2013.07.28 07:00 - Games we Play

The Guardian for this meeting was Bleu Oleander. The comments are by Bleu Oleander.

Eliza Madrigal: 's current display-name is "Eliza".
--BELL--

Bleu Oleander: 's current display-name is "Bleu".
Bleu Oleander: hiya Eliza :)
Eliza Madrigal: Morning Bleu :)
Bleu Oleander: how's all in fla?
Eliza Madrigal: quite hot! Arizona?
Bleu Oleander: ditto :)
Bleu Oleander: although not a bad morning so far
Eliza Madrigal: we were saved by rain for several weeks but it seems that is passing and the brutal heat and humidity setting in
Eliza Madrigal: at least everything is green green green
Bleu Oleander: yes, we had a lot of rain this week too but did increase the humidity quite a bit
Bleu Oleander: hair gone wild lol
Eliza Madrigal: hahah, yes
Eliza Madrigal: What have you been up to?
Bleu Oleander: well lots as usual ha!
Bleu Oleander: had an interesting salon yesterday
Eliza Madrigal leans in
Bleu Oleander: the Phoenix Art museum has a show on games
Bleu Oleander: from pac-man on up to almost present time
Catrinamonblue Resident: 's current display-name is "Catrinamonblue".
Bleu Oleander: very interesting to see the changes
Eliza Madrigal: has the idea of gaming changed?
Bleu Oleander: http://www.phxart.org/exhibitions/videogames
Bleu Oleander: seems games have gotten more life like and more violent
Eliza Madrigal: my son said to me yesterday that he thinks of gaming as a high art form
Bleu Oleander: yes
Bleu Oleander: involves all the arts really
Eliza Madrigal: we wthat's exactly what he said
Bleu Oleander: music design narrative etc
Eliza Madrigal: -we w
DR42 Resident: 's current display-name is "-- Maude --".
Eliza Madrigal: he borrowed a game that was fascinating but a bit disturbing
Bleu Oleander: was pretty cool to compare also to some of their art collection
DR42 Resident: ηαмαѕтє
Bleu Oleander: hiya Maude
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Maude!
Bleu Oleander: hey Cat
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Cat!
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi didn't want to disturb the talk :)
Bleu Oleander: not at all
Eliza Madrigal: most game designers feel that violence is a given if one wants an audience for their game, and that's upsetting
Bleu Oleander: just bits and pieces a visit to an art museum
Bleu Oleander: yes
Bleu Oleander: was fun to play some of them though
Eliza Madrigal: :) old games or new?
Bleu Oleander: both :)
DR42 Resident: Violence or sex
Catrinamonblue Resident: I love the old nes rpg games such as Final Fantasy and Dragon warrior but dislike the new versions of those games
Bleu Oleander: I'm not a gamer really but love to see the designs
Bleu Oleander: was interesting how many people that were there that were "hooked"
Eliza Madrigal: I took to gaming very quickly... the pac man machine at the subshop when I was in jr high, had a little glitch where one could disable the limitation on lives
Bleu Oleander: do you consider SL a game?
Eliza Madrigal: I think it can be
Catrinamonblue Resident: no, it's more of social interaction
Catrinamonblue Resident: :) guess it depends on why your here
Bleu Oleander: there's a choice I think in how one can approach sl
Eliza Madrigal: yes
Eliza Madrigal: but even conversation sometimes has a game quality
Catrinamonblue Resident: yes
Bleu Oleander: can yes
Bleu Oleander: how do you decide if a conversation has a game quality?
Eliza Madrigal: not sure, usually only notice in retrospect
Bleu Oleander: and what do you notice about it?
Eliza Madrigal: sometimes when we have fast paced sessions or get very silly it feels like there are buttons pushed music triggered, certain rythms
Eliza Madrigal: like there is a pattern tapped into
Eliza Madrigal: not exactly gaming, but maybe similar in ways
Bleu Oleander: so more predictable in a way?
Eliza Madrigal: well, like being taken on a ride? yet a ride one engages and may go in directions one didn't know before
--BELL--

