2009.11.29 19:00 - Homework

The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

Tonight we had a number of guests from the Northern Arizona University doing  homework for a class on SL groups and we were their assignment tonight. They were a bit more active than observers for the evening.

stevenaia Michinaga: hello

JezzieBelle Garsdale: hello

JezzieBelle Garsdale: hey shyshy

stevenaia Michinaga: have you come for the meeting

JezzieBelle Garsdale: we have

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Shyann Davi: Hi everyone

JezzieBelle Garsdale: we want to see how it all works, curious :)

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

stevenaia Michinaga: have you been here before?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: you got dog poo again lol

Shyann Davi: lol yeah thanks Jezzie :P

JezzieBelle Garsdale: not when anyone has been here

JezzieBelle Garsdale: hehehe it's probably from my dog... my avi is named for her :P

stevenaia Michinaga: We record out meeting and post them to our wiki, is it ok if we include you?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I don't mind

JezzieBelle Garsdale: mind

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Avastu, so nice to see you again

Avastu Maruti: hello my friend

JezzieBelle Garsdale: so, do you bring your social experiments into SL, or talk about things you do in RL here?

stevenaia Michinaga: we explore the nature of things through meditation (90 seconds every quarter hour and share what we see there

stevenaia Michinaga: we have a little bell that rings here at the 1/4 hour

stevenaia Michinaga: if you would like we can select a topic to focus on for those 90 seconds and thereafter

JezzieBelle Garsdale: may we just observe and you guide us through it?

stevenaia Michinaga: We try to be flexible and respectful

JezzieBelle Garsdale: we can back off if you need, don't want to interrupt

JezzieBelle Garsdale: hey andy, corrine, welcome

stevenaia Michinaga: no, feel free to stay, hello andrew

stevenaia Michinaga: have you been here before?

Andrew Varthader: hello

JezzieBelle Garsdale: they are just starting, so we're all here in time :)

JezzieBelle Garsdale: click a pillow and sit andy

Eden Haiku: Hi everyone!

stevenaia Michinaga: how did you happen to come by this place?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: hi eden

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Eden

JezzieBelle Garsdale: one of the members at Delphi told me about it

stevenaia Michinaga: many new faces tonight

Eden Haiku: Many new people tonight I think?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: my fault, I brought my friends :)

stevenaia Michinaga: we record our conversations, Andrew, it is ok to include any comments you might have?

stevenaia Michinaga: no problem

Andrew Varthader: yeah haha

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Eden Haiku: I met Shyann here earlier...Hello Shyann!

stevenaia Michinaga: have you meditated before?

stevenaia Michinaga: (newcomers)?

Shyann Davi: Hi Eden :)

stevenaia Michinaga: there is much information on what we do here on the Wiki

stevenaia Michinaga: feel free to read them at your leisure

stevenaia Michinaga: http://playasbeing.wik.is/

stevenaia Michinaga: but we have meetings here 4 times a day, feel free to come back anytime

stevenaia Michinaga: 7:00 and 1:00 am and pm

stevenaia Michinaga: SLT

stevenaia Michinaga: do you have any questions

stevenaia Michinaga: I usually come here to listen :)

stevenaia Michinaga: sometimes it;s just simple enough during the 90 seconds to look at what your mind is thinking and let it flow

JezzieBelle Garsdale: listening and observing seems a good idea for us, since we're new :)

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: the chime will ring shortly, then you can come back and share

Andrew Varthader: you guys can just email me your part and i can put it all into power point..and i just email it back to you guys

stevenaia Michinaga: go on andrew, not sure I understand

Eden Haiku: I just spent 2 hours in a SL poetry reading. It was all very exciting, I'm not fully here yet ;-)

stevenaia Michinaga: this a class project?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: what's that flashing light I keep seeing?

Calvino Rabeni: I think eden has bling

Andrew Varthader: the cricket is annoying

Calvino Rabeni: Some of you look totally gray

Eden Haiku: That might be my nose-ring yes ;-)

JezzieBelle Garsdale: yes eden it must be lol

stevenaia Michinaga: you can turn down the background sound or focus in on why it;s annoying

Eden Haiku: According to the "method» we are supposed to write something down after the 9 secs in RL. Do you do this practice Steve, Calvino, others?

Shyann Davi: i think it's annoying because it's constant. there is no break at all, well hardly.

stevenaia Michinaga: on your sound menu at the bottom, you can turn such things down

Eden Haiku: Sometimes, we do a running meditation too...

stevenaia Michinaga: or tune it out

JezzieBelle Garsdale: in real life I am in my room, after almost three years it's not much for inspiration

Shyann Davi: i know i was just focusing on why it was annoying

Andrew Varthader: are we going to talk to each other about something?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: i like the cricket, I'm from the midwest and summertime is filled with crickets and frogs

Eden Haiku: What would you like to talk about Andrew?

Andrew Varthader: life!

stevenaia Michinaga: we are Andrew, I was asking you about your powerpoint project, can you explain a bit about it?

Andrew Varthader: its for school

Eden Haiku: The cricket triggers good memories for you JezzieBelle.

