2011.07.02 07:00 - Mutual Support

Eliza posted this session...

[06:59] Bertram Jacobus: hello dash ! ... :-)
[06:59] Dash Earthboy: hey Bert ;)
[06:59] Dash Earthboy: 's up?
[07:00] Bertram Jacobus: sry, my english is not so perfect, but i understand that you ask me what´s going on ? or "how is life" and such - am i right with that ? :-)
[07:00] Dash Earthboy: yah :)
[07:01] Bertram Jacobus: ah. good. so - nothing special - how are you ?

[07:02] Dash Earthboy: like you, i struggle with what people mean with their words...are you asking what my feelings are at this time?
[07:02] Bertram Jacobus: yes. as part of my question - would be nice to know. if you like to tell and to share (?) ...
[07:03] Dash Earthboy: well, the headache I have is increasing my anxiety at this point :(
[07:03] Bertram Jacobus: oh. sry to read that !
[07:04] Bertram Jacobus: i take medcine / pills / little helpers when it becomes too worse sometimes. not often. but i´m very thakful that there is such a possibility to get free from such suffering (!) ...
[07:04] Dash Earthboy: yah
[07:05] Dash Earthboy: i took an Excedrin migraine pill to help prevent it going migraine on me
[07:05] Bertram Jacobus: may be once in a month or once in 6 weeks i take something to push headche away. i think that is not too much (?) ...
[07:06] Dash Earthboy: hadn't heard of that practice before
[07:06] Dash Earthboy: does it work?
[07:06] Bertram Jacobus: practice ? noo - sry - may be i expressed it not correctly. i mean when i have headache i take a pill, then
[07:07] Dash Earthboy: oh okay
[07:07] Dash Earthboy: so you don't get headaches very often?
[07:07] Dash Earthboy: maybe one in a month or six weeks?
[07:07] Bertram Jacobus: no. and sometimes so slightly that i don´t take medcine
[07:07] Bertram Jacobus: yes. exactly.
[07:08] Bertram Jacobus: the heavier form once in a month or in 6 weeks
[07:08] Dash Earthboy: i see

[07:08] Bertram Jacobus: besides that twice or three times in lower intensity
[07:08] Dash Earthboy: how nice for you! that the headaches are so rare :)
[07:09] Bertram Jacobus: it´s said that women have more problems with it then men ...
[07:09] Bertram Jacobus: that should be normal i think, isn´t it ?! -
[07:09] Bertram Jacobus: i find, that´s "more then enough" (!) ;-)
[07:09] Dash Earthboy: that is conventional wisdom, but my g/f's would beg to differ :)
[07:10] Dash Earthboy: after an assault in 1980, i got prone to migraines
[07:10] Bertram Jacobus: i think both is real : to differ and to see general tendencies (?) ...
[07:11] Dash Earthboy: but before that i had plenty of stress headaches
[07:11] Bertram Jacobus: assault ? (!) -
[07:11] Dash Earthboy: yes, my head took the brunt of the battering i got
[07:12] Dash Earthboy: from a neighbor drug dealer/child molester
[07:12] Bertram Jacobus: oohh ... :-(
[07:12] Dash Earthboy: yah
[07:12] Bertram Jacobus: life ...

[07:12] Bertram Jacobus: do you meditate ?
[07:12] Dash Earthboy: since 1990 i've also developed allergies and those headaches
[07:13] Dash Earthboy: yah i meditate, since 1970
[07:13] Bertram Jacobus: i mostly speak with my body and ask him not to allow such things - illnesses and deseases ... mostly it / he works
[07:13] Bertram Jacobus: i am very thankful for that
[07:14] Bertram Jacobus: ah. and does the meditation help you ?
[07:14] Dash Earthboy: yes, how fortunate for you :)
[07:14] Bertram Jacobus: yes. i wish, that this may become available for more and more people (!) ...
[07:14] Dash Earthboy: the idea of meditating?
[07:16] Dash Earthboy: we're not being recorded :)
[07:16] Dash Earthboy: oops, i guess we are :)

[07:16] Bertram Jacobus: may be we enter a much more spiritual age now, in these days and months and years (?) ... hopefully ... without clinging, for sure (!) ... ;-)

[07:16] Dash Earthboy: are you a guardian and claimed this session?
[07:17] Bertram Jacobus: no : i meant the friendship with our bodies which allows to be free from deseases and ilness
[07:17] Bertram Jacobus: but for sure meditation is a great precondition for that and so it is also a wish that more and more people may learn meditation as well
[07:18] Bertram Jacobus: yes ( @ guardian and claimed ) ;-)
[07:18] Dash Earthboy: ok
[07:18] Dash Earthboy: i missed that :)
[07:18] Bertram Jacobus: and it´s even recorded when no guardian claimed it - then the autorecorder records
[07:18] Dash Earthboy: ok, good to know :)
[07:19] Dash Earthboy: another Bert?

