2010.05.23 13:00 - our various acceptances

The Guardian for this meeting was Maxine Walden. The comments are by Maxine Walden. 

This session seemed to have several strands winding into a braid of sorts: accepting the less pleasant, even violent, or greedy aspects of our world and ourselves, then some inquiry into appetite and greed, what we need and what we want, and then re food and how eating less may be healthy, less being more; And then some focus on sleep deprivation, perhaps as a dangerous aspects of deprivation/starvation. But we seemed to come full circle about acceptance of the variety of appetites, greed, less-appealing aspects of our experience as part of the appreciation of Being.

Sartre Placebo: hi maxine
Maxine Walden: hi, Sartre
Maxine Walden: not sure we have met, have you come to these meetings often?
Sartre Placebo: yaku
Sartre Placebo: it´s just my alt
Maxine Walden: ah, !!, thanks!
Maxine Walden: does it feel different being Sartre?
Sartre Placebo: nein, not for me, but i feel that ppl like the name somehow even tho i am not that deep into literature :)
Maxine Walden: yes, nice evocative name, and I love your hat!
Sartre Placebo: yes, it´s the ,,mad hatter" outfit
Maxine Walden: !!, yes it is, isn't it. Great outfit!
Wol Euler: hello maxine, sartre
Maxine Walden: hi, Wol
Sartre Placebo: nabend wol
Maxine Walden: nice outfit, Wol
Wol Euler: ty :)
Wol Euler: an old favourite
Wol Euler: but one that I seldom wear
Maxine Walden: ah
Maxine Walden: guess you and Sartre have met, Wol?
Wol Euler: mmhmm, but thank you :)
Maxine Walden: :))
Wol Euler: for implicitly offering
Maxine Walden: I may be the least familiar with alts, but just checking...
Wol Euler nods. Confirmation is always good.
Maxine Walden: :)
Wol Euler: what is the topic?
Maxine Walden: none stated yet, anything you would like to mention?
Wol Euler thinks. Nothing at present, no :)
Wol Euler: hello bleu
Maxine Walden: sometimes just being able to Be peacefully for a bit is nice
Wol Euler nods.
Bleu Oleander: hi Wol, Maxine and Sartre
Maxine Walden: hi, Bleu
Sartre Placebo: hi bleu
Wol Euler: hello darren
Wol Euler: you're looking very much like a day at the seaside, darren
Maxine Walden: yes, :)
Darren Islar: been on the seaside last few days
Wol Euler: ah :)
Darren Islar: but I'm afraid only in sl
--BELL--
Wol Euler: ah well :)
arabella Ella: Hiya!
Sartre Placebo: hi ara
Maxine Walden: hi, ara, 90 sec pause in place
Bleu Oleander: hi Ara

It seemed like we needed some focus so I offered a personal experience which had given me pause

