2010.02.14 01:00 - Warm conversation

The Guardian for this meeting was Susi Alcott. The comments are by Susi Alcott.

I have not changed any word of the text.

Thank you Law, Bert and Cos from the nice Sunday morning

Susi Alcott

Bertram Jacobus: hey lawrence - nice to see you again ! :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: Hey :) Nice to see you, also!
Bertram Jacobus: nice ... you "still" remember our first meeting at the buddha´s land ? ... :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: Not sure... :) What happened?
Bertram Jacobus: we met, you seemed to be very new to sl and we started talkin ... then cosmicflower joined us ...
Lawrence Vyceratops: Ah, yes. I've had an account for almost a week now.
Bertram Jacobus: i took a look at taht. and enjoyed, taht the meetings here now "follow" in a way the talks we startet at the buddha land ... :-)
--BELL--
Bertram Jacobus: that* sry for typo pls
Lawrence Vyceratops: No prob. :)
Bertram Jacobus: fine. you feel well in sl ? :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: Sure. I hope this thing catches on with people.
Bertram Jacobus: hello susi ... :-)
Susi Alcott: Good Morning Law and Bert_/!\_
Bertram Jacobus: ty same same :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: What is _/!\_?
Bertram Jacobus: what do you mean with "catch on with people" please law ? :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: I meant SL.
Susi Alcott: folding hands together the buddhist way
Bertram Jacobus: sry. i don´t always understand all english phrases. could you express the thought in other words once again please law ?
Lawrence Vyceratops: I hope that more people join SL. I think the place has much potential.
Bertram Jacobus: ah ! ty :-))
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Bertram Jacobus: there are already a lot ! 18 million registered accounts (!)
Lawrence Vyceratops: I wasn't sure what the symbol was.... I see now :)
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: I thought it was something else..... haha
Susi Alcott: well...that does not mean that there is so many persons in SL
Lawrence Vyceratops: Also, there doesn't seem to be a lot of people around the places I visit.
Bertram Jacobus: but mostly between 50.000 and 60.000 online, sometimes more
Susi Alcott: in the beginning Lindens told the account amount in the log in page
Susi Alcott: yes
Susi Alcott: seen myself 71.000
Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, they are not here! :) I think everyone is about shopping for clothes. ;)
Bertram Jacobus: yes. and around 1.x millions in recent month -
Susi Alcott: when SL was brought to news and many rumors started, they soon started to tell only the online amount
Bertram Jacobus: hehe law - spiritual interests is a kind of quite special terrain ... ;-)
Susi Alcott: as in few months the account amount rised from ab 30.000 over the million
Lawrence Vyceratops: That's a shame.
Susi Alcott: but much also because more people started to make alts
Bertram Jacobus: but i think, in the inner and deeper spheres all people have an interst in it
Bertram Jacobus: so is my experience at least
Susi Alcott: then there was this group of people who created 'millions' of accounts and set such 'alts' to camp; they made real money for a while
Bertram Jacobus: one can talk to all about it, on different levels for sure
Lawrence Vyceratops: I wish more people were interested in the mind.
Bertram Jacobus: nearly all *correct myself* ;-)
Bertram Jacobus: depending on our own dispositions ... ;-)
Susi Alcott: ah yes; have pondered such people's speech who says that they 'walk on the spiritual path'....like all people woudn't
Lawrence Vyceratops: Whatever spiritual means...
Susi Alcott: but yes; more than many accounts are such 'robot' accounts
Susi Alcott: and online amount tells more
Bertram Jacobus: sry. may be a matter of words again. spiritual and mind for me are similar in a way
Susi Alcott: ah yes...but I take that cuz all of the people has the spirit, all are 'walkers on the spiritual path'
Bertram Jacobus: the field of interest we share here ...
Lawrence Vyceratops: I am not quite sure I follow the meaning of spiritual. It seems very... esoteric.
Susi Alcott: hm...do you Bert 'depart' heart and mind ?
Bertram Jacobus: that was what i meant : matter of words. perhaps i choosed a wrong one. if yes : sry pls
Susi Alcott: no sorry please
Susi Alcott: words are always poor anyway
Lawrence Vyceratops: But necessary.
Bertram Jacobus: no susi - "in the end all comes together" is my way of thinkin and feeling ...