Andrew Varthader: have to observe a group

JezzieBelle Garsdale: yes, they do

stevenaia Michinaga: can you drop expectations?

Eden Haiku: Oh, and we are this group you are observing? What do you notice about us? ;-)

Andrew Varthader: youre quiet

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Theodoor

Andrew Varthader: haha

Eden Haiku: I think a teacher sent us his/her class...;-)

TheoDoor Sandalwood: hello

stevenaia Michinaga: Theodoor

Eden Haiku: *teacher

stevenaia Michinaga: have you been here before?

Calvino Rabeni: I am interested in groups and social psychology also

Andrew Varthader: no lol

JezzieBelle Garsdale: no, we decided to come here on our own, this isn't the group we were supposed to observe, we were curious when we found out about you guys

Andrew Varthader: Why do you guys play this game?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: your info cards say you do stuff like social experiments and we are in social psychology

stevenaia Michinaga: aww, interesting

TheoDoor Sandalwood: interesting topic for hell

Calvino Rabeni: Hmm, I don't remember - oh social psychology?

stevenaia Michinaga: what school?

Eden Haiku: This is a very in formal group in a way. I'm new to it (about a month and the group has been on for more than a year).

JezzieBelle Garsdale: nice ink steve-o

TheoDoor Sandalwood: i will be an ear

Calvino Rabeni: Oh yes, I think part of the idea is that your own life can be like a laboratory, to gry things and see how they turn out.

stevenaia Michinaga: thx, it was a gift

Calvino Rabeni: What school are you from?

Eden Haiku: It is more like a circle of friends interested in awareness, meditation, empathy and so on...

Andrew Varthader: school in az

JezzieBelle Garsdale: northern arizona university

stevenaia Michinaga: Avastu, can you share what you have been doing since you were last here?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: see? we be edumacated and typin n all good stuff LOL

Avastu Maruti: writing

Avastu Maruti: sleeping

Avastu Maruti: eating

Eden Haiku: ;-)

Andrew Varthader: lmao what..

stevenaia Michinaga: a busy soul, I see

JezzieBelle Garsdale: sounds like a good group, eden

Avastu Maruti: ha!

Eden Haiku: I like it a lot,

Andrew Varthader: why do you guys play SL?

Eden Haiku: Unexpected things keep happening...Tonite, you seem to be part of the play guys from Arizona University...

stevenaia Michinaga: Play as Being is the Group Name

Calvino Rabeni: Is a good question, yes?

Calvino Rabeni: TO see what will happen, is part of it/

JezzieBelle Garsdale: so you are more of a reflection group than support or life-changers?

stevenaia Michinaga: We come, talk, play, relax, discuss

Eden Haiku: Here is why I play. It is a pome I wrote today

Calvino Rabeni: could be, it is partly social to get together

--BELL--

Eden Haiku: *Poem

Calvino Rabeni: and partly reflection

Andrew Varthader: haha ok but why on SL, why not with someone in RL, like a gf or wife...husband bf..friends..

Eden Haiku: Second Life Bliss by Eden Haiku

::::::When you find yourself
::::::Dressed as a Santa Claus's elf
::::::Flying over a tropical beach
::::::With a huge Christmas tree
::::::Attached to your right hand

::::::This is, my friend, Second Life bliss

::::::When you finally master the art
::::::Of using your symbolic translator
::::::To local-chat with a tiny elephant
::::::Who is a Chinese newbie

::::::This is, my friend, Second Life bliss

::::::When you can at last remember
::::::That the bling shoes you love so
::::::Are listed under Curly Pink Shoe Box
::::::In your overflowing inventory

::::::This is, my friend, Second Life bliss

::::::When Torley Linden is becoming your guru
::::::When you start teleporting in your dreams
::::::When on a subway ride
::::::You try to click people on their right shoulder
::::::To read their profile
::::::This is, my friend, Second Life Bliss

 

_/!\_ Eden Haiku© Totempoetry 2009

stevenaia Michinaga: Around you sits people from all over the hemisphere and other times from all over the world, Sl provide this special opportunity

Andrew Varthader: may i ask what your real life job is?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: nice eden :)

 

Eden Haiku:

 

::::::When Torley Linden is becoming your guru
::::::When you start teleporting in your dreams
::::::When on a subway ride
::::::You try to click people on their right shoulder
::::::To read their profile
::::::This is, my friend, Second Life Bliss

 

_/!\_ Eden Haiku© Totempoetry 2009

 

Shyann Davi: Wow thats wonderful Eden

Calvino Rabeni: Eden writes some very interesting poems

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Calvino Rabeni: I an not sure quite why I like them - but I do

stevenaia Michinaga: have a seat andrew

Eden Haiku: Thanks. I'm a poet in RL too but I write in French. I write in international English for SL. This is the world my friends...

stevenaia Michinaga: quite the observer bouncing around

Eden Haiku: Yes, please sit Andrew. It becomes hard to focus on the chat and we need to to follow the conversation.

stevenaia Michinaga: here we are all students

Andrew Varthader: haha

stevenaia Michinaga: can we have your prof's email address so we can grade you....laughs

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I can ask him LOL

JezzieBelle Garsdale: maybe we will get extra credit

Calvino Rabeni: Do you have an assignment you can tell us about?

stevenaia Michinaga: as I said there is much of our conversations to read on the wiki, I would recommend you look at some of the nights that have been posted

Andrew Varthader: we have to observe a group in SL

Andrew Varthader: how many hours a day do you spend on SL

stevenaia Michinaga: as with life, the observer often becomes the subject

Eden Haiku: It varies a lot, depending.

stevenaia Michinaga: that is also what we discuss

Andrew Varthader: what

stevenaia Michinaga: how the observer becomes the subject... Andrew

stevenaia Michinaga: ..grins

stevenaia Michinaga: *how

Andrew Varthader: how many hours a day do you spend on SL

Andrew Varthader: 1 hour, 2 hours, the entire day..

