2012.07.29 13:00 – The quality of Mercy

Investigating the quality of mercy in awareness experience, particularly in 90-second lab sessions

The Guardian for this meeting was Aphrodite Macbain. The comments are by Aphrodite Macbain.

Aphrodite Macbain: Hello Zon!
Aphrodite Macbain: Welcome Raffi
Aphrodite Macbain: Hiya
Raffila Millgrove: greets Aphro, hi Zon.
Aphrodite Macbain: are you wearing a crown Raffi? You look very regal!
Raffila Millgrove: haha. well i was in costume for some dance and didn't have time to change clothes yet.
Raffila Millgrove: no really a queen crown... more of a Roman mistress get-up.
Aphrodite Macbain: Ah.:-) where was the dance?
Raffila Millgrove: oh one of my groups. You are a barista?
Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Korel
Korel Laloix: Heya all.
Raffila Millgrove: Hi Kori
Korel Laloix: Was just giving Sano a SL historical tour.
Aphrodite Macbain: Oh-in one of my groups! Yes I run a cafe in Melioria where my exhibition is
Korel Laloix: Was nice to show her around.
Aphrodite Macbain: Sano?
Raffila Millgrove: ah yes. i went to the opening of your exhibit.
Korel Laloix: Santoshima
Korel Laloix: I am having a very bad typing day.
Raffila Millgrove: lovely party. i liked all the history you gave too. Great exhibit.
Aphrodite Macbain: What were you showing her here she hasn't seen yet
Aphrodite Macbain: thanks Raffi
Aphrodite Macbain: or were you showing her other sims?
Korel Laloix: Just the original sims and things back to 2002 and 2003.
Korel Laloix: Some just went over ten years old this month.
Zon Kwan: heya
Raffila Millgrove: oh cool. Hi San.
Aphrodite Macbain: Ah, he's awake!
Raffila Millgrove: oh come sit Zon. i thought maybe you were having some SL problem stuck over there.
Zon Kwan: hope so
Aphrodite Macbain: Hello San. Smiles and waves
Korel Laloix: Heya Santo
Zon Kwan: awakeawakeawake
Aphrodite Macbain: lol
Santoshima Resident: hello, learning how to sl walk
Aphrodite Macbain: ah,you may need a HUD
Santoshima Resident: have one
Zon Kwan: not learned yet
Raffila Millgrove: eh?
Zon Kwan: so clumsy
Santoshima Resident: nope
Raffila Millgrove: you don't need a hud to walk?
Korel Laloix: It is overrated.
Zon Kwan: like a pigeon
Raffila Millgrove: you just use your arrow buttons.
Santoshima Resident: "so clumsy", yes
Aphrodite Macbain: wonder why you need to get up to type san
Santoshima Resident: it's the Hud
Santoshima Resident: now off
Santoshima Resident: how is everyone?
Zon Kwan: calm and peaceful
Aphrodite Macbain: well thanks. I've had a lovely morning. Spent an hour reading and listening to lovepoems
Aphrodite Macbain: I found a great on\ e by Goethe
Zon Kwan: love poems ?
Aphrodite Macbain: yes.
Korel Laloix: Love poems?
--BELL--
Korel Laloix: Have a link?
Aphrodite Macbain: There is a poetry group in the Sim I'm in-many of you have visited it. Melioria.
Aphrodite Macbain: this week it was pre 19th century love poetry
Lorel Laloix: Have an example?
Aphrodite Macbain: I can quote mine if you like. The one by Goethe
Korel Laloix: Sure.
Korel Laloix: I actually know about Goethe.
Zon Kwan: please
Wol Euler: evening all
Zon Kwan: hi wol
Aphrodite Macbain:

NEW LOVE, NEW LIFE. by Johann Wolfgang von Goethe [Written at the time of Goethe's connection with Lily.] 1775.

HEART! my heart! what means this feeling? /What oppresseth thee so sore? /What strange life is o'er me stealing! /I acknowledge thee no more.

Fled is all that gave thee gladness, Fled the cause of all thy sadness, Fled thy peace, thine industry-- Ah, why suffer it to be?

Say, do beauty's graces youthful, Does this form so fair and bright, Does this gaze, so kind, so truthful, Chain thee with unceasing might?

Would I tear me from her boldly, Courage take, and fly her coldly, Back to her. I'm forthwith led By the path I seek to tread.

By a thread I ne'er can sever, For 'tis 'twined with magic skill, Doth the cruel maid for ever Hold me fast against my will.

