2008.11.30 01:00 - The usual way of being normal

Vertigo Ethaniel: greetings all
Moon Fargis: ^^/
Fael Illyar: How is it going? I can't recall seeing you for a while :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: yea, ive been AWOL, hehe
Vertigo Ethaniel: im good thanks. hows you?
Fael Illyar is ok.
Fael Illyar: Well, looks like I forgot breakfast :)
Fael Illyar: afk for a moment.
Moon Fargis is eating candy atm :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: im having dinner, hah
Vertigo Ethaniel: steak is on the menu tonight
Fael Illyar: different timezones :)
Moon Fargis: hmm yummy
Moon Fargis: candy steaks
Fael Illyar: yes, I took one candy for emergency energy bonus :P
Vertigo Ethaniel: hehe
Fael Illyar: candy for breakfast, yay!
Vertigo Ethaniel: new locations i see
Vertigo Ethaniel: such as this
Vertigo Ethaniel: and the library
Moon Fargis: ahh yes
Moon Fargis: you saw the library?:)
Vertigo Ethaniel: and the kira cafe, or is that fairly old?
Fael Illyar: no, relatively new :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: ah yep
Vertigo Ethaniel: just got the landmark, so wasnt sure
Moon Fargis: well the library is still under construction :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: looks good anyway
Moon Fargis: ^^
Vertigo Ethaniel: so whats going to happen to the old pab meeting place?
Faenik loves wells!
Moon Fargis: striptease club maybe ::)
Moon Fargis: but i prefer a candystore
Vertigo Ethaniel: :)
Moon Fargis: well i dont knwo :)
Fael Illyar: Moon's making the library :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: ah true
Moon Fargis: well when i got time :) maybe i will continue today for another room
Moon Fargis: 2 rooms left
Fael Illyar: all the things we have to do :)
Moon Fargis: ahyes right
Moon Fargis: ohh yes i forgot something
Fael Illyar blinks 'Forgot something?'
Vertigo Ethaniel: haha
Vertigo Ethaniel: nomnomnom
Moon Fargis: *giggles*
Moon Fargis: so hmmm what do we want to talk ?
Fael Illyar: Hi Adams :)
Moon Fargis: pab?
Moon Fargis: hi adams!
Fael Illyar: Oh, interesting outfit, Adams :)
Vertigo Ethaniel: hey there
Moon Fargis: yes:) woodstock outfit or something :)
Faenik: indeed?
Adams Dubrovna: Good morning everyone :)
Adams Dubrovna: My pajamas
Adams Dubrovna: haha
Fael Illyar smiles.
Fael Illyar: Can't recall seeing you at many 1AM meetings :)
Moon Fargis: brb
Adams Dubrovna: No not too many. It is 4am here
Fael Illyar: Still trouble sleeping ... it's getting to be a rather long term thing.
Adams Dubrovna: I just woke up and nobody is here and my laptop was on so IO thought I'd check in
Adams Dubrovna: so here I am
Fael Illyar: Ah, welcome :)
Adams Dubrovna: thanks
Fael Illyar: Well, not much of a conversation going on here though.
Vertigo Ethaniel: heres some food for thought
Adams Dubrovna: I see. My thboughts aren't together to help start one
Vertigo Ethaniel: i was discussing this with my girlfriend
Vertigo Ethaniel: these days, in modern society, do we work to live, or live to work?
Adams Dubrovna: ah yes
Fael Illyar: tends to depend on the person but for me it's more of a work to live kind of thing.
Adams Dubrovna: Work is immportant but it is not the most important
Adams Dubrovna: Our jobs can be satisfiying and add to our practice
Fael Illyar: but there are many people who do live to work
Fael Illyar: and depending on how you define work that could apply to more too :P
Vertigo Ethaniel: for so many people, i think they believe they are working to live, yet are bound to their jobs, or ways of making their way
Moon Fargis: re
Faenik loves wells!
Vertigo Ethaniel: that is true, i mostly define work as something you spend time doing for money
Moon Fargis: hmm
Vertigo Ethaniel: although, tending to your garden could be called work
Moon Fargis: depends on the work ofcourse but i guess you are right
Fael Illyar: does it cease to be work if you do it because you also want to do it, money being just a bonus?
