2008.10.14 07:00 - Happiness

Adelene Dawner: Hiya, Max :)
Maxine Walden: hi, Adelene, great av, some kind of animal?
Adelene Dawner: Winged lion. ^.^
Maxine Walden: winged lion, great mythical character, really impressive. Did you create him/her? Must have
Maxine Walden: wow,thinking of where I have seen winged lions, wonderful guardians in ancient temples, places of power
Adelene Dawner: It's the Grendel's lion av with the wings and AO from the Grendel's gryphon av. ^.^ Not hard to put together.
Adelene Dawner: But it's mostly relevant as a mixed creature - lion and crow. ^.^
Maxine Walden: ah, mixed creature, I can really relate to that
Maxine Walden: hi, Sky, nice to see you; think its been awhile
Sky Szimmer: hi maxine, adelene
Adelene Dawner gives Max a hint: Three's a lion...
Sky Szimmer: it's been awhile, yes!
Adelene Dawner: Hi, Sky. ^.^
Maxine Walden: Adelene, you know I did think of Three as a lion when I first saw you this morning....wondered about that...
Adelene Dawner chuckles.
Maxine Walden: how are you, Sky?
Adelene Dawner: My avs have always been symbolic, it's no surprise to me that the other one no longer seems 'right' after the events of the last week or so.
Sky Szimmer: just a quick note, i maybe in and out as i have to attend to the child
Maxine Walden: ah, want to hear more about that, Adelene, and thanks Sky for your note
Sky Szimmer: oh? what happened last week or is it too long to discuss
Adelene Dawner: It was discussed here: http://playasbeing.wik.is/Chat_Logs/...-_Art_and_Love
Maxine Walden: you asking Adelene about last week?
Maxine Walden: Hope that chatlog captured the events moreless, also hoping of course you would add more or send it along to me to add if the conversation continued after I left, Adelene
Adelene Dawner: Yup, it's been completed - I discovered later that SL was not logging, but Fael got it from the autologger.
Maxine Walden: Can we catch Sky up briefly summarizing the events, Adelene?
Sky Szimmer: oh... i will have to catch up and read it
Sky Szimmer: that'd be great.
Adelene Dawner: Sure
Sky Szimmer: i have really been out of touch
Adelene Dawner: Though it feels weird talking about this without Three here.
Sky Szimmer: oh. if it's too much, we can skip it and i can read it later.
Maxine Walden: (maybe Three is here in the lion being present sort of)
Adelene Dawner: But a few days ago... about a week, maybe, now, my time sense is abysmal as usual ^.^... Three and I had what I can only describe as a shared experience of each other.
Adelene Dawner grabs relevant quotes from the log.
Adelene Dawner: Adelene Dawner: There were actually two events, apparently related, on the same day. The earlier of the two, I was sitting at the computer as I am now, doing... something, don't remember... and was suddenly but un-startlingly aware of another body overlapping mine. It was Mark, meditating... he wasn't aware that he was doing it at the time, we figured that out later, after the second event.
Adelene Dawner: Adelene Dawner: The second event happened right at the end of the evening's PaB session - I was havign a *really* rough day, sensory-system-wise, and Three knew it... and suddenly there he was in my head, poking at the sensory system to make it work better, just like I do when I'm nto too fatigued to do it.
Adelene Dawner: Adelene Dawner: And we both were aware of what was going on, that time, because he was IMing to me about it as he did it. *chuckles*
Sky Szimmer: wow. how weird
Sky Szimmer: did this happened before
Adelene Dawner: Not with Mark, no.
Sky Szimmer: i don't mean weird in a critical way : )
Sky Szimmer: so Three pokes into your head huh?
Adelene Dawner: This is already a hard thing to put into words.
Maxine Walden: I was at the session and I understand that the overlapping of avs', two bodies in once space as it were, had a deep impact upon each, maybe bringing personal feelings and openness more into the experience. It was moving to hear, and of course I may not be wholly correct re what Adelene's experience was, but that was my read at the time
Sky Szimmer: yes. it must be.
Maxine Walden: that personal closeness seemed to grow from that overlapping experience
Adelene Dawner: Nope.
Maxine Walden: Oh, sorry, please correct me, Adelene, I seem to misstep here sometimes
Adelene Dawner: Three and I have been very close friends for a while now - we were quite close before either of us started at PaB, actually.
Maxine Walden: ah, didn't know that
Adelene Dawner: So that's not new at all... it was a natural progression of something that's been there and growing.
Adelene Dawner: And my reaction to the overlapping event was almost entirely curiosity - I didn't even begin to guess untill later that it may've been him.
Maxine Walden: ah...thanks for the correction. Interesting how we each read into another's experience what may not be quite what the person is trying to convey.
Adelene Dawner: No worries :)
Sky Szimmer: what did you learn from the experience or any new insights?
Adelene Dawner chuckles. "That the lines aren't where I thought they were?"
Sky Szimmer: hee hee
Maxine Walden: the lines, the boundaries?
Adelene Dawner: mmhmm
Adelene Dawner: And not just in the obvious ways, either.
Sky Szimmer: i have never had that experience. although when i have meditated, the boundary of "me" seem to expand and move.
Sky Szimmer: i take your meaning of boundaries being one of personal self, your physical space. Is that right?
Adelene Dawner: The first person ... other than Mark, obviously ... that I talked to about this was Pema. I really wasn't sure how he'd react. And his reaction was a very calm "yup, that happens"... which I really wasn't expecting.