While those magic chains confine me, To her will I must resign me. Ah, the change in truth is great! Love! kind love! release me straight!

Aphrodite Macbain: Kind of describes a lot of my relationships...
Aphrodite Macbain: (Wol-I was in a poetry session this morning in Melioria)
Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Stevenaia
stevenaia Michinaga: greetings
Zon Kwan: hi stev
Korel Laloix: You could write at least two country songs from that.
stevenaia Michinaga: waves to everyone
Korel Laloix: heya
Raffila Millgrove: hi stevie
Aphrodite Macbain: Well,you asked for it Kori
Raffila Millgrove: lol Kori
Korel Laloix: I did.
Korel Laloix: And thank you.
Wol Euler: ah :)
Aphrodite Macbain: Cheatin and hurtin songs,yes.
Wol Euler: hello stevie
Raffila Millgrove: hey Wol.
stevenaia Michinaga: hi San

Aphrodite Macbain: So the proposed theme discussion for today is investigating the quality of mercy in awareness experience, particularly in 90-second lab
Korel Laloix: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mA67y3mqjMs

Aphrodite Macbain: are we merciful?
stevenaia Michinaga: mercy, can we spend a moment on that?
Aphrodite Macbain: yes
Aphrodite Macbain: what is mercy?
Korel Laloix: Sounds like we need to figure out mercy first before we add context.
Zon Kwan: opposite to justice ?
Aphrodite Macbain: Is it simply the ability to forgive and not judge harshly?
stevenaia Michinaga: is it judgement?
Zon Kwan: forgiveness
Korel Laloix: This may be a semantics thing to me.
stevenaia Michinaga: compassion?
Zon Kwan: not to punish although crime committed
Korel Laloix: I mean... if I come across someone in pain...and I don’t know the circumstances.. and I help them.. Is that mercy?
stevenaia Michinaga: when I think of mercy, I think of a king forgiving a lesser soul
Aphrodite Macbain: to show mercy-is to forgive and not judge harshly
Wol Euler: to me mercy implies judgment
Wol Euler: yes, what aph said
Korel Laloix: Ok.. I see what you are getting at.
Wol Euler: hello bleu
Aphrodite Macbain: yes, they go together don’t they?
Raffila Millgrove: well if you check the dictionary. the word "power over" shows up a lot. In other words.. mercy seem to involve some quality of power... a weaker/stronger thing.
Zon Kwan: to help is not to give mercy
Aphrodite Macbain: no
Bleu Oleander: hi everyone :)
stevenaia Michinaga: so mercy begins with judgment?
Aphrodite Macbain: Hi Bleu
Zon Kwan: but to forgive somehow
stevenaia Michinaga: waves to Bleu
Raffila Millgrove:

1. compassionate or kindly forbearance shown toward an offender, an enemy, or other person in one's power; compassion, pity, or benevolence: Have mercy on the poor sinner.

2. the disposition to be compassionate or forbearing: an adversary wholly without mercy.

3. the discretionary power of a judge to pardon someone or to mitigate punishment, especially to send to prison rather than invoke the death penalty.

4. an act of kindness, compassion, or favor: She has performed countless small mercies for her friends and neighbors.

5. something that gives evidence of divine favor; blessing: It was just a mercy we had our seat belts on when it happened.

Aphrodite Macbain:Thanks Raffi. It tempers judgment
Wol Euler: exacty
Raffila Millgrove: don't have to have judgment in it...
Wol Euler: but the judgment of having sinned comes first
Raffila Millgrove: or power.
stevenaia Michinaga: hard to concentrate w/ hank Williams playing in the background
Aphrodite Macbain: The quality of mercy is not strained
Bleu Oleander: would mercy start with an awareness of others?
Aphrodite Macbain: It droppeth like the gentle rain from heaven
Korel Laloix smiles
Aphrodite Macbain: To the earth beneath

Wol Euler: hello sophia

SophiaSharon Larnia: hi everyone :)

Bleu Oleander: hi Sophia

stevenaia Michinaga: hi Sophia, gtsy
SophiaSharon Larnia: gtsy too
Zon Kwan: hi sophia

Aphrodite Macbain: Hey SSL!

