2010.02.15 19:00 - What is Mind

 

The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

I was joined by Lawrence Vyceratops and Archmage Atlantis this evening. I claimed the log as no other host arrived.

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Lawrence

Lawrence Vyceratops: Hello, Stevenaia. How do you pronounce that?

stevenaia Michinaga: you don't, it's Steven AIA

stevenaia Michinaga: have you been here before?

Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes, several times, now.

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Archmage

Archmage Atlantis: Hello Steven, hello Lawrence

Lawrence Vyceratops: Hi, Archmage.

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: I see you are new to SL, how did you fund this group?

Lawrence Vyceratops: The SL search bar. :)

Archmage Atlantis: I am glad you have returned to this place Lawrence

stevenaia Michinaga: *find

stevenaia Michinaga: funding come later...grins

Archmage Atlantis: Whatever magic works :)

Lawrence Vyceratops: Thank you, Archmage. I am glad to be here.

Lawrence Vyceratops: haha sM

stevenaia Michinaga: SM?

Lawrence Vyceratops: I missed the typo joke and just noticed it. I was referring to your name.

Lawrence Vyceratops: I'll just call you steven... without the aia

stevenaia Michinaga: I know , AIA is a professional title of sorts

stevenaia Michinaga: hmmm, the bell did not ring at 7:00

Lawrence Vyceratops: *ding*

stevenaia Michinaga: thank you

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Lawrence Vyceratops: np ;)

Archmage Atlantis: Listening to Johnny Cash, Foslsum Prison

stevenaia Michinaga: sets timer for a minute

stevenaia Michinaga: <<>

Lawrence Vyceratops: Who would like to begin?

stevenaia Michinaga: I am ready to listen :)

Lawrence Vyceratops: Haha

stevenaia Michinaga: sometime the beginning happens just at the appropriate time

stevenaia Michinaga: can you give us your impression of you time thus far, Lawrence

stevenaia Michinaga: *your

Lawrence Vyceratops: Of PaB?

stevenaia Michinaga: nods

stevenaia Michinaga: what keeps you returning?

Lawrence Vyceratops: It's interesting, to me, and I'm glad that the organization exists.

stevenaia Michinaga: smiles

Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, I enjoy having discussions about what I believe the original exploration/experiment was.

Lawrence Vyceratops: Exploration into the question of what IS.

stevenaia Michinaga: you mean taking a moment to explore reality outside looking in?

stevenaia Michinaga: and inside looking out

Lawrence Vyceratops: What do you mean by that?

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: there was a very early exercise we do here simply stated as YSBS, you see, being sees, where you take the 9 seconds or 90 seconds and see Being from your viewpoint and then take the perspective of "Being" seeing

stevenaia Michinaga: it offers an opportunity to play with your view of reality

stevenaia Michinaga: and of what Being is

Lawrence Vyceratops: Are you saying that YS is looking at things subjectively and BS is looking at things objectively?

stevenaia Michinaga: I suppose that depends of who and what is doing the looking

stevenaia Michinaga: but it can be

Lawrence Vyceratops: What do you mean by that?

stevenaia Michinaga: when you playing with Being seeing, it mean different things to each of us

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, we must try to be clear on what we are saying.

stevenaia Michinaga: bit is usually alters your perspective or viewpoint

Archmage Atlantis: Lawrence...I have not seen Steve challenge another as he is doing to you

Lawrence Vyceratops: What do you mean, Archmage?

Archmage Atlantis: That challenge is respect

stevenaia Michinaga: I am not not challenging, just explaining that reality is relative

stevenaia Michinaga: the explanation is what we come here for

Lawrence Vyceratops: I feel we are having a serious dialogue, where we attempt to understand one another.

stevenaia Michinaga: clarify for one person can be quite a fog to another

stevenaia Michinaga: word only become clear over time, I could not have had this conversation when I began coming here almost 2 years ago

stevenaia Michinaga: but I am intrigued by listening and understanding and have learned much

stevenaia Michinaga: but my typing has not improved

stevenaia Michinaga: the only challenge I find here is learning from others and myself

Archmage Atlantis: Vyseraops is a dinosaur like name

Archmage Atlantis: You chose it

stevenaia Michinaga: it does help to bring an open mind :)

Lawrence Vyceratops: haha Nice moves.

stevenaia Michinaga: I have had some very insightful 90 second moments here

Lawrence Vyceratops: Can we discuss YSBS some more?

stevenaia Michinaga: but I can never march the energy of Archmage dance steps

stevenaia Michinaga: sure, in 3 minutes there will be another 90 second break

Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes.

stevenaia Michinaga: why don;t you try it

Lawrence Vyceratops: I am familiar with that part of it.

stevenaia Michinaga: there is also much written about it on the wiki

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: sometimes it's like a recurring dream for me

stevenaia Michinaga: like space folding inside out when I change from YS to BS

Lawrence Vyceratops: Hmmm...

Lawrence Vyceratops: Quite metaphorical.

stevenaia Michinaga: I see from inside me looking out...... then I am the outside looking at me

stevenaia Michinaga: of course I am the inside and the outside

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Lawrence Vyceratops: Again, you talking about subjectively seeing and objectively seeing?

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes, in our discussion, we should try to see objectively. Would you agree?

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

stevenaia Michinaga: are you saying as an object or without precondition "objectively"

Lawrence Vyceratops: Without precondition.

stevenaia Michinaga: I thought so but god to check

stevenaia Michinaga: good

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, often comes the question of what is mind...

stevenaia Michinaga: wiggle words

Lawrence Vyceratops: ...shall we explore that?

Archmage Atlantis: Eating cornmeal muffins

stevenaia Michinaga: and what is reality?

