2012.12.02 13:00 - Clarity is a Quality

Eliza posted this session from the auto-listener database...

[13:11] Santoshima Resident: looking for how're you zon?
[13:11] Santoshima Resident: type there
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: re-type:
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: hor are you, zon?
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: hor = how
[13:12] Zon Kwan: im good, ty :)
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: (great type lag + poor typing skills)
[13:12] Zon Kwan: anf hor you ?
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: ko
[13:12] Santoshima Resident: :)
[13:13] Zon Kwan: quiet today

[13:13] Santoshima Resident: aph is away?
[13:13] Zon Kwan: all are away
[13:13] Zon Kwan: except us
[13:13] Santoshima Resident: seems

[13:13] Zon Kwan: what is this weeks theme ?
[13:14] Santoshima Resident: hmm, i should know ...
[13:14] Santoshima Resident: hang on
[13:14] Santoshima Resident: oh yes, CLARITY

[13:16] Korel Laloix: Heya
[13:16] Zon Kwan: sounds clear
[13:16] Santoshima Resident: hi Korel
[13:16] Zon Kwan: hi Korel :)
[13:16] Zon Kwan: how is your day ?
[13:17] Korel Laloix: Just got back from a night down in the City.. was lovely..
[13:17] Korel Laloix: Unwinding before I hit the books.
[13:17] Korel Laloix: Thanks.
[13:18] Zon Kwan: back from a night..partying ?
[13:19] Korel Laloix: No, just a nice short trip with Reeba... down to the city, BandB, shopping, show, drinks, hottub, etc... smiles
[13:19] Korel Laloix: Was a lovely time.
[13:19] Zon Kwan: smiles
[13:19] Santoshima Resident: nice
[13:20] Korel Laloix: Saw a rather fun but definaly amature version of the Wizard of Oz musical.. was fun.

[13:20] Santoshima Resident: hi wol :)
[13:21] Korel Laloix: Heya
[13:21] Wol Euler: hello korel, san, zon
[13:21] Wol Euler: sorry I'm late
[13:21] Zon Kwan: hi wol
[13:21] Santoshima Resident: we all padded in a little late
[13:21] Wol Euler: what's the topic?
[13:21] Wol Euler smiles.
[13:22] Santoshima Resident: just determining that
[13:22] Santoshima Resident: it's Clarity
[13:22] Wol Euler: ah
[13:22] Wol Euler: at least that is clear :)
[13:22] Korel Laloix smiles
[13:24] Zon Kwan: what is clear
[13:24] Zen Arado: Hi all
[13:24] Korel Laloix: Heya
[13:24] Zon Kwan: hi zen :)
[13:24] Santoshima Resident: hi zen :)

[13:24] Zon Kwan: tell us what is clear
[13:24] Zon Kwan: and what is clarity
[13:24] Zon Kwan: im all lost
[13:24] Santoshima Resident: but you are clear about that
[13:25] Zon Kwan: hm..not sure

[13:25] Korel Laloix: I think clarity for the most part is temporary and often just means you have a limited context.
[13:25] Zon Kwan: is clarity same as order ?
[13:26] Korel Laloix: I don't think so.

[13:26] Zen Arado: have to go again
[13:26] Zon Kwan: chaos and cosmos
[13:26] Wol Euler: hello and bye, zen
[13:26] Santoshima Resident: bye zen
[13:26] Zon Kwan: bye zen
[13:26] Zen Arado: byee
[13:28] Zon Kwan: leaves too, waves
[13:29] Wol Euler: bye zon, take care
[13:29] Korel Laloix: ciao

[13:29] Wol Euler: clarity, hmmmm, so you think it's an illusion or a misunderstanding, korel?
[13:30] Santoshima Resident: bye zon ...
[13:31] Korel Laloix: Not realy an illusion.
[13:31] Korel Laloix: But to have clarity, you have to know a whole lot... and often we do not actually have the whole picture...
[13:31] Korel Laloix: So we just have to make reasonable bounds and go with what we know inside of those.

[13:32] Wol Euler: so it's an ambition or a hope, rather than an achievement?
[13:32] Santoshima Resident: it's a quality

[13:33] Santoshima Resident: greetings qt :)
[13:33] Wol Euler: hello qt
[13:33] Qt Core: Hi all
[13:33] Korel Laloix: Heya
[13:33] Korel Laloix: A reasonable guess.
[13:33] Korel Laloix: An informed guess.
[13:35] Wol Euler ponders.
[13:35] Qt Core: topic ?
[13:35] Korel Laloix: Clarity

[13:35] Wol Euler: I tend to use the word in very limited contexts, as when I ask a question for the third time to make sure that everyone at the table has understood unambiguously
[13:36] Korel Laloix: I use it a lot more as I still have parts of my English that are less than precise.
[13:36] Korel Laloix: But to the same end I think.
[13:36] Wol Euler nods.

