2009.11.22 01:00 - Operating in PaB

Moon Fargis: morning vendy:)
Vendy Walpole: Good morning
Vendy Walpole: Still can't see you
--BELL--
Moon Fargis: *grins*
Stargate Tone: good morning Vendy
Vendy Walpole: Hi
Vendy Walpole: oh here you are
Vendy Walpole: :)
Moon Fargis: yes we are relaxing a bit at the morning :)
Vendy Walpole: I am surrounded by flowers, what happens?
Moon Fargis: morning QT
Stargate Tone: Good morning Qt :)***
Qt Core: hi all
Moon Fargis: vendy: magic :)
Vendy Walpole: Is this new landscaping or SL game ?
Moon Fargis: both and neither of both :
Moon Fargis: :)
Vendy Walpole: Hm. well, I fo not mind to sit among flowers, that I call a beautiful morning
Vendy Walpole: do*
Moon Fargis: ^^
Moon Fargis: if you wish i can change
Vendy Walpole: If I try harder can smell them
Vendy Walpole: Okay, now i can see you better
Vendy Walpole: How are you all this morning?
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Moon Fargis: im fine thanks and you ?
Qt Core: just awoke, still checking ;-)
Vendy Walpole: sleepy still but well, thank you, planning when to start to clean the house
Stargate Tone: lol
Stargate Tone: ah...then U started it already
Moon Fargis: ^^
Vendy Walpole: smile, if you mean the house in me?
Moon Fargis: (brbr rl calls for a second)
Stargate Tone: both
Vendy Walpole: how would it imply on external house?
Stargate Tone: but might there not be so much within U to clean up
Stargate Tone: well, as we have this saing in Finland;
Stargate Tone: 'well planned is halfly done'
Vendy Walpole nods
Stargate Tone: (them wise ppl told me)
Vendy Walpole: We have the same saying
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Vendy Walpole: and that is really true
Vendy Walpole: btw I like your outfit Star
Stargate Tone: ty
Qt Core: in italy it is he who starts well
Vendy Walpole: looks so pure
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Vendy Walpole smiles widely
Stargate Tone: sometimes to plann well is to plan only the beginning
Qt Core: after that chaos would overcome too detailed plans ;-)
Stargate Tone: Hello Cal
Vendy Walpole: Hello Calvino, nice to see you again
Qt Core: Hi Calvino
Stargate Tone: ah yes...star learned at very early age that she must not plan 'anything' 'ever'
Calvino Rabeni: Hello PAB people!
Vendy Walpole: I read somewhere that the chaos is not so bad actually
Vendy Walpole: Because it is the step before the sorting things
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Moon Fargis: <- back
Vendy Walpole: so, it is neseccary at some stage to be in chaos even :)
Stargate Tone: wb :)*
Moon Fargis: greetings cal
Vendy Walpole: wb
Stargate Tone: ...even to create the mess...
Stargate Tone: (star is very good with that)
Vendy Walpole: (vendy is not bad as well)
Stargate Tone: smiles widely
Vendy Walpole: giggles
Vendy Walpole: If you let me I as relatively new guardian would ask you to tell me about your experience in paB and excercizes you practice yourself?
Stargate Tone: (star is an outsider)
Moon Fargis: ahwell vendy, i cover this plot now since almost a year and have to say, Pab changed much and in a way not
Vendy Walpole: (I believe star you have some experience about Being)
Moon Fargis: (being messy:)
Vendy Walpole: in what way it changed Moon?
Stargate Tone: for 'few' years in this life *
--BELL--
Moon Fargis: hmmm it was more simple at the beginin, wch is naturally as pab growed by people, but it turned from a, meditation prcatise into a intellectual brainstorming expression war sometimes
Vendy Walpole: can't we have the bot at the same session?