Andrew Varthader: give or take

stevenaia Michinaga: these meetings are usually an hour, today I attended 2 other meetings

Calvino Rabeni: Often about 2 or 3. BUt sometimes nothing for quite a while

stevenaia Michinaga: mostly related to this group

Calvino Rabeni: It depends on real life.

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, there is that

Calvino Rabeni: I like the people in this group, but I give RL relationships priority. Sorry SL friends :)

stevenaia Michinaga: we do hold RL retreats as well

Andrew Varthader: cool

Eden Haiku: Yesterday: 0, today: around 3 hours

stevenaia Michinaga: SL friends become RL friends

Andrew Varthader: so you meet your SL friends in RL..?

Shyann Davi: when you say you hold RL retreats, does that mean you meet in RL?

Eden Haiku: Yes, some people meet in RL.

Andrew Varthader: what if that "friend" turns out to be a serial killer..

Eden Haiku: Well you get killed I guess...

Calvino Rabeni: Hmm, i think it is in groups, right? So no wonky "dates"

Andrew Varthader: lame..

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, there was one in october in Princeton, August in Santa Cruz California and in January i one in Malta is planned for the convenience of our European friends

stevenaia Michinaga: interesting comment Andrew, should we be concerned about your presence here?

Andrew Varthader: lets say we weren't here tonight, what would you guys be doing

JezzieBelle Garsdale: he;s harmless, andy is a gentle but twisted soul LOL

JezzieBelle Garsdale: no, j/k

Andrew Varthader: well i dont plan on meeting with any of you..so you dont have to worry..

stevenaia Michinaga: hello Storm

Storm Nordwind: Hi!

Eden Haiku: Hi Storm. Happy to see you ;-)

stevenaia Michinaga: well you are here and have become a lovely addition to our group tonight

stevenaia Michinaga: Storm, we are a student project tonight :)

Storm Nordwind: Cool!

--BELL--

JezzieBelle Garsdale: new life brought to any meeting place is a welcome relief, a new perspective

Andrew Varthader: do any of you actually look like your avatar ?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I do, first thing I did was try to make "me" look like me

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I dunno guys, did I do a fair job?

Calvino Rabeni: I think it looks good.

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I was asking my RL group, but thanks cal

Shyann Davi: lol yes Jezzie you did

Andrew Varthader: do the rest of you you actually look like your avatar ?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: thanks shyshy

stevenaia Michinaga: my avatar was a gift

Calvino Rabeni: Do you see gray squares, or is my viewer broken?

stevenaia Michinaga: from someone I never met until recently

Andrew Varthader: haha ok

stevenaia Michinaga: I think that is Storm's snow

JezzieBelle Garsdale: it's snowing LOL

Calvino Rabeni: brb

Eden Haiku: Steve has is RL picture in his profile, you can check. And Storm too. I think they look like their avatars.

Storm Nordwind: My avatar looks like I did 25 years ago! :)

Storm Nordwind: (So hard to make elderly avatars!)

Eden Haiku: And your spirit is still young Storm!

JezzieBelle Garsdale: they dont let you do age huh

Storm Nordwind: Thanks Eden!

Andrew Varthader: haha wow

stevenaia Michinaga: interesting comment heard today (Tom Petty) If you aren't growing old... you are dead

stevenaia Michinaga: wb Cal

Calvino Rabeni: ahh, much better

Eden Haiku: So it is a group project for school you are doing?

Calvino Rabeni: Do you have to write together?

Eden Haiku: Andrew seems to have some attention disorder does he?

Shyann Davi: yes for our class, and we have to do our project together. writing included

Calvino Rabeni: Now I don't like the word "disorder'" very much.

Calvino Rabeni: But certainly a lot of energy

Eden Haiku: That is quite difficult, to write as a group.

Calvino Rabeni: I guessed something like that

JezzieBelle Garsdale: yes, poor andy, our bald one-shoed friend is a little spastic, but we still love him LOL

Calvino Rabeni: You can study yourself as a group while you are trying to work together

Calvino Rabeni: :)

Storm Nordwind: Telling stories as a group can be great fun

Eden Haiku: I love the word «spastic», I agree, he is lovely ;-)

Eden Haiku: Well, a bit nude maybe...

Calvino Rabeni: Not a bad word.

stevenaia Michinaga: watching andrew edit himself

Eden Haiku: Amazed at what can happen here!

Calvino Rabeni: You NEVER know

Corinne Azemus: i apologize!