Wol Euler: I disagree, Raffi, I think it follows a judgment
Raffila Millgrove: they mention in guardian a mercy to oneself.. altho not mentioned in any definitions.
Raffila Millgrove: see above. Could be an act of kindness or compassion. no judgment in that definition.
Korel Laloix: Just thinking of mercy vs kindness
Aphrodite Macbain: Ah, to be a good Guardian we need to temper judgment with mercy, not only to others but to ourselves
Bleu Oleander: hi San :)

stevenaia Michinaga: wb San
Wol Euler: a judge in court might have mercy on the guilty party, but I don't think he could properly be said to have mercy on the guy who mopped the floor
Aphrodite Macbain: Wol??? canyou say more?
Wol Euler: because the guy who mopped the floor has done nothing wrong. He needs no mercy
Wol Euler: and there is no occasion for the judge to give it to him
Zon Kwan: judge cant have mercy
Aphrodite Macbain: OK unless she mopped over your new shoes
Zon Kwan: he judges
Wol Euler: of course he can, zon. He can commute what should be a prison sentence into a fine and social service
--BELL--
Zon Kwan: that’s not mercy
Wol Euler: why not?

Zon Kwan: its assessment
Aphrodite Macbain: But he tempers his judgment both with information and perhaps with mercy
Zon Kwan: mercy means no punishment
Aphrodite Macbain: think about it during these 90 seconds
stevenaia Michinaga: or less punishment
Raffila Millgrove: 4. an act of kindness, compassion, or favor: She has performed countless small mercies for her friends and neighbors.
Zon Kwan: waves
Aphrodite Macbain: please try and observe the seconds of silence
Raffila Millgrove: it doesn't have to have judgment. it could.. but that definition... doesn't require any assessment or judgment.
stevenaia Michinaga: oops
Raffila Millgrove: oopsie didn't hear the bell sorry
Aphrodite Macbain: just see if the ring turns red
Wol Euler: or the fountain stops

Wol Euler: or the green text in the chat stream :)

stevenaia Michinaga: grins, oh that

Bleu Oleander: depends on how you define it
Raffila Millgrove: it could have power/judgment.. but it doesn't have to.. we dont' have to narrow the wide definition. do we?
Wol Euler: can you give an example of mercy which has neither power nor judgment, please?
Raffila Millgrove: 4. an act of kindness, compassion, or favor: She has performed countless small mercies for her friends and neighbors.
Raffila Millgrove: she has performed....
stevenaia Michinaga: trying to picture a "small mercies"
Raffila Millgrove: you have no power over your friends or neighbors... this suggest no power or judgment. It is definition number four in this list i posted earlier.
Wol Euler: okay, I'll grant that usage :)
Raffila Millgrove: so.. it has wide .. definitions.. could be power/judgement. Could be not.

Aphrodite Macbain: I was wondering whether we could contemplate the concept of being merciful to ourselves during the 90 seconds

Aphrodite Macbain: Can we be merciful to ourselves?
Korel Laloix: I wish we could Aph.
Wol Euler: we can certainly be harsh to ourselves, so I'd guess that it is possible :)
Raffila Millgrove: i think so. Doesn’t anyone think we.. can't?
Aphrodite Macbain: Judge ourselves less harshly?
Bleu Oleander: compassion = mercy?
Aphrodite Macbain: they are not equivalent but definitely related Bleu
Bleu Oleander: what's the diff?
Raffila Millgrove: act of compassion.
Aphrodite Macbain: black and bleu
Bleu Oleander: :)
Raffila Millgrove: rather than a feeling.. actual.. ACT
Korel Laloix: I am far harder on me than others I think.
Wol Euler nods to korel
Wol Euler: definitely true :)
Aphrodite Macbain: compassion is feeling another's pain
Aphrodite Macbain: which could lead one act mercifully
Raffila Millgrove: mercy is the act of compassion. Not just feeling.
Raffila Millgrove: feel.. then show mercy. act of compassion.
Korel Laloix: I agree Raffi.. It is an act.
Aphrodite Macbain: yes
Aphrodite Macbain: makes sense
Aphrodite Macbain: Can we do that here? Around the pool?