Vertigo Ethaniel: good question
Adams Dubrovna: Life is boring if all a job does is bring in money
Moon Fargis: hmm
Adams Dubrovna: It can become fragmented (i.e.life)
Adams Dubrovna: The good part of the day and the bad part of the day
Moon Fargis: reminds me on the social way of life
Moon Fargis: the way the society forces you mostly to life
Adams Dubrovna: Stopping very 15 minutes has helped put my job in perspective for me
Vertigo Ethaniel: personally, i tend to dislike the traditional working day, even though i am a slave to it. i would much rather be tending my farm.. assuming i had one (working on it)
Vertigo Ethaniel: yes moon, i get funny looks from people when i mention how i want to drop out of the working day
Fael Illyar: Yes, working day concept is something I've been disregarding for some reason for quite a long time.
Faenik: could be
Vertigo Ethaniel: how so?
Fael Illyar: it never quite fit in my world, even with having gone to school every day for years.
Vertigo Ethaniel: yes, i understand that
Moon Fargis nods
Adams Dubrovna: Working a fram is sort of working with the rhythms of the world and in the same way we can work withing the rhythms of society. Maybe harmony is the key
Adams Dubrovna: fram - farm
Vertigo Ethaniel: thats a good point
Fael Illyar: I've somehow ended up doing just enough work to live.
Moon Fargis: its the way your days changes.. you stand up early go to work, come back from work.. clean up a bit.. set infront of the computer or tv and sleep
Moon Fargis: then you stand up again
Fael Illyar: even if I'm at times a bit worried I might end up with a bit less
Moon Fargis: maybe here and there a little hobby
Vertigo Ethaniel: however, i dont think i can fit in with society at large
Vertigo Ethaniel: thats just me tho
Fael Illyar: what does fitting in mean?
Adams Dubrovna: ah
Adams Dubrovna: anpther interesting question
Moon Fargis: so thats why i prefer going into a zen monastery.. stand up erly and switch between body ans mind work, do something for the others without earning money
Vertigo Ethaniel: honestly, i think id love to stay in a monestary for a few years
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Vertigo Ethaniel: the only thing i wouldnt enjoy as much is the organised religion
Vertigo Ethaniel: i am my own, with my own beliefs
Vertigo Ethaniel: and im very stubborn
Fael Illyar is rather stubborn there too.
Moon Fargis: depends on the monastery i would say and the path of religion they follow
Adams Dubrovna: Fael, I think I meant going with the flow, accepting the rhythms of the modern working world
Adams Dubrovna: yes to the organized religion issue
Fael Illyar: but there are side rhythms that can accommodate you.
Adams Dubrovna: ys
Adams Dubrovna: yes
Fael Illyar: just less mainstream
Fael Illyar: less visible
Adams Dubrovna: For example one doesn';t have to commute
Fael Illyar: 9-5 is not the only work/freetime division
Adams Dubrovna: yes
Vertigo Ethaniel: true, i myself work 10-5 (lol, so different...)
Moon Fargis: 7:30 - 6
Adams Dubrovna: I work 8:30 - 4:30 haha
Vertigo Ethaniel: but i used to work nights in a restaurant... hated it
Vertigo Ethaniel: but that might have just been the work
Adams Dubrovna: I wouldn;t like to work at night
Fael Illyar: what you've mentioned are all basically the same, just the time and length shifted a bit
Vertigo Ethaniel: exactly yes, heh
Adams Dubrovna: You used the word division Fael, maybe a part of what societ expects
Fael Illyar: yes, why is there a need for division?
Vertigo Ethaniel: but then again, those times are in natural rhythm with sleep patterns
Adams Dubrovna: It is society;s need to make things flow
Vertigo Ethaniel: and the transit of the sun
Adams Dubrovna: we can organize differently in some cases...yours may be a good example
Adams Dubrovna: I must be there during those times so people can find me
Fael Illyar: Yes, I tend to work when I feel like it :)
Fael Illyar: (or have been putting it off for too long)
Adams Dubrovna: But me being there also is expected by people at home
Adams Dubrovna: haha
Adams Dubrovna: They have to do their thing and I would be in the way
Fael Illyar: Well, that's a question of adapting :)
Adams Dubrovna: The entire 20c society is one of adapting I think
Moon Fargis: reminds me of: S.A.A.R.T.
Adams Dubrovna: whoops 21st century
Fael Illyar: what's that?
Fael Illyar: oh yes, adapting is becoming the most important skill in 21st century quite fast
Vertigo Ethaniel: yes, im looking forward to the changes that should be happening soon... all natural of course
Moon Fargis: a term one invented who then goes kamikatze here in a shool and shooten several people to death until he shot himself
Moon Fargis: the english version would be: S.A.W.R.D.
