2010.04.08 01:00 - I am a lobster in real life

The Guardian for this meeting was Zen Arado. The comments are by Zen Arado. Present were Qt Core, Darren Islar, and briefly, Crusty Goldshark and Stevenaia Michinaga - and my cat:)

Qt is suffering a bout of Flu' so we talked about that (and cats and dogs):  

    Zen Arado: Hi Qt :)
    Qt Core: hi
    Zen Arado: how are you?
    Qt Core: not so great recovering from a flu
    Zen Arado: oh
    Zen Arado: swine flu?
    Qt Core: don't know, don't think
    Qt Core: the cat is a friend of yours ?
    Zen Arado: must be seasonal variety maybe
    Zen Arado: yes it's my cat :)
    Zen Arado: brought her for company :)
    Qt Core: and as real cats she is ignoring you and sleeps away :-)
    Zen Arado: ha ha yes
    Zen Arado: but she also sits and stares at me
    Zen Arado: I had a ittle cat like this when I was a boy
    Zen Arado: little
    Zen Arado: I like cats - and dogs
    Qt Core: only cats for me and i had one or two when i was a child
    Zen Arado: I would like one in RL but where I live is not good for cats
    Zen Arado: too near a main road
    Zen Arado: and I don't like to keep cats in the house all the time
    Qt Core: same here, until 9 i lived in a home with a little but nice garden with several fruit tree and space for animals we had chicken, a turtle and the neigorough visiting dog and sometimes a cat
    Zen Arado: that's nice
    Zen Arado: I live in a ground floor apartment atm
    Zen Arado: I had a dog but he died abbout 5 years ago
    Zen Arado: I used to walk him every morning from an electric wheelchair
    Zen Arado: it was very cold in winter
    Zen Arado: so I didn't get another one
    Zen Arado: dogs need a lot of care and attention
    Qt Core: yes that is the utilitaristic part of my preference for cats ;-)
    Zen Arado: yes they are more indepenent

The pub and Eckhart Tolle:

    Zen Arado: Yaku and I were in the pub for a while yesterday
    Zen Arado: not many use the pub
    Zen Arado: I invited a woman and we talked about Eckhart Tolle
    Zen Arado: you know him?
    Qt Core: no, i think i don't
    Zen Arado: he is a German guy who wrote a famous book called 'The Power of Now'
    Zen Arado: similar to what we do here I think
    Zen Arado: keeping coming back to the present moment
    Zen Arado: there is a group for him in SL but nothing much has happened with it yet

Back to the Flu:

Zen Arado: flu makes you weak?
    Zen Arado: I have a vaccination against it every year
    Qt Core: yes, it made me quite weak
    Qt Core: i don't get the vaccination and i don't usually get the flu, but this year we get at least 4 round and i lost on this fourth one
    Zen Arado: I get it because I am old and have muscular dystrophy, a nuscle wasting disease
    Zen Arado: muscle
    Zen Arado: so my muscles are weak already
    Zen Arado: if I got flu I might not be able to get out of bed
    Zen Arado: I would need nursing care
    Qt Core: both my mother and sister get it and they didn't get it (yet)
    Qt Core: get it the vaccine don't get it the flu ;-)
    Zen Arado: yes - I havent had the flu for about 20 years
    Zen Arado: in fact I don't remember it was so long ago
    Qt Core: in last decades flu changed, now it is most a gastric bug that the old cold type
    Zen Arado: Hi Darren

Darren arrives and we talk about alt personality and societal gender roles and stereotypes:

