2012.01.01 13:00 - Do You Know How You Are?

The Guardian for this meeting was Eliza Madrigal. The comments are by Eliza Madrigal.

SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Eliza :)
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Sharon :))
SophiaSharon Larnia: how are you??
Eliza Madrigal: lovely to see you... so curious what you are up to lately, how work is going, family, life :))
Eliza Madrigal: Oh, and Happy New Year!
SophiaSharon Larnia: how was your holiday???
SophiaSharon Larnia: happy new year!!
SophiaSharon Larnia: ive been working a lot :)
Eliza Madrigal: wonderful in many ways, thanks
Eliza Madrigal: long hours?
SophiaSharon Larnia: not really, but alot of days
SophiaSharon Larnia: 8 hrs
Eliza Madrigal: hope you are resting and playing too then :)

SophiaSharon Larnia: Ive pushed myself a little hard, not much resting
SophiaSharon Larnia: im not sure why
SophiaSharon Larnia: but now find my self a little crazy :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: btw, you look good as a blond lol
Eliza Madrigal: :) maybe just the initial push of getting used to new schedules and such
Eliza Madrigal: :)Ty... this is the first blond I've felt comfortable in

SophiaSharon Larnia: i dont know, just a bit of Disequilibrium
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: i think the holidays on top of working a lot
Eliza Madrigal nods
Eliza Madrigal: holidays are fun but can be exhausting
SophiaSharon Larnia: first day to sit around and do nothing, fitting, on Jan 1st haha
Eliza Madrigal: :)))

Eliza Madrigal: the topic of 'equanimity' has been coming up spontaneously for a few of us
SophiaSharon Larnia: good
Eliza Madrigal: seems timely
SophiaSharon Larnia: i like it when that happens
Eliza Madrigal: me too :)
Eliza Madrigal: we support one another in the understructures sometimes I think...
Eliza Madrigal: even when not overtly communicating
SophiaSharon Larnia: hmm

SophiaSharon Larnia: how have you been Eliza?
SophiaSharon Larnia: thanks Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: :) most welcome
Eliza Madrigal: I have been overdoing some things and underdoing others
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh

SophiaSharon Larnia: hi there Zon
SophiaSharon Larnia: Im on the cushion youre standing on
Zon Kwan: hi hi
Eliza Madrigal: so this morning I've been writing a bit... integrating... about PaB, about family life, personal life, etc... 'being seen'
Zon Kwan: sery
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zon :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: nice Eliza
SophiaSharon Larnia: no problem Zon

Eliza Madrigal: Happy New Year Zon, how are you?
Zon Kwan: happy new year ELiza
Zon Kwan: mm..dont know

Zon Kwan: do you know how you are

Eliza Madrigal: :)
Eliza Madrigal checks in with self
Eliza Madrigal: :::looks around:::
Zon Kwan: yes ?
Eliza Madrigal: many contradictory things, so your point is well taken
Zon Kwan: lol
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Zon Kwan: part of me is fine

SophiaSharon Larnia: if im not in imminent danger, then im 'fine' ha
Eliza Madrigal: haha
Eliza Madrigal: an honest evaluation sometimes can take a while
Eliza Madrigal: shining the light here and there
Zon Kwan: it can
Zon Kwan: feelings can disturb clear evaluattion
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes indeed
Eliza Madrigal nods

--BELL--

SophiaSharon Larnia: experiences 'feelings' during the 90 sec pause, and feels a distracting shakiness of the body and hands.
Zon Kwan: nods..ceratin dullness i feel
Eliza Madrigal: mmm, feel my 'speediness'
SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles, you're probably up to a lot at once :)
Eliza Madrigal: inwardly, yes :)

