2011.05.13 01:00 - Purpose

Wol Euler was guardian for this session.

Wol Euler: hello sam!
Wol Euler: nice avatar
oO0Oo Resident: hiya Wol :)
oO0Oo Resident: like your outfit
Wol Euler: thank you ;) brand new, I just discovered this store
Wol Euler: it comes in opaque and sheer versions :)
Wol Euler: I thought the opaque more appropriate to the dignity of PaB
Wol Euler: hello rhi
oO0Oo Resident: hiya Rhi .. gtsy
Rhiannon Dragoone: hi Wol; hi Samud
Wol Euler: how is everyone today?
Rhiannon Dragoone: I'm good, how about you, Wol? Samud?
oO0Oo Resident: good :)
Wol Euler: I'm well, hoping for a day off today (in exchange for a half Sunday)
Rhiannon Dragoone: What do you think are your odds of getting it?
Wol Euler: better than even!
Rhiannon Dragoone: hi Egg!
Wol Euler: because I wouldn't be at work before noon and the boss will be leaving at 2pm
Wol Euler: hello egg
eggsalad Ormstein: hi rhia, hi wol
oO0Oo Resident: hi eggsalad
eggsalad Ormstein: hi sam
Wol Euler: if the mountain won't come to Mohammad ...
Wol Euler: how are you, egg?
eggsalad Ormstein: well, wol. and you?
Wol Euler: quite well thanks
eggsalad Ormstein: wos macht du?
Wol Euler: we haven't seen either of you here for a while
eggsalad Ormstein: i keep losing track of the time :(
Wol Euler: aaah
Rhiannon Dragoone: Yeah, and I keep getting busy in RL
Wol Euler: things on your mind?
eggsalad Ormstein: yes, big things
Wol Euler: care to talk about it?
Rhiannon Dragoone: What sort of things, egg?
eggsalad Ormstein: major life issues, like purpose
Wol Euler listens.
eggsalad Ormstein: I can't find one
eggsalad Ormstein: not much else to say about it
Wol Euler nods.
Wol Euler: how long have you felt this ... lack of purpose?
eggsalad Ormstein: sorry it's not a very interesting topic
Wol Euler: oh but it is.
eggsalad Ormstein: oh, it comes and goes
Wol Euler: (next topic: why do people apologise for talking about their own fears and feelings?)
eggsalad Ormstein: well, what I meant was, I don't have much to say, because the question is unresolved
Wol Euler: do you have a feeling of what kind of purpose it should be?
eggsalad Ormstein: nope, I'm completely lost