Vendy Walpole: both*
Vendy Walpole: there is time for meditation and discussion
Stargate Tone: practicly that's been also possible
Moon Fargis: ah i dont mean discussion, there here always loots of babbling goingon :)
Moon Fargis: but people started over the time to express natural happenings my them with scentiffic expressions and unnessesary much analytics wich drives them often into the trap that their ego blocks their way of free feeling and a open mind
Moon Fargis: my = by
Bertram Jacobus: hello every body ! ... :-)
Moon Fargis: hi bert :)
Stargate Tone: Hello Bert :)***
Vendy Walpole: I understnd what you say, well, each of us should try to be focused to the main point and share own eperience about practice with others
Vendy Walpole: it is how I see this session
Vendy Walpole: Hi Bert
Moon Fargis: yes this is nessesary
Moon Fargis: and was always a part of pab
Vendy Walpole: I am at stage when need to hear olders guardians
Vendy Walpole: still wonderer :)
Moon Fargis: but, hmm let me give a example, still feel everytime not verry well when i hear this expression once made in pab: "Appreciate the presence of appearance as a presentation by Being"
Vendy Walpole: hmm, not sure I get it
Vendy Walpole: do you understand it Moon?
Bertram Jacobus: why not moon ?
Bertram Jacobus: and vendy - for me , i can reduce that sentence to one word : appreciation ...
Moon Fargis: well i know the background so yes i have a idea about it, but this sentence is a expression of a special state archived by one who practised pab and tryd to express it with it intellectual mind instead with the feelings, then such sentenses appear
Moon Fargis: and people will cling to such developed sentenses and use it as "ohh look what we got"
Calvino Rabeni: I see, but ?
Moon Fargis: and then they often stop looking at themself
Vendy Walpole: in this case, what is appearance ?
Bertram Jacobus: everything
Vendy Walpole: or the Being itself?
Calvino Rabeni: Moon, I htink you might have a suggestion?
Bertram Jacobus: that´s the same
Vendy Walpole: Ok, got it :)
Bertram Jacobus: :-))
Moon Fargis: let me quote this from the Pab page at the hint section : For starters, we can consider the following working hypothesis: all that appears is (in some sense yet to be explored) presented by Being. A way to work with this working hypothesis is to do the following homework: Appreciate the presence of appearance as a presentation by Being. In many different situations, take a moment: consider all that appears both inside your own thoughts and feelings as well as in the world outside of you, and simply appreciate their presence while considering them as given (in some sense; the sense may shift) by Being.
Vendy Walpole: what would be the difference between the apprectaion and awareness then?
Qt Core: ie keep your eyes open
Vendy Walpole: appreciation*
Bertram Jacobus: awareness is more neutral to me ...
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Vendy Walpole: appreciation is connected with gratefulness?
Calvino Rabeni: Stargatem what does _/!\_ mean?
Bertram Jacobus: is very close i think
Stargate Tone: not nesessary
Stargate Tone: ...forgot the word...
Bertram Jacobus: both positive aspects, appreciation and gratefulness ...
Stargate Tone: gratefulness is sure stronger good feeling
Moon Fargis: so far we could really reduce this sentence to "Appreciate the appearance of being"
--BELL--
Moon Fargis: but thats my opinion :)
Vendy Walpole: simpler is clearer always
Stargate Tone: 'to fold hands'
Stargate Tone: >to Cal
Qt Core: never thought about gratefulness
Bertram Jacobus: i love it
Qt Core: in this
Vendy Walpole: gratefulness is often mentioned in christianity
Stargate Tone: in a way also in buddhism
Vendy Walpole: be grateful to the God for all you get from him
Qt Core: oh yes, i was speaking in regard of PaB and awareness
Vendy Walpole: yes, I know
Bertram Jacobus: i´m grateful in the direction of the universe, anyhow ... for so many things (!) ...
Calvino Rabeni: Gratefulness is a powerful enabler
Vendy Walpole: gratefulness is close to love
Vendy Walpole: and love is Being
Stargate Tone: star compares that to be 'like love'...it rises ..or not...
Stargate Tone: but even if not, one still could appreciate
Vendy Walpole: just got a thought, how could we explain the Being best?
Stargate Tone: no matter if the being is 'different'...
Vendy Walpole: is there any close explanation of Being?
Moon Fargis: is there any reason to explain being ?
Bertram Jacobus: isn´t it clear by itself vendy ? being ? simply being ? without any mysticism ?
Vendy Walpole: well, I would love to hear how other see it?
Moon Fargis: :)
Moon Fargis: just be
Moon Fargis: and never stop to be
Bertram Jacobus: i hope, my expressin satisfies you vendy (?) :-)
Bertram Jacobus: expression*
Vendy Walpole: thinking of it still :)
Vendy Walpole: so, when we play as being what happens?
Stargate Tone: star is curous why...
Vendy Walpole: why thinking star?
