2012.12.25 19:00 - solitude and community and dzogchen

The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

Eos Amaterasu, Paradise Tennant and Bertrum Resident joined in tonight

stevenaia Michinaga: greetings
Eos Amaterasu: Hi Stevenaia
Eos Amaterasu: Managed to get in here but not sure how long I'll last
stevenaia Michinaga: you made it, feel free to take the evening off of you have other distractions
stevenaia Michinaga: Santa returning north affects the internet?
Eos Amaterasu: Turkey was done much more quickly than expected so had early dinner
stevenaia Michinaga: good to check often
Eos Amaterasu: I'm at an apartment in Montreal with shared internet, goes in and out
stevenaia Michinaga: nods, one of my favorite cities
stevenaia Michinaga: always cold this time of year, was there once for vacation... it was 40 below
Eos Amaterasu: we're in the Plateau area of Montreal, below Mile End
stevenaia Michinaga: nods
Eos Amaterasu: I experienced -40 in Vermont once
stevenaia Michinaga: much snow there?
Eos Amaterasu: Some..
Eos Amaterasu: enough

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: we finally got a dusting last night... and tomorrow... and this saturday
Eos Amaterasu: Northeast gets hit with storm starting tomorrow ...
Eos Amaterasu: Euclid
stevenaia Michinaga: some snow is nice, they are expecting a foot at the other end of the state
stevenaia Michinaga: they named it?
Eos Amaterasu: yes, you can google it.... Euclid Storm
Eos Amaterasu: Any discussions on this week's theme of "alone together", & http://aliainstitute.org/blog/2012/1...lone-together/
stevenaia Michinaga: few people here, but I ahven;t read the logs, what does it mean?
Eos Amaterasu: http://aliainstitute.org/blog/2012/12/10/being-alone-together/
stevenaia Michinaga: thx, works much better
Eos Amaterasu: Eliza suggested it, and by coincidence I was thinking of the same thing...
stevenaia Michinaga: coincidence? there is no coincidence :)
Eos Amaterasu: What Eliza quoted was:
Eos Amaterasu: "If we are to hold solitude and community together as a true paradox, we need to deepen our understanding of both poles. Solitude does not necessarily mean living apart from others; rather, it means never living apart from one’s self. It is not about the absence of other people—it is about being fully present to ourselves, whether or not we are with others."
Eos Amaterasu: The section on being present toward the end is superb
stevenaia Michinaga: sounds like what we do here :)
Eos Amaterasu: like, attentive being there?
--BELL--
stevenaia Michinaga: I often wonder if all states can co-exist within us, it's more a matter of recognizing the special ones
Eos Amaterasu: yes, I think that relates to discovering that it's really more a process of uncovering rather than achieving or cranking up
stevenaia Michinaga: yes, like an onion, all the layers are there
Eos Amaterasu: but, as someone once said, "recognizing is easy; remembering is hard"
Eos Amaterasu: we can have special situations where the environment makes it easier (like here, perhaps)
Eos Amaterasu: but then the interesting question is how that reflects in 'real' and ongoing life
stevenaia Michinaga: remembering is easy, since you can make up the memory each time, recognizing can be more diffcult for me
Eos Amaterasu: but is the memory of it the same as "it"?
stevenaia Michinaga: which "it"
stevenaia Michinaga: one becomes the other
stevenaia Michinaga: so it is for a moment
Eos Amaterasu: ideally...
Eos Amaterasu: and then there's the next moment
stevenaia Michinaga: but recognition initially needs to be found.. or uncovered
stevenaia Michinaga: like intuition, it's there
Eos Amaterasu: yes
stevenaia Michinaga: it's amazing how complete we truely are, but we are the last to know this
Eos Amaterasu: there's this idea of "decide on one point", in some traditions (such as dzogchen)
stevenaia Michinaga: will google that
Eos Amaterasu: which is that 1) you realize "it", nature of mind, being resting in itself, whatever
Eos Amaterasu: then 2) decide on that one thing as the one thing you keep coming back to, or remembering, or re-realizing
Eos Amaterasu: no matter what situation - it applies to everything
Eos Amaterasu: very simple approach: find the one true hammer, and then everything is a nail :-)
stevenaia Michinaga: smiles

