2009.05.16 07:00 - no head and light

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    The Guardian for this meeting was Lia Rikugun. The comments are by Lia Rikugun.

    Lia Rikugun: hello eos
    Lia Rikugun: have you been here before?
    Lia Rikugun: oh yes
    Lia Rikugun: you are a guardian ;)
    Eos Amaterasu: :-)
    Eos Amaterasu: Are we Being guardians?
    Eos Amaterasu: :-)
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: I don't think I've met you here yet
    Eos Amaterasu: before :-)
    Lia Rikugun: I dont come so often
    Lia Rikugun: i have my slot saturdays at 7
    Lia Rikugun: i didnt have so much time coming to other sessions in the last time
    Lia Rikugun: new appartment, new job...
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Lia Rikugun: lot to do
    Eos Amaterasu: Real Livelihood


    "on having no head"

    Lia Rikugun: i started reading the book "on having no head"
    Eos Amaterasu: ?
    Lia Rikugun: and really appreciated reading it
    Lia Rikugun: but only came to page 18
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: Hi Mickorod
    Mickorod Renard: Hi
    Lia Rikugun: hello mickorod
    Mickorod Renard: Lia..have you still not read many pages?
    Lia Rikugun: hehe no
    Mickorod Renard: naughty
    Lia Rikugun: i always need to pause
    Lia Rikugun: and read again
    Lia Rikugun: and try to feel the same
    Lia Rikugun: this takes time ;)
    Lia Rikugun: did you get the book mick?
    Mickorod Renard: well, i need to get it,..but i am trying to get through neal stephensons latest book
    Lia Rikugun: what is the title?
    Mickorod Renard: thats an epic
    Mickorod Renard: Anathum
    Lia Rikugun: what is it talking about?
    Mickorod Renard: but next will be no head or Stims book
    Mickorod Renard: well, Anathum is a fiction
    Lia Rikugun: ah ok
    Mickorod Renard: although its quite philosophic it must be taken as a pinch of salt
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Lia Rikugun: i liked one idea in the no head book
    Lia Rikugun: we have this expression
    Mickorod Renard: yes,me too
    Lia Rikugun: talking from face-to-face
    Lia Rikugun: but actually it is only one face
    Lia Rikugun: because you cannot see your own
    Lia Rikugun: so somehow this is getting the other person into you
    Lia Rikugun: you become him/her
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: the other one has your face
    Lia Rikugun: exactly eos
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Mickorod Renard: mmmm..not quite sure I understand
    Lia Rikugun: it takes me so much time going through the book
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Lia Rikugun: maybe i can say it in my words
    Lia Rikugun: or what i take out of that
    Mickorod Renard: yes please
    Lia Rikugun: hm
    Lia Rikugun: let me think
    Lia Rikugun: after reading the paragraphs
    Lia Rikugun: i realize
    Lia Rikugun: i have to be more open
    Lia Rikugun: not so concentrated on my own thoughts
    Lia Rikugun: which jump and circulate in my own head
    Mickorod Renard: yea
    Lia Rikugun: letting things in
    Lia Rikugun: because this is what happens every day
    Lia Rikugun: we make the distinction between "me" and the outside world
    Eos Amaterasu: things happen but they don't get in your face
    Lia Rikugun: but how can there be a distinction?
    Mickorod Renard: yes, I think I can see where you are going
    Lia Rikugun: :) i am not really sure where i am going :)
    Mickorod Renard: I guess its trying to see yourself as a person in the outside world,,instead of the outside world being something alien
    Lia Rikugun: you in the outside world and the outside world in you
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Eos Amaterasu: you're in the world, but it's as much you as the skin or face or brain you think you are
    Lia Rikugun: i dont think you can disconnect
    Lia Rikugun: eos i am nit sure what you mean
    Mickorod Renard: maybe shouldnt even disconnect
    Eos Amaterasu: the world is just as perceived as I am
    Mickorod Renard: perhaps that disconnecting is the mistake we make
    Eos Amaterasu: freezing of the play
    Lia Rikugun: nono i meant you cannot disconnect and just choose one of the both expression you in the outside world and the outside world in you
    Eos Amaterasu: is disconnect?


    appreciating the presence of appearances

    Mickorod Renard: freezing the play I think would be useful exercise
    Lia Rikugun: how do we do that?
    Mickorod Renard: to have time to observe
    Mickorod Renard: well, I dont know if its recomendable,,just me thinking
    Mickorod Renard: I suppose I am relating to the usual mode of existance where we get rushed along in the crazyness of daily routine
    Eos Amaterasu: just stopping, for 9 sec
    Mickorod Renard: but we should stop and observe more often
    Lia Rikugun: i try to see everything as appearances
    Lia Rikugun: but i have to remind myself
    Mickorod Renard: that is a nice thought
    Lia Rikugun: in daily life
    Lia Rikugun: pema always says this
    Lia Rikugun: and somehow it is difficult to try to do this all the time
    Lia Rikugun: but it works easier now than for example 6 months ago
    Lia Rikugun: so thats great ;)
    Lia Rikugun: sometimes when i am walking
    Mickorod Renard: sorry, he says what?
    Lia Rikugun: to see everything as appearances
    Mickorod Renard: ahh ok
    Mickorod Renard: thanks
    Lia Rikugun: or appreaciate the presence of appearances
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Lia Rikugun: hello friedrich
    Mickorod Renard: I am doing it whilst I drive to and fro work
    Mickorod Renard: Hi Fred


