2009.03.17 07:00 - Time Re-Lived

The Guardian for this meeting was Riddle Sideways. The comments are by Riddle Sideways.

Pilgram, please tell me about memories.  Is it just a recording of the past?  Is it true/false? 
When I re-visit the past, am I 'just' walking through memory or ...  ?
I wonder.
And we wander.

"Novice Adams Rubble" and I had one of the nicest mornings together.

Adams Rubble: Hi Riddle :)
Riddle Sideways: good morning adams
Riddle Sideways: ah you have added 'novice' to your title
Adams Rubble: Yes, it reminds me to be open as a child to new ways of thinking
Riddle Sideways: is one of the best first steps
Adams Rubble: I did that last June and over most of the summer but lost the ability to do it in the fall
Adams Rubble: Since late December I have been able to do it again
Riddle Sideways wonders what is seaonsal about it
Adams Rubble: hehe
Adams Rubble: That is only an "appearance"
Adams Rubble thinks "user error" would better describe it
Riddle Sideways: will it is very much like planting crops / seeds
Adams Rubble: yes it is
Riddle Sideways: that reaping what you soww
Adams Rubble: very much so
Riddle Sideways: I miss gardening
Riddle Sideways: use to be a farmer
Adams Rubble: I have never been a very good gardner
Adams Rubble: Ah, neat
Adams Rubble: My grandfather had a farm so we visited it as kids
Riddle Sideways: back in those back-to-the-earth days
Riddle Sideways: had a little homestead
Adams Rubble: that is neat
Riddle Sideways: 25 acres
Riddle Sideways: goats, potatoes, horse-drawn equiptment
Adams Rubble: wow, horse-drawn :)
Riddle Sideways: horse power is sooooo
Riddle Sideways: more then awe-some
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: there is a super respect
Adams Rubble nods
Adams Rubble: although I still go gah-gah when I see a John Deere tractor
Riddle Sideways: went to the woods, cut down a tree
Riddle Sideways: hook a horse by chain to the tree
Riddle Sideways: say go
Riddle Sideways: it takes it's best path to the road
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: That is a wonderful experience to have had
Adams Rubble: I still ave so much imagery from my days on the farm
Riddle Sideways: I am forgetting what the sci-fi authors name is
Adams Rubble: I draw from it constantly
Riddle Sideways: that wrote character Lasurius Long
Riddle Sideways: speeling problem
Riddle Sideways: heinlein maybe
Adams Rubble wouldn;t know anyway unfortunately but waiting to hear what Riddle has to tell
Riddle Sideways: Lassirious was a great vehicle for quotes
Riddle Sideways: I can't quote it exactly
Riddle Sideways: had a list of what a complete man needed to do in his life
Riddle Sideways: program a computer, birth a baby, grow a meal
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: there were about 8 items
Adams Rubble: the modern renaissance man?
Riddle Sideways: yep
Riddle Sideways: good thing I am guardian
Adams Rubble: I must say Riddle, you are full of surprises about all you have done :)
Riddle Sideways: I will edit all this
Adams Rubble: hehe
Riddle Sideways: is why I don't write my bio
Riddle Sideways: sometimes sounds like forest gump
Adams Rubble giggles
Riddle Sideways: biggest memory = I was at woodstock
Adams Rubble: there was an accidental quality to Forest Gump's experiences..he never really knew he was having them in a sense
Riddle Sideways: biggest disappointment = don't remember anything of saturday at woodstock
Adams Rubble: I was almost in a trendous 50 car accident near Woodstock during that time
Adams Rubble: I remember that vividly
Riddle Sideways: wow
Adams Rubble: Fortunately there was room for the cars to go off each side of the highway
Adams Rubble: when the dust cleared...
Adams Rubble: there were cars everywhere
Adams Rubble: and I stopped about a half inch behind the car in front of me
Adams Rubble: there ahd been a motorcycle weaving in and out of traffic
Adams Rubble: he too was in the middle medium strip with his bike on the side
Adams Rubble: there seemed to be a long pause when no one moved
Adams Rubble: then slowly it began to move and all the cars slowly got back on the road\
Adams Rubble: after that everyone drobe much more sanely
Adams Rubble: drove
Riddle Sideways: I need to search the PaB logs to see how many records about car accidents exist
Riddle Sideways: it is a short moment in ones life
Riddle Sideways: that sticks
Adams Rubble: yes
Riddle Sideways: time is strecthedout
Adams Rubble: That is one of two in which I was very lucky
Adams Rubble: That was before i had seat belts too
Adams Rubble: I have to go
Riddle Sideways: I have also been in accidents too
Riddle Sideways: very lucky in them too
Riddle Sideways: Oops... Adam poofed ... gone
Riddle Sideways: oh well, we never know what happen-stance will bring
Riddle Sideways: ...
