2009.11.01 19:00 - Offensiveness

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    The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.


    A conversation with Mary Korpov  and Archmage Atlantis


    stevenaia Michinaga: hello Mary
    Mary Korpov: hi
    Mary Korpov: Big turnout
    stevenaia Michinaga: I expect a wonderful attendance
    stevenaia Michinaga: so I paced up the extrainious cushions
    stevenaia Michinaga: packed
    Mary Korpov: So normally Sunday evenings have low attendance?
    stevenaia Michinaga: it's random, from me to 6 or more sometimes, I figured it will take a bit for the EU crowd to figure out the time change
    stevenaia Michinaga: time
    Mary Korpov: I'm only half here, anyway. The World Series is on TV
    stevenaia Michinaga: who's winning
    Mary Korpov: Yankees, alas
    Mary Korpov: 4-2 in the 5th
    stevenaia Michinaga: I am right between Philly and NYC
    stevenaia Michinaga: I go both ways
    Mary Korpov: I'm in Boston, so there is only one choice
    stevenaia Michinaga: I'll try not to get to distracting tonight :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: just let me know when the pillies even things up
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Mary Korpov: The handsome men in their uniforms are already distracting enough
    stevenaia Michinaga: I leave that to you
    stevenaia Michinaga: I'll
    Mary Korpov: ok
    stevenaia Michinaga: hello Arch, love your entry

    Archmage Atlantis enters on a horse

    Archmage Atlantis: I am what i am
    Mary Korpov: And what would that be?
    stevenaia Michinaga: aren;t we all
    Archmage Atlantis: Old broadway tune
    Mary Korpov: You're an old broadway tune?
    stevenaia Michinaga: thought that was a quote from Popeye the Sailor
    Archmage Atlantis: Ah, stolen by la cage
    Mary Korpov: Yes, Popeye does say that a lot
    Archmage Atlantis: Yes you are correct
    stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps he says "I yam what I yam"
    Mary Korpov: Sounds right
    stevenaia Michinaga: would you like to join us Arch or happy on your horse and lights
    Mary Korpov: Perhaps he'd rather stay on his high horse
    Archmage Atlantis: I am here
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Archmage Atlantis: Mary is correct btw
    stevenaia Michinaga: well I tried to eliminate any pillow talk tonight

    A reference to last sunday's conversation, which actually turns up later in the meeting

    Mary Korpov: Or would it be his hobby horse?
    Archmage Atlantis: I am on a high horse
    Mary Korpov: Now I seem to be looking at a horses ass
    stevenaia Michinaga: looking for a high horse, no offence intended

    Archmage Atlantis: You know I was told by a friend that I offend others
    Mary Korpov: Do you offend them often?
    Archmage Atlantis: It seems so
    Mary Korpov: Perhaps if you bathed more frequently
    stevenaia Michinaga: is that your intention?
    Archmage Atlantis: There is no smell here in SL
    Mary Korpov: I couldn't tell if you offend them in RL or SL
    Mary Korpov: You do seem to like attention
    stevenaia Michinaga: shall we talk about ..offensiveness?
    Mary Korpov: Or perhaps defensiveness, too?
    stevenaia Michinaga: I'd be interested in offensive intentions
    stevenaia Michinaga: and what you ahve to say about them and your friend
    Mary Korpov: That was a good question about wheter or not Arch wanted to offend others. Some people do.
    stevenaia Michinaga: and if a friend told him he was, it would seem his friend was not offended but only wished to express the sence of Arch's result
    stevenaia Michinaga: care to comment Arch?
    Archmage Atlantis: You and mary seem to be carrying on this conversation quite well, I will listen
    Mary Korpov: Well, that seems rather pointless, since you brought the issue up
    Mary Korpov: Why do your friends think you offend people?
    Archmage Atlantis: I do not know
    Mary Korpov: They didn't tell you what it is that you do that is offensive?
    Archmage Atlantis: they say I push too hard
    Mary Korpov: Push what too hard?
    Mary Korpov: Your opinions?
    stevenaia Michinaga: I often find out people are offensive from other people as I do not take offense easily due to the intentions of others
    Archmage Atlantis: Well I allowed opinions am I not?
    Mary Korpov: I'm not taking a position. I was asking what it is that they find offensive and what it is that you push to much on. Don't get defensive.
    Archmage Atlantis: I am not defensive, I rode in on a horse
    Archmage Atlantis: I admire women who are strong
    Mary Korpov: Well, in general, my experience in talking with you Arch is that you are evasive
    Mary Korpov: You rarely answer a direct question
    stevenaia Michinaga: your friend is a woman?
    Archmage Atlantis: e is both
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
    Mary Korpov: How can you be both a man and a woman?
    stevenaia Michinaga: raises hand, I have been both in SL
    Mary Korpov: Well, that is different. You still are whatever you are in RL, regardless of your avatar
    Archmage Atlantis: The male seahorse bears the children
    stevenaia Michinaga: but that;s another topic :)
    Mary Korpov: And that, Arch, was a pointless comment
    stevenaia Michinaga: I guess , to get specific, what did your fiend say to you about your offensive behavior/comment/ or whatever it was?
    Archmage Atlantis: wow i am angry in rl
    Mary Korpov: THat's what you were told?
    Archmage Atlantis: no sister it is what i am
    Archmage Atlantis: at this point
    stevenaia Michinaga: aww, yam what I yam
    Mary Korpov: I think incoherent would be much more descriptive than offensive
    Archmage Atlantis: are you channeling Ayn Rand sister
    Mary Korpov: Arch, why don't you eer answer quesitons directly?
    Mary Korpov: Who is Ayn Rand? And I'm not your sister.
    stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps answering questions will defuse anger
    Mary Korpov: I'm not convinced that Arch just doesn't get a kick out of playing head games with people in SL
    stevenaia Michinaga: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayn_Rand
    Archmage Atlantis: I have answered every question I have been asked
    Mary Korpov: Not in a way that makes any sense at all
    Mary Korpov: If I ask you something like, "what time is it" you will answer with something like "grapefruit"
    stevenaia Michinaga: part of PaB is about what you see, whoever is speaking, and I am just trying to understand, Arch
    Archmage Atlantis: A grapefruit is sometimes sour
    Mary Korpov: I am, too, but I can't make sense of the answers
    Mary Korpov: No shit
    stevenaia Michinaga: metaphors can be elusive to some
    stevenaia Michinaga: to paraphrase Mary
    Mary Korpov: Good metahpors are fine, but these don't make much sense
    Mary Korpov: I can't even tell that they are metaphors. In general, they seem like nonsense

