2008.12.19 19:00 - mai`kai pe hea `oe?

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    Adelene was the guardian this evening.  She sent me, Pema, the chat log, I put it up and added a title.

    Adelene Dawner giggles.
    stevenaia Michinaga: ...smile
    Adelene Dawner: How goes, Steve?
    stevenaia Michinaga: good, let me remove my skates... was skating with Storm earlier
    Adelene Dawner: ahh ^.^
    stevenaia Michinaga: what's up with you
    Adelene Dawner: not much new - life proceeds apace.
    stevenaia Michinaga: :)
    Adelene Dawner yawns and rests her head on her forepaws.
    Adelene Dawner: aww...
    Adelene Dawner is doing some 'net surfing with StumbleUpon, and found an interesting YouTube video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kAVVyjRY42s
    Adelene Dawner: It turned out to be a commercial, but for the first part, my reaction was "holy crap! somebody gets it!"
    stevenaia Michinaga: hehe, well ad agencies usually do
    Adelene Dawner: mm.
    stevenaia Michinaga: light turn out tonight, I;m going to take off
    Adelene Dawner: Sounds good. See you tomorrow. :)
    stevenaia Michinaga: see you soon I;m sure
    Adelene Dawner: ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: hi Adelene
    Adelene Dawner: how goes?
    Pila Mulligan: mai`kai
    Pila Mulligan: pe hea `oe?
    Pila Mulligan: fine -- how are you in hawaiian
    Adelene Dawner: ah ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Adelene Dawner: good. tired.
    Pila Mulligan: yes, I had abusy day also
    Pila Mulligan: yep
    Pila Mulligan: I got to the 2:00 discussion quite late -- did you go?
    Pila Mulligan: about the phenomenology expereiment
    Adelene Dawner: nope. I wasn't home yet... not especially interested in any case tho.
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Pila Mulligan: when I arrived the focus was on relating to a pen :)
    Pila Mulligan: as an experiment
    Adelene Dawner: ah :)
    Pila Mulligan: being one with the pen :)
    Adelene Dawner is amused...
    Pila Mulligan: may were -- and dubious also
    Pila Mulligan: many*
    Pila Mulligan: however, it is going forward so we shall see
    Adelene Dawner: In he sense that I'm one with the pen, I'm always one with the pen, aware or not. In the sense that I am not one with the pen, that's also always true.
    Pila Mulligan: yes, it may be more valuable to try being one with a bird, or a cat or dog, or a tree -- at least they are not inanimate
    Adelene Dawner: ...valuable?
    Pila Mulligan: they may wink at you or something
    Pila Mulligan: the pen will just sit there, unresponsive
    Adelene Dawner chuckles and shakes her head knowingly.
    Adelene Dawner: ...do you make art, in any sense, Pila?
    Pila Mulligan: hmm, not really -- I write, but for lawyers and it is more technical than artcistic
    Adelene Dawner: Ah.
    Pila Mulligan: are you an artist?
    Adelene Dawner: Very much so, in many mediums.
    Pila Mulligan: cool
    Pila Mulligan: so maybe the pen is responsive?
    Adelene Dawner: mmhmm ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: well, there you are :)
    Pila Mulligan: I was excludinh a reality by my suppositions
    Adelene Dawner: Even with animals, humans... almost all of what we think we know, is our own ideas of the person, not objective reality...
    Adelene Dawner: but that's still considered 'real' for functional uses... so why not, with an inanimate object?
    Pila Mulligan: yes, I am quite sensitive to animals, and I believe your analysis is correct as to the ordinary view of pets and such as dumb beings
    Pila Mulligan: I had just not thought of a pen or brush as contributing to the art, but now II correct my first impression
    Adelene Dawner: ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: and I now recall haveing met sculptors telling me that the medium tells them the result
    Adelene Dawner nods.
    Pila Mulligan: it emerges from theinanimate substance
    Adelene Dawner: It is suggested in the nature of the materials, yes.
    Pila Mulligan: lawyers unfrotunately are not similar
    Pila Mulligan: :)
    Adelene Dawner: :)
    Pila Mulligan: I wonder how many perople in the expereiment will reflect these thoughts in their expereinces
    Pila Mulligan: some will, I suspect