Riddle Sideways: ah, Adams returns
Adams Rubble: yes, sorry that was so rude..but necessary
Riddle Sideways: RL happens
Adams Rubble: hehe
Adams Rubble: analogy noted
Riddle Sideways: is becoming one of favorite sayings
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: but.... we were almost getting somewheres
Riddle Sideways: with the car accident subject
Adams Rubble: yes, I broke up the flow
Adams Rubble: and time strecthed out for you
Adams Rubble: went fast for me
Riddle Sideways: had time to do a little searching in wiki
Adams Rubble: oh?
Riddle Sideways: please remind me... does wiki contain the old blog entries too?
Adams Rubble: yes :)
Riddle Sideways: well search is not very detailed in wiki
Riddle Sideways: and was wondering if it had all the stuff
Riddle Sideways: it showed 25 hits on accident
Adams Rubble: wow
Riddle Sideways: but maybe 25 is max it will show
Riddle Sideways: so many people have memories of accident time
Adams Rubble: We need to get more shared knowledge to work on the searching...I haven't had time to paly with it too much
Riddle Sideways: things happening so fast
Riddle Sideways: I have not either
Riddle Sideways: then we play the scene back repeatedly
Riddle Sideways: and see things that happened automagically
Riddle Sideways: that we think we didn't know then
Riddle Sideways: is a big wide open subject that many can relate to
Adams Rubble nods
Riddle Sideways: in the PPF chats we are stumbling on the memory vs past area
Riddle Sideways: when we 're-play' the scenes of the accident
Riddle Sideways: are we re-living it
Riddle Sideways: are we only remembering it
Adams Rubble: I think a bit of each
Riddle Sideways: are we going through it NOW as if then
Adams Rubble: In my case, I can see much of it vividly
Adams Rubble: and feel some of the emotion
Adams Rubble: but I am not shaking
Adams Rubble: Ooooooh there's a third one that I might be shaking if i told it
Riddle Sideways: that happens
Adams Rubble: Interesting because that is one in which I did not do anything wrong
Riddle Sideways: which is right then
Adams Rubble: Thinking of all these accidents makes your horse experience look mighty good
Riddle Sideways: yep
Riddle Sideways: but there were accidents there too
Adams Rubble: Although in reading through old newspapers doing some geneology I came across serious horse accidents
Adams Rubble: oh, both at the same time :)
Adams Rubble: yes!
Riddle Sideways: image of my asking horse to go/do something
Riddle Sideways: and having her swing her big head around and give me SUCH a look
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: imagine if your car, computer, phone, etc. any of todays tech
Riddle Sideways: could just give you a look
Adams Rubble always wondered what horse had to say to each other when all the humans were out of the barn
Adams Rubble: horses
Riddle Sideways: I think we know what they say about us
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: well, back to a time streaching subject
Riddle Sideways: I have had problems relating how I do time tothis group
Riddle Sideways: since it is based on an art that is hard/long to describe
Riddle Sideways: not many would/could relate
Riddle Sideways: took me years
Riddle Sideways: but, I can experience what others most times do in an auto accident
Riddle Sideways: that calm
Riddle Sideways: of just having to DO
Riddle Sideways: the auto-setting of priorities
Riddle Sideways: and only doing the most important
Riddle Sideways: as if automagically
Riddle Sideways: no thoughtt
Riddle Sideways: then later re-live the inputs that were just 'recorded'
Adams Rubble "wows" at the re-live part
Riddle Sideways: and that re-live vs remember vs play-back it the point
Riddle Sideways: what is that
Riddle Sideways: ?
Riddle Sideways: IDK
Adams Rubble: Up to the re-live I was wondering if I had anything I could relate to what you were saying
Riddle Sideways: sorry and TY
Riddle Sideways: now you can add
Riddle Sideways: and help me figure out that moment vs memory
Adams Rubble: Often someone reports something here in PaB that seems magically and wonderful
Riddle Sideways: yes
Adams Rubble: at that point the rest of us sit and try to match that against our own experiences
Adams Rubble: I would have to think deeply about this
Adams Rubble: I think it is wonderful you can do this
Riddle Sideways: in watching/listening to most people
Riddle Sideways: they relate to auto accidents
Riddle Sideways: which is a sick thing
Riddle Sideways: but, they know of what we talk
Adams Rubble nods but not about the sick
Riddle Sideways: inputs/data is coming in toooooooo fast
Riddle Sideways: most has to go to secondary storage
Riddle Sideways: later
Riddle Sideways: while sitting on the curb talking to the police
Riddle Sideways: it gets played back
Adams Rubble nods
Riddle Sideways: later at night
Riddle Sideways: when no inputs/sences coming in
Riddle Sideways: secondary storage is reloaded
Adams Rubble nods
Adams Rubble: I think you are answering your own question
Riddle Sideways: are those fresh, unexperienced inputs?
