compassion with kindness
        Fefonz Quan: when it can be the opposite
        Tarmel Udimo: I did for a long time, still do sometimes
        Fefonz Quan: i found a kick in the butt (metaphoricly) to bring me some of the best quantum leaps forward
        Tarmel Udimo: yes:-)
        Fael Illyar: yes, some people just are able to give themselves the kick and might even do that too much. So those people don't need others kicking them more :)
        Fael Illyar: others can't and need it from others
        Fefonz Quan: yes, that's true
        Fefonz Quan: a good teacher should know to recognize it
        Fael Illyar: I find it a good "rule" to not look at rules, look at the person you're dealing with
        Fefonz Quan: exactly, that's what i meant in the previous response
        Fefonz Quan: and the tricky part is: try to look at him without your own filters
        Fael Illyar: filters, rules, are they not the same thing?
        Fefonz Quan: i wouldn't say so Fael
        Fefonz Quan: rules you set for yourselfs, your filters you are sometimes unaware of
        Wol Euler: that's a nice definition.
        Fael Illyar: can you give me an example of a filter?
        Tarmel Udimo: yes filters are the hardest
        Fael Illyar: and perhaps explanation how to tell it apart from a rule
        Fefonz Quan: a rule i telling you what to do: "if you meet a tall strong guy, he needs a kick in the but"
        Fefonz Quan: is *
        Fael Illyar: oh, you don't have rules you make for yourself? or is filter your term for those?
        Fefonz Quan: a filter is "when i see a tall big guy, i immediately feel intimidated, in both conscious or un conscious way"
        Fael Illyar: is that just not a rule that says "a tall big guy is dangerous"?
        Tarmel Udimo: no I think of it as a filter
        Fefonz Quan: well, maybe filters have some rules, but rules can apply to many things
        Fefonz Quan: filters define how we see the world, i think
        Fefonz Quan: rules can tell us what to do,
        Fael Illyar: isn't that interpreting and as such doing?
        Fefonz Quan: a more basic filter can be - i am color blinded
        Tarmel Udimo: filters feel more like they come from rules and embed themselves in us so we don't even know they are there
        Fefonz Quan: i'm not sure color blindness is a rule i put on myself
        Fael Illyar: Whether it is, or isn't, I don't know.
        Arisia Vita: If you all will excuse me, I want to catch the Kira meeting...
        Fael Illyar: but why does a rule have to be something you've put on yourself?
        Tarmel Udimo: yes i have to go too..
        Arisia Vita: hope to see you all again....
        Wol Euler: bye ari, take care
        Fefonz Quan: mee too
        Wol Euler: and bye tarmel too.
        Wol Euler: and fefonz
        Chiaiu Chiung: and me too
        Wol Euler: enjoy the weekend
        Wol Euler: bye chiaiu
        Wol Euler: bye fael
        Wol Euler: bye me
        Wol Euler: bye playgoda
        Fefonz Quan: have a good weekend too, Wol, Fael :)
        Fael Illyar: See you later Tarmel :)
        Chiaiu Chiung: bye all
        Fael Illyar: See you later Wol, Fefonz, Chiaiu

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