    Friedrich was one of the first PaB-ers

    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hi mick
    Eos Amaterasu: Hi Friedrich
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, i don't know any of you...
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, believe it or not, i was at the very first PaB
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: last April1
    Lia Rikugun: oh really
    Lia Rikugun: wow
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and played all of last summer...
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, got really busy w/ school in the fall and spring
    Mickorod Renard: so you do not need all the handout cards etc?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and am thinking about returning for this summer vacation
    Lia Rikugun: and now you are back!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, am i being recorded?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ;-)
    Lia Rikugun: yes you are
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Lia Rikugun: is this ok?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: of course
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i just was around for the monumental effort of getting the recording set up
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: wasnt sure if it was done
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: anyways... what are you all taling about. sorry i am late. 10am?
    Lia Rikugun: 7am :)
    Eos Amaterasu: having no face
    Lia Rikugun: SL time
    Lia Rikugun: having no head
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,we also have the fountain that turns into mist to ask us to be qiuet for contemplatio for a few seconds
    Lia Rikugun: no nose
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Eos Amaterasu: we do have the sounds and the water before us :-)


    the mode of having no head and the feeling you get from it: opening up, getting a feeling of light

    Mickorod Renard: I know that when I switch into that mode,,I do feel like light enters into my head
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: very peaceful and beautiful here
    Eos Amaterasu: almost midsummer night's dream
    Lia Rikugun: what mode mick?
    Mickorod Renard: the mode of no head
    Mickorod Renard: or at least without a top to my head
    Mickorod Renard: almost feels like I am airating my brain
    Lia Rikugun: this is amazing, I am not sure if I really get the whole idea
    Lia Rikugun: how to get into that mode
    Mickorod Renard: I am not sure I do it right, or if its my imagination,,but I am happy so far
    Lia Rikugun: :)
    Mickorod Renard: much of it for me is getting rid of focussing on all the noise that is usually going around my thoughts
    Lia Rikugun: exactly this si very difficult
    Mickorod Renard: yes
    Eos Amaterasu: the noise has momentum
    Mickorod Renard: once done, you can then open up to allowing things around you to enter, like appearance
    Eos Amaterasu: noticeable in the 9 secs gaps
    Lia Rikugun: yes yes opening up
    Mickorod Renard: and in that opening up, comes a feeling of light
    Eos Amaterasu: appearance presencing from openness, yes, feels illumined
    Eos Amaterasu: the 9 secs is a nice trick, .... , something you come or see from that


     the book "finite infinite games"

    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i just came across a book recently that reminded me of this project. i haven't read it yet, but i want to this summer
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: http://www.amazon.com/Finite-Infinit.../dp/0345341848
    Mickorod Renard: thanks
    Lia Rikugun: wow sounds interesting
    Lia Rikugun: I am sorry i will have to leave
    Lia Rikugun: have a nice week end you all!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, it was nice meeting you
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: hope to see you around, Lia
    Lia Rikugun: yes likewise
    Eos Amaterasu: I also must leave, thanks everyone!
    Lia Rikugun: was really nice to talk to you
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sorry i missed the session