[07:19] Bertram Jacobus: yes - and i asked myself why you are not a guardian yet here - i see you since a while and appreciate it - and the more people help the better - isn´t that so ? ;-)
[07:19] Dash Earthboy: agreed BJ
[07:20] Bertram Jacobus: no - but people mix us up very often . he is bertrum, i am bertram. that´s a difference ;-)
[07:20] Bertram Jacobus: and hello bertrum ! :-)
[07:20] Bertrum Resident: Hi everyone
[07:20] Dash Earthboy: hey BR
[07:21] Bertram Jacobus: *smile* - pls excuse me when i try to "produce a more balanced seating symmetry (?) ... ;-)
[07:21] Dash Earthboy: :)
[07:22] Bertram Jacobus: and dash - wouldn´t you like to help us as a guardian here ?
[07:22] Dash Earthboy: i would certainly like to help :)
[07:22] Bertram Jacobus: great - so may be, we see you soon in our group ! ... :-)
[07:23] Dash Earthboy: next weekend i leave my home and may not even have this slow DSL connection i'm using now
[07:23] Bertram Jacobus: as a member i mean ... :-)
[07:23] Dash Earthboy: yes as a guardian :)
[07:23] Bertram Jacobus: ah. i see. but others even have slower ones ! ...
[07:23] Bertram Jacobus: with many crashes etc ...
[07:24] Dash Earthboy: ur right BJ
[07:24] Bertram Jacobus: :-)
[07:24] Dash Earthboy: where is Hinei Gardens?
[07:25] Bertrum Resident: It will come up in a search.
[07:25] Dash Earthboy: for sure
[07:25] Dash Earthboy: where is hinei gardens?
[07:26] Dash Earthboy: hey Bruce
[07:26] Bertram Jacobus: hey again bruce ! :-)
[07:26] Bertrum Resident: Hi Bruce
[07:26] Bertram Jacobus: men´s circle ... ;-)
[07:26] Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Dash, Bertram , , , and another Bertram!
[07:26] Bertram Jacobus: no bruce : he´s a bertrum ! :o)

[07:27] Bruce Mowbray: Heavy rains here in Ohio have been knocking out my satellite connection.
[07:27] Bertram Jacobus: whaow
[07:27] Dash Earthboy: Yikes!!
[07:27] Bruce Mowbray: OH -- a "BertrUm..."
[07:27] Bruce Mowbray: Hello, then, Bertrum!
[07:27] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. yes :-)
[07:27] Bertrum Resident: Hi Bruce
[07:28] Bertrum Resident: Dash, the location is 54 151 61

[07:28] Dash Earthboy: Bruce would you believe it was a bout with Legionnaires I got in NYC that knocked me out of the summer concert series I was doing and interrupted the budding music career I had there?
[07:29] Bruce Mowbray: WHOA!!! Was that THIS summer????
[07:29] Dash Earthboy: i also recuperated in an Ohio hospital for a few days
[07:29] Bruce Mowbray: no -- ok. I understand now.
[07:29] Dash Earthboy: no, years ago Bruce
[07:29] Dash Earthboy: they didn't even want to admit it was Legionnaires in NYC :(

[07:29] Bruce Mowbray: I've been pondering whether to notify the hostel where I stayed over a month ago that I got the disease -- and it MIGHT have been in the room where I bunked.
[07:31] Bertram Jacobus: what means "bunked" pls ?
[07:32] Bruce Mowbray: "bunked" means slept in a bed in a dormitory with alots of others -- there were 12 "bunks" in the dorm room where I stayed.
[07:32] Dash Earthboy: i put bunk beds in my son's room when we moved to GA
[07:32] Dash Earthboy: such fun to build :)
[07:32] Bruce Mowbray: This was the Hostelling International youth hostel in New York, Bertram.
[07:32] Bertram Jacobus: ah. i see. ty
[07:32] Bruce Mowbray: sure.
[07:33] Dash Earthboy: yah Bertram, bunks are common in hostels :)

[07:33] Bruce Mowbray: My doctor assures me that the Center for Disease Control in Atlanta has been notified -- and that if there are any patterns emerging for the disease - they will be aware of them.
[07:33] Dash Earthboy: they expect you to sleep alone with your teddy bear :)
[07:33] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. now i see. ty again , yes, common ... in germany as well -
[07:34] Dash Earthboy: Bruce, that's good they're following up like that

[07:34] Bruce Mowbray: A couple of years ago, I went all throughout Scotland -- staying in hostels everywhere...
[07:34] Bruce Mowbray: wonderful experience.