JezzieBelle Garsdale: he is amusing :))

Eden Haiku: We HAVE to take ourselves lightly!

stevenaia Michinaga: the observers become the theater

Calvino Rabeni: Sometimes things get slightly boring, then they change to who knows what. :)

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, sometimes we can change on a word

Calvino Rabeni: I think you noticed, we often do not stick to a subject very long.

stevenaia Michinaga: Hello PAradise

Eden Haiku: That's ok Corinne. See in the words "Play as Being" the word Being encompasses everything that happens, the way I understand it. So this is part of it, our reactions are part of it yours too ;-)

Paradise Tennant: hello everyone .. my apologies .. :)

stevenaia Michinaga: seems we are a class homework project tonight

JezzieBelle Garsdale: so this is a very open and unstructured group - meeting for the pleasure of it

stevenaia Michinaga: This a first year seminar Jezziebelle?

Calvino Rabeni: I would be very interested in the final report, too.

JezzieBelle Garsdale: no, sophmore/junior class

Eden Haiku: Hi Paradise. These students here from Arizona University are bringing a lot of questions...

stevenaia Michinaga: we are open and unstructured but at times very focused

Paradise Tennant: hiya eden cool!

JezzieBelle Garsdale: someone said eww?LOLLLLL

JezzieBelle Garsdale: haha!

Calvino Rabeni: The more questions the better

Andrew Varthader: haha me

Eden Haiku: onigokko

Andrew Varthader: wtf is that......

stevenaia Michinaga: Play

stevenaia Michinaga: stop

Andrew Varthader: aw

Eden Haiku: stop

--BELL--

Eden Haiku: That is a running meditation. We do that too.

Andrew Varthader: Boo!

stevenaia Michinaga: feel free to wear "onigokko" and you can join us

Corinne Azemus: what does it do??

stevenaia Michinaga: ...grins

Eden Haiku: If you will excuse me, I have to go. Good nite everyone and good luck in your schoolwork guys!

stevenaia Michinaga: helps us play

Paradise Tennant: good nite eden :)

Corinne Azemus: it gave me a tail

JezzieBelle Garsdale: thanks eden, good night

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

stevenaia Michinaga: onigokko

stevenaia Michinaga: stop

Andrew Varthader: haha yeah

Corinne Azemus: what ... just happened?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: so if we wear it, we dance?

Calvino Rabeni: yes

JezzieBelle Garsdale: good trick meastro

stevenaia Michinaga: you can research the origins of it online or in our wiki

stevenaia Michinaga: you will be tested in the morning

stevenaia Michinaga: would anyone like to bring a topic to discuss?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: Hey!

stevenaia Michinaga: you new to SL?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: Over here!

JezzieBelle Garsdale: Looking good!

Shyann Davi: yes we're all fairly new lol

JezzieBelle Garsdale: who you talkin to steve-o?

stevenaia Michinaga: the observers

JezzieBelle Garsdale: yes, we are new like shyshy says

Corinne Azemus: this is my 3rd time on here

Corinne Azemus: i finally figured out how to walk and fly

stevenaia Michinaga: ...and sit

Corinne Azemus: yes that too

Storm Nordwind: And you can take a ride on the balloon over there if you want too

Calvino Rabeni: Shyann has lots of groups. Did you check out lots of things in SL?

Shyann Davi: yeah, i've been on more often

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, much of what you see here has been constructed by Storm

Calvino Rabeni: I checked out SL quite a but, but then got bored

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I've spent more time exploring on my own than sitting with groups... lots of neat places but they are usually empty

Calvino Rabeni: SOme friends of mine in RL think it is a game

Storm Nordwind swoons in shock

JezzieBelle Garsdale: its not a game, its just a place

Calvino Rabeni: but it is more like a place to meet.

JezzieBelle Garsdale: one of my friends back home is on SL

Calvino Rabeni: Although some sims have role playing games

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, there is the dark side of role play

Calvino Rabeni: It seems popular.

Calvino Rabeni: GTG, I have RL food to eat. See you all later.

stevenaia Michinaga: bye Cal

Calvino Rabeni: Off to dinner

Shyann Davi: bye

Paradise Tennant: good nite cal :)

Calvino Rabeni: bye

Paradise Tennant: I should scoot too

Storm Nordwind: One of my daughters' friends uses SL because she is agoraphobic and can't get out. In fact she had her birthday party on SL, thrown by her friends

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Paradise Tennant: hope you all enjoy your evening :)

stevenaia Michinaga: night PAradise, thanks for stopping in

Corinne Azemus: i watched a True Life episode on SL on MTV

Corinne Azemus: about people who perform on here

Andrew Varthader: how did you daughter meet this girl. if in fact the girl could have never seen here..

stevenaia Michinaga: there are many musicians

Storm Nordwind: There's a lot of live music here, if that's what you're in to

Andrew Varthader: when was this group founded

stevenaia Michinaga: April 1 2008

Storm Nordwind: We moved to this site 4 months later

stevenaia Michinaga: there is a short history of the group on our wiki

Corinne Azemus: april fools?

Storm Nordwind: And you're all now part of the history :)

JezzieBelle Garsdale: why did you start the group?

