The Guardian for this meeting was Zen Arado. The comments are by Zen Arado.

Xirana Oximoxi: hello Zen! :-)
Zen Arado: Hi Xirana:)
Xirana Oximoxi: how are you?
Zen Arado: fine thanks
Zen Arado: you?
Xirana Oximoxi: I'm fine too:) ...more busy now that I have begun mysemester again...it will be the last..if I pass all :-)
Xirana Oximoxi: how is your writing course going?
Zen Arado: still studying Catan authirs?
Zen Arado: Catalan
Xirana Oximoxi: yes :-)
Zen Arado: is it a Master's dissertation?
Zen Arado: or Ph D?
Xirana Oximoxi: well... I don't know the relation with other titles in other countries...
Xirana Oximoxi: so, not sure
Zen Arado: ok
Zen Arado: we worry too much abut such things
Zen Arado: status symbols :)
Xirana Oximoxi: yes :-)
Zen Arado: I have my first assignment for my course started
Xirana Oximoxi: it is the less important title...the first one you get when studying in our Univesity
Zen Arado: ok
Xirana Oximoxi: afte it...if you want more high must work in a more important project
Zen Arado: usually you have to be more independent in higher studies
Zen Arado: in MA philosophy we had to pick topic, write proposal, then research it and write dissertation
Zen Arado: took 3 years
Xirana Oximoxi: yes, here is similar
Xirana Oximoxi: have you started writing in a creative way? have you discovered a lot of tricks to do it?
Zen Arado: hmmm
Xirana Oximoxi: oh! region restart
Zen Arado: my writing sounds unimaginative
Xirana Oximoxi: we must go to kira
Zen Arado: oh ok better go to Kira
Xirana Oximoxi: yes, we go:)

Region restart - we moved to Kira. Writing techniques:

Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): well...you may be used to it:))
Zen (zen.arado): last week they just logged us off
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): oh!
Zen (zen.arado): no warning
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): they are losing maners:)
Zen (zen.arado): yes :(
Zen (zen.arado): I don't think I can be a creative writer
Zen (zen.arado): they teach many techniques though
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): it may be the programm that was not working well...
Zen (zen.arado): I have started 'morning pages' again
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): that's fine
Zen (zen.arado): I write about 900 words every morning
Zen (zen.arado): about anything
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): ahhh that's quite a lot:)
Zen (zen.arado): I use voice typing
Zen (zen.arado): it's just drivel
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): and you don't copy them from a book, isn't it???...then...you are a creative writer:))
Zen (zen.arado): I talk about the first things that come into my head
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): surrealism proposed to do that
Zen (zen.arado): it is supposed to be good for artists too
Zen (zen.arado): yes!
Zen (zen.arado): it bypasses the critical part of the brain
Zen (zen.arado): so ideas can come up
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes...and maybe it shows things you are not aware of
Zen (zen.arado): associations
Zen (zen.arado): I write about my childhood a lot
Zen (zen.arado): I also do freewriting
Zen (zen.arado): which is a bit more focused
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): interesting:)...do you have nice souvenirs?
Zen (zen.arado): you start with a word or phrase
Zen (zen.arado): good and bad memories
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes....that's normal...me too:)
Zen (zen.arado): you can start with a diagram
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): do you share what you do with other people following the course?
Zen (zen.arado): and then write about something that is interesting in the diagram
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): or with the 'teacher?
Zen (zen.arado): not yet but we will
Zen (zen.arado): there is an online forum
Zen (zen.arado): and there are day schools in RL
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): which kind of diagram?
Zen (zen.arado): they call them 'clusters'
Zen (zen.arado): like mind maps
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): ahh yes...I understand
Zen (zen.arado): just a word in a circle
Zen (zen.arado): then add another word or phrase
Zen (zen.arado): it brings up associations
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes...good strategy
Zen (zen.arado): my course officially started last Saturday
Zen (zen.arado): but I like to stay ahead
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): :-)
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): I am sure you are never 'bored':)...is it still the topic for this week?