    Fox Monacular joins us for a short time

    stevenaia Michinaga: hello Fox
    stevenaia Michinaga: still wearing your bat wings after the holiday?
    Fox Monacular: :)
    Fox Monacular: hello Steve, Mary, Arch
    Mary Korpov: hi
    Archmage Atlantis: This circle has become small
    stevenaia Michinaga: Head games cannot be played by one person (it takes at least 2)
    Fox Monacular: I can't stay long, boyfriend gives bath to baby:)
    stevenaia Michinaga: the same it true for an offensive comment
    Mary Korpov: Sor of, Steve. But they can be played with one person imposing them with someone who does not want to participate or who is not clear that the game is being played
    Fox Monacular: this is more symmetrical
    Mary Korpov: Head games are not symmetrical
    Mary Korpov: Steve do you really think it takes two people to engage in head games?
    stevenaia Michinaga: at least 2
    Archmage Atlantis: used all my horses up
    Mary Korpov: By that do you mean two or more willing people?
    Mary Korpov: I see head games as a sort of aggression.
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, and to not fight back makes it one hand clapping of sorts
    Mary Korpov: When I become convinced that someone is playing them with me, I promptly quite the game
    Mary Korpov: quit, that is
    Fox Monacular: be back in 5 min
    Mary Korpov: And in general I lose any respect I might have had for the person
    stevenaia Michinaga: right, game over
    stevenaia Michinaga: it makes for a game of one to observe
    stevenaia Michinaga: shadow boxing
    Mary Korpov: I can see that
    Mary Korpov: But I think that a single person can be playing the game with another who is not playing the game
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, which could be very boring or very amusing
    Mary Korpov: or annoying, depending upon your perspective
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, if you hold on to it
    Archmage Atlantis: or offensive now you understand
    Mary Korpov: No, it can be annoying without holding on to it.
    Mary Korpov: No, Arch, Idon't understand your point
    stevenaia Michinaga: we jsut asked what your friend found offensive about your behavior (still waiting for your answer)
    Mary Korpov: Yes, still waiting
    Archmage Atlantis: That I challenge the way he thought
    Mary Korpov: What's wrong with that?
    Archmage Atlantis: I do not know truth
    Mary Korpov: Who does?
    Archmage Atlantis: I am only human
    Mary Korpov: Therefore, you should not speak?
    stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps you both can be right.. or wrong
    Archmage Atlantis: I challenged where you sat the other night mary
    Mary Korpov: So?
    Mary Korpov: I remember that, Arch. And your assessment of why I sat where I sat, the learning of which was like pulling teeth, was completely wrong. What does that have to do with your friend?
    stevenaia Michinaga: well challenging people is one way to provoke someone, but a roud abut way to understand them
    Archmage Atlantis: i bought him flowers tonight
    Fox Monacular: goodnight everyone, sorry have to go
    Archmage Atlantis: I called first
    Mary Korpov: bye
    stevenaia Michinaga: bye fox
    Archmage Atlantis: I asked if he would accept the flowers
    Archmage Atlantis: He said no
    stevenaia Michinaga: were your intensions to offend?
    Mary Korpov: Well, I think I'll go. No offense, but this type of personal stuff isn't something I want to get into.
    stevenaia Michinaga: bye mary
    Archmage Atlantis: Yet you asked the question'
    stevenaia Michinaga: for instance I didn;t intent to upset you Arch
    stevenaia Michinaga: assumes the anger was the result of the conversation
    stevenaia Michinaga: but that is my assumption
    Archmage Atlantis: She asks, then refuses when the answers don't fit
    stevenaia Michinaga: yes, everyone has their own perspective
    Archmage Atlantis: I told the creator to bring the flood
    Archmage Atlantis: the animals said to ask again
    stevenaia Michinaga: I find what we do here can do here is create an alignment of perspectives, try to see what you see through dialog
    Archmage Atlantis: In this mary is correct
    stevenaia Michinaga: even in the defintion of simple words, not a matter of who is right ot wrong
    Archmage Atlantis: I no longer seek alignment
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
    Archmage Atlantis: I ask for justice
    stevenaia Michinaga: that is a topic for another night
    Archmage Atlantis: No really
    stevenaia Michinaga: there is no one here to give anyone that
    Archmage Atlantis: We are all here
    stevenaia Michinaga: not to give jsutice
    stevenaia Michinaga: justice
    Archmage Atlantis: I hear the crickets
    stevenaia Michinaga: they are here
    Archmage Atlantis: Fael gave you that tatoo
    stevenaia Michinaga: nods
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