Eliza Madrigal: one question may be, what is gaming
Bleu Oleander: would the others in the conversation need to view it that way also in order for it to be game-like? or more like only you are playing the game? that was an interesting theme of the talk yesterday ... solo games vs mmo
Bleu Oleander: yes interesting question
Eliza Madrigal: I don't think so, at least in my case, since as I said it is often in retrospect that I see it
Eliza Madrigal: yet also some willingness to go along was present before, or sense of adventure
Eliza Madrigal: strange to point
Eliza Madrigal sits on hands to listen to others ^^
Eliza Madrigal: pinpoint*
Bleu Oleander: so what is a game?
Eliza Madrigal: and what is a game if one drops the idea of "winning"
Eliza Madrigal: lol sorry
Bleu Oleander: competition is often associated with games
Bleu Oleander: no need to be sorry :)
Eliza Madrigal: some talk about game theory
Catrinamonblue Resident: everything could be a game, life itself, if we choose to look at it that way, though there is no winning or losing per say just existing in the moment
DR42 Resident: https://www.coursera.org/course/onlinegames
Eliza Madrigal: and using games to solve complex problems of our time - global warming, etc
Bleu Oleander: I signed up for that Maude lol
Eliza Madrigal: :) Cat.. so the question of whether friendly or unfriendly game
Eliza Madrigal: <--signed up for the poetry course
DR42 Resident: https://www.coursera.org/course/ggp (General game playing)
Catrinamonblue Resident: nods
Eliza Madrigal: nice, ty
Bleu Oleander: yes looking forward to poetry one
Eliza Madrigal: I like to play games with people who aren't attached to winning/losing, that's fun, but eek to play with someone who stomps away from the table for days
DR42 Resident: https://www.coursera.org/course/livearthistory Live!: A History of Art for Artists, Animators and Gamers
Bleu Oleander: too many courses ... not enough time :(
Eliza Madrigal: that was me at 16... lol no one would want to play monopoly with me
Bleu Oleander: haha
DR42 Resident: There are a few more, too.
Catrinamonblue Resident: I used to be attached to winning, sometimes still am, but try not to worry about it to much :)
Bleu Oleander: I used to be a "killer" back gammon player lol
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
Bleu Oleander: no one would play with me either
Eliza Madrigal giggles
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Eliza Madrigal: fun to play hard with someone who wants to win but maybe it is how long the grudge lasts after that matters
Bleu Oleander: yes I think so
Catrinamonblue Resident: nods
DR42 Resident: Sometimes I like games that require thought, try to understand and analyze the game to develop an optimal play strategy.
Bleu Oleander: play hard then release it
Eliza Madrigal: yes!
DR42 Resident: Is "Freecell" a game?
Bleu Oleander: win or lose it's the play that's fun
Catrinamonblue Resident: I tend to like solitary games myself rather than competitive ones
Bleu Oleander: really?
Eliza Madrigal: I'm not familiar with freecell
Bleu Oleander: why is that Cat?
DR42 Resident: Windows solitaire card game
Catrinamonblue Resident: not sure really just the way I am maybe?
Eliza Madrigal: interesting
Bleu Oleander: it's more social for me
Eliza Madrigal: I like both
Bleu Oleander: :)
Eliza Madrigal: am often playing some game while doing something else
DR42 Resident is playing freecell right now
Eliza Madrigal: ^^
Bleu Oleander: interesting, for the online gaming class they use J. R. R. Tolkien's The Fellowship of the Ring ... have you all read it?
Catrinamonblue Resident: long ago :)
Eliza Madrigal: yes
Bleu Oleander: or played LOTRO
Catrinamonblue Resident: haven't played the online game no
Bleu Oleander: I never did so interested to read it
Bleu Oleander: seems many games have a Tolkien quality about them
Eliza Madrigal: I have to say that the graphics and complexity of games now is compelling, when I see what my son is interested in, but still feels quite limited
--BELL--