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: it was started by another person

JezzieBelle Garsdale: do you remember who?

Corinne Azemus: are you the leader steve?

JezzieBelle Garsdale: Boo!

stevenaia Michinaga: no, I am just the host of this meeting tonight

Corinne Azemus: oh okay

Storm Nordwind: We have a rota system

stevenaia Michinaga: I am in charge of greeting and posting the meeting log to the Wiki

Storm Nordwind: 28 meetings a week, and some of us take a turn to host it

Corinne Azemus: do you know who founded the group?

stevenaia Michinaga: Pema Pera

stevenaia Michinaga: he comes now and then

Corinne Azemus: do you know why he started it?

stevenaia Michinaga: you can search his profile

Corinne Azemus: was it just for something to do?

Storm Nordwind: He's interested in seeing how people react to this new meditation practice

Storm Nordwind: It's an exploration

Storm Nordwind: So we get views on it from all over the world

Corinne Azemus: have any of you guys met in real life before?

Corinne Azemus: where abouts are you guys from?

stevenaia Michinaga: I met Paradise in October at the recent retreat

Storm Nordwind: I've met a whole bunch of Play as Being practitioners in real life, but not these guys here yet!

stevenaia Michinaga: and a number of others previously through the group

stevenaia Michinaga: I am on the east coast in RL

Storm Nordwind used to be in Scotland but is now in Colorado

Corinne Azemus: did you all plan to meet together?

Storm Nordwind: Sure!

Andrew Varthader: Well everyone its been interesting..thanks for allowing me to be here, im off to go eat

Storm Nordwind: Bye Andrew

Storm Nordwind waves

stevenaia Michinaga: there are over 40 of us from all over the world

stevenaia Michinaga: (perhaps more now)

Storm Nordwind: (Definitely more now!)

Corinne Azemus: would you ever plan a group meeting?

stevenaia Michinaga: we do, a few every year, but difficult to all meet at the same time

Storm Nordwind: What do you mean by a group meeting Corinne?

stevenaia Michinaga: and we meet here every 6 hours :)

Corinne Azemus: like all getting together and having your meetings in real life

Storm Nordwind: Every 3 months we have Play as Being retreats in real life

Storm Nordwind: It's unlikely that we'll all be there at the same time though

Storm Nordwind: That's one reason why we use Second Life

Corinne Azemus: how many people typically show up?

Storm Nordwind: Here or in RL?

Corinne Azemus: rl

Storm Nordwind: A dozen would be a good number

stevenaia Michinaga: fewer at the 1:00AM session

stevenaia Michinaga: more Europeans then

Storm Nordwind: That's in SL steve!

stevenaia Michinaga: oh right

Storm Nordwind chuckles

Storm Nordwind: We had 17 in our meeting earlier today I believe

stevenaia Michinaga: was trying to remember the basis of our discussions.. centering on the "Nature of Reality" a lovely topic

JezzieBelle Garsdale: does the group dynamic change with the size?

Storm Nordwind: Don't all group dynamics change with size? ;)

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: it can go from zero (no talk) to increadible depths on the direction of the wind

Storm Nordwind smiles

JezzieBelle Garsdale: I mean in a more specific way than simply the number of inputs :P

stevenaia Michinaga: but even "no talk" can be quite inspirational

Storm Nordwind: There's no formula JezzieBelle. It's not possible to predict or extraploate

Storm Nordwind: *extrapolate

stevenaia Michinaga: much can be learned from simply listening and sometimes asking questions

Corinne Azemus: what do you typically talk about

JezzieBelle Garsdale: does the dynamic change in who takes charge, who talks more?

stevenaia Michinaga: we talk about the "Nature of Reality"

stevenaia Michinaga: :)variety

Storm Nordwind: We talk about a wide variety of stuff Corinne. The meditation practice itself, how it affects our daily lives, insights it has given us, and... the Nature or Reality bien sur!

stevenaia Michinaga: means something different to each of us

Storm Nordwind: *variety

stevenaia Michinaga: so we try to understand each other views

Storm Nordwind: And if you're British you might talk about the weather for a couple of minutes too!

stevenaia Michinaga: since our backgrounds are quite diverse

JezzieBelle Garsdale: the weather? it snowed here :)

stevenaia Michinaga: or how best to drink single malt scotch

Storm Nordwind: No one is in charge as such JezzieBelle, so yours is a hard question to answer

stevenaia Michinaga: most decisions that need to be made are made after group discussions

JezzieBelle Garsdale: what I meant was does any one person sometimes take the lead, speak more than others, try to guide a meditation?

stevenaia Michinaga: the inception of the group was Pema Pera's, but the discussions continue whether he is here or not

stevenaia Michinaga: wb Cal

Corinne Azemus: so is this the most off topic you guys have ever been before?

Storm Nordwind chuckles

Storm Nordwind: I doubt it!

stevenaia Michinaga: hardly

stevenaia Michinaga: I think it is the first time we have been a homework assignment

stevenaia Michinaga: I would suggest coming back a few times to see the consistency.. or lack thereof

Storm Nordwind: Although some of our group get homework assignments in the Kira workshops (often run by Play as Being members in the Kira Cafe)

Storm Nordwind: Learn about it by osmosis - good advice from Steve

Avastu Maruti: good night my friends

stevenaia Michinaga: I usually attend 2-4 meeting a week

Storm Nordwind: Goodnight Avastu!