Pity

Korel Laloix: But when is it mercy vs pity vs just doing what is right?
Aphrodite Macbain: yes there is a difference
Aphrodite Macbain: Pity is somehow condescending
Wol Euler: yep
Korel Laloix: And then there are times when from one point of view it is mercy, and to another pity.
Raffila Millgrove: i think for example.. when someone fumbles up...over the bell. We are showing some mercy when we .. recognize they probably didn’t' do it intentionally.
Raffila Millgrove: that is an act of mercy i think?
Aphrodite Macbain: and compassion
stevenaia Michinaga: Mercy-act of kindness, pity-a burdened act of kindness
Aphrodite Macbain: pitty poor kitty
Korel Laloix: Interesting way to separate those.
stevenaia Michinaga: one is within, the other is external
Korel Laloix: How do you mean Stevenaia?
Raffila Millgrove: pity is a kind of superior position, don’t' you think? feeling sorry. it's not exactly compassion or showing any mercy ..
stevenaia Michinaga: (not sure which is which)
Aphrodite Macbain: For me, mercy is a larger gift
Aphrodite Macbain: It implies a fuller heart
Raffila Millgrove: most people do not really want people to show pity on them. it's not exactly a friendly move
Aphrodite Macbain: no, it diminishes them
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, mercy is the gift to someone that rewards yourself, pity is not, they may result in the same thing
Raffila Millgrove: yes aphro. exactly. a diminishing.
Korel Laloix: Depends on how low you are Raffi.
Aphrodite Macbain: ??
Bleu Oleander: not sure a person in need would care what you called it as long as you helped them
Raffila Millgrove: well i show pity to you.. seems like i am putting myself above you Kori?
Aphrodite Macbain: what do you mean Kori?
Raffila Millgrove: helping isn't the same as pity.

Aphrodite Macbain: Let's get back to mercy.
Korel Laloix: I have been in some survival situations.. and I was grateful for anything.
Aphrodite Macbain: Mercy gives relief.
Korel Laloix: Not sure the right words.
stevenaia Michinaga: acting on pity can too
Santoshima Resident: what about the ever-popular "wallow in self-pity"?
Bleu Oleander: maybe helping is the act and mercy/pity is the motivational stance?
Santoshima Resident: has its function
Aphrodite Macbain: you didn’t care what the motivation was right Kori?
Wol Euler: pity is not about the help that you get, it may be accompanied by lots and lots of really useful help
Santoshima Resident: yes, wol
Wol Euler: pity is about what I think of you as I help you
Santoshima Resident: indeed
Korel Laloix: Not at the time no.
Aphrodite Macbain: acting on pity is better than simply pitying, that's true
Raffila Millgrove: well i don't want anyone to pity me, no matter how screwed up i am.. and i don't like to pity anyone else. Compassion/mercy seem very different to me from pity.
Santoshima Resident: "poor, poor pitiful me", country tune, isn't it?
Aphrodite Macbain: As opposed to taking that pound of flesh, one has compassion and is merciful. .Right?
Raffila Millgrove: pity damages someone's self respect. mercy/compassion/helping.. they don’t' necessarily do any damage.
Korel Laloix: For me though, I probably would not be here except for the pity (if that is the right word) of a few people.
--BELL--
Korel Laloix: Not sure I am getting the right shades of meaning though.

Aphrodite Macbain: Are there examples in our PaB discussions where we need to be more merciful?
Santoshima Resident: in labeling someone as "mentally unstable", for instance
Aphrodite Macbain: I am finding people are becoming a little harsh in their judgments of others' opinions for instance
Korel Laloix: I admit I can be harsh.
Santoshima Resident: hence, my comment
Korel Laloix: But I mean it... smiles
stevenaia Michinaga: I think to think (my definition) that being merciful means the gift to someone is my reward
Santoshima Resident: i meant mine in response to Aph, Korel
Santoshima Resident: i don’t type fast enough
Korel Laloix: OK.
Aphrodite Macbain: yes I agree San. I wasn't aware of that
Aphrodite Macbain: any name calling is unkind and unmerciful
stevenaia Michinaga: but apologizing is
Aphrodite Macbain: is what?
stevenaia Michinaga: for name calling
Korel Laloix: But what is the difference between name calling and accurate labeling?
stevenaia Michinaga: merciful
Raffila Millgrove: er this isn't about accurate labeling as much as it is about speaking of someone who cannot be present in a way they might find upsetting.
Santoshima Resident: exactly
Raffila Millgrove: such as "mentally unstable".
Aphrodite Macbain: It is apparent, Criticism can be done kindly and not publicly for instance
Aphrodite Macbain: For me, the challenge is first to be merciful in my thoughts as well as my words.
Aphrodite Macbain: By the time we say the unkind words it is too late.
Santoshima Resident: exactly
Korel Laloix: That is true for sure.
Santoshima Resident: whether publicly, or in group email
Santoshima Resident: whether validated by meeting the person in rl, or not
Santoshima Resident: it's not appropriate
Santoshima Resident: and it is destructive
Santoshima Resident: to the person
Santoshima Resident: and to the listeners
Santoshima Resident: imho
Raffila Millgrove: upsets the listeners cause they wonder when it might happen to them. am i next?
Raffila Millgrove: trust issue.
Santoshima Resident: correct, in part
Santoshima Resident: right on the mark
Santoshima Resident: and counter to the "dropping"
Santoshima Resident: practice of this place
Santoshima Resident: you going to drop aspects that you hold about yourself
Santoshima Resident: you better be willing to do that about others as well
Wol Euler: ((nine minutes to Bertie's meditation))
Santoshima Resident: "the quality of mercy is not strained"
Aphrodite Macbain: We need to work on our thoughts first, before we speak
Raffila Millgrove: well that is true aphro. and it's exactly why I apologized cause i caught it too late.. to stop saying it was ok.. and had to back up and apologize.
Aphrodite Macbain: I suggest we think bout this during the last 90 seconds
Raffila Millgrove: it's better to avoid the apologize by being careful in the first place..
stevenaia Michinaga: is mercy = to kindness?
Raffila Millgrove: i screwed up there.
Aphrodite Macbain: Oh dear I was wondering whether we could contemplate the concept of being merciful to ourselves during the 90 seconds and it just went by!