Eliza Madrigal: have either of you done body scan meditations?
SophiaSharon Larnia: i started trying to go into my body... long story, but thats when i feel a lot of emotional stuff come up
Zon Kwan: yes
SophiaSharon Larnia: what exactly is body scan meditations, when you rest on each part of your body?
Eliza Madrigal: me too, honestly, which tells me there is something important there... stored memory or what-have-you
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes
Eliza Madrigal nods...
Eliza Madrigal: I find that it takes a while, that the quicker guided meditations one might find online aren't exactly helpful...
Eliza Madrigal: they bring stuff up but don't give one time to relax
Eliza Madrigal: but I guess they are a 'how are you'
Eliza Madrigal: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: ha :)

SophiaSharon Larnia: experiencing the present moment is in body
SophiaSharon Larnia: to attempt to glimpse awareness any other way seems like something missing

Zon Kwan: i have been wondering bout this
SophiaSharon Larnia: i avoided that forever, and almost gave up altogether. Im still not ready to face it
Zon Kwan: are we our bodies
Zon Kwan: or mind
SophiaSharon Larnia: listening
Eliza Madrigal: or neither or both

Eliza Madrigal: what are your thoughts about it so far Zon?
Zon Kwan: mixed
Zon Kwan: i know
Zon Kwan: i should be in my body
Zon Kwan: and mind disturbs
Zon Kwan: but
Zon Kwan: somehow
Zon Kwan: the mere body
Zon Kwan: seems
Zon Kwan: like
Zon Kwan: not me

Eliza Madrigal: emotions and body seem so intertwined to me, far moreso than emotions and mind
Eliza Madrigal: have to be intentional regarding body because I'm so easily 'in my head'
SophiaSharon Larnia: nods
Eliza Madrigal: which thinks it is control central, lol
Zon Kwan: must go,,just as it was coming interesting

SophiaSharon Larnia: thats what my last sculpture was about, the shadow has no head :)
Eliza Madrigal: bye for now Zon, thanks
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Zon :) nice to see you
Zon Kwan: see you
Eliza Madrigal: beautiful sculpture Sophia...
SophiaSharon Larnia: wasn't fishing :P but thanks, i shouldve written more i guess
Eliza Madrigal: why was there no head?
SophiaSharon Larnia: on the shadow?

SophiaSharon Larnia: because i am at times a head without a body, or a body without a head :)

--BELL--

Eliza Madrigal: I know not fishing... but I was up in the retreat center yestereday and sort of pondering you, your talents, many lovely things you've done for pab:)
SophiaSharon Larnia: feels like a really long time ago now, and I almost removed that place the other day. I was going to package it up, but thats a long undertaking from scratch, and some of the stuff up there is either no copy, or not mine. :)

Eliza Madrigal: :)
Eliza Madrigal: when you are creating in SL, is that body or 'in your head'?
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh, in my head
SophiaSharon Larnia: part of the draw
SophiaSharon Larnia: allows it
Eliza Madrigal: because in RL you are more physical?
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes

SophiaSharon Larnia: but i am very physical at work, and forget to eat, drink or go to the bathroom, totally a head without a body
SophiaSharon Larnia: digital
Eliza Madrigal: ah, yes I can get into that mode too... sort of ordering my body around... 'you can wait'... or forgetting it entirely
SophiaSharon Larnia: a bad habit :))
Eliza Madrigal: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: you wouldnt allow your kid to do it, you'd remind them

Eliza Madrigal: the first time I did yoga I cried and cried after realizing how compartmentalized I was, dis-intigrated I suppose
Eliza Madrigal: true
SophiaSharon Larnia: oooh really
SophiaSharon Larnia: i want to start yoga this month
SophiaSharon Larnia: i had this idea that in a class id HAVE to
SophiaSharon Larnia: lol
Eliza Madrigal: haha...yes...
Eliza Madrigal: I tried a few different things, and I still like walking...