JezzieBelle Garsdale: night avastu

Storm Nordwind: Namaste

stevenaia Michinaga: night Avastu

Calvino Rabeni: Did I miss anything interesting?

Calvino Rabeni: Hmm, did that sound like I expected not?

Storm Nordwind: We're fielding interesting questions Calvino :)

Calvino Rabeni: AH

Storm Nordwind: This group may be unlike anything you've ever seen anywhere in the way it runs

Storm Nordwind: The closest you'll get to it (but only possibly) is in education...

stevenaia Michinaga: actually much of what we do here is ask questions, so you guys will fit right in

Storm Nordwind: in Waldorf Schools

JezzieBelle Garsdale: so you would call this an open-ended discussion learning environment?

--BELL--

Storm Nordwind: That could be one use for it JezzieBelle

stevenaia Michinaga: an appropriate summery

Shyann Davi: so are we all supposed to do something special during the 90 seconds of silence?

Calvino Rabeni: yes it is usually quite open-ended

Storm Nordwind: First of all I would recommend that you investigated the core practice, and that is 9 seconds only, rather than 90

Storm Nordwind: Then see how you want to use the 90

stevenaia Michinaga: http://playasbeing.wik.is/Informatio..._in_a_Nutshell

Storm Nordwind: Thanks Steve

Calvino Rabeni: I just had the idea, maybe 30 seconds would be effective for starting out

Corinne Azemus: well thank you guys for being so helpful, but i have to go get some coffee and do some more homework!

Calvino Rabeni: 9 is if you do it all the time.

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Calvino Rabeni: 90 is for in these meetings.

Storm Nordwind: And here: http://playasbeing.wik.is/Informatio...sked_Questions

Calvino Rabeni: But if you were to do it for the first time, maybe an in between time would be a happy medium

stevenaia Michinaga: the log will be on the wiki later this evening if you want to reference it

Storm Nordwind: And here (for avid readers!): http://playasbeing.wik.is/Informatio..._play_as_Being

JezzieBelle Garsdale: well, thanks for the evening guys, but I need to get going

stevenaia Michinaga: happy researching and come back again

JezzieBelle Garsdale: good night all

Storm Nordwind: bfn

stevenaia Michinaga: night

Storm Nordwind waves

Calvino Rabeni: the wind effect earlier - was that yours, Storm?

Storm Nordwind: I'll bid you all farewell too

Shyann Davi: take care

Storm Nordwind: You mean the whirlwind around Eden?

Calvino Rabeni: You could get an effect go "blow away" - Yes, where did that come from?

Storm Nordwind: Like this?

Calvino Rabeni: Yes that.

Storm Nordwind: I made it a few years ago

Calvino Rabeni: Is esthetic. Can I try it?

stevenaia Michinaga: nice

Storm Nordwind: I'll give you both one if you like

Calvino Rabeni: THanks

stevenaia Michinaga: thx (and snow too)

Storm Nordwind: Enjoy. Bye for now!

stevenaia Michinaga: thx for joining is

stevenaia Michinaga: us

stevenaia Michinaga: Storm is a board member of Kira, (kira.org) the organization in Rl that Play as Being is a part of

stevenaia Michinaga: LSL?

stevenaia Michinaga: awww, good luck to you

stevenaia Michinaga: I've bearly gotten to building here

stevenaia Michinaga: you mean on the lots nearby?

Shyann Davi: I'll be leaving now too, sorry for sitting idle. I'll see you again soon I'm sure. Take care and good night.

 

Calvino Rabeni and I continue with a conversation about intentions and cultural settings

 

Calvino Rabeni: Bye, THX

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: thanks, send me a copy of your assignment when done

stevenaia Michinaga: U an architect?

Calvino Rabeni: Software architect. Did a lot of graphics for a while.

Calvino Rabeni: Wol also, what a coincidence.

Calvino Rabeni: Do you work for a firm, or independently

stevenaia Michinaga: myself

Calvino Rabeni: ah, have a special area?

stevenaia Michinaga: not really, urban mixed use is most of what I do, and residential/commercial

Calvino Rabeni: ok.

Calvino Rabeni: Hopefully, it affords room for creativity.

stevenaia Michinaga: daily, more from dealing with clients than projects

Calvino Rabeni: I was going to suppose that :)

stevenaia Michinaga: laughs

Calvino Rabeni: I'm getting more interested in the people than the technology

Calvino Rabeni: Earlier, it was the opposite.

stevenaia Michinaga: individuals are more interesting than design for groups too

Calvino Rabeni: Sadly so

Calvino Rabeni: The group spaces are generic rather than expressing individuality

stevenaia Michinaga: unless it's a special group

Calvino Rabeni: RIght, there are some.

