The Guardian for this meeting was szavanna Resident. The comments are by szavanna Resident.

szavanna Resident: 's current display-name is "Sunshine".
Catrinamonblue Resident: 's current display-name is "Catrinamonblue".
szavanna Resident: hi Cat °͜°
Catrinamonblue Resident: hi :)
--BELL--
szavanna Resident: settling into session mode :)
szavanna Resident: how are you doing Cat
Catrinamonblue Resident: up and down
szavanna Resident: oh not too balanced then?
Xirana Oximoxi: 's current display-name is "Xirana".
Catrinamonblue Resident: being patient with people is hard work!! :)
szavanna Resident: hi Xiri °͜°
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Xirana :)
szavanna Resident: true Cat
Xirana Oximoxi: hello Sunji and cat :)
szavanna Resident: why Cat what do people do that make you impatient?
Xirana Oximoxi: thanks for asking me for friendship on FB cat :-)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: people sometime misintrupt things you do or say
Catrinamonblue Resident: then you have to be patient while they figure it out
szavanna Resident: misinterpret?
szavanna Resident: ah yes so true
Catrinamonblue Resident: compassion helps I find
szavanna Resident: I wonder if people could ever really get what I mean
Catrinamonblue Resident: with being patient
szavanna Resident: but its very special when you do have those moments of deep understanding
Catrinamonblue Resident: yes
szavanna Resident: what do you think Xiri
szavanna Resident: how much do we really get each other
szavanna Resident: how much do I get you for example :)
Xirana Oximoxi: it's dificult to undersdtand ...but it's also a matter to put interest on it, and ask and talk as much as necessary if you feel something is not clear
Xirana Oximoxi: I don't know:)
szavanna Resident: hmm yes
szavanna Resident: I think it does help also that you paint
Xirana Oximoxi: and I agree it's special when we get moments of deep understanding...in RL and also in SL
szavanna Resident: when I look at your paintings I feel closer somehow
Xirana Oximoxi: what I wonder, is how much of our own imagination or wishes is in SL understanding
Catrinamonblue Resident: a lot I would say
szavanna Resident: hmm yes SL is a different sort of connection
szavanna Resident: we add lots of imagination I think
Xirana Oximoxi: that's a way to connect to someone...through creativivty
szavanna Resident: but also in RL - how much do we really get about others ... and how much do we imagine ... or suppose - we know about someone
Xirana Oximoxi: you connect more with some ways of expression than others
Xirana Oximoxi: you're right in RL there's also a big part of our own interpretation
szavanna Resident: but usually friction and misunderstanding resolves itself with time
Catrinamonblue Resident: and patience :)
Xirana Oximoxi: also...here I talk much much more than in RL about personal thoughts
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: I think I talk the same here as I do in RL about myself :)
szavanna Resident: hmm me too I am sort of the same
szavanna Resident: but here I have more opportunity to express myself
szavanna Resident: explore who I am
Catrinamonblue Resident: yes
szavanna Resident: even just to make sure I get myself better
szavanna Resident: what can be done when one feels the others really don't get us?
Catrinamonblue Resident: just be ourselves and be patient
Catrinamonblue Resident: they will get it or not but that is up to them not us
szavanna Resident: yes I think thats all one can do
Xirana Oximoxi: I don't have the sensation I explore 'who I am'...I guess I am more curious about others... that does not mean my mind may be quite chaotic too :)
szavanna Resident: I live on the other side of the planet ....so most people don't get me
--BELL--
Xirana Oximoxi: just be yourself...they will get you:)
Catrinamonblue Resident: I am who I am,but I'm changing every day :)
szavanna Resident: hmm but when you paint - doesn't it help to discover your likes and dislikes?
szavanna Resident: hmm yes we do change all the time
szavanna Resident: I think ....when we say "patience" - that word has some tension in it already
Catrinamonblue Resident: maybe becasue we want to hurry up and get there
szavanna Resident: when you say the word patience ....you imagine someone - chewing their fingernails or something ...
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
szavanna Resident: hehe
szavanna Resident: may be another word is better
Xirana Oximoxi: yes....more than patiencer I would say...go slowly
szavanna Resident: Bleuji :)
Xirana Oximoxi: hi Bleu! :-)
Bleu Oleander: 's current display-name is "Bleu".