Mercy to me

Aphrodite Macbain: Start from within
Korel Laloix: I think that is the hardest part though.
Aphrodite Macbain: you didn't screw up Raffi!
Korel Laloix: Being kind to me is far harder than being kind to others.
Santoshima Resident: not at all, Raffi!
Aphrodite Macbain: Precisely. That's perhaps the place to start
Aphrodite Macbain: with ourselves
Santoshima Resident: how else?
Raffila Millgrove: I agree... it is hardest to be merciful to self. (for most of us)
Korel Laloix: In my Faith, there is the "love thy neighbor as thyself" thing..
Aphrodite Macbain: Many people try to fix others San before they try and fix themselves
Korel Laloix: Amazing how hard that is.
Aphrodite Macbain: the golden rule
Aphrodite Macbain: do-as-you-would-be-done-by
Korel Laloix: Very meaningful to me.

Meditation & mercy

Aphrodite Macbain: Yes, that's where meditation can really help
Aphrodite Macbain: I think that Bertram's session follows this. He was away last week.
Wol Euler: yes, in two minutes
Raffila Millgrove: some of us meditate a lot. Would you say that you could meditate on being merciful to yourself? How would you do that?
Aphrodite Macbain: It's always nice to meditate after this session.
Wol Euler: I shall sneak away now. Goodnight all, thanks for the very interesting discussion
Raffila Millgrove: bye Wol.
stevenaia Michinaga: Golden Rule, doesn't that presume you are not self destructive
Bleu Oleander: bye all, take care :)
Santoshima Resident: good night, Wol ~
Raffila Millgrove: bye Bleu
Aphrodite Macbain: Raffi,I would think about what I do with others, examine it, become aware
Santoshima Resident: bye Bleu
Aphrodite Macbain: I do apologize for my typing. I am going to buy a new keyboard
stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps a bad note to leave this discussion
Raffila Millgrove: yes. but Aprho.. You just spoke of being merciful to self.. How would you meditate on that concept?
Aphrodite Macbain: I would begin by seeing where and how I judge myself harshly
Raffila Millgrove: ah.
Aphrodite Macbain: and try and figure out why I do
Raffila Millgrove: ty. for giving example.
Aphrodite Macbain: yw
Raffila Millgrove: i wonder why we do it?
Raffila Millgrove: too?
--BELL--
Aphrodite Macbain: Once I begin to understand my motivations for doing things I don’t like, I can begin to change things
Raffila Millgrove: i often wonder.. why are we so hard on ourselves. or why am I hard on myself.. i mean.
Santoshima Resident: conditioning
Santoshima Resident: internalized
Santoshima Resident: habit patterns
Aphrodite Macbain: Good questions to ask yourself Raffi. Only you can answer them.
Raffila Millgrove nods.
Aphrodite Macbain: thanks everyone
Santoshima Resident: thank you so much for this talk

Aphrodite Macbain: It was wonderful
Santoshima Resident: bye

Aphrodite Macbain: byee
Raffila Millgrove: i found it. long ago. the reason why... but... i never could get past.. or change the habit of being harder on self. than on others.
stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps we don’t give ourselves the time we truly need to assess ourselves and our actions, resulting in regret followed by correction
stevenaia Michinaga: thank you all
stevenaia Michinaga: nice discussion
stevenaia Michinaga: to begin the week’s theme
Raffila Millgrove: very nice. ty for hosting us Aphro.
stevenaia Michinaga: that a hat or a tiara, Raff?
stevenaia Michinaga: bye all
Santoshima Resident: bye stev
Santoshima Resident: bye raffi and korel