Calvino Rabeni: There's some kind of leader with vision, usually, who determines what happens.

stevenaia Michinaga: us, or who lets things arise :0

Calvino Rabeni: Have you worked with any group clients that had open styles of leadership?

stevenaia Michinaga: I did a chapel recently that worked well and the pastor enjoyed working with us

stevenaia Michinaga: in they end she could be persuasive when necessary

Calvino Rabeni: I wonder what it would be like if everyone who use this sim had equal creative ability to Storm?

stevenaia Michinaga: and we enjoy each others company

Calvino Rabeni: That sounds pleasant

stevenaia Michinaga: group design is another story, vs group input

Calvino Rabeni: There's the Burning Life scene - in RL for an example of rampant creativity

Calvino Rabeni: Not sure whether it transferred to SL

stevenaia Michinaga: so you program in RL?

Calvino Rabeni: Oh, how did you like the session tonight?

Calvino Rabeni: And does the public nature of the log bias what you feel comfortable saying?

stevenaia Michinaga: Andrew was a bit of an anti-observer but other than that it was interesting

stevenaia Michinaga: no, it just tempers my words

Calvino Rabeni: He I think, liked to stir things up to see what happens. He was in a sense being an experimenter.

Calvino Rabeni: Perhaps not in a planned way though.

Calvino Rabeni: In the sense that you have an idea about what might happen with your interventions.

stevenaia Michinaga: he was exploring his avatar

stevenaia Michinaga: "your interventions." not sure what you mean

--BELL--

Calvino Rabeni: The classic ide of the experiment is what I meant. You have a hypothesis ahead of time, figure out what might test it, then do that.

stevenaia Michinaga: I leave that aspect to Pema and others

Calvino Rabeni: You know the "life as a laboratory" idea - it is somewhere in the Kiva materials.

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

stevenaia Michinaga: I am the lab rat

Calvino Rabeni: So some of that is going on in PAB, I think

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Calvino Rabeni: You can be the experimenter too

Calvino Rabeni: It is fair, because Pema is his own lab rat too.

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, in the thick of it

stevenaia Michinaga: but still, he set it up

stevenaia Michinaga: to include himself

Calvino Rabeni: There is something in the culture, that disapproves of being experimental in relationships.

stevenaia Michinaga: you mean people relationships?

Calvino Rabeni: Yes.

Calvino Rabeni: LIke, calling someone a calculating person.

Calvino Rabeni: Or manipulative.

Calvino Rabeni: So people of course have lots of strategies, but they keep them secret.

stevenaia Michinaga: usually it is self evident

stevenaia Michinaga: or they don;t recognize them themselves

Calvino Rabeni: Not sure quite what that means

Calvino Rabeni: Normal people learn tons of strategies.

Calvino Rabeni: They get them validated constantly

stevenaia Michinaga: some people don't understand the affect of their actions

Calvino Rabeni: Like, for example, marketers, or Cosmopolitan magazine, or Oprah magazine -

stevenaia Michinaga: other's as you have stated, do

stevenaia Michinaga: I was thinking more the bully, or obnoxious person

Calvino Rabeni: Right, it gets out of hand, then it is grating.

stevenaia Michinaga: on some more than than others

Calvino Rabeni: But even when it is subtle, and appropriate, I think people are careful to conceal it

stevenaia Michinaga: like the crying baby drives some people to the edge

stevenaia Michinaga: hard to quantify what people conceal

stevenaia Michinaga: if you would like to take this private, feel free

Calvino Rabeni: I think it is in the realm of PAB interest.

stevenaia Michinaga: nods

Calvino Rabeni: The crying of babies is received differently in various cultures.

Calvino Rabeni: Perhaps related to the assumptions about what emotions are.

stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps but are assumptions about people real intention or what you perceive them to be

Calvino Rabeni: hmm, not sure how to define it, but my impression is people play by the same rule book, and some is based on more fundamental human nature, while other aspects are cultural.

Calvino Rabeni: Not sure quite what you were asking / stating.

stevenaia Michinaga: I was saying there is what your impression is... then there is what the person's intentions is, they could match or be totally different depending how you interpret it

Calvino Rabeni: in the sense that there is room for misperception?

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: much of the discussion here (PaB) tends to try to clarify those differences

Calvino Rabeni: Sure, there can be errors. But I believe people are for the main part tuned in to the social conventions and the human universals, unconsciously

Calvino Rabeni: And when it goes wrong, e.g. with brain damage or other conditions, then people notice it by its absence.

stevenaia Michinaga: it being "social conventions and the human universals"

Calvino Rabeni: Yes

Calvino Rabeni: WHen behavior diverges due to those reasons

stevenaia Michinaga: that seems to be a special case, do you think it applies to this group?

stevenaia Michinaga: or are you saying something else

Calvino Rabeni: Not sure. Mainly everybody knows the conventions and follows them.

Calvino Rabeni: Occasionally it is hard to know what to make of someone.

stevenaia Michinaga: for the most part I think we are quite in sync

Calvino Rabeni: I mean, they are off the map.

Calvino Rabeni: Yes that is what I mean, usually in sync.

Calvino Rabeni: But, it seems to me there are certain costs in assuming those limits, playing it safe.

Calvino Rabeni: I am not suggesting transgressing those limits

Calvino Rabeni: but noticing them.

stevenaia Michinaga: cost?