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Bleu
szavanna Resident: I think it is very normal for others not to get us
Bleu Oleander: hi everyone :)
szavanna Resident: imagine we would get everyone
Catrinamonblue Resident: yes, even people who have known you for a long time sometimes don't get you
szavanna Resident: Bleuji we are talking about patience and about times when people don't understand us well ...
Bleu Oleander: a lot of the time :)
szavanna Resident: sometimes even your mom doesn't get you
Bleu Oleander: could be 'cause we don't understand ourselves well ?
szavanna Resident: or sometimes your friends get you and your family doesn't
szavanna Resident: what is the sign - that we do understand ourselves?
szavanna Resident: ( uh English )
szavanna Resident: °͜°
Bleu Oleander: good question Sunji
szavanna Resident: if we feel comfortable in our skin? hehe
szavanna Resident: we feel happy?
Catrinamonblue Resident: peaceful
szavanna Resident: ponders
Bleu Oleander: lifetime project perhaps
Xirana Oximoxi: yes....maybe when we don't asl too much questions about what we do, why we do, why we don't do...etc.
Xirana Oximoxi: ask
Bleu Oleander: so patience .... sooner or later you might?
szavanna Resident: Lila °͜°
szavanna Resident: ommm shantiii shantiiii ommmmmm
Xirana Oximoxi: hello Lila:)
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Lila
Lila Darkmatter smiles
szavanna Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: hi Lila :)
Lila Darkmatter: Hi everyone
szavanna Resident: we are talking about ways of understanding our true selves
Lila Darkmatter zooms Xiri
szavanna Resident: and being patient when we don't get others
Xirana Oximoxi: :))
Bleu Oleander: first step ... showup as yourself?
Lila Darkmatter: very pretty
Bleu Oleander: hehe
szavanna Resident: do you also love those things floating around :)
szavanna Resident: listens to Bleuji
szavanna Resident: what do you mean by "showup"
Bleu Oleander: nothing too profound hehe
Lila Darkmatter: which yourself?
Lila Darkmatter giggles
szavanna Resident: hehe :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: me myslef and I ?
szavanna Resident: ;p
Bruce Mowbray: 's current display-name is "Bruce".
szavanna Resident: Bleuji! Lila is confusing me!
Bleu Oleander: which self do you bring to the table?
Bleu Oleander: hi Bruce
Lila Darkmatter: which table?
szavanna Resident: Brucey °͜°
Lila Darkmatter: Hi Bruce :))
Bleu Oleander: table of life
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Bruce :)
Bruce Mowbray: Hello hello!
szavanna Resident: Lila should be grounded!
szavanna Resident: ;D
Bleu Oleander: the dance, the party, the table ... whatever :)
Lila Darkmatter: :)
Bruce Mowbray: ?me listens carefully to catch the drift....
Catrinamonblue Resident: being patient when others don't understand us or we don't understand others :)
szavanna Resident: Brucey we are talking about - how to get a deeper understanding of ourselves
Lila Darkmatter: just being silly - I like the "rule" - Show up as yourself
Xirana Oximoxi: hi Bruce! :-)
Bruce Mowbray: kk. Thank you!
Bruce Mowbray: Heya, Xir!
Lila Darkmatter: (in whatever way you show up)
Bleu Oleander: "rule" hehe
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander likes breaking rules :)
szavanna Resident: hehe yes Lila but even that makes a good point ...- "which me"
szavanna Resident: the hungarian me, or the zulu me
szavanna Resident: or some other me
Bleu Oleander: the me you think you are at the moment :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Lila Darkmatter: or one that is timeless and locationless....
szavanna Resident: and eternal
szavanna Resident: hmm :)
Bruce Mowbray: I used to think I had only 12 "me's." Now I realize that an entirely new "me" is born every every moment. How's THAT for "grounded"?
Bleu Oleander: are we timeless and eternal?
Bruce Mowbray: What else could "we" possiby be?
szavanna Resident: what if we are Bleuji
Lila Darkmatter: THAT seems very grounded to me, Bruce
Catrinamonblue Resident: I am me in all my infinite varieties
szavanna Resident: a new me every moment hmm
Bruce Mowbray: ;-)
szavanna Resident: but its fun to think that I am eternal
Bruce Mowbray sits on hands and listens to all the multitide of "me's" here today -- and is grateful for every single one!