--BELL--

Rhiannon Dragoone: Samud, I think I've seen you buzzing around my pond
Wol Euler: hello obs
Rhiannon Dragoone: hi obs!
oO0Oo Resident: in the absolute.. mmm ..expect so Rhi
oO0Oo Resident: hi Observerm :)
Rhiannon Dragoone: Where is he? I saw him on my radar, but not visually
Wol Euler muses. There are all kinds of purposes, I guess. Devoting one's life to saving abandoned pets, for example
Wol Euler: due west of us, he hides in the bushes :)
Rhiannon Dragoone: oh, way over there
Rhiannon Dragoone: yeah, he is kind of hiding
eggsalad Ormstein: yes, but I can't get any motivation to do anything such as that
Wol Euler: well that makes it difficult, I guess, it would have to be something that grabs you
eggsalad Ormstein: right, and nothing appeals to me
Wol Euler: something that is significant to you (if nobody else)
Wol Euler: is this a new feeling? I don't recall you speaking about it before
eggsalad Ormstein: it's been worse lately, but it's always there
Wol Euler nods.
Wol Euler: perhaps the strength of that feeling at this particular moment is "just" a biorhythm effect?
eggsalad Ormstein: idk why it comes and goes, never gave that much thought
Wol Euler: (I'm not saying you don't need a purpose, but that your strength of feeling about it might be biorhythm based)
Rhiannon Dragoone: I need to log
Rhiannon Dragoone: Hope you work it out, egg
Wol Euler: bye rhi, take care
eggsalad Ormstein: bye rhia and thanks
Rhiannon Dragoone: You too, Wol
Bertram Jacobus: hey friends n folks ! :-)
Rhiannon Dragoone: Hi and bye Bertam
eggsalad Ormstein: hi bert.
Rhiannon Dragoone: bye Samud
oO0Oo Resident: hi Bertram .. gtsy
oO0Oo Resident: bye Rhi
Bertram Jacobus: ty - same same :-)
Wol Euler: I notice in myself the effect of biorhythms on my emotional state: I can go from despair and panic to calm without any particular change in external circumstances, over a quite long timescale
Wol Euler: hello bert, nice to see you again
Bertram Jacobus: again : tyty :-)
Bertram Jacobus: to drop emotions is not so easy ...
Wol Euler: indeed
oO0Oo Resident nods
eggsalad Ormstein: I don't even remember how they work
Bertram Jacobus: you mean, you don´t experience / have some egg ?
oO0Oo Resident: you sound depressed egg
eggsalad Ormstein: no, I remember studying biorhythms as a kid, but I've forgotten it all
eggsalad Ormstein: well, yes, sam
Bertram Jacobus: ah ! :-)
Wol Euler gives your hand a squeeze
Bertram Jacobus: hmmm ...
oO0Oo Resident: I'm sorry for any discomfort you are going through egg.. glad you made it here too.. to be here
Wol Euler: agreed
Bertram Jacobus: me too
Wol Euler: I find sitting alone much worse than sitting with friends, even if I don't say much then

--BELL--

Wol Euler: when alone in such a state, my thoughts go into a "death spiral"
Bertram Jacobus: hmmm - i was here yesterday or the day before yesterday and i found it nice as well - but i have friends at other places - so i never feel "totally alone" ...
Bertram Jacobus: oops - sry
eggsalad Ormstein: well, I'm so accustomed to it, it's really no longer a major issue
Wol Euler: no reason not to address it :)
Bertram Jacobus: "death spiral" ? what does that mean pls wol ? if i may ask ... (?) -
eggsalad Ormstein: but every time I revisit it, I get the same (non) answer
Wol Euler: that my thoughts circle around the same issue, getting tighter and faster on my inadequacy or the failure of whatever I'm obsessing about
Wol Euler: until there is no room for any other idea, nor for a solution or a way out
Bertram Jacobus: oh. i see. sry to read that, all that ...
Bertram Jacobus: so much suffering in the universe ! ...
Wol Euler: which is one of the ways that depression sustains itself: it prevents you from seeing anything but the problem
Wol Euler: talking helps, in my experience
Wol Euler: if you have somebody you can trust to listen, and to respond without bias or judgement
Bertram Jacobus: ok ...
Wol Euler: it helps enormously just to have them say that htere is a second side to it
oO0Oo Resident:

when shadows are gathering when memory dementors are raging I drop there, at the fountain there is always someone there to greet me always someone to make me laugh always some giggling or smiling or listening weaving stories in poetic voices someone showing up as a whirling dervish or making the snow fall on us with a kind heart and generous advice

from The PaB Neighborhood Cafe by Eden Haiku [fair use]