[07:34] Bruce Mowbray: They have to follow up on it, Dash -- federal laws -- as with AIDS.
[07:34] Dash Earthboy: hostels are good but i like hosts even better Bruce :)
[07:35] Bruce Mowbray: My doctors also tested me for AIDS, by the way.
[07:35] Bruce Mowbray: I laughed in their faces -- having been a celibate monk for almost 40 years!
[07:35] Dash Earthboy: better to be safe like that Bruce
[07:35] Bruce Mowbray: but I went along with the test to make them happy.
[07:36] Bertrum Resident: What were the symptoms?
[07:36] Bertram Jacobus: 40 years celibate monk ?! that means - no orgasms since such a long time ? (!) ...
[07:36] Bruce Mowbray: (by the fourth day they were getting desperate to find a diagnosis).
[07:36] Dash Earthboy: yah

[07:36] Bruce Mowbray: The symptom that really clued them in that it was Legionnaire's was my low sodium (blood.)
[07:36] Dash Earthboy: they do get desperate

[07:37] Bruce Mowbray: Please do not confuse celibacy with no orgasms -- I probably have more orgasm every week than all of you put together.
[07:37] Bertrum Resident: Did it begin like the flu?
[07:37] Bruce Mowbray dies from laughing....
[07:37] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. ah ! okay ! ty for the answer bruce ! ...
[07:37] Dash Earthboy: good for you Bruce
[07:38] Bruce Mowbray: It began when I realized (in New York) that I could no longer be a tourist-- and that I'd need to lie down.
[07:38] Dash Earthboy: dang
[07:39] Bruce Mowbray: I spent the next five days in the hostel -- with a high fever -
[07:39] Bertram Jacobus: but the "probably part" of your notion ... i don´t think that it is like that ... ;-)
[07:39] Bruce Mowbray: although I didn't realize how sick I was until I returned to Hio-
[07:39] Dash Earthboy: i actually collapsed after my biggest concert to that point
[07:39] Bruce Mowbray: Then I immediately checked into a hospital where I was admitted and remained a patient for ten days.
[07:40] Dash Earthboy: 10 days in a NYC hospital....hope you have good insurance :(
[07:40] Bruce Mowbray: Yes, I apologize for the "probably" part -- because that's unfair to all of you.
[07:40] Bertram Jacobus smiles widely ... :-)

[07:40] Bruce Mowbray: NO -- I returned to OHIO before I went into the hospital, Dash.
[07:40] Dash Earthboy: oh ok
[07:41] Dash Earthboy: that's where I found doctors desperate enough to find a diagnosis too -- in Ohio :)
[07:41] Bruce Mowbray: The hospital's bill for the entire stay was $25,800 --- of which I am required to pay $1,350.
[07:41] Bruce Mowbray: but on to other topics, OK?
[07:41] Bertram Jacobus: whaow
[07:41] Dash Earthboy: not too bad Bruce :)
[07:41] Bruce Mowbray: Yeah, the American health care system really sucks.
[07:41] Dash Earthboy: for 2011
[07:42] Bruce Mowbray: i have had five doctor's appointments since being discharged from the hospital -- and each of those costs me $35.
 

[07:42] Bertram Jacobus: yes : that in germany , for example , everybody is assured and if poor , in the social medical system . so nobody must fear costs which he can´t pay ...
[07:42] Bruce Mowbray: Indeed, Bertram.
[07:42] Dash Earthboy: Bertram, i guess this session's title will be "Health Issues" :)
[07:43] Bruce Mowbray: That's how intelligent and civilized countries deal with health care -- UNLIKE the USA!
[07:43] Bertram Jacobus: hehe. we´ll see ... ;-)
[07:43] Bertram Jacobus: obama wants to install such a system, doesn´t he ?
[07:44] Dash Earthboy: obama wants a better healthcare system for sure
[07:44] Bruce Mowbray: He did so last year -- but now the majority of the American public says they don't want it.
[07:44] Bertram Jacobus: strange ...
[07:44] Bruce Mowbray: They think it's too expensive.
[07:44] Dash Earthboy: well, the majority being interviewed Bruce :)
[07:44] Bertram Jacobus: here, it is not
 

[07:44] Bruce Mowbray: They'd rather have their taxes go to our armies invading foreign countries, I guess.
 