Eliza Madrigal: but the teacher I found starts everything from the heart
Eliza Madrigal: maybe that's what's missing, re integrating mind / body

SophiaSharon Larnia: perhaps
SophiaSharon Larnia: starting out from a place of acceptance
Eliza Madrigal: which doesn't mean it isn't tough to override habit of saying "sshhh" to needs
Eliza Madrigal: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: haha to shh to needs, in my case its, huh?
Eliza Madrigal laughs
Eliza Madrigal: well, until one is floored and has to 'stop'
SophiaSharon Larnia: right. hit a wall, then body without a head
Eliza Madrigal: !
SophiaSharon Larnia: i am so mean to myself
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Korel :)
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Korel :)

Eliza Madrigal: do you have any notion why that is? or is that what is hard to look at?
SophiaSharon Larnia: just thinking right now... its easy to forget whatever I am thinking about, or what i have been contemplating.
SophiaSharon Larnia: i shelve it all
SophiaSharon Larnia: im sure something else will occur to me later about that
SophiaSharon Larnia: just, bad habits.
Korel Laloix: Heya
Eliza Madrigal nods
Eliza Madrigal: me too... yet trying to change them doesn't usually work for me... replacing , maybe :) so perhaps a class helps :))

SophiaSharon Larnia: yes, with a little gentle peer pressure
SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
Eliza Madrigal: :)) yup!
Eliza Madrigal: I'm really affected by environment too... so actually things like moving furniture or strange little things, can have a big effect on my habits
Eliza Madrigal: Hi San :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: I remember a long time ago, some one said something about wearing a necklace or charm to remind you to stay in the current moment
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi San :)
Santoshima Resident: hi eliza, sophia, korel
Korel Laloix: Heya
Eliza Madrigal: touchstones?

--BELL--

SophiaSharon Larnia: yes, sure, like in inception lol
Eliza Madrigal: "Am I being heedless?" totems... lol
SophiaSharon Larnia: i could wear a bell, and ensure that everyone else is in the current moment as well.
SophiaSharon Larnia: :P
Eliza Madrigal: =P~ haha
SophiaSharon Larnia: joking aside, ive been thinking of it lately
Eliza Madrigal: thanks for the discussion, find it very helpful too

Eliza Madrigal: San and Korel, we've been talking a bit about habits, suppose appropriate for the New Year
Eliza Madrigal: and about forgetting body... a little about 'checking in'
Eliza Madrigal: body scan meditations are perhaps like opening the windows of a house?
Eliza Madrigal: checking the weather, allowing circulation..
SophiaSharon Larnia: letting out the ghosts
Eliza Madrigal: :) Yes!
Eliza Madrigal: writing feels that way for me too, facing fears
Eliza Madrigal: calling bluffs
SophiaSharon Larnia: wonderful

Korel Laloix: To me just the concept of habits is hard to define.
Korel Laloix: What is a habit, vs a way that you just normally do something?
Eliza Madrigal: nods
Santoshima Resident: same
Santoshima Resident: which habits are destructive pattern and which are positive?
Korel Laloix: Or how serious or complex does it have to be to be a habit?
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh so even if it's positive, its still a habit
Santoshima Resident: sure
Santoshima Resident: of course
Korel Laloix: I can only start my car one way, is that a habit?
Eliza Madrigal: lol
Eliza Madrigal: for me, it can be a matter of not seeing when I'm doing something that in its time may have made sense, but doesn't any longer
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Santoshima Resident: how to replace unconscious habitual patterns with more conscious positive ones
Santoshima Resident: ?
Santoshima Resident: that is something that interests
Eliza Madrigal: nods, yes, to step up in a way
SophiaSharon Larnia: muscle memory of the brain

SophiaSharon Larnia: catching yourself could be the hardest part, maybe
Eliza Madrigal: seems so
Eliza Madrigal: the consciousness does seem the heart of it
Korel Laloix: Yes there can be bad habits, but the parts of my personality that are really disfuctional are much more complex than just habits.

--BELL--

SophiaSharon Larnia: for me personally, thinking in an unhappy way is habitual
Eliza Madrigal: so then in this context habits are more a reflection of something else... some unmet need or reasoning that is hiding beneath habits?
Korel Laloix: I don't think so, sometimes it is just the way you learned how to do something.