Maxine Walden: I had an interesting experience only a couple of hours ago:
Wol Euler: hello ara
Maxine Walden: while resting and pausing (9 sec, 90 sec) and looking out a lovely window on a garden,
Maxine Walden: I saw a favorite 3-legged cat friend, who has been so sweet with me, catch a bird, right there on the lawn.
Maxine Walden: The experience was one of shock and pain for me, and I found myself withdrawing feeling confused and angry at my 'friend', but then
Mickorod Renard: hellloooo
Maxine Walden: felt 'well, this is part of being open to Being as well, open to all the varied experiences of beauty, and violence...
Wol Euler nods to Maxine. Hello Mick
Mickorod Renard: :)
Maxine Walden: hi, Mick
Maxine Walden: hard sometimes to not withdraw from the violence in nature
Darren Islar: it is
Mickorod Renard: mmm,,thinks about it
Maxine Walden: I did find that when I could catch myself and resume the openness even to the pain of my 'friend' catching the bird, then I could feel even more open, have a wider view, be more accepting...
Darren Islar: yes
Maxine Walden: and not surprisingly let go of my 'wish' for only the pain-free and the pleasant, could see that as a limiting lens
Wol Euler nods.
Darren Islar: right there!!
Wol Euler: hello kazana, have you been here before?
Mickorod Renard: we all gotta eat,,even the animals
Darren Islar: hi Kazana
arabella Ella: brings to mind the food chain in nature
Kazana Kazan: No Wol but I would like to join
Wol Euler: ok, I'll give you an introduction in IM so we dont't disturb the others
Kazana Kazan: TY
Maxine Walden: thanks, Wol
Maxine Walden: What experiences have others been having ?
Darren Islar: it has been confusing for me, until my teacher told it is all habitual
arabella Ella: well i just watched a part of a documentary on tuna
Darren Islar: made sense to me
arabella Ella: and it was very sad
arabella Ella: europe consumes over 400 million cans of tuna annually
Kazana Kazan: Why sad? Becasue they are just food for people?
arabella Ella: mainly because it is not sustainable and most tuna species will soon become extinct
Darren Islar: besides that.....
Kazana Kazan: yes, they cannot "farm" tuna the way they have salmon
arabella Ella: over-fishing
arabella Ella: lack of funds for controls
Kazana Kazan: greed
Darren Islar: the subject here is more about the respect you have for other living creatures
--BELL--
arabella Ella: good money for poor economies
arabella Ella: isnt it lack of resp?ect that leads to extinction
Mickorod Renard: have they got to the bottom of how that Indian chap lives without eating food?
Darren Islar: fish to me are living creatures, more so then food
Darren Islar: right Ara, you're right
Wol Euler: do we believe that he does, Mick?
Kazana Kazan: how can one live without food?
Kazana Kazan: cells need nurishment
Wol Euler: there's a self-proclaimed mystic who says he hasn't eaten since ... how many decades?
arabella Ella: why should humans always over-consume everything they can lay their hands on?
Mickorod Renard: well,,i think we have to be open minded as he has offered to be tested
Wol Euler: it was in the news lately
Wol Euler: oh, I'm entirely willing for him to be tested, Mick. Eager, even :-/
Kazana Kazan: tested?
Mickorod Renard: he hasnt eaten for something like 4 or 5 decades
Mickorod Renard: I think
Maxine Walden: (such interesting threads we are having right now in our conversation about food/intake/greed/respect)
Kazana Kazan: you belive this?
Kazana Kazan: believe
Wol Euler: short answer: no.
Darren Islar: I belief it is possible yes
Kazana Kazan: anything is possible
Mickorod Renard: well, i often remind my kids of the greed in the sense that we do eat in the west more than seems required for our output
Kazana Kazan: no question about that
Kazana Kazan: they have proven that a "near starvation" diet keeps mice living much longer than those on even a normal diet.
Maxine Walden: less as more?
Mickorod Renard: that doesnt suprise me
Maxine Walden: seems the body streamlines its function on less food and cells live longer
Mickorod Renard: and lets face it, much we eat is no less than poison
Kazana Kazan: processed foods are poison
Maxine Walden: but maybe with less, we feel emotionally more balanced as well
Maxine Walden: so many different ways to think about these things
Bleu Oleander is hungry .... c u later :)
Darren Islar: bye Bleu
Wol Euler: bye bleu, eat carefully
arabella Ella: bye Bleu
Mickorod Renard: bye bleu
Kazana Kazan: bye bleu
Mickorod Renard: much is to do with coping with temptation,,its lenths are to no abound
Maxine Walden: yes, unbounded temptation can be disturbing
Kazana Kazan: temptation for one person is normal appetite to another
Maxine Walden: hmm, different baselines, perhaps?
Mickorod Renard: its like consumation of world resourses too
Kazana Kazan: yes, all of us need things in differen proportions
Kazana Kazan: food, sleep, sex, social networking et cetera
Maxine Walden: perhaps so, Kazana, maybe also a matter of how we choose our priorities
Darren Islar: as you describe it is taking care of matter
Kazana Kazan: choice yes or perhaps our priorities select us
Darren Islar: which is important of course
Mickorod Renard: yes, maybe we should consider in what order we would write those options..he he
Kazana Kazan: has the holy man also abstained from sleep and sex as well as food?
Darren Islar: it is not in the priorities or where they come from, it is how you deal with it
Maxine Walden: not sure, only heard about the claim re food
Mickorod Renard: I am sorry but I dont have any more on him
Darren Islar: he probably did
Kazana Kazan: there are cases of people who have not slept in many years
Mickorod Renard: but the military are interested in finding out how he sustains himself,,naturally for armed forces survival technique