Moon Fargis: Shool, Aprientiship, Work, Retirement, Death
Fael Illyar: Moon, yes, those would be examples of people who refused to learn to adapt.
Vertigo Ethaniel: which is a direct result, and symptom, of something being very wrong with our lives
Vertigo Ethaniel: in my opinion
Adams Dubrovna: Yes, tragically not adapting
Faenik: ah :)
Adams Dubrovna: We can never know how many people could not adapt to living on a farm. They probably did not survive
Fael Illyar: That sounds likely, yes
Vertigo Ethaniel: we are on a farm... just not what you think a farm is :)
Adams Dubrovna: yes
Fael Illyar: but that sort of adapting is a bit different.
Adams Dubrovna: I like to think we have it much easier
Vertigo Ethaniel: probably sounds a bit conspiracy theorist of me, but im a skeptic and a pessimist when it comes to other people
Fael Illyar: oh yes, failure to adapt doesn't come with very fast death
Fael Illyar: that's why we have so many people not adapting.
Moon Fargis: hmm but its intresting
Adams Dubrovna: Our westgern religions were born in agriculture
Adams Dubrovna: They speak to the rhythms of nature
Adams Dubrovna: In the 21st century world we are distant from those
Fael Illyar: that's not to say if it's because the death being out of the picture makes people adapt less or if it just removes the non adapting ones.
Adams Dubrovna: and so the spiritual life becomes harder to sustain
Moon Fargis: to see how then politicans search on wrong sides of reasons why he did that.. shooted people and killed himself... they completley ignored the social aspect ..no they just started looking what he did in his sparetime
Moon Fargis: and this was playing computergames like counterstrike
Adams Dubrovna: yes Moon
Moon Fargis: then the term "Killergames" where invented
Moon Fargis: and they said he did this becasue he played such games
Adams Dubrovna: The games are more a symptom of the alientaion
Vertigo Ethaniel: of course, its the easiest scapegoat
Moon Fargis: he even wrote a goodbye letter saying why he did this and uploaded it into the net
Moon Fargis: a few days before
Fael Illyar: Of course, politicians have to publicize things people want to hear ... or more like not publicize things people don't want to hear ... so that kind of shapes what they say.
Moon Fargis: the letter was then deleted
Adams Dubrovna: A response to fear
Moon Fargis: but thanks to internet nothing can be deleted so easyly
Faenik: why not?
Vertigo Ethaniel: yes, the internet gives me more hope for humanity and the planet earth as a whole than any other development in history
Vertigo Ethaniel: its a marvellous tool, and we must protect it at all costs
Vertigo Ethaniel: im a big advocate of net neutrality
Fael Illyar: Yes, free flow of information needs to be protected.
Moon Fargis: but as you see... humans tend to think simple and often ignorant
Moon Fargis: like SL
Moon Fargis: its still wholeworld misleaded to child pron becasue there was those things in SL and all over the news in world
Fael Illyar: yes, we also have a tendency to not want to hear things we don't like, even if it's very important we hear them.
Moon Fargis: its past nearly 2 years and still people remember this
Vertigo Ethaniel: scandal is more important than fact
Vertigo Ethaniel: evidently
Vertigo Ethaniel: something i mentioned at the supermarket earlier tonight, looking at the womens magazines
Fael Illyar: So we latch on to scapegoats that are mostly imaginary, like childporn and blame them for everything.
Adams Dubrovna: Fear is a powerful motivator
Vertigo Ethaniel: that it is
Vertigo Ethaniel: anyhow, interesting discussion, but i must go.. work tomorrow (groan)
Moon Fargis: eek
Moon Fargis: work
Adams Dubrovna: Good to see you Vertigo
Moon Fargis: poor vertigo
Vertigo Ethaniel: you too adam
Vertigo Ethaniel: i should be back more often
Fael Illyar: Yes, that's the way it goes, unfortunately.
Fael Illyar: Hope to see you again soon Vertigo :)
Adams Dubrovna: bye
Faenik: why not?
Fael Illyar: Hi Crusty :)
Moon Fargis: hi crusty
Vertigo Ethaniel: namaste
Vertigo Ethaniel: good night
Adams Dubrovna is ready forf more sleep now. Interesting discussion
Crusty Goldshark: hi guys
Fael Illyar: Ok, see you later Adams :)
Adams Dubrovna: Thank you Moon adn fael :)
Moon Fargis: adams: ahh it was then boring enought to make you sleepy again :)
Adams Dubrovna: Hi and bye Crusty
Adams Dubrovna: Haha Moon
Crusty Goldshark: hibye
Fael Illyar smiles.