edenhaiku©Totempoetry2011

Wol Euler smiles.
Wol Euler: thanks, sam
Wol Euler: this is why therapy works: not because the therapist is a genius, but just because they are not you :)
Wol Euler: your problem doesn'T have the same emotional weight fo them as it does for you
Bertram Jacobus: ah. yes. no. :-)
eggsalad Ormstein: mine doesn't really carry emotional weight
Wol Euler raises an eyebrow.
eggsalad Ormstein: there are only two possible solutions
Wol Euler listens.
eggsalad Ormstein: find a cause, or cease living
Wol Euler: O.O
eggsalad Ormstein: so I just put off the decision indefinitely
Wol Euler: I find the second option rather drastic ...
oO0Oo Resident: i find that the 'baby giggle' is a third alternative for me.. when i feel this way
eggsalad Ormstein: oh, I didn't mean suicide, that's unacceptable
Wol Euler: good
eggsalad Ormstein: you can exist without living
Wol Euler: ah, yes, I follow you now
Wol Euler: become a robot, you mean
eggsalad Ormstein: right
Wol Euler: on the whole I'd still think the first option better ... but that's just my opinion
Wol Euler: what have you tried as possible purposes?
eggsalad Ormstein: helping people, making them smile
Bertram Jacobus: nice
Wol Euler: but that wasn't enough?
eggsalad Ormstein: it wasn't very rewarding
Wol Euler: what does "rewarding" mean?
Bertram Jacobus: but we are taught not to make a difference between us and others : so let´s make ourselves smile as well (!) ... ;-)
Wol Euler: were you expecting parades with elephants, and only got a few butterflies?
oO0Oo Resident: :)
Wol Euler: (I don't know why that image came up, I hate parades, think them a total waste of time)
Bertram Jacobus: ··..•♥•··..☺ SaTiA ☺ ..··•♥•..··
Bertram Jacobus: says she likes butterflies more then elephants ;o)
Wol Euler: well yes :)
Bertram Jacobus: but the picture you gave were very nice she says also :-)
eggsalad Ormstein: well, it felt shallow and selfish, instead of good
Wol Euler nods thoughtfully
oO0Oo Resident waves to Satia :)
eggsalad Ormstein: because I was only doing it to make ME feel better
Wol Euler: aaaaah
Bertram Jacobus: ··..•♥•··..☺ SaTiA ☺ ..··•♥•..··
Bertram Jacobus: rewinks :-)
Wol Euler: yeah, most sages agree that that doesn't work :)
Bertram Jacobus: rewaves sry - that before was germanglish :o)
Wol Euler: that satisfaction and fulfilment are usually found as byproducts of something entirely different

--BELL--

oO0Oo Resident: mangle the germanglish
Bertram Jacobus: but helping always is better then hurting (!) -
Bertram Jacobus: oops - sry - again ! :o)
oO0Oo Resident: saw this quote today
oO0Oo Resident: “In rivers, the water that you touch is the last of what has passed and the first of that which comes; so with present time.” ~Leonardo da Vinci
Wol Euler nods.
Wol Euler: we talk about that often here, Egg, whether actions can ever be truly altruistic
Wol Euler: or whether our joy or pride or happiness in doing them perhaps lessens their value
Bertram Jacobus: i repeat : helping always is better then hurting
Wol Euler: agreed!
eggsalad Ormstein: what about doing neither?
Bertram Jacobus: not possible
Wol Euler: I infer that you are trying that, and that it isn't working -- since you still hurt?
eggsalad Ormstein: mostly that was over yesterday
eggsalad Ormstein: I talk to some sad people on SL, and it seems to cheer them up
Wol Euler smiles.
eggsalad Ormstein: some people find me pleasant to chat with
Wol Euler: that's a good and worthy thing, I would say
eggsalad Ormstein: so it fixes the problem for a while
Wol Euler: and consider this: if they experience a cheering-up, a bettering -- then what does your motivation matter?
eggsalad Ormstein: right, but SL is on my terms
Wol Euler: you did help, focus on that
Wol Euler: and you want to be able to extend that outside of SL?
eggsalad Ormstein: no, I can be my selfish self in SL
Wol Euler frowns. I'm confused, can you expand on that a little?
eggsalad Ormstein: if I don;t want to help, I can just logoff
Wol Euler: ah, I see
Wol Euler: logging out of RL is harder
Wol Euler: but there are ways to do that too: TV, alcohol, sex-tourism ...
eggsalad Ormstein: and I don't do any of those :)
Bertram Jacobus: but with all that you´re still in life
Wol Euler grins.
eggsalad Ormstein: have you heard of isolation chambers?
Wol Euler: mmhmm
oO0Oo Resident nods
eggsalad Ormstein: with the salty water that you float in?
oO0Oo Resident: sensory deprevation tanks?
eggsalad Ormstein: yes, that's the word! thanks, it wouldn't come to me
eggsalad Ormstein: er, phrase
Wol Euler: sounds like a mini-hell to me frankly, but that's my problem
Wol Euler: I have trouble enough going into some deep subway stations :)
eggsalad Ormstein: and to me, it sounds like a fantastic escape
Wol Euler: ha :)
Wol Euler: have you tried it?
Wol Euler: perhaps you should.
eggsalad Ormstein: yes, I wanted to look into building one
oO0Oo Resident: you may be able to buy a KIT
Wol Euler: wouldn't it be better to try one out first? :)
Wol Euler: take a week and go on a retreat to some place with one
eggsalad Ormstein: either way, I couldn't find one until Bert just gave me the right words!!
Wol Euler: true :))

