2009.11.27 07:00 - From Having to Being to Exercising

    Table of contents
    No headers

    The Guardian for this meeting was Pema Pera. The comments are by Pema Pera.

    Widget Whiteberry: good morning
    Qt Core: Hi all
    Pema Pera: good morning Widget, and good afternoon, Qt!
    Qt Core: ty pema good ... depending where in the wordl you are today pema ;-)
    Pema Pera: haha, morning here
    Pema Pera: I'm still at home in New York
    Pema Pera: next week I'll be in Japan again
    Qt Core: (japan, the only country i really would like to visit)
    Widget Whiteberry: that's a lot of time in transit
    Pema Pera: yes, but I'm used to it by now, Widget
    Widget Whiteberry: I'm still hovering on the edges of PaB .... what for the two of you, makes for a good hour here?
    Widget Whiteberry: edges of understanding ...
    Pema Pera: many possibilities, Widget
    Widget Whiteberry nods enocouragingly
    Pema Pera: most importantly, if you have some questions, or comments, or something you'd like to share, please go right ahead!
    Qt Core: a way to force myself to be quieter and more open
    Widget Whiteberry thinks she just did
    Pema Pera: hahaha
    Widget Whiteberry: ^^
    Pema Pera: well, have you been playing a bit with the notion of "dropping what you have to see what you are"? That may be a fun topic!
    Pema Pera: hi Calvino!
    Widget Whiteberry: I have not!
    Qt Core: i calvino
    Pema Pera: have you tried the 9 seconds breaks in general?
    Widget Whiteberry: yes
    Widget Whiteberry: frequently
    Pema Pera: how did that go?
    Pema Pera: or how does that go?
    Widget Whiteberry: ☆smiles☆
    Pema Pera: :)
    Widget Whiteberry: for me, they are a moment to center myself
    Widget Whiteberry: and let go of whatever is occupying my attention
    Pema Pera: ah, you see, a shift from what you have to what you are -- you've secretly been doing it already :-)
    Widget Whiteberry: lol
    Widget Whiteberry: how clever I am!
    Indeed :-), and there are so many ways to do these explorations, each of us in our own way, which makes it fascinating, and also challenging, to compare these different ways.
    Qt Core: in the last days i used them to drop some nervousness coming from frequent (and sometimes useless) meeting
    Pema Pera: :)
    Widget Whiteberry: meetings sometimes do that to me too
    Pema Pera: what happens then, Qt?
    Widget Whiteberry: Good day, arch mage
    Pema Pera: hi Arch!
    Widget Whiteberry: Fael!
    Qt Core: then i can start doing whet we decided without being angry if i didn't liked the solution ;-)
    Pema Pera: hi Fael!
    Qt Core: hi arch, fael
    Fael Illyar: Hi Everyone :)
    Pema Pera: yes, Qt, and this goes back to this notion of dropping what you have
    Archmage Atlantis: Greetings all
    Pema Pera: normally we see "I am angry" with the "am" seeming to indicate that we are really stuck to it
    Widget Whiteberry: so a solution to a problem is a thing I have..... interesting notion
    Pema Pera: I "am" angry
    Pema Pera: but in fact you can also view the anger as a kind of coat you are temporarily wearing
    Qt Core: (but i still wich for a pungingball, sometimes )
    Qt Core: wish
    Pema Pera: you try it on and then you can take it off again
    Pema Pera: so centering means finding your real core, underneath the anger
    Widget Whiteberry: Qt, that wish for a punchigball is a biochemical signal from your body - running a flight of stairs helps
    Widget Whiteberry: or even walking one a few times
    Qt Core: yes, like finding the floor in low sea after the floating sand drops
    Widget Whiteberry: anger creates chemical changes and strenuous large muscle exercise helpss to reset yourself
    Widget Whiteberry wonders if she a committed a fauz paux
    Pema Pera: how so, Widget?
    Widget Whiteberry: the silence that followed my statement, Pema
    Pema Pera: :-)
    Pema Pera: perhaps we were all pondering, Widget :)
    The topic switches to physical exercise.
    Qt Core: whichever large muscle exercise is mentioned to me i'm scared ;-) jk
    Widget Whiteberry: :(
    Widget Whiteberry: ☆smiles☆
    Qt Core: whenever
    Widget Whiteberry: lol Qt
    Widget Whiteberry: no dancing? no brisk walks?