[07:44] Bertram Jacobus: so there - it shouldn´t be either
[07:46] Bruce Mowbray: The "reason" health care is so expensive in the USA is that there are no controls on what doctors can charge for their services. I had one doctor spend less than 2 minutes with me every morning - for which he charged over $200 each time. Ridiculous!
[07:47] Dash Earthboy: a medical centre i worked for also was fraudulently billing regular checkups as emergency services
[07:47] Bertram Jacobus: tz. so i would ask before i accept his service ? no ? and go to another one then. no ?
[07:47] Dash Earthboy: they fired me when I wouldn't participate in such unethical business
[07:48] Dash Earthboy: of course, their reason was "insubordination"
[07:48] Bruce Mowbray: Since my balance was all wacko, a physical therapist wanted to give me "occupational therap" --- but I told her I was retired -- so she said OK. And for that five-minute "consultation" she charged $150.
[07:48] Dash Earthboy: dang
[07:49] Bertram Jacobus: sounds rude ... :-/
[07:49] Bruce Mowbray: Bert, when you're a death's door and completely vulnerable -- and hoping that the doctors are gong to be able to save your life (and have no idea what they are charging) -- you don't say, "Go away; you charge to much; my life isn't worth that expense!"
[07:50] Bruce Mowbray: at death's door*
[07:50] Dash Earthboy: i may Bruce :)
[07:50] Bertram Jacobus: a change seems to be urgent i would say
[07:50] Bertram Jacobus: of such systems
[07:50] Bruce Mowbray: ;-) Go for it, Dash. Maybe that's why you were only in the Ohio hospital for a couple of days and I was there for ten days!
[07:51] Dash Earthboy: couldn't afford it Bruce
[07:51] Bruce Mowbray: I do understand that -- and I am sorry.
[07:51] Dash Earthboy: and yet
[07:51] Dash Earthboy: here i am
[07:51] Dash Earthboy: i credit God

[07:51] Bruce Mowbray: and MANY Americans cannot "afford" to get basic health care -- even for their children. It is a moral issues, I feel.
[07:52] Bertram Jacobus: moral and social !
[07:52] Bertram Jacobus: ethical
[07:52] Dash Earthboy: i have been in the front-line trenches of such important domestic issues
[07:52] Bruce Mowbray: some states are having to say which life-saving procedures they will not pay for . . . so people are dying.
[07:53] Bertram Jacobus: so let´s change the world and make it a better place ...
[07:53] Bruce Mowbray: Indeed, let's do that.
[07:53] Dash Earthboy: Bert, that's what i'm here for
[07:53] Bruce Mowbray: starting with our basic values ---
[07:53] Bertram Jacobus: helping each other, building communities ... in the end one community ...
[07:53] Bruce Mowbray: that life is worthwhile....
[07:54] Bruce Mowbray: yes, building communities of mutual support.
[07:54] Bertram Jacobus: yes. it has started

[07:54] Bertram Jacobus: the internet is a new great help for that
[07:54] Bruce Mowbray ponders: Mutual support community is how I view PaB.
[07:55] Bruce Mowbray thinks he'll try on a new hat.
 

[07:55] Bertram Jacobus: mutual support is how i see the universe ... ;-)
[07:55] Bertram Jacobus: including everything and everyone
 

[07:56] Dash Earthboy: new hat Bruce?
[07:56] Bruce Mowbray: "New hat" is a work in progress.
[07:56] Bertram Jacobus: dear friends - i´m becoming tired now a bit - and like to have a bit relaxing time - so i say bye and log off now - ty for chatting and your community !
[07:56] Bertram Jacobus: may all beings be happy pls !
[07:57] Dash Earthboy: bye Bertram
[07:57] Dash Earthboy: hi Zon
[07:57] Bertram Jacobus: *smile*
[07:57] Bertrum Resident: bye Bruce
[07:57] Bruce Mowbray: BYE, Bertram!
[07:57] Bertram Jacobus: hi and bye zon
[07:57] Zon Kwan: same
[07:57] Bertrum Resident: I need to log off ase well. Bye everyone.
[07:57] Dash Earthboy: bye Bertrum
[07:57] Bruce Mowbray: Bye, Bertrum!
[07:58] Dash Earthboy: bye Zon
[07:58] Bruce Mowbray: There! How does that look, Dash?
[07:58] Bruce Mowbray: Hi, Zon!
[07:59] Dash Earthboy: virtually delicious
[08:00] Dash Earthboy: i'm being beckoned to another location, Bruce...sry
[08:00] Dash Earthboy: have a good one :)
[08:00] Bruce Mowbray: OK -- have a good weekend, Dash.