--BELL--

Bertram Jacobus: i like those tanks
Wol Euler: tell us about them?
eggsalad Ormstein: you have one?
Bertram Jacobus: find them enourmous relaxin
Bertram Jacobus: no - i twice was at places where you can be in it
eggsalad Ormstein: I should google to see if there is such a place local to me
Wol Euler: yeah :)
Wol Euler: it would really surprise me if there weren't, Egg.
Wol Euler: so many people pass through Vegas, for so many reasons ...
eggsalad Ormstein: yes, already found one at a yoga place :)
Wol Euler: ha! Book yourself in!
oO0Oo Resident: :)
Wol Euler: and come back and tell us all
eggsalad Ormstein: humph, they are closed
Wol Euler: :(
Bertram Jacobus: sadly it´s not cheap ... mostly ...
Bertram Jacobus: but i agree : you´re in las vegas ? there should be something like that ...
eggsalad Ormstein: striking out thus far
Wol Euler: I'm really surprised
Wol Euler: I'd have expected every major hotel to offer that as part of its "wellness" package
Wol Euler: the things one learns about one's expectations :)
Bertram Jacobus: "floating tank" may be a good search term ...
eggsalad Ormstein: so far, no luck
Bertram Jacobus: hmmm ...
Wol Euler: huh
eggsalad Ormstein: no, all links point to that yoga place, that is now closed :(
oO0Oo Resident: Sadly.. I must fly... but happily, I was with you all. :)
Wol Euler: bye sam, fly well
Wol Euler: take care
eggsalad Ormstein: bye sam
oO0Oo Resident: best wishes.. and may everyone be happy and have the seeds of happiness
Bertram Jacobus: bye sam ...
oO0Oo Resident: when that is possible
oO0Oo Resident: :)
Wol Euler: :)
Bertram Jacobus: it´s a nice wish and thought ...
Bertram Jacobus: okay - so i´ll leave too now ...
Bertram Jacobus: ty for the talk and the community !
eggsalad Ormstein: bye bert, thanks for the help
Wol Euler: bye bert, take care, and hugs to satia
Bertram Jacobus: ty ... :-)
Bertram Jacobus: ··..•♥•··..☺ SaTiA ☺ ..··•♥•..··
Bertram Jacobus: says : hugs back :-)

--BELL--

Wol Euler: :)
eggsalad Ormstein: it's a great outfit, wol
Wol Euler: thank you :) it's new, i just discovered the store
Wol Euler: there's an opaque version too :)
eggsalad Ormstein: sort of see-through, but not
eggsalad Ormstein: do you have a lm for that store?
Wol Euler: sure, just a mo
eggsalad Ormstein: thanks!
Wol Euler: yw
eggsalad Ormstein: if you don't mind, I'll be off now to check it out
eggsalad Ormstein: always good to see you
eggsalad Ormstein: be well
Wol Euler: take care, egg
Wol Euler: I hope you find a purpose, or at least peace of mind without it