Bleu Oleander: think and are ... two different things :)
Xirana Oximoxi: :)
Bleu Oleander: me, myself and all my other me's hehe
szavanna Resident: hmm so what I think - has nothing to do with me?
Lila Darkmatter: what thinks?
Bleu Oleander: has everything to do with you
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
szavanna Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: :)
--BELL--
szavanna Resident: something is bugging me .....
Xirana Oximoxi can not find 'bugging' in the dictionary :-)
Bleu Oleander heard that somewhere ....
Xirana Oximoxi: bugy bugy?
szavanna Resident: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H3SWBvBl9JE
szavanna Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: hehe
szavanna Resident: Druthy :)
druth Vlodovic: hi guys
Lila Darkmatter grins
Bleu Oleander: hiya Druth
Bruce Mowbray: Heya, druth-ji!
Lila Darkmatter: Hi Druth
szavanna Resident: hi there - we are talking about the "many me's" that we are
Catrinamonblue Resident: hey Druth :)
Xirana Oximoxi: ahhhh thank you Sunji!! :-)
szavanna Resident: and similar things ;p
Bruce Mowbray: ...;-)
Bleu Oleander: mini me's :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: infinite varieties
szavanna Resident: :))
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, infinite.
szavanna Resident: Bleuji has such a special style about her ....
Bruce Mowbray: And with such an infinity of "me's" I populate the cosmos. . .
Bleu Oleander: why ty Sunji :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Bruce Mowbray listens, again.
Bleu Oleander: we all do actually
szavanna Resident: Me-smos
Bruce Mowbray: AHH! LOVE that, Sun!
szavanna Resident: so we are all soo different ... and we probably don't get each other too well ...
Bleu Oleander: :)
Lila Darkmatter: profile poem: ...Greet Yourself In your thousand other forms As you mount the hidden tide and travel Back home. ... All the hemispheres in heaven Are sitting around a fire Chatting... While stitching themselves together Into the Great Circle inside of You (Hafiz)
szavanna Resident: but how come - when we come from the same planet ...
Bleu Oleander: nice Lila :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: Lovley Lila ty
szavanna Resident:
szavanna Resident: ♥
Bruce Mowbray quickly make a copy/paste of the Hafiz poem.
Lila Darkmatter: :) it is a good question Sun, sorry to interrupt
szavanna Resident: oh I got lost in Hafiz °͜°
Lila Darkmatter: but maybe we DO 'get' one another in a deeper sense than varied experiences and perceptions?
Bleu Oleander: more similar then different
Catrinamonblue Resident: we may all be different but we do have similarities :) and while we may not "get" each other or ourselves we all know we are here
szavanna Resident: can one go to "getting others" school? lol
Lila Darkmatter: maybe that's where we are
Bleu Oleander: lol
Lila Darkmatter: :)
Xirana Oximoxi: I must go now..I wish you all a nice day!! and see you soon! :-)
szavanna Resident: can one teach - how to get the others
Bleu Oleander: bye Xiri
Catrinamonblue Resident: Bye Xiri
Lila Darkmatter waves Xiri
szavanna Resident: hugs Xiri ty for coming
Bruce Mowbray: I think the "getting other school" might be what I call life.
Xirana Oximoxi: byebye,,,ty to you :)
Bruce Mowbray: "getting others school" -- My typist can't seem to hit the "s" this morning. ha ha.
Bruce Mowbray: Byefor now, Xir!
Lila Darkmatter: cold fingers?
szavanna Resident: hmm one of the reasons why I started my opencafe ,,,is try to to get others
Bruce Mowbray: Oh yeah! Cold everything this morning. Yes!
Bleu Oleander: got yourself in the process?
Lila Darkmatter: hah!!
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
szavanna Resident: yes it did help in getting me
Bruce Mowbray: ;-) Loves "got yourself in the process..."!
szavanna Resident: ;o)
szavanna Resident: I think when trying to get others - one gets oneself too
druth Vlodovic: in that case if you learn something then the cafe is a roaring success
Bleu Oleander: like a mirror
szavanna Resident: or - it is essential to get others - to be able to get ourselves ...