    I had to leave at this moment and will not try to comment on the discussion

    Mickorod Renard: i think I can describe my feeling, from the point of light through a camera apperture, like an iris opening up,,one always has light entering,,but when opening up(like with an iris) one can be more perceptive to things usually outside of the range
    Mickorod Renard: its ok,,we have pleanty more
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ha ha
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: where are oyu from mickorod?
    Mickorod Renard: do you still get the mail to say when things are on?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: SL mail?
    Mickorod Renard: I am from the Uk
    Mickorod Renard: well,,google group mail
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i was on the gaurdian list, but i got kicked off for not showing up for a while
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: crummy policy, if you ask me
    Mickorod Renard: well,,maybe u need to ask to rejoin
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i didn't mind lurnking, and i wasn't bothering anyone
    Mickorod Renard: the policy may have reasons
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: probably.
    Mickorod Renard: for example,,a gaurdian has an oportunity to claim land here
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i would have waived that, if asked
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i don't want land here right now
    Mickorod Renard: well, I guess if everyone showed up once or twice and claimed land it would be unfair for those more regular
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: or, why shouldn't i be entitled to land either?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh, i showed up more than once or twice
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: though i never permanantly manned a post
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but i subbed
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: substitute gaurdian
    Mickorod Renard: well, I was just tryin to show that there are considerations to why there may be policies
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: that could have been my title
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sure
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: doesn't make htem any less crummy ;-)
    Mickorod Renard: not everyone is as honest as you perhaps
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: s'ok. i'm over it.
    Mickorod Renard: cool
    Mickorod Renard: do you visit the kira sessions?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: that apeture feeling, that is from the 9 second practice?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: um, haven't been there yet.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: do you have the landmakr?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i seriously haven't been inside SL in months
    Mickorod Renard: the aperture feeling is more from my personal time
    Mickorod Renard: I never really get into the 9 seconds
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: interesting.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: is that still hte core of hte practice here?
    Mickorod Renard: we have deviated into other themes too,,but when Pema is here we tend to focus on Being
    Mickorod Renard: Being as in 'Being'
    Mickorod Renard: he he
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: nice. you know, i think i will hit that workshop at kira
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: please, sir.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh wait, is that now?
    Mickorod Renard: but we also do time and dreams and even delve into ethic and theology through the back door
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yes, i've had one of those months
    Mickorod Renard: yes?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: time, waking dreams (or dreamlike states while awake), being, the works
    Mickorod Renard: yep,,thats the stuff
    Mickorod Renard: and of course 'phenemology'
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh, it felt exhilirating
    Mickorod Renard: well, not sure if you are joking..he he
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: never can tell in here, heh?
    Mickorod Renard: grin
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, here's a hint: I try my best to never lie
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: which, i suppose is not identical with honesty
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,thats an interesting point
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, generally speaking, my insides are viewable from outside
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: what is your background?
    Mickorod Renard: lol,,that wud take a long time
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh - sorry, i forgot how this world works. i haven't even right-clicked you
    Mickorod Renard: i am in design and technology at the moment,,but I am not young and have a mixed history
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: ah. an alchemist.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: me too.
    Mickorod Renard: grin,,I soppose on the periphery of ,yes
    Mickorod Renard: great
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yes, i work in educational technology
    Mickorod Renard: cool,,me too
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and am also working on a phd in communications
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: sweet.
    Mickorod Renard: interesting
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: are you an NMC'er?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (New Media Consortium)
    Mickorod Renard: no
    Mickorod Renard: I am just plain old me
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: true dat.
    Mickorod Renard: I work at a college
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: at least, for now.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: tomorrow you'll be someone else
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: we all will
    Mickorod Renard: grin
    Mickorod Renard: wherabouts are you from?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i told you - my insides express themselves publically
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: check out the shirt
    Mickorod Renard: a ha
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: the statue of liberty gave it to me, but i am not just a tourist
    Mickorod Renard: sussed
    Mickorod Renard: do you know Pema then?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: not well
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but yes
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i learned about PaB at a talk he gave up at Columbia U
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: before this began last year
    Mickorod Renard: great
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: it was at a science and religion conf, on free will or something
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i didn't attend the conf
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but, i knew pema's name, from college reading
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i took a class w/ a philosopher who used to dialogue w/ pema often
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: and we read some of their dialogues
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: so, when i saw pema's name on the program, i made sure to check it out
    Mickorod Renard: he is working in Japan at the moment so he is on a diferent time zone than we usually meet him on
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: right. half a year there, or more...
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: he is amazing.
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: his wife is a notable sociologist at the new school also
    Mickorod Renard: yes, I dont know how he can spend the time on here with his rl commitments
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, i think the institue for advanced study is a special place ;-)
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: kinda like The Village, in the prisoner, at least from afar
    Mickorod Renard: grin,,thats a good way of putting it
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i wonder if they effectively neutralize most of hte brillance that ends up there...
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: not pema, but i think its odd, being that smart and not teaching
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: maybe that's just me
    Mickorod Renard: I have mused over this too,,not about Pema, but about where everyone goes
    Mickorod Renard: they seem to move from one project to another and then ,,I dunno
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: you mean who? avatars here in SL? Gaurdians? Humans? Professors? im confused?
    Mickorod Renard: sorry, Humans/professors
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: well, for sure. and it does seem as if the institutions, like many other industrial era information production systms, are in a state of, err, flux
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: wow
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: irridescent
    Mickorod Renard: he he ..well,,i think the whole world is in a state of flux at the mom,,
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heck - swine virus has bred w/ avian flu....
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: that means that pigs are flying, right?
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: (ba-da-bump)
    Mickorod Renard: yea,,and we may get poo on our heads yet
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: heh. but at least all those debts will be cleared up
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: but yeah, i had some friends looking for prof jobs this year - it was really tough
    Mickorod Renard: I think jobs are gonna be tough to find in any sector,,best hang onto what we got
    Mickorod Renard: hope it sorts itself out
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: i'm indentured for the better part of hte next decade, so i'm not going anywhere
    Mickorod Renard: thats handy
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: of course it will sort itself out. i just hope it sorts itself out /quickly/ ;-) I'm very impatient
    Mickorod Renard: me too
    Mickorod Renard: ok,,I will have to leave
    Mickorod Renard: got rl calling
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: yup. cool meeting you.
    Mickorod Renard: yes,,you must come back..or to kira
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: oh!
    Friedrich Ochsenhorn: can you give me the kira landmark pls?
    Mickorod Renard: sure
    Mickorod Renard: ok matey

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