Susi Alcott: but I addmitt that 'mind' told me less...
Lawrence Vyceratops: What do you mean, Susi?
Susi Alcott: ah yes; as I thought U to think so, that's why I tried to make the question that clarifies it
Bertram Jacobus: and i can (!) seperate relativly and bring together to the "absolute" realm ... hm
Bertram Jacobus: unity and such ...
Susi Alcott: ah yes; as to me that is, that mind 'collects' all 'parts' of the entity
Bertram Jacobus: to me, mind is a kind of tool
Susi Alcott: that all is whole existence , but mind is the limit
Lawrence Vyceratops: You guys are getting way ahead of me...
Susi Alcott: ?
Bertram Jacobus: but may describe also the whole - not sure again about the english meanings ...
Lawrence Vyceratops: I'm not following... sorry...
Bertram Jacobus: sry. in which way law ?
Susi Alcott: 'all together' is to be 'whole'
Lawrence Vyceratops: I'm not sure what we are talking about...
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: a bit sure of the meaning of the words
Susi Alcott: and people's way of thinking
Lawrence Vyceratops: I am unsure of the meaning of the terms we have been mentioning.
Bertram Jacobus: about mind and spirituality also ?
Susi Alcott: and to what people gives value; mind or body or spirit or...
Lawrence Vyceratops: What is spirit?
Bertram Jacobus: yes. i think, when we think in a constructive way, things become more easy at least in some time
Susi Alcott: spirit is the eternall life 'there is' ; base of the human kind being
Lawrence Vyceratops: You mean "time"?
Susi Alcott: soul is all experiences of the existence incarnation
Bertram Jacobus: yes, while practising
Susi Alcott: mind is what we feel and think
Lawrence Vyceratops: What is the difference between mind and body?
Bertram Jacobus: mind is more sutile
Bertram Jacobus: subtile*
Susi Alcott: mind shall not die when body dies
Lawrence Vyceratops: Subtle? ;)
Lawrence Vyceratops: I am not sure of this...
Susi Alcott: well; I am
Bertram Jacobus: i meant the material aspects
Lawrence Vyceratops: Perhaps, we should deliberate on the issue, for clarification.
Susi Alcott: please Law do that if you wish
Lawrence Vyceratops: What separates mind from body?
Susi Alcott: imo PaB is always free meeting to speak what ever
Susi Alcott: death
Bertram Jacobus: yes - perhaps you tell your views on the topic law ? to start with that -
Susi Alcott: also the phrase called 'sleep' separates the mind almost completely from the body
Bertram Jacobus: how, for example, would you describe "the topic" which is in your mind now here law ?
Susi Alcott: but male's 'habbit' is to keep it connected to the body more than females does
Lawrence Vyceratops: Rather than to just express my view, perhaps we can search for truth, which is without prejudice.
Lawrence Vyceratops: Well...
Lawrence Vyceratops: I do not see mind as separate from body.
Susi Alcott: how that's 'told' that difference is this;
Lawrence Vyceratops: The brain is the body.
Lawrence Vyceratops: The nervous system is the body.
Susi Alcott: male uses to live the dream much also with there earthly/human body
Susi Alcott: but women dont do so 'all the time'
Bertram Jacobus: law - that was what i wanted to express too : mind and body are not only seperated. but there are aspects which one can differ always, too -
Lawrence Vyceratops: Are you speaking of the conscious mind?
Susi Alcott: I also understand your point of view Law; that's the way imo also, when one is awake and not in shock
Bertram Jacobus: that was not my thought. no. but we can speak about it
Susi Alcott: as shock phrase is also such that separets the mind often quite completely from the body
Susi Alcott: still; shock does not separate it so strongly than sleep and death does
Lawrence Vyceratops: Susi, are you speaking of the conscious mind?
Susi Alcott: well...to me, when we are awake in human world, is included also subconscious with the conscious mind
Lawrence Vyceratops: So, what do you mean when you say that mind is separate from body?
Susi Alcott: as this subconscious is 'one kind of body' inside human body, which connects part of enity's spirit's knowledge and awareness
Susi Alcott: when one gets the shock, sleeps or dies
Lawrence Vyceratops: See, I am unclear, also, on this concept of spirit.