Archmage Atlantis: taste good

stevenaia Michinaga: is the mind part of it or just an observer

stevenaia Michinaga: wants some please, Arch

Lawrence Vyceratops: what separates?

stevenaia Michinaga: well reality could still exist without the mind seeing it (but who would care?)

stevenaia Michinaga: asking the question may be enough to make it matter

stevenaia Michinaga: not sure there will ever be an answer to the question

stevenaia Michinaga: "What is mind"

Lawrence Vyceratops: But, perhaps, we could find an agreement in our talk tonight.

stevenaia Michinaga: sure

stevenaia Michinaga: listens....

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, often we refer to mind as something that thinks. What else do we consider mind? Something that senses. What else?

stevenaia Michinaga: sees

Lawrence Vyceratops: Is the body also mind?

stevenaia Michinaga: no, but it is more of like a tree without a mind

Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, sometimes, we say that the mind "senses" but our nervous system is the body.

Archmage Atlantis: Yikea... the body and the mind are joined

stevenaia Michinaga: it's all "plugged in" to the mond

stevenaia Michinaga: mind

Archmage Atlantis: Just with different responsibility

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, does the mind do the thinking and the sensing, like we generally think of it?

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: not the sensing, just the accumulating (processing) of the senses

Archmage Atlantis: The mind does Lawrence, but the mind is divided into parts

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, the mind thinks but does not sense?

stevenaia Michinaga: if the mind is (or lives in) the brain, yes,

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, what does it mean to sense?

Archmage Atlantis: Need to redefine mind

stevenaia Michinaga: you need an eye to see, a nose to smell

Lawrence Vyceratops: No, Archmage, we don't need to define it, we just need to discover it, I think. :)

stevenaia Michinaga: and the mind to think

Archmage Atlantis: Yes

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, stimuli comes into contact with the body...

Lawrence Vyceratops: ...and all sorts of chemical changes occur, sending signals to the brain, where the brain processes these signals...

stevenaia Michinaga: the mind to empathize

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Noone

Lawrence Vyceratops: ... and this process is a thinking process... thinking about what is sensed?

stevenaia Michinaga: certainly to start with

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, are we saying that, rather than an object, like the brain, mind is actually a process?

stevenaia Michinaga: a process taking place in a specific location (brain)

Lawrence Vyceratops: A thinking process.

stevenaia Michinaga: nods

Lawrence Vyceratops: A system of thoughts?

stevenaia Michinaga: a system?

stevenaia Michinaga: who's system?

Lawrence Vyceratops: The process.

stevenaia Michinaga: it does seem to have structure at times

Lawrence Vyceratops: Right, let's have a look.

stevenaia Michinaga: a look?

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, the idea of the process is of the mind, but the actual process itself is the mind. Is that what we agree to?

stevenaia Michinaga: thinking

Lawrence Vyceratops: Perhaps, if we can agree to what is mind, we can discuss awareness.

stevenaia Michinaga: no sure that will simplify much, but yes, without the process with the mind, there is, once again, only a tree trunk, so yes I agree

Lawrence Vyceratops: So, is the mind aware?

Lawrence Vyceratops: Hi, noone.

noone Dover: hi

noone Dover: im new...

stevenaia Michinaga: welcome noone, we record our conversations ere, is it ok to include you?

noone Dover: here and don't know how to use the sl

noone Dover: yeah~

Lawrence Vyceratops: The conversations are recorded and posted on a weblog.

stevenaia Michinaga: here is a little information about our group

noone Dover: go on..

noone Dover: may i ask some questions..

stevenaia Michinaga: always

Lawrence Vyceratops: Feel free :)

noone Dover: thanks... and my english is poor..

noone Dover: my first language is not english..

noone Dover: so can you tell me

noone Dover: where are you from?

Lawrence Vyceratops: US.

noone Dover: aha~

stevenaia Michinaga: Eastern US

noone Dover: aha~

--BELL--

noone Dover: Looking good!

noone Dover: amazing...

Lawrence Vyceratops: What's amazing, noone?

noone Dover: everything is secondlife..

noone Dover: in

Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes :)

noone Dover: everything in secondlife..

noone Dover: aha~

noone Dover: like foreignal..

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, much to explore

noone Dover: i come from china..

Lawrence Vyceratops: What brought you to Play as Being?

noone Dover: my friend

Lawrence Vyceratops: Oh, so you are somewhat familiar with it?

noone Dover: yeah..

noone Dover: aha...

noone Dover: are you new here?

noone Dover: i don't know how to change my hair..

Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes, I have been here several times already, though.

noone Dover: i am too ugly now...

Lawrence Vyceratops: We were just discussing "what is mind," to try to see if we could come to an agreement.

stevenaia Michinaga: there are places to get new hair

stevenaia Michinaga: places

noone Dover: i am sorry..

Lawrence Vyceratops: It costs money to "buy" your appearances. :)

noone Dover: but i have no money...

stevenaia Michinaga: there are free places

Lawrence Vyceratops: Your hair looks fine to me.

stevenaia Michinaga: in time you will find these places

Lawrence Vyceratops: What is your interest in PaB, noone?

stevenaia Michinaga: unfortunately, I must be going, I will be hosting on Wednesday Lawrence if you want to continue

stevenaia Michinaga: pleasure meeting you

Lawrence Vyceratops: I have to work nights. But sometimes I make the 1AM meetings... sometimes.

Lawrence Vyceratops: You, too, Steven.

stevenaia Michinaga: nods, the europeans are a lively bunch at the 1:00 am session

stevenaia Michinaga: hope to see you again soon

Lawrence Vyceratops: take care