2010.04.15 01:00 - Being Souls and Flowering

The Guardian for this meeting was Zen Arado. The comments are by Zen Arado. present were Cosmic Ushinawa, Crusty Goldshark, Calvino Rabeni and Jadelike McAuley.

Introducing ourselves:

    Zen Arado: Hi Everybody!
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hello
    Crusty Goldshark: hi guys :)
    Zen Arado: not used to people being here so early!
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: where are You from People?
    Zen Arado: I live in N.Ireland
    Crusty Goldshark: London
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Finland
    Zen Arado: Hi Jade
    Aztlan Foss: oh hi everyone!
    Crusty Goldshark: Fin land - we sharks want our fins back!
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;D
    Zen Arado: I know 2 people from Finland
    Crusty Goldshark: did you see the guy with the gun? Was he a shark fisher? (quakes]
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I saw ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Cal**
    Zen Arado: was just passing therough maybe
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hope so ;9
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Crusty Goldshark: hope so too
    Zen Arado: you know Stargate Tone?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, also in Rl ;)
    Crusty Goldshark: no?
    Zen Arado: she comes here sometimes
    Zen Arado: with Moon usually
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
    Zen Arado: and Fael of course
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: She invited me to join to Sl ;)
    Zen Arado: ah great
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Had not heart from this before she invited me join ;)
    Zen Arado: she is a friend of mine too
    Jadelike McAuley: hello,everybody
    Crusty Goldshark: sit down guys :)
    Zen Arado: Hi Jade
    Zen Arado: you been here before Jade?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hi Jade
    Jadelike McAuley: simle
    Jadelike McAuley: :) nice to meet u
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: same same **
    Crusty Goldshark: nice to meet you
    Zen Arado: you too
    Jadelike McAuley: what are u doing here?
    Zen Arado: you know we record these sessions Jade?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: talking and expanding our minds and souls...
    Zen Arado: I will give you a notecard telloing you what we do
    Crusty Goldshark: we just finished our cigars and are now looking for seals in the pool
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: lol ;)
    Jadelike McAuley: that's sound very cool
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that would be fun ;)
    Crusty Goldshark: I sadly sold my soul
    Zen Arado: we meet here 4 times a day
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: oh, to whom?
    Crusty Goldshark: I got a refund :)
    Zen Arado: 1nad 7 am and 1 and 7 pm
    Crusty Goldshark: Not sure . . . just glad of the refund . .
    Zen Arado: usually to the devil
    Zen Arado: don't think he gives refunds :)

The Devil and soul beliefs:

    Crusty Goldshark: The devil eh - I don't believe in him - and he is free to believe in whatever he displeases . . .
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I prefer to keep it to my-Self ;)
    Zen Arado: I don't even believe in beliefs :)
    Crusty Goldshark: You have a soul cosmic?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes I feel so to have One ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with spirit
    Crusty Goldshark: tee hee @Zen
    Crusty Goldshark: Oh we seem to have lost the seal hunter - just as I saw one swimming by the fountain . . .
    Jadelike McAuley: im sorry,i'll go,bye bye
    Crusty Goldshark: lost the guy with the cigar too - LOL
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Bye Jade
    Zen Arado: ok bye Jade
    Jadelike McAuley: im sorry,icant speak english well
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: So, do you have experience not having own soul?
    Zen Arado: you are doing well Jade
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: You are understood Jade
    Jadelike McAuley: im a foreiginer,thank you
    Crusty Goldshark: Ah he just stepped back a bit - still here Jade - so welcome
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, yes, like we all are foreigners in our point of wiew
    Crusty Goldshark: I too am a foriegner - only parlly human
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: from different countries
    Zen Arado: we are all foreigners in SL I guess
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: You too Crusty, hello alien ;)
    Crusty Goldshark: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, we got a cat here ;)
    Jadelike McAuley: some day i'll come ,listen to your words,i feel very happy
    Crusty Goldshark: good news Jade :)
    Zen Arado: great Jade
    Zen Arado: come any time
    Crusty Goldshark: Be kind to the fish
    Crusty Goldshark: Live long and prosper
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Here is nice to Be..
    Zen Arado: I am not sure about having a soul
    Jadelike McAuley: i want to take classes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: part of some group then?
    Crusty Goldshark: agrees with ZZen
    Zen Arado: it is difficult to prove
    Zen Arado: maybe you just feel it
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: does everything needed to be proved?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thats right
    Zen Arado: you can get translators too Jade
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: feel
    Zen Arado: Hi Cal!
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: the soul
    Jadelike McAuley: lol,have a good time !Crusty,Cos and Zen
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: **Cal***
    Crusty Goldshark: no but if not experienced then just another angel dancing on a pinhead . . .
    Crusty Goldshark: Bye Jade
    Zen Arado: you too bye Jade
    Zen Arado: well how do you experience a soul?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with my heart
    Crusty Goldshark: hi calvino
    Zen Arado: you can't put it into words I guess
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or throught the heart
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: sometimes feeling to be kinda giant
    Zen Arado: I studied it one time in philosophy
    Calvino Rabeni: Hello again Everyone :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
    Zen Arado: :)
    Zen Arado: you ask where is it located ?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, I found it from my heart
    Zen Arado: and how does it interact with the body?
    Crusty Goldshark: You studied the soul - that must have been a short course
    Zen Arado: many aspects to it though
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its kind of line connected to body, mind, spirit, soul
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: goes throught many levels/distances
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Zen Arado: if it is some kind of energy could be plausible
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: plausible?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: another words..
    Zen Arado: believable?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah
    Crusty Goldshark: I tend to feel it is experiential
    Zen Arado: makes sense?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, I can only say my own experience
    Zen Arado: yes maybe Crusty
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: like feeling to see this life throught my souls eyes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps its "somewhere" "up" there
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but can be linked
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Me become My-Self
    Zen Arado: a lot of people report 'out of body 'experiences after death
    Zen Arado: brb phone
    Crusty Goldshark: So I feel the presence of a soul or Spirit but give it the same credence as my lack of a soul (from an intellectual perspective - it is a sort of Quantum on/off condition . .
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or, what if it IS, but its about if we are open to it all the time
    Zen Arado: back
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or do we choose to close that connections sometimes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: wellcome back Zen
    Crusty Goldshark: wb zen
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: wellcome back Cal
    Crusty Goldshark: hi again calvino
    Zen Arado: wb Cal
    Zen Arado: Cal is in Thailand atm
    Zen Arado: so maybe has bad connection
    Calvino Rabeni: :) The net is dotty here - hard to stay linkedin
    Crusty Goldshark: I would say that being open to absence or presence - or being in a state of remberance as the Sufis migh say is directly linked to how and what we experience
    Calvino Rabeni: Agree Crusty
    Zen Arado: if we are an energy field we could transfer when we die
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Sufis?
    Zen Arado: since energy is never destroyed
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes, it is linked
    Calvino Rabeni: And also agree, Cosmic has a Soul
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: throught all bodies One haves in distances and ending to Soul??
    Zen Arado: Sufism is kind of mystical part of Islam religion I think
    Crusty Goldshark: However I would say further that the condition of having or not having a soul can be trancended and we can be impervious to whether the Soul is present or absent - a sort of tao or Zen moment . . .
    Zen Arado: yes Crusty - we never really will 'know' one way or another
    Crusty Goldshark: Sufism is strongly identified with Islam - yes
    Calvino Rabeni: Some mystics think soul must be made, does not come for "free"
    Crusty Goldshark: I would tend to agree with that from my knowledge Calvino
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, well I think it might be created life in many way
    Crusty Goldshark: It is a construct - or developing awareness
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but I also have a feeling I have always been and always will be

Lucid dreaming:

    Crusty Goldshark: Are you you when asleep?
    Zen Arado: like a self you mean Cal?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Well, I am My-Self when I do sleep
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: very strongly
    Crusty Goldshark: Gonna be even harder existing before or after you are reborn
    Calvino Rabeni: OK Zen a type of Self
    Crusty Goldshark: You sleep consciously cosmic?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes mostly, and see a lot. Also as symbolic ways
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: sometime I have commanded some not so nice fade away
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or when i was 7, I saw a nightmare
    Crusty Goldshark: ah - OK understood - most people are not lucid dreamers . . .
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and I said to my-Self in my dream; " this is only dream, go away"
    Zen Arado: amazing Cosmic
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: to that "bad" thing there in my dream ;)
    Zen Arado: how do you control dreams?
    Calvino Rabeni: Souls lile Self's seem mostly unconscious - being conscious is not a very sgnificnt thing IMHO
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: mostly can not control them, there are appearing things what is needed to appear
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or if there is a message
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I am kind of open to receive
    Calvino Rabeni: True
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what is coming
    Crusty Goldshark: Conciousness independent of body - for example tranferrence to future 'hard drives' is gonna be more reliable (if possible' then reincarnation IMHO
    Zen Arado: I remember reading about a technique to control dreams
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what is IMHO?
    Zen Arado: you could have a body transplant then Crusty
    Zen Arado: in my humble opinion
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, okey ;)
    Crusty Goldshark: Yes quite a few in Dream yoga used in Tibetan Buddhism - and Sufis sometimes 'drift' a kind of waking sleep
    Calvino Rabeni: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, and one night not so long ago
    Zen Arado: this was in a Carlos Castenada book
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I was crying loud
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: my partner asked me whats wrong
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I had my eyes open
    Crusty Goldshark: Yes we will be growing bodies in the next hundred years or less
    Zen Arado: yes Cosmic?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I said to him that witch burned my girls
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: he said
    Calvino Rabeni: ACK - s l o w - l i n k - :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: do not worry about it and took me to his arms
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I calmed down
    Zen Arado: nice :)
    Crusty Goldshark: IMHO = In My Humble Opinion
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: at morning he asked me do I remember what I spoke. I said noup
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: he thought I was awaik
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I said no I havent been, not eaven my eyes was open
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think I was somewhere past, and he cut the line there when started to speak, kind of took me back on this time
    Zen Arado: I am trying to be more open to these kinds of things
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: But usually I do remember my "dreams" and most of those are not dreams, but true
    Crusty Goldshark: ok gotta go guys - tghanks for company and chat - sweet dreams
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: happening on some other dimension
    Zen Arado: before I would have said the concept of a soul is completely irrational
    Zen Arado: bye Crusty
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Ok Crusty, have Fun
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: full of energy

Being more open, but with wisdom:

    Calvino Rabeni: @zen, to be more open is to learn new ways of knowing
    Zen Arado: yes of course
    Calvino Rabeni: :) that is what makes it fun :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, and everything what we do not know, or like that much, there is always something to learn, or remember..
    Zen Arado: have to watch out for spiritual charlatans too though I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: because all we like or know, that we already remember ;)
    Zen Arado: we need wisdom as well
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: wisdom of heart with Truth
    Zen Arado: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: Watch out for the confused more than the charlatans
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Intellect is then totally different thing in head ;)
    Calvino Rabeni: And trust your self
    Zen Arado: as long as they know they are confused
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that is very important to trust one`s own feel of something
    Zen Arado: it's when you don't that the problems start :)
    Calvino Rabeni: Which takes time to learn, at least for me
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if doing against one-Self there might be some "stones to breake at the way" ;)
    Calvino Rabeni: True Cos
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I learned that
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: by experience it ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: learned the lesson well ;) now days do not hesitate
    Zen Arado: maybe I am not open enough to feelings and emotions
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but on the other hand.. it makes me to be right then, almost everytime.. lol
    Zen Arado: too much in my head
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its the other side of that "coin"
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: lol
    Calvino Rabeni: If you listen to all parts of self, etc. at first it will seem a "committee" because one is not a unity
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, but well, its my truth. Everyone of course do have their own truth, and that is needed to honour
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: nothing worse than committees:)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, but I feel to be One
    Calvino Rabeni: because of identification with few parts of self
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: meaning with other people
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: being right, trusting own feel
    Zen Arado: intuition feeling
    Zen Arado: have to develop that
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it just need to trust blindly to one`s own intuition
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: firts feel what comes
    Calvino Rabeni: A voice cannot speak well unless honoured
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then notice to been trust on truth
    Zen Arado: if you live in the present moment you are doing this I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes
    Zen Arado: rather than always planning ahead
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its more fun to live in a moment
    Calvino Rabeni: Live in timeless place, that is not always what "the present" means
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thinking everyperson I meet at that moment, should be honoured like she/he is the most important person
    Zen Arado: the present is the only time though
    Zen Arado: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes cosmmic
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: because that person is at that moment who we see
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and meet
    Zen Arado: yes - we use the present as a means to the future I think
    Zen Arado: I lived most of my life fror the future I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but not anymore?
    Zen Arado: try not to
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Calvino Rabeni: They say - the present is etermity and includes past and future
    Zen Arado: but still do a lot I guess
    Calvino Rabeni: It is not the "relative" present

Living in the Present vs planning and rule adherence:

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thats good. Yesterday here came to my home one woman from child health centre
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: they use to visit when having new born child
    Zen Arado: it was always 'now' says Eckhart Tolle
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: so mother do not need to go
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: there with the baby
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: they do look that baby is grown etc
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: so
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that woman asked me how I have planned to brest feeding baby
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I said to her, I have not planned it
    Zen Arado: listens
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it just happens as long as it is possible
    Calvino Rabeni: And what will happen is part of that "now"
    Calvino Rabeni: (also listens)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but there I saw how perhaps people do plan eaven such a thing how long they attend to milking baby
    Zen Arado: ha yes
    Zen Arado: so natural a thing too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what if that milk is not enough for that "planned" thime
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: time
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: do those people punsih them some how..
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or get disappointed
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: It made me wonder why people do create such rules
    Calvino Rabeni: Perhaps a vision of the future is not the same thing as a plan
    Zen Arado: humans love to make rules
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but aliens do not ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: lol
    Zen Arado: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I try to give to people opportunities to get rid of those not necessary rules
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with their hearts
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but also sometimes rules are needed
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if person have no understanding for example
    Zen Arado: yes - but flexible rules
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then it might go against one-Self
    Zen Arado: we seem to need a framework of some kind to operate in
    Zen Arado: but we should be prepared to dump it if necessary
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes,
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: sometime rule can also be as a cover
    Zen Arado: yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or a shelter
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if One feels strongly to need that rule
    Zen Arado: and it stops creativity and imagination
    Zen Arado: we want things to stay the same
    Calvino Rabeni: It is always a fine thing to think along with others' minds knowing their connection
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: hmm, but perhaps people do keep their rules, because there is needed some courage to jump to "air" to live in moment
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: without controlling everything
    Zen Arado: yes - we try to control too much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Ys it is ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes
    Calvino Rabeni: I feel no desire to have things stay the same
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it is ;)
    Zen Arado: sometimes I do if they are going well :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, they can not stay the same, because all is changing all the time
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: people do change, grow,
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: as well living environment- people there- do change
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if one-self do change
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or grow
    Calvino Rabeni: My desire is for them to change as their Way would have it
    Zen Arado: it can be painful to grow sometimes

Adapting to change:

    Zen Arado: want to cling to old ways
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: change might also bring some mind exploding, or growing
    Zen Arado: fearful
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: those changes are not bad always, but well
    Calvino Rabeni: :)
    Zen Arado: true
    Calvino Rabeni: It can be very painful *not* to grow
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: of course there are also those not so good changes, but then needed to listen that first impression, feeling
    Zen Arado: I see so many people so set in their ways
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Thats true
    Zen Arado: true too Cal :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if something is about to happen, or change for growing, it will happen
    Calvino Rabeni: Being set in ones ways "does not compute" (?)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if resisting
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: it might get some "troubles"
    Zen Arado: a kind of refusal to accept new things
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and many people do think they are victims
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: of system
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or work place
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or what ever
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: only because they ar just stuck on rules
    Zen Arado: ah yes - I know all about 'victim' thinking
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: But I think there is no victims
    Zen Arado: being disabled can very easily make you feel like a victim
    Calvino Rabeni: Zen, did I ever mention the book "The Other Within"
    Zen Arado: no I agree Cos
    Zen Arado: no Cal
    Zen Arado: tell ma Cal
    Zen Arado: who wrote it?
    Calvino Rabeni: It is about the power held by the disfigured and disabled
    Calvino Rabeni: I will find a link
    Zen Arado: sounds interesting
    Zen Arado: I don't find much about the psychological problems fo living with disability
    Calvino Rabeni: Sorry, net too slow. Author is Daniel Deardorf (or some spelling)
    Zen Arado: ok I will find it thanks
    Calvino Rabeni: He is story shaman
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that is something I do help people. Many comes to me saying what they would love to do, but there is too much How`s
    Calvino Rabeni: I attend his events in person when I can
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ahh, I will also look at that writer and book
    Zen Arado: too much Hows Cos?
    Calvino Rabeni: He is very disabled / disfigured
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: with people
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: they do not know how to manifest their dreams come true
    Zen Arado: Hi Lexi
    Calvino Rabeni: A very strong mind/soul power
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then I help them a bit ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hi Lexi
    Zen Arado: come and join us
    Zen Arado: ok sure np :)

Dealing with depressed person:

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: there is one girl I have helped many years now
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: she feels depressing many times
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: tryed to tell her how she create her own reality, and to choose different
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: these days I have given up
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have noticed, there is all okey in her life, but she choose to tell me always "the bad news"
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and no matter how much I try to help
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: she choose the same
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: so, there is also a line going, can not all the time do someone`s "job"
    Zen Arado: you have met people like this too Cal?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: she need to learn by her self
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if not choosing the positive way
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: helping goes for nothing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then that help, is Not to Help
    Zen Arado: yes - you can't help people like that
    Zen Arado: if they have no desire to be healed
    Zen Arado: perhaps they have a core belief that they are worthless
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I do not know
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or they just love that feeling of being depressed
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and loves to bring it to other people
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then only healing is not to heal
    Zen Arado: yes - it makes them feel important too
    Zen Arado: it is from the ego I think
    Calvino Rabeni: With people like that, do not listen to what they say
    Zen Arado: it always wants to feel important somehow
    Calvino Rabeni: but listen past that
    Zen Arado: yes Cal?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Hmm
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but my heart can not usually say no, if someone do ask for help
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: then need to go a bit more far
    Calvino Rabeni: They talk only the rehearsal of the problems and thus hold it in place
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Now I choose not to see her for a while
    Zen Arado: what kind of help can you give?
    Calvino Rabeni: It is heir "spell" or trance
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ys
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes
    Zen Arado: you have to go deeper somehow
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, that girl for example
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: comes to have a cup of tea
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: when she have trouples
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: once she said
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: about my helping
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that "its amazing, I came here on bad mood and now I leave with lightfull feeling"
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I did nothing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I just was
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that is how I help
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: just Be
    Zen Arado: yes great Cos
    Calvino Rabeni: And it is not about answering to problems
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and well, perhaps I "do" something, but on the other hand don`t do anything
    Calvino Rabeni: Ah you did "being" :)
    Zen Arado: just your presence helps her
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes, thats how I help, by presence
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Zen Arado: and you listened
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have not studied for healing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but somehow I have just done that
    Calvino Rabeni: Can be an active "presence"
    Zen Arado: deep listening - as Thich Nhat Hanh says
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, and thats why it is a bit difficult for me not to listen her
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or deny my help of heart

Necessity for formal study - or not?

    Zen Arado: if you studied you couldn't do it :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thats why I chose to be silent
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, perhaps those courses, or studies would have mixed up that inner knowing
    Zen Arado: yes - took you into your mind too much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Once Star said to me when we met in rl, she said I should burn all the spiritual books I have
    Zen Arado: like that nurse you mentioned
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Perhaps people do not need actually study
    Calvino Rabeni: Probaby that is wise Cosmic
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what if all is already existing in knowledge
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, well I did not burn those books
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes surely :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but learned not to belive all what there are said to be
    Calvino Rabeni: But you might have taken the study differently
    Zen Arado: yes -It is a balance with knowledge
    Calvino Rabeni: To not hand over your power o knowing to others
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ahh, well, I think I study by experience
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: full living my life
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: at least trying to live fullest
    Zen Arado: read with discrimination and critically
    Zen Arado: perhaps some of us need to read
    Zen Arado: others have spiritual knowledge naturally?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, some do read
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: that might be true
    Zen Arado: or from spiritual practice
    Calvino Rabeni: _/!\_ Cosmic - living to fullest as you are able
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: smiles
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: now, at home, mostly
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but it is full living too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: enjoyable
    Zen Arado: very full :)
    Zen Arado: with children
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yeap
    Calvino Rabeni: Some have taken "vows" wether they know it or not

Flowering through children:

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and also kind of feeling of hidden flower
    Zen Arado: children can teach you so much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: when being at home, not taking too much others energies there "from the road"
    Zen Arado: allowing you to flower yourself?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: of course, thats the extra benefit or right if being female :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: of being..
    Zen Arado: ha but many women would see it as a burden too
    Zen Arado: being tied to the house
    Zen Arado: would want freedom
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, I have still my freedom, I am not slave of my partner...
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps those many woman have a partner who keeps her as a property
    Zen Arado: many women want to work and let someone else look after the kids
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, I have worked too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but this is now
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: what doing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I will work again
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have my own business
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: so, firm needs its bilder
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ah, but tiny firm, firm still ;)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: love to be home too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: when worked much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: all is good
    Zen Arado: sounds good
    Zen Arado: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: there is also very important to let man feel to be a man in house
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: sometimes its good to stay at home
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and let man take that responsibility
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: from family
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its natural
    Zen Arado: I think a woman needs to look after childern when they are young
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, as well they do need their fathers too
    Zen Arado: but I am old fashioned I think
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps a little
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: not too much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: man can do also very well with kids I think
    Zen Arado: feminists would object to that
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;9
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its ecuality
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: woman can not do a child by her-self
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but woman can also let man take his "job" too
    Zen Arado: no you need a father too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes
    Zen Arado: I never had children
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and so do children too
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well,
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: still if not having "own" children One can be a father to many children
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: if knowing woman who already have a child
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: its not about that biological father
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: there are some fathers who do not care of their kids
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and someone might be more father no matter if its biological
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
    Zen Arado: I had a girlfriend with 2 children
    Zen Arado: last year
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
    Zen Arado: they stayed with me for 10 days
    Zen Arado: was very instructive for me :)
    Zen Arado: TV was on all the time :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, kids are wonderfull
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: here all the male persons loves movies and games
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have tried to brigh those to ski
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: etc outside
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: doing
    Zen Arado: yes outside is better
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Once I was laughing what should I do, when kids grow up, and start all men watch tv icehoccey with beer
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Then I should have friends or hobbies where to run away..
    Zen Arado: children can be difficult too though
    Zen Arado: very demanding
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: yes, but that is kind of natural thing
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: they do demand much
    Zen Arado: temper tantrums....
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: a battle field of willing
    Zen Arado: yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: sometimes is this house
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: battle of wills:)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: thats right
    Zen Arado: but I like kids
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes, they are wonderfull
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but its also amazing how to see already from kid their Being, or essence
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and how all of them do not have a good will
    Zen Arado: wb Cal
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: how some do are wery sweet, and some are kind of users of others
    Zen Arado: and you see your own childishness in them sometimes

The influence of the Internet on the young:

    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: wb <3
    Calvino Rabeni: TY - the bits come round the planet somehow :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: some Asian countries are very advanced with the Web
    Zen Arado: South Korea for example
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I have wondered these times are truly amazing
    Zen Arado: verey high speed internet
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: we can talk to people on the other side of the world, and for that we do understand each others, having a language what brakes limits of countries
    Zen Arado: thay worry about the influence on kids of using the internet so much
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I think internet is good thing
    Zen Arado: there was a TV documantary here about it
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: enable the communication world wide
    Zen Arado: a university prefessor said that new students have never read a complete book
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: why not?
    Zen Arado: they just use internet instead
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: having knowledge from net
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: and smaller portions of text
    Zen Arado: like on Twitter
    Zen Arado: or Facebook
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: well, when I was at school, I tryed to put a book under my pillow, and thought all the information will go to my head while I was sleeping
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: got a bad degree on examination ;)
    Zen Arado: didn't work :)
    Zen Arado: people used to listen to tapes while they slept
    Zen Arado: didn't work either :)
    Calvino Rabeni: I tried that trick and it worked - as long as thebook was not too technical :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: noup, perhaps its been working "some day" because I took it so for granted it will work out that way.. ;)
    Zen Arado: ah ok :)
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: wow
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps those are from some mystery chool stuff
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: from "old good days"
    Zen Arado: would save so much time if you could learn things while asleep
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: or if putting hand to a book and thats it
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: all info gone to head
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: ;)
    Zen Arado: on the TV programme they also said that modern children have learned to collaborate better with each other through using the Internet
    Zen Arado: through using social networking sites
    Zen Arado: so that is a positive thing
    Calvino Rabeni: The "always connected" generation - who knows what influence that will have ?
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Yes it is
    Zen Arado: but I worry if they will ever study things in depth
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: and I have wondered if there have been on this planet this kind of time before it is possible to communicate with language where ever on the planet
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: perhaps not
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: these are unique times I think
    Zen Arado: yes
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: telepathy , medium kind things, those have been
    Zen Arado: the INternet is taking down barriers
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: but with language
    Zen Arado: not possible to keep things secret so easily
    Zen Arado: I will have to go soon
    Zen Arado: I have a lot to do today
    Zen Arado: was nice talking to you both
    Calvino Rabeni: For me it is "siesta" time - the hot afternoon when it is great to stay inside in the cool
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Nice to talk Zen
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: have good time
    Calvino Rabeni: Yes thanks Zen - take care and be well
    Zen Arado: envious of you Cal :)
    Zen Arado: bye
    Cosmicflower Ushimawa: bye