2008.07.01 07:00 - Chatbots and levels of beings playing

The weather in SL seems so nice. Riddle (me) was guardian and far too chatty today.

Riddle Sideways: good morning, Fael
Fael Illyar: Hi Riddle :)
Riddle Sideways: I really like your outfit
Fael Illyar: thank you :)
Riddle Sideways: SL resolves in a different way then RL
Riddle Sideways: I was just watching the trees become
Fael Illyar: trees become?
Riddle Sideways: there was nothing there
Riddle Sideways: then there was some white prims
Riddle Sideways: then a shape
Riddle Sideways: then a brown trunk
Riddle Sideways: then yellow leafs
Fael Illyar: ah, yes, rezzing :)
Riddle Sideways: rezzing is the proper word but...
Riddle Sideways: become seemed to fit too
Riddle Sideways: as in RL daybreak was the proper word
Riddle Sideways: but it became morning works too

Maxine joins us.

Fael Illyar: Hi Maxine :)
Riddle Sideways: hi Maxine
Maxine Walden: hi, Riddle, Fael
Riddle Sideways: I had a kitty walk across me about 5am
Maxine Walden: oh?
Faenik: could be
Riddle Sideways: so I started watching the dawn rezzing in

Fael had technical problems, left and came back.

Fael Illyar: I should leave testing preferences I should leave testing preferences for later, managed to make my screen black. Will be back in a moment
Riddle Sideways: ok
Riddle Sideways: Maxine, I got a blank your blank email?
Maxine Walden: oh, yes, error on my part, sorry if it brought confusion
Fael Illyar: did my attempt at writing a message blind get through?
Maxine Walden: just now, Fael?
Riddle Sideways: yes
Fael Illyar: yes, before I logged out and back in
Maxine Walden: yes
Riddle Sideways: TY most ppl would have just left
Riddle Sideways: very considerate
Fael Illyar: well, the sounds were still playing like it was only the picture that wasn't working so I tried if I can still write messages by remembering how it works

we had a long silent spot.

Faenik: indeed?
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Maxine Walden: nice to listen to the morning sounds
Riddle Sideways: yes, that is what I was just doing

The following section has very little to Caspian, whom I do not know yet.  
Caspian was only the catalyst for my remembering many years of my Playing with software generated Beings.

Riddle Sideways: I was bothered by something in Rajah's chat log
Maxine Walden: oh?
Riddle Sideways: when Caspian Inglewood was here
Maxine Walden: think I read it briefly but am not recalling...
Riddle Sideways: in reading the log it struck me that Caspian might have been a chat bot
Faenik: why not?
Maxine Walden: chat bot?
Fael Illyar: quite well made one if he is.
Fael Illyar: Not the first time I've seen him around.
Riddle Sideways: had a huge vocabulary
Fael Illyar: also, he was silent for the last half of one session after which Moon said he'd been IMing with him.
Riddle Sideways: ok

A discussion of what a bot (software roBot) is, although we did not do enough detail.

Maxine Walden: sorry, what is a chat bot?
Riddle Sideways: chat bot is an software agent
Riddle Sideways: that responds to chat with it's own chat
Maxine Walden: sort of an inanimate infiltrator?
Maxine Walden: or a mindless one?
Riddle Sideways: not artifical intelligence
Riddle Sideways: but approching
Fael Illyar: I don't think he's a bot but what he says isn't often really connected with the topic others are talking about.
Maxine Walden: huh, did not know such were around
Maxine Walden: what is the 'purpose' of a chat bot, something like a hacker?
Riddle Sideways: his non-connectedness was what first threw me
Riddle Sideways: a chatbot makes a good greeter in many worlds
Fael Illyar: he mostly seems to be throwing about quotes from different people in Zen Buddhism
Riddle Sideways: hacker is different
Maxine Walden: ah, right, a greeter but without much depth, while might appear to 'know' a lot
Fael Illyar: Well, he might be a "hybrid". chatbot sometimes and real user other times.
Riddle Sideways: there are many chatbots that will talk on and on about ther companies products
Faenik loves wells!
Riddle Sideways: probably
Maxine Walden: thanks, I feel better oriented to chat bots, guess the issue is how to relate to him/it
Riddle Sideways: there are a couple tech support websites that you chat with bots about your product problems
Faenik: indeed?
Fael Illyar: but I don't think it's an unsupervised bot.
Riddle Sideways: There are also some bots that have almost beaten the Turning test
Fael Illyar: I mean, he reacts sensibly to Moon playing around with him nonverbally.
Riddle Sideways: for whether a human can distinquish between
Riddle Sideways: a human or software that they are chatting with
Riddle Sideways: So, it really did not matter to me about him
Riddle Sideways: it was how an artifical intelligence could be in SL
Riddle Sideways: and moreover in PaB
Riddle Sideways: more into the fasination of an AI going through the chat logs for intel

In the above, I was not meaningfully ignoring Fael (though it sure reads that way).
I wished to get Maxine up to speed on Bots and then expand to hybrid, helper and guided chat sessions.


Fael Illyar: We do actually have something resembling a chat bot here, every time I'm around :P
Riddle Sideways: lol
Fael Illyar: very primitive one though
Riddle Sideways: I like Faenik
Faenik meaows confusedly.
Fael Illyar: although, I can make him say things too :)
Riddle Sideways: why does Faenik love wells?
Fael Illyar: Well, there is a friend I have who has this scripted attachment that drops a well on someone when it detects the word "well" in chat.
Faenik: ????^^
Fael Illyar: I was going to make Faenik move temporarily to his position before proclaiming loving wells when I filled the notecard for the phrases :P
Riddle Sideways: :)

Then Maxine had to leave.