    Qt Core: hi Darren
    Darren Islar: hi guys
    Zen Arado: you were here before?
    Darren Islar: sorry, changed my tag last night
    Darren Islar: yes, I have as Liza
    Zen Arado: ah I thought I recognizes the name
    Darren Islar: yes, I think you saw Darren before, but not sure
    Zen Arado: the cat is looking suspiciously at you :)
    Darren Islar: ow, then maybe I should do something about that
    Zen Arado: how do you like being male?
    Darren Islar: hmmmm, I'm afraid she doesn't like me
    Darren Islar: pretty normal :_)
    Darren Islar: It is different, but I do have a strong male-side
    Darren Islar: and sl gives me the opportunity to feel how that is like
    Darren Islar: but I need to say that Darren surprised me
    Zen Arado: in what way?
    Darren Islar: well, I alwasy thought that the maleside sometimes got in the way in my personality
    Darren Islar: but that turns out to be liza's ....eh.....bitchy side
    Darren Islar: and never want to have children
    Darren Islar: but Darren seem to love them
    Zen Arado: I don't know what way to think about male/female
    Darren Islar: I guess we projected to many labels on being male or female
    Darren Islar: some are right but some are very cultural
    Zen Arado: ther is a lot of prejudices and hang ups in me about that
    Darren Islar: and all my life I have been fighting with that
    Darren Islar: because I am not a 'normal' female
    Zen Arado: what is 'normal' ?
    Zen Arado: I think it is like a scale from masculine to feminine
    Qt Core: i had trouble for my knowledge of male/female roles even in the first week of kindergarden ;-)
    Zen Arado: you could be in the middle
    Darren Islar: well, normal is a picture in your head of what you think a male or female should be like
    Darren Islar: and some of the picture is colored in by the environment
    Zen Arado: yes but it is a societal stereotype isn't it?
    Darren Islar: and some you color in yourself
    Zen Arado: there is fear in males in case they are gay
    Darren Islar: yes, so you can ask yourself what 'normal' is
    Darren Islar: but if you define that as: what most people do
    Darren Islar: i don't fit the normal standard
    Darren Islar: but does that make me abnormal
    Darren Islar: yes Zen, I understand
    Zen Arado: no only as far as a lot of prejudiced people are concerned
    Darren Islar: interesting QT
    Zen Arado: I am a pretty heterosexual male
    Darren Islar: :-)
    Darren Islar: well, I think me being a lesbian opened up things
    Qt Core: my mother was a teacher and my father an engineer, so i was used to see my mother working grading papers and my fathers halping around home
    Darren Islar: there is no 'role' of what a lesbian should be like
    Darren Islar: especially not in my days
    Qt Core: so when i was asked to draw my family i depicted that... free pass to the school shrink ;-)
    Zen Arado: you should just learn to be yourself
    Darren Islar: ah, your parents took different roles
    Zen Arado: :) Qt
    Darren Islar: wow
    Qt Core: it was only thet my father didn't take work home so he had teh time to help
    Zen Arado: some countries are less open to gayness
    Qt Core: luckily the shrink was a family friend ;-)
    Zen Arado: and are rigid in gender roles
    Darren Islar: yes, but it is an experience you will not forget
    Darren Islar: so you learned something about what others think would be right or wrong
    Zen Arado: yes
    Darren Islar: it shouldn't be that way
    Qt Core: yes,people should mistreat male and females equally ;-)
    Darren Islar: and as a child you are open to that kind of input
    Zen Arado: society is changing for the better though
    Darren Islar: :-) QT
    Zen Arado: :)
    Darren Islar: I don't know, I thought so too, but still a lot of lesbians seem to have the same kind of problems
    Zen Arado: older people still have hang ups
    Darren Islar: but there are more opportunities to explore more, that is true
    Qt Core: sometimes i wonder if speaking a language that don't have a neuter so everything is male ot female make that worse
    Darren Islar: oh but younger too, especially with the growing group of immigrants, that still have the same prejudices
    Zen Arado: there was a case in the UK last weekend where a gay couple were refused admission to a bed and breakfast place
    Darren Islar: I mean for somebody form Turkey to be gay, well, you'd better not be
    Darren Islar: it still happens
    Darren Islar: I don't know QT, interesting question
    Darren Islar: I think so
    Darren Islar: where did the cat go
    Zen Arado: good point t
    Zen Arado: I took it
    Zen Arado: everything is going funny for me here
    Darren Islar: ah, so I can't try to make friends anymore :-(
    Zen Arado: thought it might be because of the cat
    Darren Islar: ah :-)
    Zen Arado: why Liza?
    Qt Core: i have to go, as i'm not comatose like yesterday i will be slaved around today :-(
    Zen Arado: the couple got a lot of sympathy - they were on TV news
    Zen Arado: ok bye Qt
    Darren Islar: good luck then QT
    Darren Islar: bye
    Qt Core: bye all
    Darren Islar: yes, well that is a good thing too, people now getting angry about such behavior