Boredom:

Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): boredom
Zen (zen.arado): I don't know
Zen (zen.arado): oh?
Zen (zen.arado): a boring topic :)
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): it was last week :))
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes:))
Zen (zen.arado): if I feel bored
Zen (zen.arado): I examine the feeling
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): but not boring in itself:))...
Zen (zen.arado): where is the boredom?
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): asking yourself why?
Zen (zen.arado): how exactly does it feel?
Zen (zen.arado): because it is imaginary I ythink
Zen (zen.arado): I do that with lots of feelings
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): well...I have no idea....the topic about it usually says that you feel you don't have any ilusion, any desire to do thinghs, ...you sit in a sofa and just stay there inable to find something interesting to do
Zen (zen.arado): if you sit in a Zen retreat for 6 days looking at the wall...
Zen (zen.arado): but it isn't boring I find
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes...not necessarily boring:)
Zen (zen.arado): it's one of those things...we think we know what it is
Zen (zen.arado): but if you look at it it disappears
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): it may be different for each person too
Zen (zen.arado): true
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): what can make you feel bored, can be interesting for me....and the opposite
Zen (zen.arado): it seems to be when you are doing something and would rather do somewthing else
Zen (zen.arado): Hi Eliza :)
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): hi Eliza!
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): Hello :D

Eliza's Gangham style dress:

Zen (zen.arado): nice flouncy dress :)
Second Life: leaping Panther (darren.islar) is offline.
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes...very nice llok:)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me smiles.. yes it is... a delight to wear
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): look
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): thank you
Zen (zen.arado): I went to Japan Kira meeting
Zen (zen.arado): but translator doesn't work well enough
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): Eliza!! what are you doing??? lol
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me laughs...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): someone needs to step into the pink poseball
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): hahaha
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): hahaha
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): this is so bizarre
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): don't think this is what's supposed to happen
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): laughing so hard
Zen (zen.arado): ha ha
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): I guess the position must be adjusted too:)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): yes I guess so
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): I am riding you
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me giggles
Zen (zen.arado): blushes
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): it is supposed to be "gangham style" dance
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): but it's you who are wearing the riding dress:)
Zen (zen.arado): ah
Zen (zen.arado): cowboy dance
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): well Zen that was quite a show for you eh
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): hehe

Pragmatism:

Eliza (eliza.madrigal): so ahem... Kira Japan?
Zen (zen.arado): it's a funny day
Zen (zen.arado): Alf mentioned it
Zen (zen.arado): I like William James
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me nods
Zen (zen.arado): and his pragmatism
Zen (zen.arado): I used pragmatism in philosophy
Zen (zen.arado): dissertation
Zen (zen.arado): pity it wasn't in English
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): pragsmagic
Zen (zen.arado): us English speakers are spoiled
Zen (zen.arado): http://plato.stanford.edu/entries/pragmatism/
Zen (zen.arado): but we would have to read up on it to be able to discuss it
Zen (zen.arado): and philosophy articles are LONG
Zen (zen.arado): 'James's dilemma is a familiar one: it is a form of the question of how we can reconcile the claims of science, on the one hand, with those of religion and morality on the other. James introduces it by observing that the history of philosophy is to a great extent that of a certain clash of human temperaments, between the ˜tough minded' and the ˜tender minded. The tough minded have an empiricist commitment to experience and going by ˜the facts, while the tender-minded have more of a taste for a priori principles which appeal to the mind. The tender minded tend to be idealistic, optimistic and religious, while the tough minded are normally materialist, pessimistic and irreligious. The tender-minded are ˜free-willist' and dogmatic; the tough minded are ˜fatalistic and sceptical.'

Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): yes...very long for me...and plus the subject is not easy too
Zen (zen.arado): reminds me of Alf that paragraph :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I've read a bit of James... but it would be a distraction from current readings... but hm.. interesting phrase 'tender minded'... in our time that might not be heard as a compliment
Zen (zen.arado): or maybe it would
Zen (zen.arado): tough minded materialism isn't so fashionable any more

Politics bit:

Eliza (eliza.madrigal): let's hold off on that measure until after the US election ...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): one canditate seems the definition of materialism
Zen (zen.arado): but...'it's the economy stupid'...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): so many economies aren't there...
Zen (zen.arado): most voters interested in their econmic well being above all?
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): seems that way.. and very short sighted
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): short memory
Zen (zen.arado): was it George Bush 1 said that?
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): I must go now....have a nice time Eliza and Zen!! See you soon! :-)
Zen (zen.arado): oh ok Xirana byee
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): aw
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): bye bye:)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): OK Xiri... did I scare you with politics...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): will stop :D
Zen (zen.arado): or pragmatism :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): not scare but bore
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): :)
Zen (zen.arado): :)
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): nooo.... the conversation is very interesting...I also find so good to hear the comments of people living in the places at the palce of hearing only the news...but rl calls:))
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): (((xiri))) okay... have a lovely day
Zen (zen.arado): kk have a good evening
Xirana (xirana.oximoxi): :)) you both too! (((hugs)))
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): Zen it was said against Bush 1
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): Cinton, but not written by hime
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): *him
Zen (zen.arado): ah ok
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): they store these 'zingers'
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): then wait for openings in debates
Zen (zen.arado): Romney and Obama having one soon?
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): tonight
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Zen (zen.arado): too late for me
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I may go to the university and watch with my daughter who is volunteering at an office
Zen (zen.arado): volunteering for what?

