2010.02.08 19:00 - Urban Markets and India Coffeehouse

The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

Doug and I got into a discussion about a current urban market project I was working on....

stevenaia Michinaga: hello doug
doug Sosa: hi steve
stevenaia Michinaga: how are you?
doug Sosa: in the middle of a muddle, so my brain is a puddle.
stevenaia Michinaga: haven;t see you in a while
stevenaia Michinaga: seen
doug Sosa: big puddle :)
stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps you need mind clearing (brain washing?)
doug Sosa: no, did that. now it is letting it all come back in, hopefully better organized.
stevenaia Michinaga: you don;t hear that phrase much
doug Sosa: which?
stevenaia Michinaga: brain washing
doug Sosa: ah yes, well it normally sounds bad., but i like it.
doug Sosa: let me ask back, how you are?
stevenaia Michinaga: suppose it is just assumed it is everywhere
stevenaia Michinaga: I am good, 9" of snow this weekend, 14-18 coming on wednesday, I like it
doug Sosa: i remember in DC when after a big snow people booed the first moving cars.
stevenaia Michinaga: A new month brought new and interesting work
doug Sosa: Hey that sounds interesting! que?
stevenaia Michinaga: DC doesn;t do good with snow
stevenaia Michinaga: urban mixed use project I've been working on for the past few years is finally taking shape
stevenaia Michinaga: (funding)
doug Sosa: how mixed? people? plants, art?
stevenaia Michinaga: Urban food market and apartments
stevenaia Michinaga: Hello Bene, nice of you to drop in
doug Sosa: is any of the food growable within the project?
Benedizione Vita: evening gents
doug Sosa: Hi bene.
stevenaia Michinaga: it could draw on regional farms, seems to be the trend
doug Sosa: no way to bring pieces of it inside the project/
doug Sosa: /=?
stevenaia Michinaga: but I am (only) the space provider in this case
stevenaia Michinaga: Hello Eden
doug Sosa: space providers have leverage, no?
Eden Haiku: Hi Steve
stevenaia Michinaga: not connected to the tenant delivery
stevenaia Michinaga: not directly
doug Sosa: hm, sounds like rethinking a bit might be in order, but that is just me.
stevenaia Michinaga: but the possibility is there
stevenaia Michinaga: I agree
doug Sosa: ah. if there were some grown inside, and the food market.. any of the workers going to live in the project?
stevenaia Michinaga: I can also bring local forces to bare
doug Sosa: watch out.. bear...
stevenaia Michinaga: that possibility exists since there will be ample housing above
stevenaia Michinaga: :)
stevenaia Michinaga: close to transport to NYC as well
doug Sosa: sounds promising. go really MIXED use.
doug Sosa: is it condos or rents?
stevenaia Michinaga: on main transit route
stevenaia Michinaga: rents
doug Sosa: can shares be bought?
stevenaia Michinaga: not a coop
doug Sosa: but of the business?
stevenaia Michinaga: but these thing can change with time and the market
doug Sosa: is the food market the owner or also a tenant?
stevenaia Michinaga: tenant
doug Sosa: great opportunity to practice 9 sec, see if new angles emerge when old ones are dropped.
--BELL--
stevenaia Michinaga: :)
stevenaia Michinaga: This is the first urban market of a reasonable size in town in decades
stevenaia Michinaga: most have to travel out to the burbs in a car to shop now
doug Sosa: is it a chain or local initiative?
doug Sosa: We are looking to do similar in Palo Alto.
stevenaia Michinaga: no one local want to go downtown
stevenaia Michinaga: that;s a different kind of town
doug Sosa: well, we have east palo alto, and some unused land.
stevenaia Michinaga: Hello Storm
doug Sosa: it is good to practice 9 sec in the middle of these projects. the idea of dropping assumptions..

