The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

oO0Oo Resident and Lucinda Lavender joined me.

Thanks oO0Oo Resident for compleing the posting after I went to bed :)

stevenaia Michinaga: waves Samud
oO0Oo Resident: Hi Stevnaia
oO0Oo Resident: My network connection is fickle.. so i hope I don't crash too much.
stevenaia Michinaga: nods, I;ve seen you come and go before, assumes it's your connection
oO0Oo Resident: I was reading about Qualia ("raw feels" .. not Jan)
stevenaia Michinaga: ....listens
stevenaia Michinaga: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Qualia
stevenaia Michinaga: reads
oO0Oo Resident: oh.. hmm.. just tried to follow and understand what wikidedia had to say... in light of recent email by Bleu.
stevenaia Michinaga: a new word for me
stevenaia Michinaga: like pema's new experiment
oO0Oo Resident: One thing.. not directly related to qualia, is how there are people of really different backgrounds and capabilities with respect to philosophy and science. Also there are diverse backgrounds of "spiritual/comtemplative" practice etc...
oO0Oo Resident: All here in the group.
oO0Oo Resident: I sometimes think there could be room for something like.. "guided mastery" in order to get into some of the subtlety of exercises and so on. Yet I imagine people need to come to such a situation.. kind of predisposed to, willing to open to guidance or instruction from another.. with appreciation for things like..hmmm
oO0Oo Resident: The backgrounds of persons.
stevenaia Michinaga: like here, people come to see and leave when there is nothing here for them

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: hi LuciLucinda Lavender: oops

Lucinda Lavender: hi:)
oO0Oo Resident: Hi Luci :)
Lucinda Lavender: my aim is accidental
stevenaia Michinaga: slow connection?
Lucinda Lavender: I guess
oO0Oo Resident: sounds almost like wu wei luci
Lucinda Lavender: yes...
Lucinda Lavender: are you in a topic at present?
stevenaia Michinaga: qualia
stevenaia Michinaga: guided mastery
oO0Oo Resident: I was sharing some impressions Luci
Lucinda Lavender: great
oO0Oo Resident: So yes.. notion of "guided mastery".. I think this one is worth thinking about
stevenaia Michinaga: in regard to that, I've always thought, on one hand that someome can "get somewhere", like enlightenment...... which is a personal state... and then discover a path to show others to take to receive the sme
stevenaia Michinaga: since no two peeple get st to the same place the same way
stevenaia Michinaga: but can be handed the tools
stevenaia Michinaga: if the tools are crafted properly
oO0Oo Resident: Yes.. well this connects into the notion of a community of diverse persons. It is sensible to appreciate some things. the scales of ability in certain ways.
oO0Oo Resident: In order to get the best from a situation
oO0Oo Resident: So for instance
oO0Oo Resident: for arguments sake, if Kurt Gödel set up a group in second life.. and a rare opportunity occurred to learn something of what he was studying.. I would want to look a little into his background so as not to show up to his meetings, only to end up asking.. how can I learn to add or subtract numbers?
oO0Oo Resident: No matter how patient and completely allowing he might be
oO0Oo Resident: In order to benefit from some kind of guided mastery.. there needs to be a certain orientation.. no?
stevenaia Michinaga: nods, the tools
Lucinda Lavender: so are you saying people who understand the language involved...the concepts involved are ready to play...
oO0Oo Resident: No.. not that so much luci.
oO0Oo Resident: Something more like.

--BELL--

oO0Oo Resident: Having an open and willing disposition and appreciating the intelligence, wisdom, training, and so on of people.. in order to benefit most from their company.
stevenaia Michinaga: how you do you see " guided mastery"
stevenaia Michinaga: there is something to be said for those who disagree, much can be learn from those who are somewhat unwilling and somewhat open
oO0Oo Resident: Well i got to thinking about this because of the way that over time, people here at PaB learn so much in so many different ways. I was contemplating the kinds of sessions Pema used to have with Stim Moraine, and how that kind of experience together might be brought to others.
oO0Oo Resident: It seemed that "guided mastery" of some kind might be a way.
oO0Oo Resident: But it would require people to appreciate that kind of relationship.
oO0Oo Resident: Some kind of respect and openness to being led, and trusting it will be a fruitful experience.
oO0Oo Resident: Because.. my goodness..
oO0Oo Resident: Princeton doesn't give seats to people like Kurt Gödel, without them having some serious chops.
oO0Oo Resident: and one could trust in that
oO0Oo Resident: as an amzing opportunity
oO0Oo Resident: and come with some respect and for that
oO0Oo Resident: ... anyway.. "guided mastery" on the mind
oO0Oo Resident: me hushes
stevenaia Michinaga: reading about Gödel http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kurt_Gödel
Lucinda Lavender: reads too
oO0Oo Resident: Well.. really just pick a name.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Institu...Advanced_Study point remains
stevenaia Michinaga: an unfortunate demise
oO0Oo Resident: There are here at PaB, people with amzingly diverse abilities, and backgrounds.. experiences.. etc..