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: binks
stevenaia Michinaga: nice example, Eos
stevenaia Michinaga: hi Para
Paradise Tennant: hiya stev eos happy holidays :))
stevenaia Michinaga: thank you
Eos Amaterasu: hi Paradise
stevenaia Michinaga: Eos, so does each person find their one thing, or does it become a tool kit where you carry a screwdriver and everthing becomes a screw
stevenaia Michinaga: orather do you have many tools
Eos Amaterasu: good questions
Eos Amaterasu: I think the key thing is to have the tool that's really personal for you and works for you
Eos Amaterasu: but there are patterns of those - we aren't really all that different
stevenaia Michinaga: like... kindness
Eos Amaterasu: but it has to connect to your life and its details as they come up
Eos Amaterasu: so it has to be personal, not just a theory
stevenaia Michinaga: solves a mulitude of problems, nods
Eos Amaterasu: I think that's that #1 point, of realizing: "rock meets bone" for you, and then you apply that to any situation (that's deciding on one point)
Eos Amaterasu: for Ramana Maharshi, for example, it was "who is thinking this"?
Eos Amaterasu: That's a really good one: no matter what you are experiencing, ask "who is experiencing this"?
Eos Amaterasu: that doesn't give an answer, but it's a good question
Eos Amaterasu: a productive question
Eos Amaterasu: answers tend to be premature stops to questioning
Eos Amaterasu: being an avatar can make such a question more alive: that's one of the interesting aspects of SL
stevenaia Michinaga: can you explan that last line?
stevenaia Michinaga: in the time you have left hare?
stevenaia Michinaga: here
Eos Amaterasu: nothing very profound, really: you have an SL identity, you have an RL identity (and probably many identities)
Eos Amaterasu: and having an identity and body and relationships in SL can make you ask, who is being this avatar?
Eos Amaterasu: or what/who am I?
Eos Amaterasu: in Sl
Eos Amaterasu: in SL
stevenaia Michinaga: nods
Eos Amaterasu: and also then in RL
Eos Amaterasu: asking that question can make it easier to ask it in RL
Eos Amaterasu: and who are you in DL (Dream Life)?
Eos Amaterasu: maybe it makes you step back a little bit from your autopilot self
Eos Amaterasu: almost literally in SL, where you have perspective on yourself from above and a bit to the back of yourself
Eos Amaterasu: :-)

--BELL--

Eos Amaterasu: Well, need to seque away
Eos Amaterasu: Thank you,
stevenaia Michinaga: few ask those questions of themselves
Eos Amaterasu: stevenaia and Paradise
stevenaia Michinaga: have a good evening
Paradise Tennant: take care eos
Eos Amaterasu: holiday cheers to you both, and your relations and friends and karasses
Paradise Tennant: sweet dreams
Paradise Tennant: karassess ?
stevenaia Michinaga: better google that one
Paradise Tennant: group of people linked in a cosmically significant manner, even when superficial linkages are not evident. Created by Kurt Vonnegut.
stevenaia Michinaga: smiles
stevenaia Michinaga: a friend of mine who met Kurt Vonnegut told me a funny story about him
Paradise Tennant: listens
stevenaia Michinaga: he was speaking at a local university a while back and had to attend a reception, of course at sponsor's house
stevenaia Michinaga: this friend of mine, the head of the religion dept was there and talking to him
Bertrum Resident: 's current display-name is "Bertrum".
stevenaia Michinaga: he was handed a drawing by Mr Vonnegut at the party and was very impressed that he now had an original , but small work on paper
stevenaia Michinaga: hi bert
Bertrum Resident: hi everyone
stevenaia Michinaga: some time later he found out the significance of the drawing
stevenaia Michinaga: seems Kurt Vonnegut would identify those who he felt were assholes and make them by giving them a Kurt Vonnegut original drawing of an asshole to match what he felt was this atribute about them
stevenaia Michinaga: sorry for the bad typing :)
Paradise Tennant: that is horrible
Paradise Tennant: what a mean thing to do
stevenaia Michinaga: nods
Paradise Tennant: he should have suffered in silence like the rest of us :)
stevenaia Michinaga: I suspect it was his way of coping with those things he did not wnat to do
stevenaia Michinaga: but my friend shows it with special pride
stevenaia Michinaga: and the story
Paradise Tennant: yes I guess one of the lovely things about getting older is not caring what others think of you
stevenaia Michinaga: smiles, perhaps not older, just wiser
Bertrum Resident: maybe it's somewhat a pragmatic decision.
Bertrum Resident: sometimes...
stevenaia Michinaga: which
--BELL--
Bertrum Resident: Not caring what others think of you
Paradise Tennant: at xmas dinner tongiht was a long time famly friend and quite by accident we found our grandmothers had the same maiden name ... we are distant relations . amazes me how connected we all are :) .. whether we realize it or not :))
Paradise Tennant: frankly when you think how little others know of you .. really how could their opinon be informed enought to matter
stevenaia Michinaga: exactly, but people do it all the time, sometimes intuition works in that way, very correctly
Bertrum Resident: that's a wonderful connection at your dinner:)
stevenaia Michinaga: we are all connected closely or remotely in so many ways
stevenaia Michinaga: what was for dinner :)
Paradise Tennant: hmm shrimp .. yummy appetizers , shrimp cocktail, salad, sweet potatoes, turkey , stuffing , peas, and cranberry sauce
stevenaia Michinaga: sounds yummy... and for dessert?
Paradise Tennant: and home made ice cream cake for dessert with a creamy home made rum punch liquer
stevenaia Michinaga: wow
Paradise Tennant: then ice wine truffles
Paradise Tennant: sound decadent ?
stevenaia Michinaga: love canadian ice wine
Paradise Tennant: very good in chocolate :)
Bertrum Resident: yum
stevenaia Michinaga: what doesn;t?
Paradise Tennant: yes glad I didn not eat all day

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: bedtime for me, back to work tomorrow
stevenaia Michinaga: storm coming too
stevenaia Michinaga: night my friends
Bertrum Resident: night Steve

Paradise Tennant: night night stev

Paradise Tennant: welll I think I will turn in too :))
Bertrum Resident: night Paradise
Paradise Tennant: smile sleepy . after all those carbs :))
Paradise Tennant: night night bertrum :))
Paradise Tennant: sweet dreams