    Qt Core: but i agree
    Qt Core: dancing... no, never, not even in sl if avoidable
    Widget Whiteberry: you deprive yourself
    Widget Whiteberry: of several of lifes simpler pleasures
    Widget Whiteberry: imco
    Qt Core: reminishing about the times i went to the gym (i hated it but i needed... well i steel may need it)
    Widget Whiteberry: the gym isn't much fun for me, but it is efficient
    Widget Whiteberry: and going regularly effects my mindset
    Widget Whiteberry: outlook, temperment, etc
    Qt Core: i disliked most exercise as the would not fully "entrap" me
    Widget Whiteberry: entrap?
    Qt Core: but the only one that did that ... i sometimes was loosing mi mind for many minutes
    Qt Core: took all my attention
    Widget Whiteberry nods
    Widget Whiteberry: for the shorter gym exercises, I concentrate on aligning my body so as not to injure myself and then I count and breathe
    Fael Illyar: yes... interesting how the mind refuses to stay silent... unless there is something to do.
    Qt Core: this kind of equipment: http://munfitnessblog.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/08/elliptical-exercise-machine-cross-trainer.jpg is the one i liked
    Widget Whiteberry: for the longer ones - cardio - I find it necessary to focus on something else
    Qt Core: i'm not speaking about the girl ;-)
    Widget Whiteberry: the girl is beautiful to look at, and that's the one I use for longer periods - and need to focus attention elsewhere for periods of time
    Qt Core: girls at the gym are far too dstracting the only solution for me is not to wear glasses while there
    Widget Whiteberry: ☆smiles☆
    Widget Whiteberry: not inspiring?
    Qt Core: btw, the main difference of that exercise, both phisically and mentally is that it gives some feedback, the thing keeps mooving so you are somewhat pushed to move and as all the limb are working almost guided the brain can stop/shut himself
    Widget Whiteberry nods
    Pema Pera: yes, like bicycling or swimming
    Fael Illyar: now... why can't the brain stop/shut without that?
    Qt Core: even more, letting drowing aside you can stop at a moment notice swimming/cycling
    Qt Core: and you have to actively start each movement
    Widget Whiteberry: so much of what our brains do is not accessible to conscious thought .... so I wonder about 'shutting down' ....
    Widget Whiteberry: maybe it's a slowing down of the firing rate of some synapses
    Widget Whiteberry needs to read a lot* more
    Pema Pera: or we can just work with thoughts -- we talk about the brain, but we only experience experiences :)
    Widget Whiteberry nods
    Returning briefly to having vs. being.
    Pema Pera: Coming back to our previous discussion: another way to describe the move from having to being: it goes in the other direction from most traditions.
    Widget Whiteberry: how so?
    Pema Pera: Usually the idea is to view yourself as very limited and in need of something, reaching out to something else outside of you: a God or an idea of enlightenment or a future better world
    Pema Pera: But here we view what we have as limited, and as not-us, as outside us, with what we really are at the core.
    Pema Pera: So rather than reaching out, we use the 9 seconds to center and come home to what we already are.
    Widget Whiteberry: ohhhh, that* is a helpful idea
    Pema Pera: and u c u already did that :-)
    Widget Whiteberry grins
    Pema Pera: as for what Qt said about thoughts slowing down, become more quiet: it's generally the thoughts at the outside, so to speak, that are loudest, it seems
    Pema Pera: at the very core of our being the thoughts are softer, in fact often wordless
    Pema Pera: hi Hana!
    Hana Furlough: hi everyone~
    Widget Whiteberry: Hi!
    Pema Pera: wb Hana!
    Qt Core: hi hana
    Hana Furlough: thanks, but not quite back yet
    Hana Furlough: : )
    Pema Pera: still in Europe?
    Fael Illyar: Hello Hana :)
    Hana Furlough: yep
    Pema Pera: Greece?
    Hana Furlough: yes!
    Qt Core: i think that most if no all of the more internal thought have just one volume level, all the louder are more or less tied to recent external inputs
    Pema Pera: at the next break, we can do a little exploration, watching thoughts arise
    Pema Pera: have you done that here already, Widget?
    Widget Whiteberry: hmm, not well, Pema
    Pema Pera: the idea is to just watch thoughts come and go
    Widget Whiteberry nods
    Pema Pera: thoughts and emotions and memories, anything the mind produces
    Pema Pera: but without holding on to any of them
    Widget Whiteberry: and not engage with any of it, right
    Pema Pera: and without judging
    Widget Whiteberry: ☆smiles☆
    Pema Pera: yes indeed
    Widget Whiteberry: like the space shuttle just landing
    Pema Pera: we can use the 90 seconds coming up to do that again
    Widget Whiteberry: that* got my attention
    Qt Core: and not actively ask for any of them i suppose
    Pema Pera: landing with only one chance :-)
    Pema Pera: indeed, Qt
    Archmage Atlantis: All are different
    Widget Whiteberry: in SL , there are so many channels pouring info in my direction
    Qt Core: the issua of i don't think, i don't think i din't think about apples... and boom a big red apple in fron of your inner eye
    Hana Furlough: that's it
    Pema Pera: so let's just watch the coming and going of thoughts -- see whether we can just follow them, without manipulating
    Many of us reported what they experienced.