Adams Dubrovna: bye
Fael Illyar waves
PaB Listener Master: Removing "Adams Dubrovna" from list.
Moon Fargis: well crusty you seem a bit too late this time :)
Crusty Goldshark: was I late?
Moon Fargis: hehe yes one our too late now :)
Fael Illyar: yes, around an hour late :)
Crusty Goldshark: I thought I was on time everyone else was early
Fael Illyar: 1,7,1,7 SLT
Fael Illyar: it's 2AM SLT now
Crusty Goldshark: Yes indeed - but who is interested in time keeping?
Moon Fargis: well i got alot of time still
Fael Illyar: Well, not really :)
Crusty Goldshark: Oh good perhaps you can tell us about Zen?
Fael Illyar: but the meetings mostly last an hour :)
Fael Illyar: of course exceptions are there too :)
Moon Fargis: sure what do you want to know ?
Crusty Goldshark: Nothing?
Fael Illyar: these last until people no longer want to talk :)
Moon Fargis: hi kir
Fael Illyar: propeller hat :)
Crusty Goldshark: Thanks Fael _ it is nice hear - and I do try to get here o time
Fael Illyar: Hello Kirkra :)
Crusty Goldshark: here hear
Crusty Goldshark: Well Moon I suppose the question about Zen is why answer questions?
Moon Fargis: becasue you always answer questions even if you dont answer
Fael Illyar: Yes, "no answer" is an answer too :)
Crusty Goldshark: Only questions no one has aked?
Fael Illyar: although, only if the questioner knows it was heard :)
Moon Fargis: when no question no answer ;)
Crusty Goldshark: Well I suppose answers and questions are much the same - idle chat
Crusty Goldshark: my fav kind :)
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Fael Illyar: idle chat but it's sometimes quite nice ones :)
Crusty Goldshark: What is Faenik about?
Fael Illyar: look on my shoulder :)
Crusty Goldshark: Wellall chat is nice ;)
Moon Fargis: sure is there something you want to chat about ?:)
Fael Illyar: It's interesting we have this delusion that what we say actually makes a difference ;)
Moon Fargis: depends on what you dont say:)
Crusty Goldshark: everything is different
Fael Illyar: (that's not to say no difference is made, just that it's not the saying that does it)
Crusty Goldshark: that makes sense
Crusty Goldshark: I suppose with awareness we are able to make a difference?
Moon Fargis: and then ?:)
PaB Listener Master: Removing "Kirkra Caerndow" from list.
Crusty Goldshark: what then?
Moon Fargis: exactly
Moon Fargis: ^^
Crusty Goldshark: what does ^^ mean?
Moon Fargis: ah its a smiley
Moon Fargis: ^_^
Fael Illyar: tries to represent a smiling face :)
Fael Illyar: like this one :)
Moon Fargis: (^_^)
Crusty Goldshark: never come across that ;)
Crusty Goldshark: ^^
Moon Fargis: came fron japan to us :)
Fael Illyar: yep, originally Japanese smiley :)
Fael Illyar: kind of resembles how smiling is portrayed in manga or anime
Moon Fargis: ^.^
Crusty Goldshark: does talk walk like skype with a mic?
Moon Fargis: yep you can also speak with a micro in SL
Moon Fargis: for that you have the voicechat option enabled in the preferences
Faenik: why not?
Fael Illyar: Well, doesn't work too well for me :)
Crusty Goldshark: OK - will try that - BRB
Fael Illyar: I tend to have problems even hearing others with it
Moon Fargis: well
Moon Fargis: yes thats the problem
Moon Fargis: not everyone got it enabled so not everyone will hear you
Fael Illyar: I participated a voice session with RL monk speaking through voice yesterday and I kept having to turn voice off and back on to keep listening
Moon Fargis: uh
Fael Illyar: somehow I hear people for a few minutes and the nothing.
Moon Fargis: firewall ?
Fael Illyar: it somehow loses everyone else
Fael Illyar: didn't work at all until I looked at SL voice FAQ and opened the listed ports in the firewall
Moon Fargis: ahh wich are they?
Fael Illyar: http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Voic..._a_firewall.3F
Moon Fargis: ah thanks
Moon Fargis: i am called now
Fael Illyar: Ok, see you later :)
Moon Fargis: see you later ^^/