Santoshima Resident: habits are how our minds work / we seek pattern ~ how to encourage patterns/habits that encourage positivity
Korel Laloix: And it is fuctional, but not the best way.
Eliza Madrigal: nods ... there do seem to be reasons for our mechanisms... maybe that is the sense of 'useful in their time'
Eliza Madrigal: or in a different context...
Santoshima Resident: body Is the unconscious, certain thought patterns encourage/reflect body/mind states, imho
Zen Arado: Hi all
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Zen :)
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh interesting, body being unconscious
Santoshima Resident: hi zen :)
Eliza Madrigal nods, interesting

Santoshima Resident: not "being unconscious", IS the unconscious
Santoshima Resident: imho
Eliza Madrigal: could you unpack that a little San?
SophiaSharon Larnia: listens
Santoshima Resident: how would you like me to unpack that?
Santoshima Resident: in a way that i can address what is not being made clear
Santoshima Resident: i'll do my best
Eliza Madrigal: ah, for me, body is the area I most neglect perhaps.... pretty much where Sophia and I began the discussion... that body seems to house emotion... or...
Eliza Madrigal: hm... well your statement is intriguing

SophiaSharon Larnia: body awareness wakes up emotions it seems
SophiaSharon Larnia: it is very intriguing
Santoshima Resident: ok
SophiaSharon Larnia: and ill have to think about it
Santoshima Resident: how you just expressed that
Santoshima Resident: about emotions
Santoshima Resident: has something to do with the idea of body/mind split
SophiaSharon Larnia: nods

Santoshima Resident: when people become involved in yoga practice, for example
Santoshima Resident: often strong emotions surface
Eliza Madrigal: nods
Santoshima Resident: as deeper levels of the body/mind are accessed/made known
Zen Arado: physical practice San?
Santoshima Resident: could be called that, zen
Santoshima Resident: but much fuller than that
Zen Arado: ok
Santoshima Resident: could be through taiji
Santoshima Resident: could be through yoga
Santoshima Resident: music

Zen Arado: didn't think physical exercises would touch emptions is all
Santoshima Resident: ah, that might not be quite correct
Santoshima Resident: dancing
Zen Arado: but I can't do them anyway so have no knowledge or experience that way
Zen Arado: dancing hmmm

Korel Laloix: PHysical exerecion is a very powerful way to touch emotions.
Santoshima Resident: you have your own ways?
Eliza Madrigal: this happened to me with yoga, expressed earlier... cried and cried,... to me it seemed about integration, or rather its lack... of components freely communicating with one another....
Korel Laloix: Dancing, running, sex, etc.
Eliza Madrigal: nods.... and music is a powerful pointer as well...
Santoshima Resident: yes, what are these meditation practices for, if not for integration

--BELL--

SophiaSharon Larnia: yes, what else for
SophiaSharon Larnia: cries :)
Zen Arado: like releasing emotions that are locked in the body in tension ?
Santoshima Resident: yes
SophiaSharon Larnia: speaking of body, I need to start dinner :D
Santoshima Resident: :) bye Sophia
Eliza Madrigal: I seem to know people who suppress things with physical activity too... so many balances...
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye for now and thank you for the discussion
Santoshima Resident: lovely to see you
Zen Arado: :) bye Sharon
SophiaSharon Larnia: you too
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Sophia, thanks and happy to talk today
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)

Zen Arado: I can only notice tensions
Zen Arado: physical stuff is out
Zen Arado: but that is helpful too
Zen Arado: I see the source of the tension
Zen Arado: the root is in the mind?

Eliza Madrigal: well there are other yogas.... perhaps painting has been one way for you Zen?
Eliza Madrigal: does it help you to examine your heart?
Zen Arado: don't know
Zen Arado: I just paint...I don't see any significance in it
Zen Arado: maye my heart is locked away :(
Zen Arado: :)
Korel Laloix: I think we all take refuge in some physical action in one way or another.