Calvino Rabeni: What happens when someone tries to stir things up.

Calvino Rabeni: ?

Calvino Rabeni: Cost - as in, lost opportunities for looking at part of lige.

Calvino Rabeni: *life.

stevenaia Michinaga: nods

stevenaia Michinaga: in some case, as it evident, some get really annoyed

stevenaia Michinaga: other are more accepting

Calvino Rabeni: True, people guard the boundaries.

Calvino Rabeni: Especially if uncomfortable.

Calvino Rabeni: And it takes skill to expand those limits.

stevenaia Michinaga: it;s interesting when the "discomfort" ranges wildly

Calvino Rabeni: Skill and something like trust

Calvino Rabeni: It is a skill worth observing and studying.

stevenaia Michinaga: and equally so I find it interesting when people do get uncomfortable and defensive and don;t see what the issue is

stevenaia Michinaga: I don;t see the issue, rather

Calvino Rabeni: It would be hard to make a blanket statement in this group, that any aspect of human experience was open to discussion. Even though I think based on the group purpose,, that might seem desirable.

stevenaia Michinaga: it could be with a try

Calvino Rabeni: Yes, you find it interesting when you are not uncomfortable and another person is.

Calvino Rabeni: It could go the other way around too.

stevenaia Michinaga: no, I ask the question what it is that makes them uncomfortable and what can be done to mitigate that

Calvino Rabeni: A certain amount of getting along with people is knowing the likely hot-button issues and not going there.

stevenaia Michinaga: true

stevenaia Michinaga: we all find our limits

Calvino Rabeni: but there is a lot of assuming going on.

Calvino Rabeni: One skill is to query the limits in a subtle way without going past them.

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Calvino Rabeni: A kind of "meta" level negotiation.

Calvino Rabeni: Some cultures handle that better than others.

stevenaia Michinaga: well depending you your "dancing" skills

Calvino Rabeni: I think it has changed over time.

stevenaia Michinaga: I think that avenue is more available in this group as there is a level of trust between most of us here

Calvino Rabeni: Yes, and there are some implicit agreements.

Calvino Rabeni: Trust is more important, probably

Calvino Rabeni: But the agreements are tested, and it is the test that strengthens the us

Calvino Rabeni: trust

Calvino Rabeni: (SOmething wrong with my keyboard - it drops chars)

--BELL--

Calvino Rabeni: Kind of like, if you have an intimate partner, an argument can strengthen the relationship, or undermine it, depending on how it plays out.

stevenaia Michinaga: I have found what I thought was offensive behaviors here between people, when I asked about it, Iw as told by the person I thought was offended that they were not,

Calvino Rabeni: Yes, in that case you may have been "conservative"

stevenaia Michinaga: so perceptions can play tricks

Calvino Rabeni: in one case it seemed like another group member thought I had gone too far.

Calvino Rabeni: So I moderated

stevenaia Michinaga: in this instance I wasn;t talking about you :)

Calvino Rabeni: But in other cases I think I'm over-concerned.

Calvino Rabeni: :)

Calvino Rabeni: There is a language maneuver, I call "putting in quotes".

Calvino Rabeni: There's a grammatical word for it but I forget what it is.

stevenaia Michinaga: was this an overt "gone to far" or something you didn;t feel was beyond the realm

Calvino Rabeni: "If I were king I would" ...

Calvino Rabeni: Says that I am not in fact king.

stevenaia Michinaga: right, you aren;t so....

Calvino Rabeni: and allows counter-factual statements.

Calvino Rabeni: that sometimes transgress boundaries.

Calvino Rabeni: Irony, fiction, distancing, supposition

stevenaia Michinaga: and you did this to propose something you could not otherwise?

Calvino Rabeni: I am saying it is a cultural mode we have now.

Calvino Rabeni: TO a larger degree than in past centuries, and relative perhaps to some other cultures

Calvino Rabeni: OK, it is like - remember the furor about the cartoons of the Prophet?

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Calvino Rabeni: To the western, modern sensibility it seems a bit like - so what's the problem?

Calvino Rabeni: A comic book is fiction.

Calvino Rabeni: Fiction isn't real.

Calvino Rabeni: It doesn't mean, that is what the author necessarily believes.

Calvino Rabeni: Etc.

Calvino Rabeni: Art also - certain art was shocking to people when first created.

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, but I would say... what don;t I understand about their culture that they find that such an assault

Calvino Rabeni: Later it became commonplace.

stevenaia Michinaga: nods

Calvino Rabeni: Some paintings of nudes were burned in effigy

Calvino Rabeni: It's not "just a picture".

Calvino Rabeni: In a way, it really matters.

Calvino Rabeni: (referring to the cartoon picture, not the nude painting)

stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps we can continue on Wednesday, it's close to one here and I'm beginning to fade

stevenaia Michinaga: :)

Calvino Rabeni: :) nice chat

Calvino Rabeni: (making mental note)

stevenaia Michinaga: thanks, sorry to cut you off

Calvino Rabeni: OK, have a good eve, stevenaia

stevenaia Michinaga: see you soon

Calvino Rabeni: :)

 

concluded 10:00 SLT :)