Susi Alcott: mind still exist, but not connected with the human body
Lawrence Vyceratops: But, when one sleeps, the body is still functioning from mind processes.
Lawrence Vyceratops: You must be talking about the conscious mind.
Susi Alcott: spirit is 'the flame'; life, with 'it's' own knowledge and awareness of all it's learned
Lawrence Vyceratops: Knowledge is the mind.
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: to me there's also feelings and motions included in mind
Lawrence Vyceratops: Yes, I agree. Feelings and emotions are mind.
Lawrence Vyceratops: They are functions of mind.
Susi Alcott: ah well; can only say that my reaction to that thought was that I cannot completely agree
Susi Alcott: cuz imo it's reactions of spirit that 'reflects' to mind ...
Susi Alcott: what ever one experience...creates reactions, no matter if mind yet wont understand 'what's happening', or 'what happened'
Lawrence Vyceratops: You mean, no matter if conscious mind understands?
Susi Alcott: yet; I am fully aware also that mind can 'make' the body and spirit to experience
Susi Alcott: that I ment yes
Lawrence Vyceratops: But what about total mind?
Bertram Jacobus: total mind - enligtened mind ? ;-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, a distinction was made - conscious mind - what about whole mind?
Susi Alcott: imo that is so, that as long as one is human kind being, one cannot receive all of the knowledge of one's own spirit to human mind
Lawrence Vyceratops: What is knowledge of spirit? Human mind is limited in knowing.
Bertram Jacobus: ah. i see. sry again - was too unaware ...
Susi Alcott: so; imo the total mind can exist only when human has died
Lawrence Vyceratops: We are talking about different things...
Lawrence Vyceratops: I am talking about the human mind, now, in this life.
Susi Alcott: that's what I'm talking about also
Bertram Jacobus: what do you expect from it law ?
Lawrence Vyceratops: That which thinks and sees and feels.
Lawrence Vyceratops: Expect?
Susi Alcott: from the conversation
Lawrence Vyceratops: Oh...
Lawrence Vyceratops: Only to discuss.
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: I have little concern with past or future lives... :( Sorry...
Bertram Jacobus: me not either law
Lawrence Vyceratops: Only interested in terms of history, I suppose...
Susi Alcott: well...aint them former lives kind of history ?
Bertram Jacobus: i only know that i don´t know about life which may long more then one life or "karma streams" or such ... ;-)
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, I am not aware of any former lives, other than other people.
Bertram Jacobus: and i´m no good believer ... ;-)
Susi Alcott: well...I just think that one needs to be aware of them too that can see how mind and spirit and human body are 'departed'...'separated'...
Susi Alcott: (smiles)
Susi Alcott: as Susi also loves that 'man' wont like to believe, but to know
Lawrence Vyceratops: I am not familiar with former lives.... I think it is important to look at the universal - that which we may all be familiar with.
Bertram Jacobus: but "knowing" sometimes can even be less (!) - i prefere to be ...
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: well...people call me to be such 'enlightened'...so ...maybe I know something of entity and incarnations and Univers itself that all the people dont know...
Susi Alcott: just that there's also so many 'rumors' that what is to be enlightened
Lawrence Vyceratops: Then, we have little to discuss, if you are alone in the matter... :(
Susi Alcott: seems that atm I am...yet...think that there can still be much to discuss
Bertram Jacobus: i like such brave words susi (!) ...
Susi Alcott: and thankfully I'm not still alone; there's 'few' million people as enlightened
Susi Alcott: and yes; I dont feel myself to be 'alone' with you two either, cuz I feel your spirit's presence very clearly
Bertram Jacobus: nice. ty two also ... for being with me ...
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: It is a pleasure to be here.
Susi Alcott: same here
Susi Alcott: may I tell a story ?
Lawrence Vyceratops: Feel free.
Bertram Jacobus: from here : sure ! please do so ! :-)
Susi Alcott: as that happened few tens of year back, that I was explaning to the partner of my life something such that I had realized; something that 'turned new leaf to my life'
Lawrence Vyceratops: Hi, CF :)
Susi Alcott: but then I realized that my partner couldn't understand at all what I was talking about
Susi Alcott: Hi CF
Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Good morning <3
Bertram Jacobus: hello cosma ... :-))
Susi Alcott: so; I said about that
Susi Alcott: then my partner said;
Susi Alcott: "how would our life be, if there was two of us the same kind ?"