Bleu Oleander: see yourself reflected back in others
Bruce Mowbray: I agree, druth. The Cafe is a total and absolute SUCCESS.
szavanna Resident: hmm I keep thinking of Desmond Tutu... he says "I need you to be you - so that I can be me"
Bleu Oleander: hey so "reflection" is the next UWA art contest
Bleu Oleander: we did that a while back
szavanna Resident: smiles at all the peeps °͜°
Lila Darkmatter peeps
szavanna Resident: hehe did I spell wrong?
Bleu Oleander: we could all submit art pieces :)
Bruce Mowbray runs into the bathroom, looks at his reflection in the bathroom mirror, and asks himself, "Who else could I possibly be?"
szavanna Resident: sounds interesting Bleuji - you have a note?
Bleu Oleander: one sec
szavanna Resident: no rush :)
Lila Darkmatter: I find it surprisingly difficult to sit and look at myself in a mirror
Bleu Oleander: http://uwainsl.blogspot.com/
szavanna Resident: ah ty :)
Lila Darkmatter: and trying to do so that's the main question - why is this so awkward?
Lila Darkmatter clicks
Bleu Oleander: the false mirror
Bruce Mowbray: TY, Bleu!
Bleu Oleander: yw!
Catrinamonblue Resident: it's hard to see who we really are and not all the masks other have put on us
Bruce Mowbray: Good day to you, Xs!
szavanna Resident: hi Xs °͜°
Lila Darkmatter: Xs!
Bleu Oleander: take care Bruce
Bruce Mowbray: hmmm, all the masks that others gave us and we ACCEPTED, unfortunately.
szavanna Resident: take care Bruce :)
Bruce Mowbray: No, I'm still here . . . (!)
Lila Darkmatter: :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
szavanna Resident: ah good °͜°
Bruce Mowbray: ;-)
Lila Darkmatter: that may be it.... one sees so much more than what is there
szavanna Resident: :)
Bruce Mowbray: And so are my manifold reflections!
druth Vlodovic: lol, "good day to you" is more often a way of saying goodbye, I wonder why we don't want them to have a god day while being with us
--BELL--
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Xs :)
Bleu Oleander: hi Xs
Xs Andree: /we waves
Lila Darkmatter hears "good day to you" in Gene Wilder's voice
Bleu Oleander: :)
szavanna Resident: it sounds very formal
Xs Andree: hey everyone
szavanna Resident: smiles
Lila Darkmatter: nice to see you again Xs
Bruce Mowbray: What is "One Billion Rising," Sun?
szavanna Resident: oh I just discovered it
Xs Andree: thank you
szavanna Resident: ONE BILLION RISING began as a call to action based on the staggering statistic that 1 in 3 women on the planet will be beaten or raped during her lifetime. With the world population at 7 billion, this adds up to more than ONE BILLION WOMEN AND GIRLS. On February 14, 2013, men and women in Second Life will join activists, writers, thinkers, celebrities, and people across the world to Walk, Dance, and Rise as a show of unity, individual strength, and the need for change.
Bruce Mowbray: Is there some way I can get one of those shirts, then?
szavanna Resident: they are recording videos as I understand .... and so I was invited to dance with them
Lila Darkmatter: there will be events during the day
szavanna Resident: of course yes
Bruce Mowbray: and perhaps an LM for the sim. . . if I'm not asking too much all at once... Maybe others would also like them.
szavanna Resident: http://onebillionrisingsl.wordpress....photo-contest/
Bruce Mowbray: Ahh1 THANKS!
szavanna Resident: I will send you after session may be ...
szavanna Resident: that page has the SLURL
szavanna Resident: to the place where you can get the tshirts
Zen Arado: 's current display-name is "Zen".
Lila Darkmatter: Hello Zen
Xs Andree: it is certainly good to see you all again.
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Zen :)
szavanna Resident: hi Zenji °͜°
Zen Arado: Hi all
Lila Darkmatter: have been wondering about you Xs... hope all going well?
Bleu Oleander: ty Sunji :)
Xs Andree: it has been rough, but necessary.
szavanna Resident: that note explains a bit more
Bruce Mowbray: Heya, Zen!
szavanna Resident: is everything ok Xs?
szavanna Resident: sorry to hear it has been tough times for you
Bleu Oleander: hiya Zen
Xs Andree: everything is as it should be. It isn't so much as tough times, metamorphosis just means accepting parts of yourself you don't always like.