Maxine Walden: (afraid RL is tugging at my sleeve so will need to go) Nice seeing you both
Fael Illyar: well, of course it only works in places where you can rez things.
Fael Illyar: Ok, see you later Maxine :)
Riddle Sideways: very nice Maxine
Maxine Walden: bye Fael and Riddle
Riddle Sideways: see you later

We talked about PaB attendence.

Fael Illyar: quite few people around today.
Riddle Sideways: yes, this slot does not seem to get many
Fael Illyar: still more than 1AM slot, usually :)
Faenik: ????^^
Riddle Sideways: I would think that is went most the euro ppl would be here
Fael Illyar: that's 11AM for me.
Riddle Sideways: oh
Fael Illyar: I'm sometimes here at that time.
Fael Illyar: I'd think most people are at work at this time in Europe.
Riddle Sideways: 7am, I am just getting started
Riddle Sideways: for the day
Fael Illyar: :)

I just would not let the Bot subject drop :)

Riddle Sideways: I need to get my agent software back out and make it work some
Fael Illyar: :)
Riddle Sideways: there is a inferrence engine that can go over huge amounts of text
Fael Illyar: Yes, if you feed something intelligent enough all the PaB meeting logs, it might be actually useful.
Riddle Sideways: I am starting to get excited about this, but I will not have time for it for a couple weeks
Riddle Sideways: work and RL have me bogged down
Riddle Sideways: where did you learn about scripting SL
Riddle Sideways: is there an ivory tower type location
Fael Illyar: if you want to use LSL scripts for doing this bot, you're going to have it interface with a server (through http requests) elsewhere for the actual logic.
Fael Illyar: LSL simply is too inefficient for much
Fael Illyar: well, the memory limit of 16kB per script is also bad. Not to mention that filling a list in a loop is O(N^2) operation
Faenik: indeed?
Fael Illyar: trust me, you don't want to do the logic part with LSL :)
Riddle Sideways: ok, I have the servers.
Riddle Sideways: which is ideal because that is where the big sw runs
Riddle Sideways: but, where do I learn LSL
Fael Illyar: I wonder if there is a tutorial place for it ... I can't recall any.
Fael Illyar: the syntax resembles C a lot
Riddle Sideways: ok
Fael Illyar: but I mostly got things done by reading www.lslwiki.net
Riddle Sideways: thanks
Fael Illyar: I know places in world that have tutorials for building, textures and particles.
Faenik is a hairy black ball with eyes and ears.
Fael Illyar: anyway, lslwiki has a lot of code examples you can read to get familiar with LSL
Riddle Sideways: ok, thank you
Riddle Sideways: now I need to find the time
Fael Illyar: That's often a problem :)

A section about marveling over how calm and un-calm can coexist within us at the same time.
Most think that you can't be both calm and un-calm at the same time, but experience shows it to happen often.

Riddle Sideways: the chimes are so nice
Riddle Sideways: how calming the chimes sound, even though my mind in racing with what I have to do today
Riddle Sideways: and maybe to find time for fun SL learning
Fael Illyar: I tend to keep what I'm going to do out of my mind until I start doing it.
Riddle Sideways: I REALLY should too, but...
Fael Illyar: well, unless it requires planning.
Fael Illyar: although, in that case I'm already doing it in a way
Riddle Sideways: I am going through a phase where I am doing to much on it
Fael Illyar: too much on ... it?
Riddle Sideways: of
Fael Illyar: ah, too much planning :)
Riddle Sideways: yes, sorry
Riddle Sideways: I usually only plant problems/situation/code snippets in my head
Riddle Sideways: for calculating at night or in odd moments
Riddle Sideways: but lately those get solved in the middle of the night
Riddle Sideways: leaving some night left
Riddle Sideways: and I spend too much time planning how/when to do that solution
Riddle Sideways: which turns into planning the day
Riddle Sideways: which turns into a waste when the phone rings and somebody elses
Riddle Sideways: choas takes my schedule
Riddle Sideways: :)
Fael Illyar: Which is pretty much why I don't plan much :)
Riddle Sideways: good
Faenik loves wells!
Fael Illyar: becomes wasted effort way too easily.
Riddle Sideways: It has gotten out of hand lately
Fael Illyar: Although, if you enjoy the planning :P
Riddle Sideways: if it is like planning for a party
Riddle Sideways: not if it is like planning 12 hrs of ops into a 5 hour space :)
Fael Illyar: well, yes, that tends to be ... impossible :)
Riddle Sideways: so it turns into worry
Riddle Sideways: and disappointment
Fael Illyar: although, if you're constantly trying to cram 12 hrs of ops into 5 hours, you seriously need to drop some of those completely.
Riddle Sideways: agreed

Then I was invaded and interrupted by another being that wanted to play.

Riddle Sideways: am having trouble typing, with a 'get in your face' kitty on my keyboard
Fael Illyar: You've got a cat?
Riddle Sideways: Naomi, is a black hairy ball with eyes and tail.
Fael Illyar: hehe :)
Riddle Sideways: I've got a cat between me and my keyboard
Riddle Sideways: 3 cats in this house
Riddle Sideways: ah, when life gets too serious... one of my cats comes to the rescue
Fael Illyar: At the moment, I don't have any animals here but I'll have a few gerbils soon I think.
Riddle Sideways: good, they are fun
Fael Illyar: My sister decided to make hers have babies.
Fael Illyar: so, I'm apparently going to get a couple.
Riddle Sideways: will they be male and female?
Faenik: why not?
Fael Illyar: remains to be seen :)
Riddle Sideways: :)

And so this session ends.

Riddle Sideways: Well, RL is calling soon
Riddle Sideways: I need to check on a client
Fael Illyar: Ok, see you later then :)
Riddle Sideways: thank you again
Riddle Sideways: bye