Bleu Oleander: was amazing to see all the games side-by-side ... comparing graphics and immersive qualities
Bleu Oleander: the older games looked clunky and not as seductive
Eliza Madrigal: like older SL? :)
Bleu Oleander: yes!
Catrinamonblue Resident: the older games had an easier game play though which made it more fun to follow the story, I have a hard time with controlling the characters and dealing with the game play in the newer games
Catrinamonblue Resident: so I get frustrated and will not play them
Bleu Oleander: seems more challenging
Bleu Oleander: have any of you played WoW?
Eliza Madrigal: The first time I played games was at a friend's house in early 80s.. her dad was in tech and had one of the first Apples... it was an olympics game and the sun came up before we realized we'd been playing like 7 hours in a row
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: oh my!
DR42 Resident remembers Leisure Suit Larry.
Bleu Oleander: lol
Eliza Madrigal thinks of various SLers lost to WoW, lol
Bleu Oleander: hehe yes
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Eliza Madrigal: there is some tension even in gaming between open endedness and tight scrips
Eliza Madrigal: scripts*
Eliza Madrigal: too much open endedness and there is nothing to latch on to, but too much scripting and it is mindless
Zen Arado: 's current display-name is "Zen".
DR42 Resident: ηαмαѕтє
Bleu Oleander: hiya Zen
Catrinamonblue Resident: Hi Zen :)
Zen Arado: Hi all
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Zen :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bleu Oleander: Zenji, sorry to miss your DJ session ... what was the focus this week?
Eliza Madrigal: yes me too
Alysabelle Resident: 's current display-name is " ÎsaЪeĻ".
Zen Arado: ah I don't do themes now
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Isabel :)
Bleu Oleander: ok just free
Zen Arado: just a mix of various genres
Alysabelle Resident: HI eliza:)
Bleu Oleander: hi Isabel
--BELL--