Storm Nordwind: Hello everyone!
doug Sosa: hi s
stevenaia Michinaga: always a good idea at any point
Eden Haiku: Hi Storm!
Storm Nordwind waves a big smile to Eden!
doug Sosa: how can she see your smile from behind you? :)
doug Sosa: oops :(
stevenaia Michinaga: smiled right offline
Storm Nordwind: She couldn't see anything, especially now
doug Sosa: back!
stevenaia Michinaga: wb Eden
Eden Haiku: Back
Storm Nordwind: I'm so glad the system works Eden!
doug Sosa: ?
Eden Haiku: Yes
Eden Haiku: I'm in this incredible little shop few feet from the Ganges
Storm Nordwind: wow!
stevenaia Michinaga: awww, you traveling in India?
doug Sosa: oh... grey sky grey water grey land?
stevenaia Michinaga: yellow food
Eden Haiku: Using wifi on my ipod touch sitting on a wall to wall white mattress with cushions
doug Sosa: fro my time there twenty years ago, i can't imagine white.
Eden Haiku: White is a wishful color yes..:)))
Eden Haiku: Place is kind of clean though. They keep vacuuming...
Storm Nordwind: Can you receive pictures in your email Eden, and if so what size?
stevenaia Michinaga: how long you going to be there?
doug Sosa: when i was there, little electricity, and the cows were always high on grass.
Eden Haiku: Yes i can Storm
Eden Haiku: I'm here until mid-march Steve
stevenaia Michinaga: you may be out first participant from india
Eden Haiku: Oh oh what an honor!
--BELL--
Storm Nordwind: When you have a moment to check Eden, you have mail - with PaB snapshots from right now! ;)
Benedizione Vita: I hope I'm not sleeping ;)
stevenaia Michinaga: are you using "Sparkle" or some other program to get here Eden?
Storm Nordwind: Not all the time Benedizione! ;)
Storm Nordwind: I think she's sharing her Wifi with most of Uttar Pradesh ;)
stevenaia Michinaga: that would do it
stevenaia Michinaga: until she returns
stevenaia Michinaga: interesting, the shadow of her pillow remains
Storm Nordwind: or the cleaner has vacuumed up the bytes
Storm Nordwind: All part of the magic Steve
stevenaia Michinaga: Alice's little rabbit hole here
doug Sosa: curioser and curioser
Storm Nordwind: Getting her here at all and in a stable reliable place is remarkably hard when she has no graphics and no way of sitting on anything
Storm Nordwind: The shadow is part of it
doug Sosa: well done. amazing.
stevenaia Michinaga: wb Eden
Eden Haiku: Hi
Eden Haiku: Tks for the pics Storm
Storm Nordwind: You're most welcome :)
Storm Nordwind: Speak louder Eden... you breaking updsadyusb *&*&#@bdssd/.... ;)
Eden Haiku: Who is the guy in yellow-white out fit?
Storm Nordwind: That's you Bene
doug Sosa: how can you see that on oh.
Eden Haiku: Recognized you and Steve and Doug
Eden Haiku: Hi Bene
stevenaia Michinaga: yellow?, more of a beige here
Benedizione Vita: hi Eden
Eden Haiku: No visuals but Storm sent me pics on email
stevenaia Michinaga: I was asking, are you using "Sparkle" to get here Eden?
Eden Haiku: Yes Sparkle and the guy at the Wifi is amazed!
doug Sosa: ah sure. i'd never be sherlock holmes :(
stevenaia Michinaga: do the know of SL there?
Eden Haiku: Keeps looking over my shoulder when is not vacuuming :)))
Storm Nordwind: hahaha!
Storm Nordwind waves to the vacuum guy
Eden Haiku: SL no i would not think so
doug Sosa: i must go at the bell.
Storm Nordwind: Did we have a topic by the way? I came in rather late.
--BELL--
Eden Haiku: Bye doug!
stevenaia Michinaga: Doug and I were talking about urban development and a project I am currently working, thought of more local participation, a bit of my reality :)
Eden Haiku: A food market Steve?
stevenaia Michinaga: nods
stevenaia Michinaga: new food markets are rare in urban centers these days
stevenaia Michinaga: ie, no one wants to do them
Storm Nordwind: What are you defining as a food market? Stalls?
Eden Haiku: Why, too much work?
stevenaia Michinaga: a grocery store
stevenaia Michinaga: no the current model is suburban
Storm Nordwind: like a supermarket?
Eden Haiku: (Vacuum guy is happily waving back !)
Storm Nordwind: hehe
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, but smaller, relatively
stevenaia Michinaga: less parking
Storm Nordwind: You still get them in the UK
stevenaia Michinaga: housing above
Eden Haiku: Food markets would make urban environment much more friendly.
Storm Nordwind: They are usually converted from existing stores
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, you wouldn;t need to drive out of town to get your groceries
stevenaia Michinaga: as you do now
Storm Nordwind: They usually only serve office workers though that work in the city centers
stevenaia Michinaga: (here at least)
Eden Haiku: Less cars and more conversations with farmers selling their produce.
stevenaia Michinaga: there are many undeserved families in towns that this would benefit
Eden Haiku: They still have this in France.
Storm Nordwind: On the other hand we still have many food shops in the center of smaller towns
Storm Nordwind: Yes in most of Europe Eden
Storm Nordwind: But then in Europe people are used to walking around their town centers and not driving everywhere
stevenaia Michinaga: and are much more dense
Eden Haiku: My citta ideale would be without cars...
stevenaia Michinaga: the problem of the states, so much outward sprawl
Storm Nordwind: I think it's exaggerated Steve. They talk about it here in Denver but it's no worse than in Europe
Storm Nordwind: The problem is there are no district community shops
Storm Nordwind: only local malls that are drivable only
Storm Nordwind: Those shopping areas not only serve people but give a sense of community
Storm Nordwind: *community
stevenaia Michinaga: the malls become the single use shopping districts
stevenaia Michinaga: no community in single use anything
Storm Nordwind: But the malls don't have the same community sense because all the outlets are too big. The shopkeeper does not know everyone!
stevenaia Michinaga: an unfortunate side affect of not living nearby
Storm Nordwind: (and who wants a dozen shops that same all the same sort of tacky looking clothes?;) (in the larger malls)
Storm Nordwind: *sell
stevenaia Michinaga: ask all those in the mall, Storm
stevenaia Michinaga: the brainwashed, another topic doug and I touched on earlier
Storm Nordwind: Ah yes... are these the same people who watch the Superbowl especially for the ads? ;)
stevenaia Michinaga: wouldn;t want to buy the wrong chips, would I
Storm Nordwind: hahaha!!
--BELL--
Storm Nordwind: what would my friends think?
stevenaia Michinaga: hello Alukina
stevenaia Michinaga: feel free to come and dismount
Benedizione Vita: what was that sound?
stevenaia Michinaga: what did you hear Bene
Benedizione Vita: big splash
Storm Nordwind: We forgive easily here :)
stevenaia Michinaga: and rarely anger
Storm Nordwind waves