Stargate Tone: well...to star that expression means 'pretending'
Vendy Walpole: play as ?
Stargate Tone: that 'to play as being'
Bertram Jacobus: when we are successful in doing that i guess, we come to a form of "pureness" - may be comparable with "pure conciousness" ?
Moon Fargis: awareness
Stargate Tone: well...as to star to be is 'just to exist'...and there's no option to chooce after one has choocen to receive the present; own life...
Vendy Walpole: I read the log where was explained the dofference betwen pretending and playing cause it was something I wanted to make clear to me
Stargate Tone: so...star cannot understand that anybody could play to be as the being...
Vendy Walpole: as i understood it, can't say, totaly, it is same as - go to being state
Vendy Walpole: or play
Moon Fargis: well i think it was pema once who explained it looong time ago also as "play to be a enlighted being"
Vendy Walpole: or be aware even netter!
Vendy Walpole: better*
Stargate Tone: well...star has thought that 'wisdom' for much more than a year, but never 'got it' untill
Vendy Walpole: play as being could be - become aware of Being, and be free
Stargate Tone: would that be playing ?
Vendy Walpole: still trying to understand
Vendy Walpole: not so sure Star, perhaps, have no boundaries?
Vendy Walpole: be free?
Bertram Jacobus: i always am remembered to a part of a songtext which was "what game shall we play today" - and it was meant really spiritually too. that makes it more clear to me ...
Moon Fargis: well to play to be a enlighted beng means, to be free of your own ego and clining to expressions and ddefinitions, just to be
Bertram Jacobus: and free. yes. i think so.
Vendy Walpole: or it says - participate here at level of being
Stargate Tone: maybe there would be good to add then something like that
Bertram Jacobus: that would be one variation of play as being vendy, to me -
Vendy Walpole: yes, could be
Bertram Jacobus: :-)
Vendy Walpole: anybody want to share own pratice?
Stargate Tone: which kind of practice you mean ?
Moon Fargis: 15 seconds waking up then napping again :)
Vendy Walpole: playing as being
Vendy Walpole: in your everyday life
--BELL--
Stargate Tone: well; I learned to play to be various kind of beings in SL using different kind of Avatars...
Stargate Tone: as to me it's to play to be for example the cat
Vendy Walpole: Aree there various kinds of beings Star really? I believe it is one being
Vendy Walpole: no matter what avatar we have, the being is same
Stargate Tone: well...I'm not a cat, but a human kind being
Vendy Walpole: yes, that is what i thought
Moon Fargis: *mews*
Moon Fargis purrrrrrsssssssss
Stargate Tone: **************
Vendy Walpole: no matter what is your profession or nationality, the being is still one
Vendy Walpole: same
Vendy Walpole: or I am wrong?
Stargate Tone: ah yes; but ment that we can play in SL
Moon Fargis: yes sure you cant be someone else
Vendy Walpole: you can believe you are someone else
Vendy Walpole: but your true be is same
Moon Fargis: thats possible yes
Bertram Jacobus: you are right, but it´s not always and not in every relation easy to let go all thoses relative aspects ...
Vendy Walpole: agree Bertarm, that why I ask how do you practice and does it help you
Calvino Rabeni: And "let go" doesn't mean they will disappear, necessarily
Vendy Walpole: how do you mean Cal?
Calvino Rabeni: Well, being can encompass forms, but not vice versa. For instance, how about "Ego As Being"?
Calvino Rabeni: Know what I mean?
Bertram Jacobus: i call it "meditation" vendy and it´s my impression that it helps me . but needs a lot of time, many years to notice stronger effects. my experience only
Vendy Walpole: Ego as Being...hm, can Ego be Being?
Calvino Rabeni: I would say yes in a sense
Stargate Tone: it's always part of being
Vendy Walpole: or Ego is watched by being?
Calvino Rabeni: Because it is
Moon Fargis: whop dont flip out here : )
Bertram Jacobus: i agree calvino
Calvino Rabeni: Words don't limit being
Stargate Tone: sure ego can be watched by being; it's to watch oneself
Calvino Rabeni: Concepts don't get in the way
Bertram Jacobus: (nad star) ;o)
Calvino Rabeni: Because they can coexist
Bertram Jacobus: and*
Bertram Jacobus: what is the flip out point in your opinion moon here ? :-)
Moon Fargis: ahhh just saw that brainstorming again :)
Vendy Walpole: Bertram , you says neditation helps you, can you share with us in what way it helps you?