--BELL--
Maxine Walden: (a 90 sec pause coming up...)
Mickorod Renard: I have read recently, to the contrary, that without sleep we would die in a week,,but many get by on short naps,,,as per the science journal I read,,,,which i always forget the name of
Kazana Kazan: day dreaming is a form of sleep
Maxine Walden: have heard similarly, Mick, that the body grabs what it needs in short naps if it must
Mickorod Renard: yes
Mickorod Renard: but total sleep deprivation is lethal
Maxine Walden: yes, probably is
Kazana Kazan: how many times have you been drivng somewhere and realize that you have gone for miles without realizing it? You were able to drive without knowing it.
Wol Euler nods.
Kazana Kazan: your mind was elsewhere
Mickorod Renard: yes
Maxine Walden: or my understanding is that we lose touch with our conscious vs unconscious selves without sleep and that can be deadly in terms of the confusion and unravelling of the mind
Darren Islar: I don't know if that is the same as sleeping
Maxine Walden: we begin to hallucinate and can do dangerous things
Kazana Kazan: I dont either but it is like dreaming
Darren Islar: makes sense Maxine
Mickorod Renard: I must look up the article for the dream session Maxine
Maxine Walden: please do, Mick
Darren Islar: would be nice :-)
Mickorod Renard: I have managed several days without sleep,,and things start to get seriously wierd
Maxine Walden: interesting, I do not feel greedy about sleep, but I can about other appetites if I go beyond self-respecting boundaries, certain foods, etc. Have not really thought about that before
Mickorod Renard: I seem to recall that it is about a week without sleep and then the body rejects sleep outright,,resulting quickly in death
Darren Islar: wow
Maxine Walden: hmm, didn't know that, Mick, but sounds very serious
Mickorod Renard: yes, i was suprised
Mickorod Renard: maybe I read it in a dream
Maxine Walden: :)
Darren Islar: did they found out if it was a physical thing or is it more like Maxine described?
Wol Euler: :)
Kazana Kazan: Thank you freinds. I found our discussion stimulating. But I must go now.
Kazana Kazan: Good bye.
Maxine Walden: thanks for coming, Kazana
Wol Euler: bye kaz, take care
Mickorod Renard: bye Kazana,,cum again
Darren Islar: bye Kazana
arabella Ella: bye KK
Maxine Walden: Just wanting to note that I will be away for the next 3 Sundays! Will post it on the email as well
Darren Islar: vacation Maxine?
Mickorod Renard: up to anything fun Max?
Maxine Walden: sort of, Darren. Various meetings, yes fun, nice places to visit, nice people to see
Wol Euler smiles.
Wol Euler: soull
Mickorod Renard: nice
Wol Euler: sounds good
arabella Ella: how lovely Maxine enjoy!
Darren Islar: great
Maxine Walden: thank you, I will enjoy time away, but will miss this group as well :(
Wol Euler nods.
arabella Ella: ah we will miss u too
Maxine Walden: But choice does that, things gained and other things lost, at least temporarily
Darren Islar: good practice :-)
Maxine Walden: life is like that...guess for me being able to feel the loss helps keep the balance
arabella Ella nods
Darren Islar: :-)
Mickorod Renard: perhaps thats how to view the animal issue you spoke about,,some things gained some things lost Max
Maxine Walden: maybe so, Mick. thanks for that insight
--BELL--
arabella Ella: nice way of putting it mick
Darren Islar: I think that is the wider perspective
Maxine Walden: well, had better go. Nice to see everyone
Sartre Placebo: take care maxine
Maxine Walden: bye all
Wol Euler: 'night maxine, take care
Darren Islar: bye Maxine
Mickorod Renard: bye Maxine
Wol Euler: enjoy your time away
arabella Ella: bye Maxine
arabella Ella: i must go too good night all!
Sartre Placebo: night are, bye everyone
Darren Islar: bye Ara
Wol Euler: bye ara, take care
Mickorod Renard: bye Ara
Darren Islar: bye Yaku (for the record I guess)
Mickorod Renard: I must move on too,,work tommorow as well
Darren Islar: bye Mick
Wol Euler: 'night mick, sleep well
Mickorod Renard: bye Guys,,sleep well u too
Wol Euler: how are you, darren? rested up?
Darren Islar: a bit
Wol Euler: I guess that's a bit good then :)
Darren Islar: :_)
Darren Islar: I don't know yet, because the process isn't over
Darren Islar: but I have been talking a bit about it this morning
Darren Islar: that is a good sign
Wol Euler nods.
Darren Islar: but something triggered emotions of long gone
Darren Islar: and frustrations since the past few years
Darren Islar: since I'm ill and can't financial take care of myself anymore
Darren Islar: it puts me in an place where others can decide what I need to do
Wol Euler nods
Wol Euler: btw the recorder is still running. Is that OK=
Wol Euler: ?
Darren Islar: they look at me, talk to me for an hour, and they know
Darren Islar: I know
Wol Euler: just checking :)
Wol Euler: because I sometimes forget
Darren Islar: I'm pretty aware of that :-)
Darren Islar: I do too, but not on these occasions
Wol Euler: ok
Wol Euler: so, yes, I can imagine that being very frustrating, and frightening too
Darren Islar: yes
Darren Islar: more frustration at the moment
Darren Islar: I have feared this situation a lot
Darren Islar: but you learn to live day by day
Wol Euler nods.
Darren Islar: and grief
Darren Islar: and still pretty emotional
Darren Islar: but have been taking better care of myself last few days
Darren Islar: that helps
Wol Euler: mmhmm
Wol Euler: if there's anything I can do to help, even just listening, I'm here.
Darren Islar: thansk Wol
Wol Euler smiles.
Darren Islar: maybe you would like to join me for a while on the seaside
Darren Islar: not for long
Darren Islar: don't want to make it late
Wol Euler: yes, that sounds good.
Darren Islar: okay, will TP you
Wol Euler: k