    Fael Illyar: silent cacophony :)
    Pema Pera: :)
    Hana Furlough: the best kind
    Qt Core: a colorful pause i kept thinking about the colors of arch's shirt, the grass and... pema's air
    Qt Core: hair
    Widget Whiteberry: I wondered if there were a bell to signal the end, so I opened my eyes, turned sounds on and then drifted
    Fael Illyar: I watched the screen, listening to the silent cacophony :)
    Widget Whiteberry: I listened to the birds
    Widget Whiteberry: once I turned sounds on
    Pema Pera: I got quite a cold the last few days. I played with switching between identifying with my sore throat as a center point, and letting it all just be, letting the feelings come and go, around me so to speak.
    Widget Whiteberry: and gargled with hot salt water, I hope
    Widget Whiteberry is such* a nurturer
    Pema Pera: now that's an idea :)
    Widget Whiteberry: especially if you are about to travel
    Pema Pera: oh, still five days away, fortunately!
    Fael Illyar: I've felt like I was getting a cold several times but each time it's been gone pretty fast.
    Widget Whiteberry: sometimes, some bug sneaks up on me
    Qt Core: between the lovely birds and the water jets that seem to becominh shorter and shorter but it never change height i lose myself often here (that is where i am when i stay silent for long times (mostly)
    Widget Whiteberry: other times, when I'm paying attemtion, I seem to be able to act quickly and effectively
    Widget Whiteberry: I see that too, Qt
    Calvino Rabeni: PAB is a kind of laboratory, is interesting like that
    Pema Pera: yes, inviting you to use your whole life as a lab
    Calvino Rabeni: Can choose what parameters to change
    Calvino Rabeni: and what to hold steady
    Calvino Rabeni: it is less like meditation than expermientation
    Pema Pera: yes, all that you ever experience is experiences, even though we label it as this and that
    Calvino Rabeni: thought experiments
    Pema Pera: so when we look at our life as a stream of experiences, we have a lot of leeway to play with it
    Pema Pera: (not meant that we would be stand-off-ish)
    Pema Pera: (in fact, in some ways relating to experiences as experiences can feel more intimate)
    Calvino Rabeni: no, we are embedded
    Pema Pera: and when I realize that "I" is also an experience, a lot opens up . . . .
    Fael Illyar: words are an attempt to categorize experiences
    Calvino Rabeni: or to commuincate experiences
    Widget Whiteberry nods
    Calvino Rabeni: or to create experiences
    Pema Pera: or judge experiences :)
    Fael Illyar: mix would be more accurate perhaps
    On the distinction between experiences and appearances.
    Pema Pera: I used the word "experiences" but "appearances" would have been more accurate. An experience has an experiencer who experiences, a subject/object structure. Appearances don't have to conform to that, they are more primordial. There is the appearance of an experiencer-experiencing-experience triad.
    Qt Core: or an attempt to idealize and drop the emotional part of an experience (in pathological cases)
    Calvino Rabeni: words *are* experiences
    Pema Pera: :)
    Qt Core: on the same level of the experience they are attached to or on a upper level ?
    Calvino Rabeni: words shift the triad
    Pema Pera: how so, Calvino?
    Calvino Rabeni: the experience is different, for example, if you choose a noun or a verb
    Calvino Rabeni: words give a perspective
    Pema Pera: ah yes, very much so
    Hana Furlough: nice
    Qt Core: buth then there are so much different experience based on the language you are experiencing with
    Pema Pera: that's an interesting part of learning different languages: in Japanese many adjectives are in fact verbs
    Qt Core: (i'm thinking about english words, the same word can be a noun, an adjective or a verb)
    Qt Core: in italian verbs are a class apart and just some are the same as nouns
    Pema Pera: time for me to return to that other world, RL . . . .
    Pema Pera: nice talking with all of you!
    Qt Core: yeah, i heard about that too
    Hana Furlough: and you~ bye pema~
    Pema Pera: bye everybody
    Calvino Rabeni: bye!
    Qt Core: i have to go too, bye all
    Widget Whiteberry: me too
    Widget Whiteberry: thank you for today
    Fael Illyar: I will go also. Bye Everyone! Have fun :)
    Hana Furlough: me three!
    Calvino Rabeni: All fly :)
    Hana Furlough: bye everyone~
    Tag page (Edit tags)
    • No tags
    You must login to post a comment.
    Powered by MindTouch Core