    Adelene Dawner: probably ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: as you said earlier, if can can , it not not
    Pila Mulligan: an old Hawaiian saying by the way
    Adelene Dawner: ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: one of the most exciting things I have done was swimining in the ocean -- deep far off shore, with a scholl of several hundred dolphins
    Pila Mulligan: thier energy was powerful beyond description
    Pila Mulligan: just exciting
    Adelene Dawner: ooo
    Pila Mulligan: and they would swim by wihtin less than a foot, but if I reached out they would move just enough to keep the same distance
    Adelene Dawner: hehe
    Pila Mulligan: and they would look right at you as they swam by with very cheerful and knowing eyes
    Adelene Dawner: ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: the school was in a hurry tog et some place evidently because they moved by quickly en masse
    Adelene Dawner nods.
    Adelene Dawner: I wish I had more meaningful interactions with animals... the opportunities for that are so rare any more, though, unless I wanted to go work at a zoo or something.
    Pila Mulligan: it is not unusual for dolpinhs to stay with stranded or injured whales or even humans to protect them from sharks
    Adelene Dawner: I've heard that, yeah.
    Pila Mulligan: yes, being in touch with animals can be quite menaingful
    Adelene Dawner: not just 'being in touch with'...
    Pila Mulligan: communing :)
    Pila Mulligan: do you have any pets
    Adelene Dawner: one of the most meaningful experiences I've had with an animal was with Twinkle, a cat we used to have at work... that little fuzz-butt adored me, and over the course of 6 months or so I trained her to go from being terrified to leave the actvity room, to being willing and even sometimes eager to sit on a cart and go around hte building with me, to hang out with the residents.
    Pila Mulligan: cool
    Adelene Dawner: I miss that lumpy beast. *wistful simle*
    Adelene Dawner: She passed away almost two years ago - cancer.
    Pila Mulligan: horses also get a bum rap as being dumb animals, but they are actually quite smart
    Adelene Dawner nods.
    Adelene Dawner: Most animals are way smarter than thy get credit for.
    Pila Mulligan: yes
    Adelene Dawner: Mostly because the kind of intelignece is different...
    Adelene Dawner: Ever heard of Clever Hans?
    Adelene Dawner: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clever_Hans
    Pila Mulligan: no, let me take a ppek
    Adelene Dawner: He was a horse who could supposedly do math. They eventuall discovered that he couldn't do math, but was picking up on his owner's involuntary and imperceptable-to-humans body language to know when the right answer had been given.
    Pila Mulligan: cool
    Adelene Dawner: The body language reading thing seems even more impressive than the math thing, to me. ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: you said earlier we have our own ideas of an object, but not objective reality ... Hans was CLerver even wihtout being able to add :)
    Pila Mulligan: yes, my point also
    Adelene Dawner: ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: have you seen the video (from THailand I beleive) of an elephant pdrawing a self-portrait?
    Adelene Dawner: I think so.
    Pila Mulligan: real video, not cartoon or fake
    Pila Mulligan: it is remarkanbel -- POicasso like, very senitive
    Pila Mulligan: Icasoo*
    Pila Mulligan: whatever
    Adelene Dawner: I'm aware that they paint, and some paint pictures - not surprised to hear of a self-portrait but not sure whether I'd alreadh heard about that or not.
    Pila Mulligan: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=He7Ge7Sogrk
    Pila Mulligan: here it is
    Adelene Dawner: silly humans in the background, going 'wow'.
    Pila Mulligan: :) isn't that cool :)
    Pila Mulligan: the painting that is
    Adelene Dawner: mmhmm ^.^
    Adelene Dawner props up her droopy eyelids...
    Pila Mulligan: that elephant made good art
    Adelene Dawner: mmhmm ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: well, it is diner time here, so paerhpas the tiring day should end :)
    Adelene Dawner: ok ^.^ cya around ^.^
    Pila Mulligan: nice to visit with you Adelene -- see you next time

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