Xs Andree: what is the topic today?
szavanna Resident: hmm we have been talking about a similar topic
Lila Darkmatter: related actually
szavanna Resident: trying to get ourselves and others on a deeper level
Zen Arado: patience with yourself?
Bleu Oleander: patience in knowing yourself?
szavanna Resident: yes how to be patient
Zen Arado: no self no patience needed hmm
Lila Darkmatter: with both parts of ourselves and so called other people
szavanna Resident: smiles at Zenji
Bruce Mowbray: ;-) ----- and infinite reflections of so-called "selves" - no patience needed, either!
Lila Darkmatter: yes!
Bruce Mowbray: celebrate every single one!
Zen Arado: selves complicate
szavanna Resident: hmm true
Zen Arado: no self is simple
Bleu Oleander: selves are necessary
szavanna Resident: yes but that is a bit abstract for me ...how can one grasp that really
Lila Darkmatter: open selves
Bruce Mowbray: Accept what is.
Zen Arado: selves want themselves to be necessary maybe
Bleu Oleander: of course :)
szavanna Resident ponders
Lila Darkmatter: I wonder if the way 'no' has translated from East to West might not complicate understanding unecessarily
Lila Darkmatter: have heard it is more accurate to say "non"
Catrinamonblue Resident: non self?
Bleu Oleander: what does non self mean?
Lila Darkmatter: but that may be just as difficult for some - need to be flexible
Lila Darkmatter: just not separate self
Bruce Mowbray images ways to un-self himself (or whatever that imaged "being" might be at this moment.)
Lila Darkmatter: nothing wrong with selves
Zen Arado: selves want to understand and grasp concepts
Bleu Oleander: no self is a concept
Lila Darkmatter nods
Zen Arado: thinks it's the other way around
Zen Arado: :)
Xs Andree: If there was no need for the self, then there would be no concept of it.
Lila Darkmatter: but what people are trying to convey is an experience?
Xs Andree: If there was no need for the "no self' there would be no concept of it.
Bleu Oleander: yes
Zen Arado: true ..it's useful byt detachable
Zen Arado: a useful fiction
Bleu Oleander: a process
Xs Andree: to be only one or the other, is still "self'
Zen Arado: just my view
Bruce Mowbray runs back into bathroom, looks in mirror again, and tries to see the "self" that imagines it "needs" a "self."
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
szavanna Resident: :)
--BELL--
Zen Arado: you just see a body in mirror..or a 2D reflection of a body
szavanna Resident: in SL there is no RL body ...
szavanna Resident: its an interesting experience
Zen Arado: yet it feels like it is a self too
Bleu Oleander: roots of the self process are in the non-conscious mind ... perhaps the conscious self concept can be lessened but can't really be eliminated all together, nor would you want it to be
Zen Arado: sometimes seems more real than meat avatar
druth Vlodovic: we also attribute "selfs" to inanimate objects
Bruce Mowbray finds, accepts, loves, and celebrates that multi-layered reflection of his imagined self (-ves).
Zen Arado: yes
Zen Arado: or animals
Xs Andree: Self is awareness of existence.
szavanna Resident: interesting Druthy yes
Lila Darkmatter: perhaps the concern is the unilluminated self, so to speak, unilluminated by the seemingly dark unconscious
druth Vlodovic: it seems a way of packaging something in order to deal with it more easily
Lila Darkmatter: disconnected somehow
szavanna Resident: we love these "selfs"
Zen Arado: is there existence without awareness?
Xs Andree: I don't know the answer to that.
Bleu Oleander: what would the point be?
szavanna Resident: scratches head
szavanna Resident: ;o)
Bruce Mowbray: How would you know?
Bruce Mowbray: heh heh
Lila Darkmatter: :)
Bleu Oleander: lol
szavanna Resident: quite a mystery this whole thing ;p
Xs Andree: Observation changes the universe, it could well be that without it there is no existence.
Zen Arado: consciousness or awareness precedes or brings reality into existence
Bruce Mowbray: Like, how would you really know if you were oxygen deprived?. . . . If your brain couldn't function well enough without oxygen to be aware of it.
