2011.05.05 01:00 - Silence and Noise

The Guardian for this meeting was Zen Arado. The comments are by Zen Arado. Present were Wester Kiranov and myself.

Zen Arado: Hi Wester :)
Wester Kiranov: hi zen
Zen Arado: how are you?
Wester Kiranov: fine. trying to come to some more PaB sessions again, not just my own
Wester Kiranov: how are you?
Zen Arado: not bad
Zen Arado: a bit tired
Zen Arado: I was at a zen sesshin last week and haven't recovered yet I think
Zen Arado: I don't get much sleep at those
Wester Kiranov: ah. I was wondering what exactly you needed to recover from.
--BELL--
Zen Arado: there's something in Zen where they seem to like to deprive practitioners of sleep
Wester Kiranov: probably to "break" the convential mind? like they do with the koans? I'm not that attracted to Zen myself, though I have to admit there is a kind of beauty in the severeness
Zen Arado: yeh
Zen Arado: there is a kind of maco quality in Zen
Zen Arado: macho
Wester Kiranov: I suppose you could call it that. I was actually thinking of the kind of beauty you can find in mathematics. very striking, but sort of cold
Zen Arado: it is designed to take you out of your comfort zone , my teacher told me
Zen Arado: but for me , being disabled, it is very difficult
Zen Arado: the disabled facilities are very bad
Wester Kiranov: comfort zones can differ a lot between people.
Zen Arado: yeh
Wester Kiranov: how are you disabled, if I may ask? just curious
Zen Arado: I have muscular dystrophy
Zen Arado: a muscle wating disease
Zen Arado: so I am now in a wheelchair
Zen Arado: wasting *
Zen Arado: the bed was too low and I struggel to do transfers
Zen Arado: and the toilet is really difficult too
Wester Kiranov: that does seem diffficult
Zen Arado: I don't really have much troble sitting for long perieds though
Wester Kiranov: that's good then
Zen Arado: do you have a Buddhist practice Wester?
Wester Kiranov: not a regular one
Wester Kiranov: I have found a meditation practice that is short enough to fit well into my schedule
Wester Kiranov: I did go to a Vipassana meditation session last week but that was mainly to check out if I had the bows right, so I could use them in my short practice
Zen Arado: I was just reading an article about fitting meditation into your life more easily
Zen Arado: http://www.tricycle.com/feature/meditators-toolbox
Zen Arado: it's easy for me since I am retired
--BELL--
Zen Arado: don't know how I would manage if I were still working full time
Zen Arado: even so I have to discipline myself
Zen Arado: I have so many things I want to do
Zen Arado: I find I can lose my evening meditation by spending too much time in SL
Zen Arado: I went to Eliza's session yesterday at 3.30 and then a music session until 6 pm
Wester Kiranov: Yeah, I know that feeling. SL, and the rest of the internet...
Zen Arado: so many interesting discussions...
Wester Kiranov: I work part-time and I have two young children, so my schedule is quite busy
Zen Arado: I just can't go to all of them
Zen Arado: yes
Zen Arado: children need a lot of time for sure
Wester Kiranov: Pema told me he likes to get more sleeping time than he actually needs, and if he wakes up he uses that time for practice.
Wester Kiranov: I think that shows a motivated mindset, and creativity
Zen Arado: yes
Zen Arado: I find sleep difficult
Zen Arado: I don't feel sleepy when I go to bed
Zen Arado: then I am sleepy through the day
Zen Arado: some people can go to bed and sleep straightaway
Zen Arado: wish I could do that
Wester Kiranov: maybe your biological clock is out of synch?
Zen Arado: I get up at 7.30am normally
Wester Kiranov: you could try getting a lot of light right when you wake up, and try not to have to much light on in the evening
Zen Arado: when I go to sesshins I have to get up at 5.20 am
Wester Kiranov: I feel that does make a difference in getting to sleep
Zen Arado: yeh maybe
Zen Arado: they say if you meditate all day you don't need so much sleep
Wester Kiranov: at the PaB retreat I actually found I needed quite a lot of sleep
Zen Arado: I need more physical exercise
Zen Arado: pab retreats are lots of talking though?
Wester Kiranov: talking interspersed with meditation. this one anyway
Zen Arado: I find it hard to get anyone to do more than 10 minutes of meditation at the SL pab retreats
Zen Arado: I get tired of all the talking
Wester Kiranov: short talking periods, short meditation periods
--BELL--
Zen Arado: to me a retreat should get you away from talking
Zen Arado: talking is just like what we always do
Zen Arado: a retreat should be intense and kind of drive yyou into yourself
Zen Arado: hard to explain
Wester Kiranov: I think you can use talking that way as well
Zen Arado: maybe up to a point
Zen Arado: but it kind of keeps you reasoning and thinking
Zen Arado: rather than just being iwth the experience of the moment
Zen Arado: something about silence....
Zen Arado: can't put it in words
Zen Arado: I feel drawn to that silence
Zen Arado: it isn't really silent either
Zen Arado: we sit and lsiten to birdsong and other noises
Wester Kiranov: I agree there is a very important part of reality that cannot be put into words.
Zen Arado: people are afraid of silence I think
Zen Arado: it has to be filled ...:)
Zen Arado: noise is a kind of reassurance
Wester Kiranov: (that was about one minute of silence)
Zen Arado: :)
Zen Arado: reality is a noisy place
Zen Arado: even sitting here now there are all sorts of noises going on
Wester Kiranov: so, then we have to find silence in a noisy place
Zen Arado: yeh...just not adding to the noise
Zen Arado: I have builders just starting owrk outside
Zen Arado: work*
Zen Arado: I remember using a noise level meter one time for a course about environmental pollution
Zen Arado: was amazed at the high noise level just in my back garden
Wester Kiranov: RL visitors now. Sorry, have to go
Zen Arado: traffic, dogs barking, kids shouting...
Wester Kiranov: namaste
Zen Arado: ok nice chatting to you
Zen Arado: bye Observerm