Susi Alcott: well; even my partner is not enlightened even today yet, we didn't need any words to answer that question
Susi Alcott: and I just stopped trying to help my partner to understand, but had complete peace with my finding
Susi Alcott: end of the story
Lawrence Vyceratops: Susi, from where comes this idea of spirit?
Susi Alcott: from experiences
Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
Susi Alcott: for example mind and soul travelings
Lawrence Vyceratops: Please, explain.
Susi Alcott: remembering former incarnations ; many of them also with help of other people
Lawrence Vyceratops: Who is it that remembers?
Susi Alcott: well; an example of mind traveling, cuz we all here are doing that atm
Susi Alcott: as we exist also where our mind is; atm we are here in SL withing our Avatar
Susi Alcott: so; we feel each other, we experience this world here; that's one way of mind traveling
Lawrence Vyceratops: So, others have contributed in offering this idea of spirit to you?
Susi Alcott: who is that remembers....is difficult question to answer
Susi Alcott: well...I had my own experiences already as the little child....and pondered much of the world that how people are so blind....
Susi Alcott: but...woudn't like to tell 'the bible' to tell so much of myself
Susi Alcott: as I have no need to proove myself
Susi Alcott: that's always up to other people to choose if to trust my word or not
Susi Alcott: I honour one's choice what ever that is
Lawrence Vyceratops: In these matters, perhaps, to see for oneself is best, in order to truly understand the mind.
Lawrence Vyceratops: We must've take what another says as truth, without seeing for oneself.
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: well...to be able to do that, I've told people to be one reason to ' come to be enlightened'
Susi Alcott: as I've also so often pondered the value of the knowledge of for example those former lives....
Susi Alcott: and think that I have not found much other reasons, but that it is needed to be able to know one's self ....if that ever can be possible completely
Lawrence Vyceratops: Surely, the mind is as easy for all to see as it is easy for us all to see the pond before us.
Susi Alcott: as to me it's so, that when one 'finds one's self', that 'self' grows up,,,and there's again 'something to find'
Lawrence Vyceratops: What what is doing the finding and what is being found? What is the difference between the finder and the found?
Susi Alcott: you speak Law like enlightened person does _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: I'm not sure of that...
Susi Alcott: to 'find' oneself is just to find wha't is 'there' existing....
Susi Alcott: so...that's the point, that how knows all of one's self....
Lawrence Vyceratops: "There" is in quotations...
Susi Alcott: who knows
Susi Alcott: ah yes....cuz all one can be aware of, is not one's self
Lawrence Vyceratops: This reminds me of awareness, a popularly confusing topic.
Susi Alcott: that can be confusing also
Susi Alcott: depends on many things
Susi Alcott: that can be also clarifying
Lawrence Vyceratops: But, why is it confusing? Don't we all have a similar dictionary? haha ;)
Susi Alcott: ah...that's the point; we dont
Lawrence Vyceratops: Sure, Webster's dictionary is similar to Roget's.
Susi Alcott: and even less similar when we cannot speak our 'first' language....
Lawrence Vyceratops: We can all Google the definitions of words and find similar meanings.
Susi Alcott: not true
Lawrence Vyceratops: How so?
Susi Alcott: there's much words in finnish that are not translated to any other language but chinese
Lawrence Vyceratops: What about "awareness?"
Susi Alcott: in which language there's even more words than in finnihs, whic is on that list as the second
Lawrence Vyceratops: What is the finnish and chinese definition of "awareness?"
Susi Alcott: to that I have the belief that we have the same dictonary :)
Susi Alcott: but cannot know for sure
Lawrence Vyceratops: In most English dictionaries, awareness is consciousness.
Susi Alcott: olla tietoinen
Susi Alcott: is finnish; chinese I dont know
Lawrence Vyceratops: Also, informed, knowledgeable.
Susi Alcott: well; conscousness is in finnish
Susi Alcott: tietoisuus
Susi Alcott: there's huge difference in finnish words meaning....
Lawrence Vyceratops: Sounds similar to olla tietoinen.
Susi Alcott: yet; huge difference
Lawrence Vyceratops: Well, I can't know... I only speak English.