stevenaia Michinaga: eeek, 12"-18" of snow coming
Storm Nordwind: to where?
stevenaia Michinaga: EAST, on top of the 9" we got this weekend
Storm Nordwind: It's been snowing lightly all day here. But our big falls were last year - so far. (4ft in some places)
stevenaia Michinaga: do you have a topic? Storm
stevenaia Michinaga: or Bene
stevenaia Michinaga: wb Eden
Storm Nordwind: Eden keeps reincarnating! :)
stevenaia Michinaga: :)
Benedizione Vita: well, time for me to stop napping and get some sleep soon :)
Benedizione Vita: goodnight, all
Storm Nordwind: Bye Bene
Eden Haiku: Hey electricity shut down for wifi but i could read my mail
stevenaia Michinaga: night Bene
Eden Haiku: Bye Bene
Storm Nordwind: I have no topic really, and perhaps it is late anyway
stevenaia Michinaga: what time is it where you are Eden?
Eden Haiku: I m early morning Tuesday
stevenaia Michinaga: I must be going, night all
stevenaia Michinaga: have a good day Eden
Storm Nordwind: Goodnight Steve
Eden Haiku: Will ask about taxi for Sarnath as soon as the israeli women book their trip to Pushkar
Eden Haiku: Bye Steve
Storm Nordwind chuckles
Eden Haiku: Lots of things happening at the same time here.
Eden Haiku: They are bringing tea now
Storm Nordwind: black no sugar for me please :)
Eden Haiku: I have been drinking black tea cause masala tea was too rich
Storm Nordwind: I can imagine!
Eden Haiku: They know nothing of 1% milk over here:)So much survival...
Storm Nordwind: 1% milk is not milk! I'm still trying to find real double cream for coffee here (50% fat) and I have to make do with heavy whipping cream (35%)
Eden Haiku: It is!!!
Storm Nordwind: noooooooooooo!!!!!!!!
Eden Haiku: Yeeessss
Storm Nordwind: That's just chalk in water!
Eden Haiku: Fun arguing with you over time lines!
--BELL--
Storm Nordwind: hehehe!
Storm Nordwind: Do you get the bell message?
Eden Haiku: Yes no sound but in chat
Storm Nordwind: right
Eden Haiku: Intense negotiation in here...
Eden Haiku: The Indian man is very proud and adamant.
Eden Haiku: The women are scared of being in a taxi for 1000 kilometers...
Storm Nordwind: Whoa... er... yes, I can understand that
Storm Nordwind: They must really want to get there
Eden Haiku: India is based on trust...
stevenaia Michinaga: hmmm, after Eden says bye to me, your text dropped off the log storm
Storm Nordwind: Odd - and it's still recording
Eden Haiku: Steve?
stevenaia Michinaga: can you send it to to me storm
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, Eden I;m back
Storm Nordwind: My lister is there, floating by my head
Storm Nordwind: *listener
stevenaia Michinaga: it looked like eden was talking to herself
stevenaia Michinaga: strange it just re-appeared in the log
Eden Haiku: Tea time want some chai Steve?
Storm Nordwind: mmmmmmmm chai
stevenaia Michinaga: never mind, that often happens, things fix themselves
stevenaia Michinaga: chai will make me fat
Eden Haiku: It is the real one Storm very rich milk...
Storm Nordwind: Real milk? Wonderful :)
Eden Haiku: No Steve it is. Tiny tiny cup
stevenaia Michinaga: oh, ok then
Eden Haiku: Glass rather
Eden Haiku: Israeli accent is so beautiful
stevenaia Michinaga: night again
Storm Nordwind waves
stevenaia Michinaga: enjoy your trip Eden
Eden Haiku: These 3 blonde young Israeli are really good negotiators , nite Steve sleep tight!
Storm Nordwind: And Steve leaves in his unique and customary fashion...
Eden Haiku: Flying?
Storm Nordwind: Stepping into the pool and flying up through the occulus
Eden Haiku: Oh yes I remember now.
Storm Nordwind: I'm so sorry Eden... I have to be very rude and leave you too now. I'm absolutely delighted to see you though! :)
Eden Haiku: It was lots of fun reading the guardian session about the cat's name.
Storm Nordwind: I was soooooo sleepy
Eden Haiku: Np storm was sonice to see yiu
Eden Haiku: Sweet dreams!
Storm Nordwind: Take care dear friend!
Storm Nordwind waves
Eden Haiku: Waving back