Zen Arado: so says Steve hagen
Zen Arado: seems to make sense
Lila Darkmatter: on a less abstract level, what 'changes' when there is an experience of non/no-self?
Lila Darkmatter: what would be different about one's life?
szavanna Resident: actually I do love the mystery of it all
Bleu Oleander: have never experienced "no self"
druth Vlodovic: I'm not sure consciousness is necessary to a mind,certainly not self-consciousness
Zen Arado: more happiness, less stress because no seld image to defend
Zen Arado: self
druth Vlodovic: newborns experience and interact but only gradually become aware of themselves
Zen Arado: I don't think it is a polarity
Zen Arado: just degrees of self
Zen Arado: less self = more happiness
Xs Andree: I don't either, Zen.
Bruce Mowbray: No self image to defend - - - and an infinity of mental images to be celebrated. . . . as so-called "reality."
Zen Arado: yes they learnn to label things and gradually make a separate image of a self
Janine Cheren: 's current display-name is "Jan".
Lila Darkmatter: Hi Jan
szavanna Resident: hi Jan °͜°
Bleu Oleander: hi Jan
Bruce Mowbray: Welcome, Janine!
Janine Cheren: Hello ツ
Zen Arado: Hi Jan
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Jan
Janine Cheren: hello
Xs Andree: Sometimes when I meet other people, I wonder if I am them in another lifetime.
druth Vlodovic: hi jan :)
Janine Cheren: hihihihi
Xs Andree: othertimes, I know it for certain
Bruce Mowbray: They are YOU, in THIS lifetime, methinks.
Bleu Oleander: they are other selves :)
Xs Andree: So a concept of the self is not so bad.
Lila Darkmatter: a self at play with others
Bruce Mowbray hopes that some week we'll consider "others" as a topic.
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Lila Darkmatter: would love that Bruce
Bleu Oleander: great topic Bruce
Bruce Mowbray imagines a staring-down contest with "others."
Bleu Oleander: what happened to learn to love yourself before you can love others?
Bleu Oleander: passe concept?
Bruce Mowbray: [Maybe they are the same thing....]
Lila Darkmatter: necessary training wheels?
Bleu Oleander: do concepts come in and out of fashion?
Zen Arado: old psychological models to me
Bruce Mowbray: For sure they do, Bleu.
Zen Arado: Freudian ideas not so acceptable these days
Zen Arado: are they?
Bleu Oleander: old models can be new for others ... even some new models can seem old to others
Bruce Mowbray: Flat earth also no so acceptable.
Bruce Mowbray: not*
Zen Arado: some questions are flat earth questions
Janine Cheren: 's current display-name is "Jan".
Lila Darkmatter: Freud is still very drawn upon Zen, just not in a fixed way
Bruce Mowbray: Male old man god sitting on cloud and judging everything -- also no so acceptable.
Zen Arado: like what is on the other side of the edge of the flat earth?
szavanna Resident: flat earth questions :)
Bruce Mowbray: not*
szavanna Resident: wb Jan :)
Zen Arado: thinks we ask a lot of those kind of questions
Xs Andree: when you love yourself it means being able to accept who you are, all of you
Xs Andree: If you cannot do this, you will not be able to do it for others.
Catrinamonblue Resident: agree
Lila Darkmatter: otherwise love it remains a concept
Lila Darkmatter: -it
Bruce Mowbray: Yes, Xs . . . I agree -- Slef-acceptance especially means celebrating ALL of our reflections. . . (also called "what is" or "reality."
Bleu Oleander: ok taking my "self" to work ... take care all :)
Bruce Mowbray: Oooops. Fed Ex delivery van here. afk.
Catrinamonblue Resident: bye Bleu :)
Lila Darkmatter waves to Blue
Bleu Oleander: bye bye
Lila Darkmatter: orange, bleu
Bleu Oleander: ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥ ♥
Lila Darkmatter: :)
Zen Arado: special 'self'delivery
Zen Arado: byee Bleu
Lila Darkmatter: this is always such a fun discussion
--BELL--
Lila Darkmatter: maybe that's why we keep having it over and over
Zen Arado: it's funny that all the Buddhist and spiritual books I have been reading and all tyhe teachers tell me there is no self...but yet everyone I meet still thinks there is
Zen Arado: scratches head
szavanna Resident: exactly Zen
szavanna Resident: I have been thinking of this hmm
Lila Darkmatter: specialized language
szavanna Resident scratches head also
szavanna Resident: ;o)
Lila Darkmatter: nonduality is the same thing Zen?