Crusty Goldshark arrived and I crashed at this point but hopefully did not miss too much. We talked about environmental pressures on gender and gayness:

    Zen Arado: oh the recording stopped too
    Darren Islar: oh there is a new recording
    Darren Islar: yes, I'm not a memeber
    Zen Arado: ha hope I can sort it out :)
    Zen Arado: interested in what you wre saying Liza
    Darren Islar: it happened to me uyesterday, had liza claimed both logs
    Crusty Goldshark: back - yes I have been here before - about a year ago
    Darren Islar: but I didn't get the link of the second log
    Zen Arado: ok and you know we record the sessions and are happy about that?
    Darren Islar: funny you still call me liza :-)
    Zen Arado: sorry I forgot:)
    Crusty Goldshark: Yes I am happy for Liza to be recorded
    Darren Islar: np :-)
    Zen Arado: gets confusing :)
    Darren Islar: pretty much so :-)
    Crusty Goldshark: Confusion is my natural state
    Zen Arado: we were taliking about gender issues Crusty
    Crusty Goldshark: I am a Lobster in real life -
    Zen Arado: and using alts of a different sex than you normally have
    Zen Arado: :)
    Crusty Goldshark: ah yes - well I am a definite gender in real life but quite happy to be human in SL
    Darren Islar: well, then you changed a lot Crusty
    Zen Arado: women's sexuality is more fluid than that of a male I think
    Zen Arado: males have more rigid roles
    Crusty Goldshark: well I feel gender is important for sex procreation and warfare and sport which men seem to enjoy . . .
    Darren Islar: yes I think your right
    Crusty Goldshark: well I have just been playing a game as a woman - it was either that or a martian . . .
    Darren Islar: at the same time, women aren't taken seriously when it comes to taken up a role besides the 'box'
    Zen Arado: maybe it is because society demands more rigidity for males?
    Darren Islar: you know a lot of males seem to think that lesbians can be turned around
    Darren Islar: if they only get the right experience with the right man
    Crusty Goldshark: depends on the environment and context _ I would be quite happy to be female in a virtual life or a robot or an animal - in real life I would be locked up . . .
    Zen Arado: ha yes
    Darren Islar: to make sure you best can also copy the onversation
    Darren Islar: the last part
    Darren Islar: true Crusty
    Zen Arado: there is a female politician in N.Ireland who last year declared that she had a psychologist friend who could treat homosexuals
    Darren Islar: OMG
    Zen Arado: make them 'normal'
    Crusty Goldshark: I like wandering around in second life (first time here in a while) but find most of the conversations too inane to bother with - prefer talking to myself . ..
    Zen Arado: but there was a huge outcry
    Zen Arado: we are pretty inane too Crusty :)
    Crusty Goldshark: homosexuality is needed for us to survive - it is a social necessity
    Crusty Goldshark: I should say societal survival mechanism
    Zen Arado: it later transpired she had had an affair with a young man 30 years younger than her ( she was married to the Prime Mininster here )
    Darren Islar: emptiness Zen? :-)
    Zen Arado: why do you say that Crusty?
    Darren Islar: wrong interpretation of it clearly :-)
    Crusty Goldshark: Is emptiness like air heads?
    Zen Arado: I practice 'not knowing' :)
    Darren Islar: people can be weird
    Zen Arado: weirder the better :)
    Crusty Goldshark: Well . . . I feel there is a male anger and even female competiveness
    Darren Islar: maybe so Crusty, but it doesn't interest me much why I feel this way, I just do
    Zen Arado: I always found feminism interesting
    Crusty Goldshark: if allowed to get out of control (no counter measure) our societal tribes would tear themselves to bits - so homosexuality deals that aggressive aspect of humanity
    Zen Arado: homosexuals aren't agressive?
    Crusty Goldshark: Anyways - have to go make tea - will cu again sometime - bfn
    Darren Islar: I thnk he means something different
    Zen Arado: ok bye Crusty
    Darren Islar: bye Crusty
    Zen Arado: yeah maybe
    Zen Arado: not so agressive in killing each other maybe
    Crusty Goldshark: homosexuals are not agressive when - eh - trying to attract rather than bitch - OK Lobster out
    Zen Arado: ok agreed :)
    Darren Islar: :-)