Adelene Dawner: So that line wasn't where I thought it was.
Fael Illyar is Offline
Sky Szimmer: did Mark sense it too?
Adelene Dawner: And then here - I had no intention of talking about this. I even told Mark that I thought it was a bad idea to. I was wrong; that was another line I'd misjudged.
Adelene Dawner: Which, Sky?
Sky Szimmer: that his body overlapped yours
Adelene Dawner: That part, not as such... he was meditating at the time and from his brief description I think he simply wasn't recording to memory, but we have no way of knowing. He doesn't remember experiencing it, in any case.
Sky Szimmer: ah.
Sky Szimmer: it is nice to be here again and to sit here with you two.
Adelene Dawner: ^.^
Maxine Walden: for me too, Sky
Adelene Dawner reads back, getting a feel for the overall flow of the conversation, and adds:
Adelene Dawner: It doesn't seem proper to over-think this. I'm willing to answer questions, of course, but if you're looking for me to justify it or prove it, I can't, and I won't try. It happened. I experienced it. That's enough for me.
Sky Szimmer: yes. i think i know what you mean.
Sky Szimmer: there is the notion that our personal life is just our own dream but I have been very caught up in it and thinking it is all very real.
Maxine Walden: And I, Adelene, appreciating the experience and letting it be
Sky Szimmer: thanks for sharing with me Adelene
Adelene Dawner: ^.^
Maxine Walden: yes, the notion of our experience as a dream is very interesting and apt, I think as well.
Sky Szimmer: do you both have any suggestions to return to Being when one gets stuck in the small being
Sky Szimmer: for me, I just haven't been able to get myself out of my own personal drama. it has been so consuming
Maxine Walden: Tell us more, Sky
Adelene Dawner: The small being is Being too, Sky.
Sky Szimmer: i know. but i know too that i am totally lost.
Maxine Walden: lost how?
Sky Szimmer: for me, the notion of doing all of this, PaB, is to live happily no matter what
Sky Szimmer: to find peace and calmness no matter what.
Adelene Dawner looks slightly concerned.
Maxine Walden: but maybe there are matters that can occur which deserve clear recignition, and that may not be calm or happy
Adelene Dawner: Sky... I want you to read something ... it's long and seemingly unrelated, but the concepts are useful to this discussion...
Maxine Walden: Recognizing what is there, even unpleasant, may be closer to Being at times
Adelene Dawner: http://ballastexistenz.autistics.org/?p=565
Sky Szimmer: well, maybe i am too black and white. i feel that if one is Being, then, none of the problems in life should derail us from love and happiness
Maxine Walden: than trying to be happy
Adelene Dawner: ...wow, that *is* long... the upshot is, though, that any space you're taking up *might* rightly belong to someone *else*, and it's hard to see when you're taking up someone else's space. 'happy no matter what' takes up *lots* of space.
Sky Szimmer: that was long but very interesting. i only skimmed it but would like to read it more in detail.
Sky Szimmer: i like the idea of people taking up space.
Sky Szimmer: what do you mean by "happy no matter what" takes up space?
Sky Szimmer: i guess, i need to define happy
Maxine Walden: Another perhaps similar view might be that when we feel that something 'must' be a certain way (happy no matter what) then one feels lost if the reality of one's experience is not that way
Sky Szimmer: interesting point Maxine.
Maxine Walden: And the lostness may make it hard to be accepting of the feeling at hand (not happy)
Adelene Dawner: If your goal is to be happy no matter what, you'll do things to try to make that happen, justify things that are not right things to do in order to make it happen... we don't always see the consequences of our actions and in this world, sometimes those consequences are *very* easy to ignore, but they're still here.
Sky Szimmer: "right things" to do is a controversial statement. i am not sure what actions are right or wrong anymore.
Adelene Dawner: 'happy' is mostly made up of 'comfortable', and it's way too easy to get comfortable with the privelege of taking someone else's space. It feels good. But it's harmful to others... not-right.
Sky Szimmer: i guess my definition of happiness is that no matter what is happening externally, there should be a sense of inner peace and contentment with what is.
Adelene Dawner chuckles. "It's almost not about actions at all, Sky."
Maxine Walden: sometimes i have found that it takes courage to face the emotions and perceptions of the moment when they are not pleasant, but to do otherwise might be a betrayal of our more real experience in the now
Adelene Dawner: That's a better goal than happiness, Sky - ' serenity' is a more apt word.
Sky Szimmer: so that our inner sense of happiness isn't swayed by all the stuff that is happening around us.
Adelene Dawner: yes, Max
Sky Szimmer: i agree with you, Maxine.
Adelene Dawner: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FDSAAlrqAHM
Sky Szimmer: not to betray the real experience. i like that.
Sky Szimmer: i don't know how you pull stuff like that up, just like that with so much ease, Adelene.
Adelene Dawner chuckeles. "Good memory for where I put it helps."
Sky Szimmer: i have seen that one before. yes. i here his song often in my head.
Maxine Walden: That seems relevant for me, as the truth seems closer to respect for the self than happiness
Maxine Walden: I'll need to be going in a few minutes, RL beginning to tug
Sky Szimmer: ok. me too. it has been really nice to be here again. thanks to both of you for your thoughts.
Adelene Dawner: I think the song is right, that we tend to go about looking for happiness 'backwards' - 'what about you' isn't the only better way of doing it right, but the idea that 'looking out for number one' is counterproductive is very true.
Adelene Dawner: ok, see you guys another time. ^.^
Maxine Walden: bye for now, all