[13:36] Wol Euler: I don't think I would use it about something as large as enlightenment, or a school of philosophy
[13:37] Wol Euler: so I suppose I agree with you, korel :)
[13:37] Wol Euler smiles.
[13:39] Korel Laloix: Not sure, but one thing I have found out...
[13:39] Korel Laloix: that when a person insists they were perfecty clear, they usually were not.
[13:39] Wol Euler smiles.
[13:39] Qt Core: i too would use it as a last resort in a discussion

[13:39] Wol Euler: I tend to use it pre-emptively, to avoid last resorts :)
[13:40] Wol Euler: because I have to work with people who hate being tied down to absolutes
[13:40] Wol Euler: but are furious if their ambiguous instructions are misunderstood
[13:40] Wol Euler: it's just self-defence

[13:40] Qt Core: there is a word for them... clients ;-)
[13:40] Wol Euler: heheheheh
[13:40] Wol Euler: or bosses
[13:40] Santoshima Resident: :)

[13:41] Korel Laloix: I have teachers like that.. give verbal assignments and then give you low grades when you give the answers they asked for but not the ones they wanted.
[13:41] Wol Euler nods.
[13:41] Wol Euler: which is the mark of a bad client / boss / teacher IMHO
[13:41] Wol Euler: brb, sorryr
[13:41] Santoshima Resident: agreed
[13:41] Korel Laloix: Agreed.
[13:42] Korel Laloix: And things that are clear to some, are very muddy to others.

[13:42] Korel Laloix: Why I dislike subjective tests.
[13:46] Santoshima Resident: needing to get some chores done ~ bye for now
[13:46] Korel Laloix: Cioa
[13:47] Qt Core: bye
[13:48] Wol Euler: back, reading
[13:48] Wol Euler: wb zen
[13:48] Qt Core: Hi Zen
[13:48] Zen Arado: wb Wol

[13:48] Zen Arado: I'm tired of art openings
[13:49] Korel Laloix: Are opening?
[13:49] Qt Core: why ?
[13:49] Korel Laloix: Like someone putting up their paitings?
[13:49] Wol Euler: awwww
[13:49] Zen Arado: yeh
[13:49] Korel Laloix: They can be fun RL.
[13:50] Zen Arado: I've seen too many paintings
[13:50] Korel Laloix: And excuse to dress up and go someplace usualy nice.
[13:50] Zen Arado: I guess
[13:50] Zen Arado: just me
[13:52] Korel Laloix: Most of the stuff at these things is really not worth looking at.
[13:52] Korel Laloix: Just go for the event.
[13:52] Wol Euler: I've cut down a lot in the last years, haven't been to an opening in RL in ages
[13:52] Zen Arado: hmm you are so wise Kori
[13:52] Wol Euler: perhaps not one in 2012
[13:53] Zen Arado: people haul me to them
[13:53] Wol Euler smiles.
[13:53] Korel Laloix: Same with me...
[13:53] Korel Laloix: But they are what you make up f them.
[13:53] Korel Laloix: The really good ones are when the stuff is so bad it is laughable.
[13:53] Zen Arado: :)
[13:54] Wol Euler: heheheh

[13:54] Zen Arado: I have gone off dynalic paintings now
[13:54] Zen Arado: thought they were great at the start
[13:54] Korel Laloix: dynalic?
[13:54] Zen Arado: dynamic
[13:54] Zen Arado: moving patterns
[13:54] Korel Laloix: OH OK.. smiles
[13:55] Zen Arado: they get a bit samey
[13:55] Korel Laloix: lag
[13:55] Zen Arado: if you know what I mean
[13:55] Wol Euler: like Op Art, nice ideas but dull as hell to look at
[13:55] Wol Euler: for the most part
[13:55] Korel Laloix: Op art?
[13:55] Zen Arado: the scripts direct the painting too much
[13:56] Zen Arado: pop?
[13:56] Wol Euler: optical
[13:56] Wol Euler: swirly black and white patterns
[13:56] Wol Euler: mostly visual tricks and illusions
[13:56] Zen Arado: yes

[13:56] Wol Euler: Bridget Riley made her name with them
[13:56] Wol Euler: (among others)
[13:56] Zen Arado: ah yes know who you mean
[13:57] Wol Euler: https://www.google.de/search?q=bridg...w=1090&bih=883
[13:58] Qt Core: that's evil painting ;-)
[13:58] Wol Euler: yep
[13:58] Wol Euler: I do like her more recent ones, colourful
[13:58] Wol Euler: http://www.tumblr.com/tagged/op%20ar...ore=1349210623
[13:58] Wol Euler: like that

[13:59] Wol Euler: they are better in RL than in a photo, the colours are gentler than the photo seems
[13:59] Zen Arado: I saw one in belfast gallery
[13:59] Zen Arado: a coloured one
[13:59] Zen Arado: nice
[14:00] Zen Arado: better go to Bert's
[14:00] Wol Euler: oh, time for Berti
[14:00] Wol Euler: goodnight QT, take care
[14:00] Zen Arado: nite Qt
[14:00] Qt Core: bye Zen, Wol