Lawrence Vyceratops: But you speak English. What is your definition of awareness?
Susi Alcott: hm...ah yes....no Susi is confused...but that yes is cuz of my lag in english
Lawrence Vyceratops: I understand.
Susi Alcott: ah...thinks 'once more'
Susi Alcott: ah yes....
Susi Alcott: to me; it's completely different to 'have' consciousness than to 'be aware'
Susi Alcott: but...well...feels that also this time I must withdraw to silence cuz my lag in language dont give the option to me to express better
Lawrence Vyceratops: Ok.
Susi Alcott: but like to tell this saying;
Susi Alcott: 'Only the other finnish person has the OPTION to understand an other finnish person'
Susi Alcott: what comes to them words
Susi Alcott: so; imo ....people have different dictenaries
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: hmm...wanna add also this; when one wants to understand what the other person means with her/his words, that happenes no matter how laggy words are uses
Susi Alcott: used
Lawrence Vyceratops: I made up this saying a long time ago:
Susi Alcott: and even one would speak the 'language of angels' like flowers would come out from one's mouth, but she/he is not wanted to understand, that happenes too
Lawrence Vyceratops: There is nothing that is separate or apart from the universe. To distinguish between one thing and another is to imply separateness. So, how is it that you are able to read these words?
Cosmicflower Ushimawa: I need to leave now for a while. some food need to be bought <3
Susi Alcott: oh...
Lawrence Vyceratops: Bye, CF :)
Bertram Jacobus: bye cosma ... :-)
Cosmicflower Ushimawa: Bye.. <3
Susi Alcott: wish good time to you Cos; was wanderfull that you dropped by
Cosmicflower Ushimawa: <3
Susi Alcott: the answer to your question Law ---imo--is this;
Lawrence Vyceratops: You are floating, Bertram... How'd you do that?
Susi Alcott: because there is the separatism and individualism
Lawrence Vyceratops: It's not a real question... It's kind of a play on words.
Bertram Jacobus: oh sry. how embarrasing - happened randomly . didn´t do anything lol ... ;-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: haha
Susi Alcott: well; there is this one word I dont know; 'imply'
Lawrence Vyceratops: imply means to suggest.
Susi Alcott: ah ok
Susi Alcott: so; that's 'PaB' talk as I call it, cuz I've heared that mostly here
Lawrence Vyceratops: What's that? The word "imply?"
Susi Alcott: yet; dont withdraw my answer
Susi Alcott: ah...those lines you wrote and eded with the question mark
Susi Alcott: so...even I'm told that it's not given answers here...cannot 'help' my nature to give such when I'm asked something
Lawrence Vyceratops: It's no problem ;)
Lawrence Vyceratops: That's what we do when we hear a question. ;)
Susi Alcott: seems that not to you and I feel good for that
Susi Alcott: well...all of the people dont
Lawrence Vyceratops: Right.
Bertram Jacobus: "ok" - i´ll take a pause ... ty very much for the talk ... cu and have a good time please - and may all beings be happy (!) ...
Bertram Jacobus: cu
Susi Alcott: here I heared also of such culture to be, that 'nobody may answer but with the question'....
Lawrence Vyceratops: Bye, Bertram :)
Susi Alcott: bye Bert
Susi Alcott: have good time
Susi Alcott: _/!\_
Bertram Jacobus: ty again :-)
Lawrence Vyceratops: Are you staying, Susi?
Susi Alcott: I am not in a hurry atm
Susi Alcott: if you like; I shall
Lawrence Vyceratops: It's my day off. :)
Susi Alcott: as I promised to Moon to back up him
Susi Alcott: so I took time for PaB
Lawrence Vyceratops: You mean, Moon was going to host, but you took his place for him?
Susi Alcott: ah yes; this is Moon's slot
Lawrence Vyceratops: Oh, I see. Well, I don't want to keep you... I don't get bored. ;)
Susi Alcott: I'm sorry
--BELL--
Susi Alcott: was busy for a moment with some IM
Lawrence Vyceratops: Not a problem :)
Lawrence Vyceratops: I'm off! It was nice talking with you, Susi.
Susi Alcott: how ever you wish _/!\_
Susi Alcott: was nice to me too _/!\_
Lawrence Vyceratops: Peace! :)