Zen Arado: I was wheelchair dancing last night
Zen Arado: not too well
Zen Arado: :)
Eliza Madrigal: nods.. we 'come back' again and again
Eliza Madrigal: :)) Zen
Santoshima Resident: cool, Zen <3
Zen Arado: not if you saw me :)
Zen Arado: but hey
Eliza Madrigal: sounds like a heart opening exercise to me :)
Zen Arado: movement to music
Santoshima Resident: yeah
Zen Arado: if limited
Santoshima Resident: we are all limited
Zen Arado: yep
Eliza Madrigal nods
Zen Arado: or enabled
Santoshima Resident: that too!
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Zen Arado: accepting one's limitations ... sigh

Eliza Madrigal: I'm reminded of a kind of mash-up I did with a biblical proverb and buddhist 'paramitas' .....
Zen Arado: mash-up?
Eliza Madrigal: "cultivate the heart with all devotion for out of it spring the virtues of life"
Eliza Madrigal: Korel, familiar with the original?

Eliza Madrigal: :) anyway, smiling .... this has been an amazingly comforting discussion, thanks
Zen Arado: how does one cultivate it?
Eliza Madrigal: myriad forms
Zen Arado: topic for another time
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Zen Arado: heart cultvation 104
Zen Arado: :)
Santoshima Resident: thanks for this conversation ~ sunshine here today is rare, so heading outside
Eliza Madrigal: :) Enjoy the sunshine San
Zen Arado: sorry I missed start
Santoshima Resident: peace and love, everyone!
Eliza Madrigal: sun is setting here already
Eliza Madrigal: *peace and love*
Zen Arado: bye San
Korel Laloix: Take care.
Eliza Madrigal: coming back to the pavilion as a kind of touchstone can be a sort of devotion/yoga too ... re
Eliza Madrigal: cultivation :)
Zen Arado: yeh I guess
Zen Arado: our grounding place

Eliza Madrigal: yeah, I guess it isn't what one does but awareness
Korel Laloix: To me it is a good chat and company.
Qt Core: Hi all
Korel Laloix: osiyo
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Qt :)
Zen Arado: Hi Qt

--BELL--

Zen Arado: that is spiritual too Korel I think
Eliza Madrigal: both path and end :)
Zen Arado: have to improve my typing ..new year resolution :)
Zen Arado: the pathless path
Zen Arado: Along thre pathless path...through the gateless gate...
Zen Arado: Ariiving where I never left
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Zen Arado: and can't be too late :)
Zen Arado: Can never be too late..is better
Eliza Madrigal: - We shall not cease from exploration. And the end of all our exploring will be to arrive where we started and know the place for the first time.
Zen Arado: yep
Zen Arado: TSEliot
Eliza Madrigal: yep
Zen Arado: it starts to unravel meaning for me
Zen Arado: now
Zen Arado: resonances ring in our hearts
Zen Arado: down the dim lanes of memory
Eliza Madrigal: :)

Zen Arado: new meanings emerging
Eliza Madrigal: adaptability, spontaneity
Zen Arado: so often surprising , unasked
Zen Arado: yes
Zen Arado: a shock to our strategising minds

Zen Arado: that wants life neat and pigeonholed
Eliza Madrigal: minds have a context too... though...
Eliza Madrigal: indeed maybe are a context
Zen Arado: nicely arranged to suit our 'self'
Eliza Madrigal: selves are fine too... just need exposure :)
Eliza Madrigal: lol
Zen Arado: yes
Zen Arado: :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)) dancing
Zen Arado: a dancing context
Zen Arado: :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)) nice
Zen Arado: 'Everybody dance...just listen to the music ...'
Eliza Madrigal: ...life being danced....

--BELL--

Eliza Madrigal: :) thanks friends....
Zen Arado: thanks to all :)
Eliza Madrigal: Happy New Year!!
Korel Laloix: Take care all.
Zen Arado: take care :)
Qt Core: Bye all
Korel Laloix: Hope youre new year gets to a good start.
Korel Laloix: ciao
Eliza Madrigal: you too Korel :)
Eliza Madrigal: And Qt and Zen :) ::::warm wishes::::
Qt Core: :0
Qt Core: :)