Vendy Walpole: say meditation*
Vendy Walpole: (please correct my spelling later :)
Moon Fargis: typos are delivered as own creations of the autor :)
Vendy Walpole: haha, I give up of such creations easily
Calvino Rabeni: It seems a wast of time to correct them, is there a reason for it?
Vendy Walpole: to get flow ot thoughts
Stargate Tone: sometimes there is
Vendy Walpole: easier floe
Bertram Jacobus: my impression is, that it gives me a kind of additional space (to which i am taught that it is always already there, but i find it finally more and more). so freedom raises and a possible distance to all the clinging ... is that understandable ?
Vendy Walpole: they make distractions
Stargate Tone: for example this typo; one means to say 'now' but typo is 'not'....that can mix the whole sentence
Calvino Rabeni: Not necessarily - I thnkk a reader can easily understand what is meant.
Stargate Tone: depends on the reader
Vendy Walpole: I understand what you mean Bertram by additional space
Stargate Tone: specially when one's first language is not english
Bertram Jacobus: feeling becomes wider ...
Vendy Walpole: It is what i feel when practice 9 seconds, get limitless space
Moon Fargis: :)
Stargate Tone: and one is not clear of the typos created person's will
Stargate Tone: do you get that limitless space , or is it only feeling of such ?
Moon Fargis: so there i want to add that i practised zazen before i started with pab, and it always sayd for me that pab has the same effects as zazen for me, its just another timing to have it
Vendy Walpole: I am in it
Calvino Rabeni: Logs can be cleaned by the owner of the session.
Vendy Walpole: I believe I am in that space star then
Bertram Jacobus: your questions seems very inspired to me vendy. is this your everyday state or more special this morning ? :-)
Vendy Walpole: (I prefer my lines to be corrected)
Moon Fargis: well everyone can freely edit the logs^^
Calvino Rabeni: Your lines are perfect in that limitless space :)
Vendy Walpole: we are not same each day, but these questions are most of the time in my mind and many others
Stargate Tone: (star cannot)
Vendy Walpole: I just do not have time to ask all :))
Bertram Jacobus: nice. ty vendy for it
Vendy Walpole: ty ytoo
--BELL--
Stargate Tone: is there truly limitless space in Universe for anybody to exist ?
Calvino Rabeni: It seems to me, zazen practice has a culture around it that is different than Play As Being
Vendy Walpole: tell us more Cal please
Moon Fargis: yes sure cal but that dont influence the effects of it just the way todo
Bertram Jacobus: my impression is yes star
Qt Core: time to go, bye all
Bertram Jacobus: by qt. have a nice day ! :-)
Moon Fargis: bye qt ^^
Vendy Walpole: Bye Qt, see you
Stargate Tone: _/!\_ Wt
Calvino Rabeni: BYe bert
Stargate Tone: Qt
Calvino Rabeni: I ment qt
Calvino Rabeni: Can someone explain the environment here?
Bertram Jacobus: ah okay :-)
Moon Fargis: snow
Moon Fargis: winter
Moon Fargis: :)
Vendy Walpole: what is the difference between zen and paB Cal?
Bertram Jacobus: moon makes it cal ... ;-)
Stargate Tone: (Moon's cretions for Avatar to wear)
Calvino Rabeni: Plants inside, snow under the roof, cannot tell where the boundary is
Bertram Jacobus: lol
Moon Fargis: no boundarys, perfect
Vendy Walpole: snow always brings me state of peace
Bertram Jacobus: pab seems to be very modern to me
Calvino Rabeni: Erlier today I was wishing for a variation to this place - now here it is!
Stargate Tone: well...if somebody could explane me what BaP truly is...
Vendy Walpole: I also imagined this place as a coffee shop
Bertram Jacobus: and from a kind of science view vendy (pab) ...
Vendy Walpole: I see Bert
Bertram Jacobus: and it´s a sort of way to being as well as zen or so many other relgions and phlosophies, too ...
Vendy Walpole: but the point is we become aware of now and here as it is in buddhism?
Bertram Jacobus: the zen background is japanese as we all may know ... if i don´t fail i hope ...
Stargate Tone: do U Bert know some philosophy to be as the philosophy of PaB ?