Eliza (eliza.madrigal): or I may TiVo and go to bed early, hah
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): obama campaign
Zen (zen.arado): I see
Zen (zen.arado): seems to be parralel parties in N.Ireland
Zen (zen.arado): DUP are like Republicans
Zen (zen.arado): Alliance party like Democrats
Zen (zen.arado): parallel?
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me nods
Zen (zen.arado): seems a type of people vote a certain way
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): the sad thing is the polarization, which doesn't reflect diversity of thought
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Zen (zen.arado): seems more cultural than rational thought
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): yes
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): game mentality
Zen (zen.arado): maybe we need the polarity
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I read a great Vanity Fair article on Obama recently... his way of playing basketball... If you go easy on him you are not invited back
Zen (zen.arado): just right :)
Zen (zen.arado): I would vote ODemocrat
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): maybe the polarity serves to stir things up, force clarity, but when it comes to making choices the two that appear are not so different
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): the machinery is too similar
Zen (zen.arado): always disliked Republicans
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): really? I was a young Republican... when I first registered to vote
Zen (zen.arado): oh
Zen (zen.arado): how could you :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): seems strange now , I know
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I still like to read some moderate republicans
Zen (zen.arado): seems candidates have to be in a certain mod
Zen (zen.arado): married with two children
Zen (zen.arado): 40's or 50's
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): the political uniform
Zen (zen.arado): mold
Zen (zen.arado): (mould in UK)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): :)
Zen (zen.arado): it's all like a big machine
Zen (zen.arado): and finances is so important too
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): all important really
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I heard that unless Putin keeps oil prices very high in Russia, he will not be able to accomplish what he's promised there
Zen (zen.arado): makes you wonder if there is actually any control
Zen (zen.arado): anywhere
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): we rarely talk about the International complexities unless there is an attack, in the mainstream US... but I think Obama is savvier there
Zen (zen.arado): politicians can only do what they are allowwed to do
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I was asked an interesting question about which 'archetypes' are present in these choices
Zen (zen.arado): they are just pawns in a way
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): 'representatives' of ___?
Zen (zen.arado): different times throw up different types
Zen (zen.arado): like they needed Churchill during world was 2
Zen (zen.arado): but dumped him as soon as war was over
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me nods...
Zen (zen.arado): a black man had no chance until recently
Zen (zen.arado): probably no woman would be elected in US
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): coincidentally as you say that, the article also mentioned that Churchill's bust was replaced, by Obama, with Martin Luther King Jr
Zen (zen.arado): oh?
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): yes quite controversial
Zen (zen.arado): I don't like to see wives behind campaigners
Zen (zen.arado): having to make emotional speeches
Zen (zen.arado): playing a wifely role
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): it can be strange... like Romney's wife telling women "he will take care of you"
Zen (zen.arado): 'stand by my man'
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): but then again, I think Michele is fantastic, hm... so...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): maybe I'm just riddled with biases
Zen (zen.arado): if you analyse their speeches though
Zen (zen.arado): mostly emotional
Zen (zen.arado): but they are intelligent women
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I think the two choices are patriarchal model vs something less definable with more grey area
Zen (zen.arado): not allowed to show it
Zen (zen.arado): Hilary does well
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): now...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): but early on, eek...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I had issues with Hillary early on, because I felt marginalized when I chose to raise the kids full time for a while
Zen (zen.arado): they have to play roles don't they?
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): and she made some comments that stung
Zen (zen.arado): one wrong word can wreck them too
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): yes
Zen (zen.arado): ah ok
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I was defensive about it, is what it comes down to... doing my best and the 'mommy wars' were being propogated
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): another simplistic view

My childhood:

Zen (zen.arado): I was writing about my childhood and realized that none of the women had jobs in the 50's
Zen (zen.arado): they stayed at home and raised the kids
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): amazing isn't it... it feels change is slow but when you look at the differences in society over just one lifetime...
Zen (zen.arado): all the delivery men
Zen (zen.arado): breadservers, milkmen,
Zen (zen.arado): groceries
Zen (zen.arado): so much more community
Zen (zen.arado): knew everyone in the street
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): sounds like a nice way to grow up Zen, guess there are reasons for nostalgia
Zen (zen.arado): it was so primitive
Zen (zen.arado): queueing up for groceries
Zen (zen.arado): no supermarkets
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): interesting
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): where were you queuing?
Zen (zen.arado): things sliced up and weighed
Zen (zen.arado): everywhere
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): ah... diversity
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): little stores
Zen (zen.arado): butchers, grocers, home bakery
Zen (zen.arado): yes
Zen (zen.arado): cheese cut with a wire cutter
Zen (zen.arado): sawdust on the floor of butchers
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me smiles... evocative, Zen
Zen (zen.arado): no refrigerators
Zen (zen.arado): lugging heavy bags of shopping
Zen (zen.arado): no cars
Zen (zen.arado): no crouching over computer screens :)
Zen (zen.arado): no TV
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): quite different from my own world, except for the schools I attended
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): when very young...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): school was homey-er than home
Zen (zen.arado): we never had a TV until I was about 13
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): we had 3 channels :) and you had to get up to change them!
Zen (zen.arado): we had two until the late 50's
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): what were your parents like Zen?
Zen (zen.arado): didn't start until 5pm
Zen (zen.arado): normal working class folks
Zen (zen.arado): father worked in shipyard
Zen (zen.arado): he worked 6 days a week often but we were still poor
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): did you feel that, as a kid?
Zen (zen.arado): not really
Zen (zen.arado): rich in other ways I guess
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): it is sort of relative to environment too... what others around are doing...
Zen (zen.arado): we socialized so much with other kids
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): /me nods
Zen (zen.arado): played games in the street
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): yeah.. free play
Zen (zen.arado): parents threw us out in the morning
Zen (zen.arado): amazing the distances away from home we travelled
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I think about that too... my bike took me so far
Zen (zen.arado): yeh me too
Zen (zen.arado): on main roads
Zen (zen.arado): but traffic so light
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): my daughter saw a kid on the handlebars of another kids bicycle the other day and protested that she would never do that.... startled me to hear that
Zen (zen.arado): so many dangerous things we did
Zen (zen.arado): miracle we survived ;)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): with our traffic and the world she's grown up in I guess it makes sense but was a bit sad... it was so fun
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Zen (zen.arado): so many restrictions now
Zen (zen.arado): and worries about pedophiles
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): so for the class are you writing your life's story?
Zen (zen.arado): I had a woman friend from England ..we used to take the kids to a playground and sit and read
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): oh... nice :D
Zen (zen.arado): but I couldn't go and sit there on my own
Zen (zen.arado): they would be suspicious
Zen (zen.arado): no I'm just gathering material
Zen (zen.arado): back to morning pages
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): :)
Zen (zen.arado): I can use it and expand on it
Zen (zen.arado): hopefully
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): will you be blogging?
Zen (zen.arado): maybe later
Zen (zen.arado): funny...you daren't use your own material on a blog until after an assignment has been marked
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): oh?
Zen (zen.arado): or plagiarism software might pick it up
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): ooooh! I get it...lol
Zen (zen.arado): I would have to prove I am Zen Arado :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): stealing from yourself... very sci fi
Zen (zen.arado): migh try writing about SL adventures
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): a little late in life to be kicked out of school
Zen (zen.arado): they are very strict about plagiarism these days
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): that's a good idea... I think about doing that too.... Eden weaved RL/SL in her poetry
Second Life: vegetal Wrigglesworth is offline.
Zen (zen.arado): so easy to steal stuff from the web
Zen (zen.arado): good idea
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): it seems more dangerous to hold back... like, if I feel to write something and I don't, then nothing more comes until I do... or it comes slowly...
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): but not holding back isn't necessarily writing on a blog
Zen (zen.arado): my writing is so factual and pedantic
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): if you write that way about things that happen in SL it will sound fantastical :D
Zen (zen.arado): they tell you weave sensory impressions into writing
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): especially if you leave out SL
Zen (zen.arado): hmmm
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): well... you did that earlier... sawdust on butcher's floor....
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): very tangible
Zen (zen.arado): just say it is in London England
Zen (zen.arado): :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): like, if you described what I am wearing as though I walked into a London cafe that would be very odd
Zen (zen.arado): and looking for nice metaphors
Zen (zen.arado): they can be strange in London :)
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): lol
Zen (zen.arado): I remember three guys fron Chile I was training being astounded at punk dress of girls in Belfast
Zen (zen.arado): in the 80's
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): "sun is in the sky oh why oh why would I wanna be anywhere else..."
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): ahhh
Zen (zen.arado): spiky hair and leather and studs
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): unpretty :)
Zen (zen.arado): yeh
Zen (zen.arado): but,,
Zen (zen.arado): hmm
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): :) a different kind of interesting maybe
Zen (zen.arado): depends on the person I guess
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): I'd better go... sure you too... hah... fun talk running quite the range
Zen (zen.arado): kk
Zen (zen.arado): yes...
Zen (zen.arado): thanks for coming
Zen (zen.arado): bye for now
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): have a really fun day Zen, thank you
Eliza (eliza.madrigal): bfn
Zen (zen.arado): you too :)