2008.12.29 13:00 - In Being, There is Openness and Nonattachment.

Stim was the guardian that night. He sent me, Pema, the chat log, which I put up. I also provided the title.

Stim Morane: Hi Wester
Wester Kiranov: hi stim
Stim Morane: how are you today?
Wester Kiranov: I'm OK, a bit tired. How are you?
Stim Morane: the same.
Lia Rikugun: hello
Stim Morane: Hi Lia and Adams
Adams Dubrovna: Hello Stim, Lia and Wester :)
Stim Morane: So ... any observations, questions, asides?
Adams Dubrovna: Hello Corvi :)
Adams Dubrovna: I'm not sure what I know what to ask Stim :)
Stim Morane: Hi Corvi!
Stim Morane: It's fine just to sit, of course.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi all
Lia Rikugun: if find it difficult to stop every 15 minutes for me it is easier to take 10 minutes time during the day
Lia Rikugun: hello
Adams Dubrovna: wb Corvi :)
Wester Kiranov: I actually find it easier to stop every 15 minutes - not through all the day, but the quieter parts
Stim Morane: Lia, you mean you spend about 10 consecutive minutes on the exercise?
Lia Rikugun: i did today yes
Adams Dubrovna: I find sometimes it is easy to stop and other times it is better to do longer stops less frequently
Adams Dubrovna: Hello Doug :
Stim Morane: Hi Doug
Lia Rikugun: i somehow have the impression i can have a "deeper" feeling
Lia Rikugun: hello
doug Sosa: hi all.
Wester Kiranov: Lia: How is your experience different when you do 10 minutes at once?
Lia Rikugun: i was am maybe more able to detach from every thoughts and problems i have
Lia Rikugun: by taking more time
Lia Rikugun: and leabing everything behind
Lia Rikugun: leaving
Lia Rikugun: detaching everything
Lia Rikugun: how are your experiences?
doug Sosa: is the purpose of PaB to deatch from everyhting,or to drop assumptions so we can see what is? Not to avoid but to encounter?
Adams Dubrovna: we can see more clearly as we drop things
Wester Kiranov: I don't think detachment is the point of PaB, although it does depend on exactly what you mean by detachement.
Stim Morane: Yes.
Adams Dubrovna: Hello Tarmel :)
Tarmel Udimo: hello alll
Stim Morane: Hi Tarmel!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi, (Doug I'm sorry I missed saying hi when you first got here) and Tarmel.
Tarmel Udimo: no worries
Lia Rikugun: so how would you define PaB wester
Lia Rikugun: do you think i am not on the correct way?
Lia Rikugun: if i detach from thoughts
Adams Dubrovna: It seems to be there is no correct way Lia
Lia Rikugun: :)
Wester Kiranov: words are so tricky here
Lia Rikugun: or no wrong one
Adams Dubrovna: yes Wester they are
Wester Kiranov: But - would Being detach from things?
Stim Morane: That is not possible.
Stim Morane: But in Being, there is openness and nonattachment.
Wester Kiranov: True - i forgot :)
Stim Morane: Again, much depends on what we're saying when we use words like "detach".
Stim Morane: Lia, your experience is consistent with traditional perspectives. It often does take time to settle down, regain composure and perspective.
Stim Morane: The PaB “9 seconds every 15 minutes” approach may itself eventually make more sustained awareness in ordinary life possible, so the two orientations may merge.
Lia Rikugun: tomorrow i will try the 9 secs 15 mins again
Lia Rikugun: :)
Lia Rikugun: see what the differences may be
Adams Dubrovna: :)
Stim Morane: It's good to try different approaches.
Stim Morane: Yes.
Stim Morane: Each person is different.
doug Sosa: ggggg
Stim Morane: ?
doug Sosa: oops, sorry.
Stim Morane: I thought you had a text abbreviation I wasn't aware of.
Stim Morane: :)
doug Sosa: wish i had,no, dropped my mouse :)
Tarmel Udimo: smiles
Tarmel Udimo: not to drop the tone of PaB but can you believe another year is almost over?
Lia Rikugun: :) yes wow in 2 days
Stim Morane: I feel like I lost 7 months or so
Adams Dubrovna still trying to realize he is living in a new millenium
Lia Rikugun: why 7 months?
Stim Morane: just an estimate. The year did go by very quickly for me.
Lia Rikugun: haha ok
Adams Dubrovna: I have been in PaB 7 months :)
Stim Morane: Interesting ...
Tarmel Udimo: new millenium - yes amazing remember all that fuss about computers rolling over in 2000?
Tarmel Udimo: was there even SL then?
Adams Dubrovna: :)
Tarmel Udimo: just checked SL was born in June 2003
doug Sosa: i have been in the 9 sec perhaps 200 times. That is about half an hour :)
Tarmel Udimo: its only 5 yeras old
Tarmel Udimo: *years
Lia Rikugun: 200 times? how mayn times per day :P
Tarmel Udimo: could you give us an overview Doug?
doug Sosa: oh beween zero and eight. av aout 2.
doug Sosa: over view of ?
Tarmel Udimo: your 200 9 secs Pabs
doug Sosa: you mean what i learned?
Wester Kiranov: I'm off for the dutch evening at kira café now - see you all later.