Bertram Jacobus: i think yes vendy
Moon Fargis: bert: more or less yes :)
Bertram Jacobus: i expected such a comment moon (!) ;o)
Calvino Rabeni: Star, part of it is to see everything that is, as natural, and see the being in it wothout trying to control it
Vendy Walpole: I am just thinking how these snowflakes help me stay in present moment
Moon Fargis: but the effects to you, wich is VERRRY important NEVER have to be set to a rule for others, like in zen and like in Pab, everyone gets other experiences
Stargate Tone: that's the philosophy of PaB to you Cal ?
Moon Fargis: we can find some terms that are true for most but not for all
Calvino Rabeni: it is an idea that I find helpful, but not a forumula for people to try to follow
Vendy Walpole: Ah, Cal, I did like a lot your synergysm therm you mentioned short time ago
Stargate Tone: the idea sure is good, but have you found that to be PaB philosophy ?
Bertram Jacobus: i´m not very experiences in philosophy star, but for example i like exisentialism in a way. there also many aspects are let left aside too to come to a more free life feeling is my impression for example ...
Calvino Rabeni: It is how I interpret some of the descriptions of others.
Stargate Tone: that still dont tell it to be PaB philosophy...
Vendy Walpole: How do you see PaB philosophy Star?
Calvino Rabeni: I don't think you will find PAB philosophy as a definition
Stargate Tone: ah; as I truly have never heared any explonation to what PaB is
Stargate Tone: well; as I dont see there to be any....
Vendy Walpole: there is a lot of explantion on the site
Vendy Walpole: have you found it there?
Calvino Rabeni: It is explanation, yes, and kind of suggestive
Moon Fargis: well
Stargate Tone: yet; many ppl asks for example the topic as 'PaB topic'....
Moon Fargis: wen either can explain Wab as we cant explain Zen
Calvino Rabeni: but it would probably be misleading to make a tight definition
Moon Fargis: we can explain the practise
Moon Fargis: and some facts what happens to us
Calvino Rabeni: Yes that is good approach
Moon Fargis: but the explaination one finds from the practise is his verry own
Calvino Rabeni: But alsy a person has to DO it to "Get" it
Vendy Walpole: I see that explanations as start only for each of us and we should travel our own journey and share the "adventures"
Calvino Rabeni: Nicely put
Vendy Walpole: that wouldbe the gate :)
Vendy Walpole: ty
Stargate Tone: well...that's limited what one is allowed to share in PaB
Calvino Rabeni: not so much,star
--BELL--
Vendy Walpole: thank you Moon for this peaceful winter surrounding
Moon Fargis: yw :)
Calvino Rabeni: You could share anything, if...
Vendy Walpole: (without the music even more peacefull)
Stargate Tone: experienced otherwise Cal
Stargate Tone: but...never mind
Bertram Jacobus: ty all for the nice sunday morning talk ! ... :-)
Vendy Walpole: Oh, time for cleaning the house!!!
Vendy Walpole: sighs
Moon Fargis: ^^ was nice to see you
Stargate Tone: enjoy Vendy
Moon Fargis: hehe happy cleaning :)
Calvino Rabeni: Bye Bert
Stargate Tone: was nice to see :)*
Vendy Walpole: I enjoyed with you all
Bertram Jacobus: may all beings be happy ! ... ;-)
Vendy Walpole: Bye and hope see you soon
Vendy Walpole: nice Sunday!!!
Stargate Tone: _/!\_ Bert
Moon Fargis: ^^/
Moon Fargis: i also should head back to do some work
Calvino Rabeni: Still puzzled over the punctuation, stargate
Calvino Rabeni: it is a computer thing?
Stargate Tone: sry...donno those words...a moment
Stargate Tone: puzzled
Stargate Tone: punctuation
Stargate Tone: ahh
Calvino Rabeni: _/!\_ = what?
Stargate Tone: that u dont understand this _/!\_
Moon Fargis: ahhh
Calvino Rabeni: yes
Stargate Tone: to join hands the buddhist way
Calvino Rabeni: oh very nice
Calvino Rabeni: TY
Stargate Tone: _/!\_
Moon Fargis: ok my friends was nice to see you all and hope to see you soon ^^
Calvino Rabeni: Moon good to meet you
Moon Fargis: same here have a nice day
Stargate Tone: was very nice to meet U too Cal *
Calvino Rabeni: See you again I hope