Zen Arado: start with modern usually
Zen Arado: did lots of funk last week
Bleu Oleander: Isabel, have you visited Play as Being before?
Zen Arado: will feature new wave nex week
Alysabelle Resident: Hi bleu:)
Alysabelle Resident: no
Alysabelle Resident: What is play as being
Zen Arado: Hi Isabel
Bleu Oleander: We record these sessions and publish them on our website, http://wiki.playasbeing.org/. May we have your permission to include your SL name and your comments in the published log?
Alysabelle Resident: Yes
Bleu Oleander: ty!
Bleu Oleander: i'll give you a notecard
Eliza Madrigal: we're still trying to figure out the answer to your question
Zen Arado: I have seen you at VAI meetings Isabel?
Bleu Oleander: an evolving project :)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Eliza Madrigal considers comparisons to gaming and group projects
Bleu Oleander: perhaps some blurring of the lines?
Bleu Oleander: fuzzy boundaries?
Eliza Madrigal: perhaps :))
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: we like to talk about the nature of reality using ourselves as labs
Eliza Madrigal: or wolves :)
Bleu Oleander: lol
Alysabelle Resident: lab rats? lol j/k
Bleu Oleander: ha!
Eliza Madrigal smiles... self elected lab rats..hm
Alysabelle Resident: :)
Bleu Oleander: pretty strange labs sometimes :)
Eliza Madrigal: "though he thinks he's in a play he is anyway..."
Zen Arado: busy with two coursers ciurses Bleu
Zen Arado: too busy
Bleu Oleander: yes?
Zen Arado: coursera
Bleu Oleander: me too lol
Zen Arado: curses ? :)
Alysabelle Resident: zen? someone once told me I was' zen'
Bleu Oleander: the music one is interesting
Eliza Madrigal: coursera needs to do a playasbeing course
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :)
Zen Arado: they did Isabel?
Bleu Oleander: start one Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: I'm too overexposed, no one would sign up to hear me chatter :P
Alysabelle Resident: yes he is an artist and i was typing and he said your very zen
Alysabelle Resident: shrugs dont know:)
DR42 Resident: https://www.coursera.org/
Zen Arado: could mean like calm in Znn tradition though
Bleu Oleander: just finished two more books for a coursera course on literature
Zen Arado: or Zen-like
Alysabelle Resident: Yes zen like he said
Eliza Madrigal: that's been a great class Bleu
Bleu Oleander: yes really has
Zen Arado: History of Rock is great
Bleu Oleander: Morrison's Beloved ... wow quite a book
Catrinamonblue Resident: wishes I had the time and energy to start a coursera course sigh...
Eliza Madrigal: even if not reading all the books, though I did make my way through "To the Lighthouse"
Bleu Oleander: did you like it?
Zen Arado: I haven't had time to read textbook though cos I started a week late
Eliza Madrigal: well it is nice that one can just listen to lectures
Eliza Madrigal: loved it, Bleu
Zen Arado: have to do quizzes
Bleu Oleander: I did too
Eliza Madrigal: seeps into everything
Bleu Oleander: yes
Zen Arado: have to write songs for songwriting course
DR42 Resident: Maybe we should compile a list of classes each of us has done?
Bleu Oleander: just finished Coetzee's Disgrace ... OMG
DR42 Resident: Even if we simply audit them.
Bleu Oleander: still thinking about it
Bleu Oleander: yes I'm auditing most of them
Bleu Oleander: but fun to join the online chats
Zen Arado: audit?
Bleu Oleander: especially about the books
Eliza Madrigal: interesting idea Maude... have wondered how it would work to have pab type study groups if we are all about diff things, but I guess that's the situation we've always had, lol
DR42 Resident: Take for no credit, listen to lectures, read, not take the quiz or tests
Bleu Oleander: probably would work best if we all took one of the classes and met as a study group
Zen Arado: oh ..whay do that?
Eliza Madrigal nods
Zen Arado: never even thought of that
Eliza Madrigal: steve jobs audited classes when he dropped out of college
Bleu Oleander: :)
Zen Arado: never even heard that word in that context before
Eliza Madrigal: :) interest of time I guess.. some sense of urgency to get at the game
Zen Arado: would be highly disapproved in Open University where I did courses
Bleu Oleander: feels like playing "catch up"
Zen Arado: they are getting old fashioned I guess
DR42 Resident: Coursera welcomes it.
Zen Arado: felt guilty not reading textbook for History of Rock
Zen Arado: even
DR42 Resident: People who are interested in a topic, but do not care about adding the class to their cv.
Zen Arado: guess I should relax
Bleu Oleander: felt I was missing something by only reading 5 of 10 books for lit class :)
Zen Arado: yeh I am not interested in qualifications
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Zen Arado: but I founnd myself taking quizzes over again to get better mark
Zen Arado: stupid I gues
Eliza Madrigal: :))
Eliza Madrigal: not at all
Eliza Madrigal: testing oneself
Eliza Madrigal: solitary game
Eliza Madrigal: ^.^
Bleu Oleander: :)
Catrinamonblue Resident: :0)
Zen Arado: perfectuonist tendencies
Zen Arado: :)
Eliza Madrigal: am making my way to village - see you soon
Eliza Madrigal: thanks Bleu and everyone!
Bleu Oleander: looks like it's time for Guardian mtg
Catrinamonblue Resident: I'm coming too :)
Bleu Oleander: thanks all
--BELL--

Eliza Madrigal: Isabel you are welcome to come, thanks for visiting
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Bleu Oleander: nice meeting you Isabel
Catrinamonblue Resident: nice to meet you Issabel :)
Alysabelle Resident: Nice to meet you all too:)
Bleu Oleander: bye all
Alysabelle Resident: bye byes
Zen Arado: bye Isabel