Lia Rikugun: bye
Adams Dubrovna: bye Wester :)
Tarmel Udimo: bye wester
Wester Kiranov: namaste
doug Sosa: -/\-
Tarmel Udimo: what you learned or any morsel you may wish to share doug
doug Sosa: well. we each have a slightly diffent approah. for me it wa to keep doing what i am doing but
doug Sosa: drop all assumptions, and observe without focus.
doug Sosa: i found
doug Sosa: that this easily becomes part of normal time and maes life a lot more relaxed and healthy feeling.
doug Sosa: bout it.
Lia Rikugun: relaxed
Lia Rikugun: this is true for me too
Tarmel Udimo: yes I found this too
Lia Rikugun: how long have you been doing PaB tarmel?
Tarmel Udimo: do you also meditate
Tarmel Udimo: since I joined about 2 months
Lia Rikugun: what have you learned tarmel?
Lia Rikugun: or did u have any experiences you want to share with us?
Lia Rikugun: :)
Tarmel Udimo: hummm its similer to Doug, I guess I don't limit myself to 9 secs
Tarmel Udimo: its part of my daily 'work' to try and stay focused
Tarmel Udimo: but what's great about PaB is its a short cut key for remembering to refocus
Lia Rikugun: yes
Lia Rikugun: and see everything more lightly
Lia Rikugun: as an observer
Lia Rikugun: somehow
doug Sosa: slighly different. i use pab to unfocus,to take the tension of focu out,drop expectations and assumptions and *see*.
Tarmel Udimo: better put - I should use the word see because that's what I meant by focus
doug Sosa: impotant to undersand focus.t is a narrowing of the muscles of the eyes (and mind) to a particular part of the total field.it takes effort, and it is painful.
doug Sosa: sometimes necessary but also costly.
Adams Dubrovna: ouch
Tarmel Udimo: yes execpt I do ind that one has to continuously refresh the seeing ie its not a habitual way for me yet
Tarmel Udimo: perhaps this is too focused :-)
Adams Dubrovna: as Stim noted, we have different needs
doug Sosa: thtat's why 9 sec. it is enough to shift awareness and feel the greater encompasing of what is.
Adams Dubrovna: yes
Tarmel Udimo: yes perhaps I am overdoing it
Adams Dubrovna: It changes for me so often
Adams Dubrovna: what I am doing that is
Adams Dubrovna: I started knowing nothing about meditation
Adams Dubrovna: and have had to learn things about myself along the way
Tarmel Udimo: me too
Adams Dubrovna: so it has been a bot more of a journey for me
Adams Dubrovna: but
Adams Dubrovna: bit
Adams Dubrovna: :)
Adams Dubrovna: Hello Allan :)
Stim Morane: Hi Allan
Lia Rikugun: hello allan
Allan Whiteberry: Hello eveyone
Tarmel Udimo: yes I guess that's what I've been trying to do because ultimately in the seeing it is not an isolated moment in time
Tarmel Udimo: hi corvi we lost you...
Adams Dubrovna: wb Corvi :)
Corvuscorva Nightfire: me nods..crashed.
Corvuscorva Nightfire: thanks.
Adams Dubrovna: I find the regular stopping gets me a little closer to that Tarmel
Tarmel Udimo: closer to discovering more about yourself?
Adams Dubrovna: closer to concentrating on the moment
Adams Dubrovna: on the present
Lia Rikugun: thats true we tend to live in the past and in teh future
Lia Rikugun: this is what i realize too
doug Sosa: interestng because neither exists.
Lia Rikugun: the here and now
Lia Rikugun: ;)
doug Sosa: here and now is also an idea.
Allan Whiteberry: How long is the here and now?
Allan Whiteberry: one minute?
Adams Dubrovna: :)
Adams Dubrovna: an etgrnity Allan :)
Tarmel Udimo: yes I am talking about the present moment by moment and many things arise within the present
Allan Whiteberry: then it includes past and future
doug Sosa: all thee are ideas,no? our experience is clear, but what is it? these words don't fit verywell.
Adams Dubrovna: In the right fframe of mind it seems we can reach out and touch eternity
Tarmel Udimo: we live in it
doug Sosa: maybe even the presen :)
Adams Dubrovna: :)
doug Sosa: the PaB for me is to relook at what is, to oen up to new ways of thiking about what we experience.
Adams Dubrovna: appreciate the presentations of appearance :)
Adams Dubrovna: I must go back to RL. bye evryone :)
Lia Rikugun: bye
Tarmel Udimo: bye adam
Allan Whiteberry: bye Adam
Stim Morane: Bye Adams
Lia Rikugun: me too soon
Lia Rikugun: :)
Tarmel Udimo: he PaB for me is to relook at what is, to oen up to new ways of thiking about what we experience.
Tarmel Udimo: yes this if ind too and within the looking do emotions arise for you doug?
Corvuscorva Nightfire: for me they do, Tarmel.
Lia Rikugun: hello
Sunyatta Navarathna: Hi
Stim Morane: Hi Sunyatta
Tarmel Udimo: hi sun
Corvuscorva Nightfire: Hi
Allan Whiteberry: Hi
Stim Morane: I will have to leave now. Thanks for the discussion everyone!
Corvuscorva Nightfire: bye, Stim.
Tarmel Udimo: yes emotions arise for me and i tyr to see them with PaB eyes :-)
Stim Morane: If you stay on for a while, would one of you send me the last bit of the log?
Tarmel Udimo: bye stim
Lia Rikugun: i think i need to leave too