Zen Arado: and I lost belief in any enduring self even before that from the topic of 'personal identity; in philosophy
Zen Arado: yes in a way Lila
Zen Arado: but the self is just one of the things we split reality into
Xs Andree: NOthing exists
Xs Andree: so there is no self, all is an illusion
Xs Andree: Therefore all that we speak of is an illusion
Zen Arado: actually the basic fact is that everything is changing..so how chn there be a self that doesn't?
Zen Arado: not an illusion, just a happening that is ungraspable
Lila Darkmatter: that's what's the illusion
Xs Andree: all that we speak of is an illusion, then.
Xs Andree: what we speak of is graspable.
Zen Arado: the illusion is a false sunstantiality we assign to things
Zen Arado: I think
Xs Andree: it is all an illusion.
Zen Arado: substantiality
Bruce Mowbray: I freely accept all of the reflections of my mental images -- my "reality -- as illusory, but they are also VERY instructional.
druth Vlodovic: it is basic to human nature to want things predictable and unchanging
Zen Arado: oh yes I agree
Xs Andree: and as all are on equal footing with one another, then all are as important as the other
Xs Andree: All that I know is a lie
Xs Andree: Everything is true
Zen Arado: but we are all unique
Bruce Mowbray: Isn't that GREAT, Xs!?
Zen Arado: everything in existence is unique
Xs Andree: most times, bruce
Zen Arado: no two snowdrops the same
Bruce Mowbray: ;-)
Zen Arado: no two trees
Zen Arado: no two people
Catrinamonblue Resident: no two people
Catrinamonblue Resident: snap
Zen Arado: snap
Bruce Mowbray: No two thoughts.
Zen Arado: :)
Lila Darkmatter: perhaps one doesn't have to be afraid of attachment if they know it won't last
Lila Darkmatter: and can therefore dive in
Catrinamonblue Resident: no enduring love eternal
Lila Darkmatter: enjoy our selves
Zen Arado: but attachment is feelin g it WILL last ? :)
Bruce Mowbray: Wabi Sabi --- nothing is permanent. Nothing is perfect. Nothing complete.
Lila Darkmatter: :)
szavanna Resident smiles and listens to the spiritual ping pong °͜°
Zen Arado: has to get dinner
szavanna Resident: oh nooo
Lila Darkmatter sees zen put down his paddle
szavanna Resident: sigh °͜°
Zen Arado: turkey slices yum
Catrinamonblue Resident: yummy :)
Bruce Mowbray: ;-) Dine well! PERFECTLY, even!
Catrinamonblue Resident: Bye Zen
Bruce Mowbray: Bye for now, Zen.
szavanna Resident: enjoy dinner Zenji
Lila Darkmatter: bye Zen, happy dining
szavanna Resident: °͜°
Zen Arado: byee all
szavanna Resident: sorry to change subject - we are planning to do the metta meditation in 5 mins
szavanna Resident: please join us if you like :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: would love to :)
szavanna Resident: :) have you done it before?
Catrinamonblue Resident: yes
szavanna Resident: its right here next to the pagoda
Bruce Mowbray: The very hardest reflection of my own consciousness that I have to struggle with are the sufferings of others.
Bruce Mowbray: -s.
Xs Andree: no two experiences of the same thing are the same either.
szavanna Resident: its very hard Bruce
szavanna Resident: in Africa I learn a lot about that
Bruce Mowbray: Yes. I am sure that you do, Sun.
szavanna Resident: hmm true Xs
Bruce Mowbray: I have real troubles visiting a city like New York. . .
szavanna Resident: then I claim the log - shall we walk over ?
Lila Darkmatter: I strive to be able to 'follow through' and commit deeply wholeheartedly ... allowing for openness at the same time
szavanna Resident: oh I would love to hear about that Bruce
Lila Darkmatter: okay
Xs Andree: I have learned to accept the suffering of others when I learned to accept the suffering of myself.
Catrinamonblue Resident: nods
Xs Andree: your suffering will free you.