Fighting for womens' or disability rights:

    Zen Arado: you don't think you should fight for women's rights?
    Darren Islar: oh I did
    Zen Arado: or raise awareness etc?
    Zen Arado: only asking BTW
    Darren Islar: but womens rights are different then lesbian rights
    Zen Arado: not saying you should
    Darren Islar: it is pretty confusing too
    Zen Arado: well - lesbian rights too
    Darren Islar: well, as a buddhist I guess I chose another way
    Darren Islar: I'm not interested anmore in demonstrations
    Zen Arado: I find the same with disability
    Darren Islar: I'm more interested what it does to me and the people around me
    Zen Arado: I used to campaign for better access etc
    Darren Islar: well, I'm very glad there are still people out there that are fighting, or campaigning which is a less agressive word
    Darren Islar: But in the end it starts with human relationships
    Zen Arado: yes - I still do it but on a personal level
    Darren Islar: I think it is important to work on both sides
    Darren Islar: exactly
    Zen Arado: I was a disability activist for a long time
    Zen Arado: but got cynical about the way the groups worked
    Darren Islar: and some are better in campaigning and some are better in other things
    Zen Arado: yes that too
    Zen Arado: I got fed up going to meetings
    Darren Islar: yes, I'm afraid I would get into a fight with the group :-)
    Darren Islar: somehow that doesn't work with me
    Zen Arado: me too ;)
    Darren Islar: so it is better to do something on a personal level for me
    Zen Arado: I talk to local concillors
    Darren Islar: what are concillors?
    Zen Arado: councillors
    Darren Islar: oh, ah
    Zen Arado: town councillors administration for my town
    Darren Islar: I understand now
    Zen Arado: I got some things improved for disabled in my town
    Darren Islar: great, that's important
    Zen Arado: but I don't want to spend all my time doing that
    Darren Islar: agreed

Disabilities:

    Zen Arado: just keeping going to things helps
    Darren Islar: are you disabled in any way Zen if it is not too personal to ask?
    Zen Arado: yes - I have muscular dystrophy
    Zen Arado: muscle wasting disease
    Darren Islar: yes, is that for your whole body?
    Zen Arado: I don't keep it a secret:)
    Zen Arado: yes
    Darren Islar: wowo
    Darren Islar: wow I mean
    Zen Arado: it starts in arms and shoulders
    Zen Arado: and it affects my legs now so I am in a wheelchair
    Zen Arado: Hi Steve :)
    Darren Islar: sorry to hear Zen
    Darren Islar: hi Steve
    stevenaia Michinaga: hello, just waking up here
    Darren Islar: is this the genetic kind?
    Zen Arado: yes I was born with it
    Darren Islar: do you have a lot of pain?
    Zen Arado: no not much
    Zen Arado: having trouble with right shoulder atm though
    Zen Arado: I use it so much for picking things up
    Darren Islar: and it is not working well anymore
    Darren Islar: quite a story Zen
    Zen Arado: soemrtimes it is the way I sleep
    Darren Islar: sorry?
    Zen Arado: if I sleep on my right side it gets painful when I wake up
    Darren Islar: ah
    Zen Arado: I was able to work for 33 years anyway
    Darren Islar: that is quite a long time with a disease like that
    Zen Arado: yes but you get used to it
    Zen Arado: you find ways to work around it
    Zen Arado: you have to !
    Darren Islar: well, somehow things that are there from the day you are born, are in a way easier to handle
    Darren Islar: because you don't now different
    Zen Arado: in some ways yes
    Darren Islar: and as you say: you have to
    Zen Arado: but I got depressed at each new stage of the disease
    Darren Islar: I can imagine, I didn't mean to say it is easy
    Zen Arado: having to use a wheelchair is the worst
    Zen Arado: I am not sensitive about it Darren :)
    Darren Islar: :-)
    Zen Arado: I am supposed to go to a retreat in 2 weeks
    Zen Arado: but it is so exhausting for me
    Darren Islar: yes
    Zen Arado: even though people give me a lot of help
    Darren Islar: yes, but everything takes up more energy now
    Darren Islar: need to think about every detail
    Darren Islar: and I suppose there is also a body fatigue
    Zen Arado: I have to get up 1/2 hour earlier than others it takes me so much time to put my clothes on
    Zen Arado: 5.30 am
    Darren Islar: yes, for example
    Darren Islar: well I think 6 is already very early :-)
    Zen Arado: they start meditation at 6.20 am
    Zen Arado: and it doesn't finish until 9.30 pm
    Darren Islar: ah yes in retreats they do that early
    Darren Islar: quite a long time
    Darren Islar: but you are still going
    Zen Arado: not sure
    Darren Islar: hmmmm, sorry to hear
    Zen Arado: you still go to retreats?
    Darren Islar: no, my body fatigue isn't letting me
    Zen Arado: you have ME?
    Darren Islar: After an hour I get exhausted
    Darren Islar: I suppose so
    Darren Islar: there seems to be nothing else wrong, so it means that I probably have ME
    Darren Islar: but they are not able to diagnose that
    Zen Arado: it is difficult to diagnose I think
    Darren Islar: yes
    Darren Islar: and hard for others to understand, because there seems to be nothing wrong with me
    Zen Arado: yes
    Zen Arado: I wonder if there is much point going if I am so exhausted all the time
    Zen Arado: I usually don't sleep very well at retreats
    Zen Arado: nearly fall off the wheelchair during the day
    Zen Arado: because I get so sleepy
    Darren Islar: :-)
    Darren Islar: well, the problem to me is that if I get exhausted
    Darren Islar: I get through my physical resistance
    Darren Islar: and when that happens
    Darren Islar: I also go through my psychological resistance
    Zen Arado: yes
    Darren Islar: I also have a psychological trauma
    Zen Arado: the body affects the mind too
    Darren Islar: and the all kind of negative feelings and emotions are coming up
    Darren Islar: oh it does
    Zen Arado: yes
    Darren Islar: and then it gets really hard
    Zen Arado: people don't understand
    Zen Arado: you have to experience it yourself
    Darren Islar: no, if you haven't been there, you don't understand
    Darren Islar: yes
    Zen Arado: like people tell me to take exercise to build up my muscles
    Darren Islar: and in relationship with friends that can become a real issue
    Zen Arado: I know
    Darren Islar: yes :-)
    Darren Islar: I have a ton of good advices
    Darren Islar: and if I don't do what they think I should do, they feel they can judge me about that
    Zen Arado: I tell them my muscles are damaged in a way that they don't get stronger with exercise but they never believe me
    Darren Islar: that I'm not working hard enough to 'get better'
    Zen Arado: yes exactly
    Darren Islar: it is so strange that people that know you for an hour seems to know what is wrong with you
    Zen Arado: yes
    Zen Arado: :)
    Darren Islar: while you're there in your body for so many years tryig to find a solution
    Darren Islar: it is almost like people are afraid to except the facts
    Darren Islar: there need to be a solution
    Zen Arado: I was diagnosed at age 12 - 54 years ago :)
    Darren Islar: yes, that;s what i mean
    Darren Islar: people like to have hope
    Darren Islar: and they don't want to understand that accepting the situation is a much better idea
    Zen Arado: yes

Stephen Batchelor and ideas of death:

    Zen Arado: I watched a video yesterday
    Zen Arado: Stephen Batchelor
    Darren Islar: (there is a familiar sound to that)
    Zen Arado: he says we only have a finite number of breaths left
    Zen Arado: each time we breathe it is one less !
    Zen Arado: but paradoxically that makes us more aware of each moment
    Zen Arado: and to make the most of what time we have left
    Darren Islar: yes
    Darren Islar: so what tells us that about top sporters I wonder :-)
    Zen Arado: http://www.tricycle.com/online-retre...wakening-death
    Darren Islar: thanks
    Darren Islar: I will look at it later
    Zen Arado: it is 26 mins long only
    Zen Arado: I better go Darren
    Zen Arado: I have to go out soon
    Zen Arado: nice talking to you:)
    Darren Islar: oh before you go
    Zen Arado: yes?
    Darren Islar: I give you another link
    Zen Arado: sure
    Darren Islar: that really cheers me up when I'm down
    Darren Islar: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tx4cRw6TIIg
    Zen Arado: ok thanks
    Zen Arado: see you soon :)
    Zen Arado: bye