Riddle Sideways: or old memory
Riddle Sideways: is it the past beoming the present
Adams Rubble: like a computer, memory goes into the processing unti and is reprocessed
Adams Rubble: the processor is blank until the memory comes
Adams Rubble: so we might view ot differently each time we reload it or maybe not
Adams Rubble: the potential is there to process it differently depending what else we have loaded into our processor
Riddle Sideways: yes, and that processing time is NOW/0th time
Riddle Sideways: we bring an old past into 0th
Adams Rubble: Not sure about the 0th time part
Riddle Sideways: we are re-living ??
Adams Rubble: it is in the moment
Adams Rubble: I think we are somewhat detached but there are degrees of detachment
Riddle Sideways: am thinking that I 'park' present moment.. yes detach present
Riddle Sideways: and attach an old recording of a present
Riddle Sideways: we are in that moment?
Adams Rubble: like listening to a song on a CD again
Riddle Sideways: yes
Adams Rubble: we feel the music
Adams Rubble: can become one with the music
Adams Rubble: but can not change the music
Adams Rubble: on the CD
Adams Rubble: unless we erase it :)
Riddle Sideways: beg to defer
Riddle Sideways: I change the lyrics all the time
Adams Rubble: but you don;t change the CD
Riddle Sideways: and hear what was not there at last listening
Adams Rubble: you change what you are doing while listening
Riddle Sideways: a scientist in me says you are correct
Riddle Sideways: another me says you are wrong
Adams Rubble: alas I am not a musician, only a parent of one
Riddle Sideways: there are facts you think you know
Riddle Sideways: there are others that ....
Adams Rubble points to her tag
Riddle Sideways: yes, novice that is how we start
Riddle Sideways: and started today
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: Our memories of the acidents are still stories
Riddle Sideways: stories we tell ourselves AND others
Adams Rubble: yes
Riddle Sideways: where does that play in time-less, zeroth, ever
Riddle Sideways: am still tinking those through
Adams Rubble begins to wonder whether the heroic tales of battles were as vivid for the ancients
Riddle Sideways: ah yes
Riddle Sideways: before the auto
Adams Rubble: life and death
Riddle Sideways: we had to have moments in battle scenes
Riddle Sideways: later we would sit shaking
Riddle Sideways: and re-live those recording
Riddle Sideways: some were soooo great that we pasted them to the next generation
Adams Rubble: Getting back to 0th time for a moment (hehe), it may be necessary for us to have some general agreement of what we are talking about when we use the term
Adams Rubble: I think of it as "eternal" time
Adams Rubble: and so for me the accident story is as irrelevant to 0th time as the battles of Homer
Riddle Sideways: that may have been the beauty of how Pema defined it
Riddle Sideways: that he seemed (to me) to define a. NOW b. eternal c. something else
Riddle Sideways: mostly outside the linear one-dimensional thought of time
Adams Rubble: yes, for me it is a connector
Adams Rubble: something I can use to plug me in
Riddle Sideways: yes, a connector... with a loose define that I can take places
Riddle Sideways: yet, not pre-determined
Adams Rubble: like a shaman putting on a mask
Riddle Sideways: zero (time) [ack, my keyboard has no approximation key/symbol]
Adams Rubble: hmm...I take the shaman part back...too much baggage
Adams Rubble: hehe
Adams Rubble: yes
Riddle Sideways: ah, thatz what I was meaning
Riddle Sideways: many/most words have that baggage
Adams Rubble nods
Adams Rubble: so we talk around and around the subject
Riddle Sideways: we slip up and say 'word' and everybody jumps
Adams Rubble: yes
Adams Rubble: I may be able to talk to you with some words and need different words for someone else
Riddle Sideways: we make a new word like 0th
Riddle Sideways: and run with it
Adams Rubble: :)
Riddle Sideways: oh dear, I am needed to move on to next life activity
Riddle Sideways: this has been
Riddle Sideways: thought provoking
Adams Rubble: Yes, we have gone past the hour but it was time well spent for me :)
Riddle Sideways: yes
Adams Rubble: Yes, lots to think about
Adams Rubble: Well, thank you for the discussion
Riddle Sideways: thank you
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: bye for now...I'll leave politely this time :)
Riddle Sideways: :D