--BELL--

oO0Oo Resident: We all benefit from that.. if not filtering too much of the "interesting dust". and it is kind of impossible to form hierarchies, but quite possible to show respect
stevenaia Michinaga: there is some wonderful commonality here...
stevenaia Michinaga: it seems to be lasting for some :)
stevenaia Michinaga: time to turn in the for evening, thank you Luci and Samúð
stevenaia Michinaga: nice to listen
Lucinda Lavender: rest well Stevenaia
oO0Oo Resident: Night Stev
oO0Oo Resident: I was appreciating what Raffi observed about PaB. She said she saw an ability for the group to stop and give space.. to wait to respond at times, which she noted is rare in groups. As we have not trained in this as such, I wonder if it comes from individual predisposition, individual training, or for instance.. sitting together in a circle, or the practice of dropping/pausing?
Lucinda Lavender: sitting together in circle...taking time to respond.
oO0Oo Resident: Can I listen to anything you may have to share Luci ?
Lucinda Lavender: I fell I have had some practice in the circle format...
Lucinda Lavender: usually done in a group of women
Lucinda Lavender: in turn
Lucinda Lavender: speaking about what ever seems universally appropriate to a topic
Lucinda Lavender: and not so much in the intellectual landscape
oO0Oo Resident: "universally appropriate"
oO0Oo Resident: could you say more about that.. What that is and how you come to know it?
oO0Oo Resident: honor it?
Lucinda Lavender: often listening to a dream
Lucinda Lavender: trying to see what is showing up in the dream in a broader way

--BELL--

Lucinda Lavender: and, eacher person allows all ways of seeing the dream...there is no correcting going on...each hears what they hear and allows it to filter in
oO0Oo Resident nods.. and listens
Lucinda Lavender: never knowing how it might add to
Lucinda Lavender: or spak for the next speaker
Lucinda Lavender: spark
Lucinda Lavender: but this is all dream material...not experiments, theories etc
oO0Oo Resident: can you say something of masculine and feminine energy.. in relation to container, trust, oepning, and allowance please Luci?
Lucinda Lavender: It has been described to me as feminine to be receptive in the listening...in the weaving of threads that form as one hears a dream
Lucinda Lavender: without correcting

Lucinda Lavender: also...listening from the body...which is hard to describe but when something sharp happens it feels like a disturbance
Lucinda Lavender: when you are really quiet and listening to a dream it is sort of like being back in it
Lucinda Lavender: and then if some one drops an obhect or shuts a door it can feel strong
Lucinda Lavender: sort of like meditation
Lucinda Lavender: nodding
Lucinda Lavender: takes a minute to come out of a kind of receptive state
Lucinda Lavender: yes
Lucinda Lavender: it seems to me that there are all kinds of exchanges and sometimes there is something that happens when we put our heads together kind of quietly, offering experiences for each other
Lucinda Lavender: sharing side by side
Lucinda Lavender: masculine and feminine can do this together seems to me

--BELL--


oO0Oo Resident: some form of valuing the humans wholly before the ideas they hold most dear?
Lucinda Lavender: yes...
Lucinda Lavender: my experience is not about scientific exploration tho..
Lucinda Lavender: come out of an intuitive source
Lucinda Lavender: so it is how I learned to look at dreams
Lucinda Lavender: not discuss reality
oO0Oo Resident nods.. There feels something natural in the pause/dropping what we have practiced.. that lends to this kind of broader appreciation
oO0Oo Resident: that feels pragmatic, if not kind of perfectly empirical
oO0Oo Resident: a kind of shared sacred space
Lucinda Lavender: the pause has been like that for me at times
Lucinda Lavender: for me
oO0Oo Resident smiles.. any dreams Luci ?
Lucinda Lavender: well I was thinking of one as we spoke here...because it involved putting my head next to the head of a fellow...quietly being together.
oO0Oo Resident: would love to hear..
Lucinda Lavender: not much more to say but he wanted to share a game of some sort on a device...we put our heads together. Felt bonded in some way.
Lucinda Lavender: Sometimes all the dreams that come to dream circle are similar...and that night it had the theme of male and female interaction
Lucinda Lavender: mine had a more uplifting feeling...


--BELL--


Lucinda Lavender: welcome back Sam!
oO0Oo Resident: ty
Lucinda Lavender: I should go soon...
Lucinda Lavender: anything more you want to say?
oO0Oo Resident: Okay.. i also.. last line from you was : Lucinda Lavender: Sometimes all the dreams that come to dream circle are similar...and that night it had the theme of male and female interaction
Lucinda Lavender: then I said...mine was uplifting in feeling
Lucinda Lavender: tho in all the masculine was offering something to the feminine
Lucinda Lavender: and in looking at all the dreams there were different results in the dreams
oO0Oo Resident: ty.. I missed the pause, wonder if we can sit quietly for say two minutes.. and just be.. and then maybe be on our way.
Lucinda Lavender: sure!
Lucinda Lavender: great idea

    (oO0Oo crashed again)

oO0Oo Resident laughs.. sorry Luci
oO0Oo Resident: shall we try again?
Lucinda Lavender: sure...I was just trying to figure out how to change the name above my head...:)
Lucinda Lavender: do you know how?
oO0Oo Resident: The group tag?
Lucinda Lavender: I think so
Lucinda Lavender: I just wanted it to say Lucinda
oO0Oo Resident: Lucinda Lavender is your username
Lucinda Lavender: yes...
oO0Oo Resident: I think that has to show.. all or nothing
oO0Oo Resident: Not sure, but don't think you can just have Lucinda. You can add a display name that is just Lucinda
oO0Oo Resident: My whole username oO0Oo resident does not show up, because of the late date at which I signed up for SL. They changed the format
oO0Oo Resident: [anyway..] :)


--BELL--


oO0Oo Resident: thanks luci.. nice talking with you
oO0Oo Resident: Night