2009.11.22 08:00 - detail and wider focus

During our weekly guardian meeting, the following 15 guardians were present: Adams Rubble, arabella Ella, doug Sosa, Eliza Madrigal, Eos Amaterasu, Lia Rikugun, Maxine Walden, Neela Blaisdale, Pema Pera, Qt Core, Riddle Sideways, SophiaSharon Larnia, Storm Nordwind, Wol Euler and Yakuzza Lethecus. The comments are by Lia Rikugun.

Greetings...

Lia Rikugun: hello yakuzza
Yakuzza Lethecus: hi lia
arabella Ella: Hiya
Lia Rikugun: hello arabella and wol and pema
Yakuzza Lethecus: hi pema, wb everyone :)
Pema Pera: Hi Everybody!
Maxine Walden: hi, everyon
Maxine Walden: everyone
Lia Rikugun: hello hello
Wol Euler: hello everyone
Eliza Madrigal: Hi, everyone!
arabella Ella: Hiya Pema all
Adams Rubble: Hello everyone :)
arabella Ella: Hiya Eos
Eos Amaterasu: HI cats and kitties!
Pema Pera: :)
Pema Pera: we all stray in . . . .
Maxine Walden: haha
Eliza Madrigal: :) Hi Eos
Wol Euler: hello storm
Eos Amaterasu: Hi Eli :-)
arabella Ella: Hiya Storm
Eos Amaterasu: Storm drops in
Storm Nordwind waves
Eliza Madrigal waves
arabella Ella: its lovely to watch people falling down like raindrops from the sky here :)
arabella Ella: (reminds me of the tune ... its raining men ...)
Wol Euler: :)
Pema Pera: :-)
Lia Rikugun: :)
Pema Pera is happy to see women raining as well . .
arabella Ella: :)
Eos Amaterasu: Hi SophiaSharon
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: did I lose the text?
Pema Pera: we were just quietly enjoying our Sunday morning here, Sharon :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles

Maxine Walden: did anyone want to pick up on the suggested topic for this meeting: the possible strain between the focus upon detail like administrative stuff we have been trying to face and the 'wider' focus we often need for the practices we do?
Adams Rubble just finishing Pema's long email
Adams Rubble: It may take some time to frame a response Pema
Pema Pera: of course, let's forget about my email till later
Pema Pera: I was just responding to what I read from Neela and Fefonz this morning
Adams Rubble: There is a problem I think
Pema Pera: I'd love to talk about the wider PaB practices, following Vendy's suggestion as well
Pema Pera: yes, Adams?
Adams Rubble: Let's take your suggestion for this morning Pema. It will take time to sort out my thoughts
Pema Pera: well, Maxine's and Vendy's suggestion, more :-)
Adams Rubble: :)
Adams Rubble: yes, maxine's and Vendy's and Pema's
Pema Pera: :)
Pema Pera: Maxine, do you want to say a bit more about the "the 'wider' focus we often need for the practices we do"?
Maxine Walden: sure, will try
Maxine Walden: My own experience is that when I am trying to practice that my mind just 'feels' less focussed, sort of like letting me eyes go soft, as they say in yoga.
Maxine Walden: And this softer focus seems to allow more access to a wider range of experience. Very different for me from the more 'sharp-eyed' focus I need when I have to think of details. Quite strikingly different in my experience
Maxine Walden: The wider focus is inclusive, gathering in, as it were, while the sharper focus differentiates detail, notices differences perhaps
Eliza Madrigal: hmm, yes Maxine..wonderfully put observation, thanks
Maxine Walden: guess I had also been wondering about the possible strain between the two, which might be inevitable when we try to sort out the detail of admin 'stuff'
Maxine Walden: while also keeping our openness, ever-exploring practice going
Pema Pera: and one of the complications is that some of the admin stuff has been an attempt to find ways to allow the whole group to spend more time on the "wider focus"
Maxine Walden: hmm, yes
Pema Pera: when we noticed that the "wider focus" was threatened by too much disturbance . . . .
Neela Blaisdale: Hello eevryone sorry to be late:)
Pema Pera: while the group as a whole did not seem to find a good way to deal with that, for a while, leading to mounting frustration
Wol Euler: hello neela
Pema Pera: hi Neela!
Storm Nordwind has not found such a strain, Maxine, and suspects these are normal parts of everyday life outside PaB too that people just get used to dealing with
Wol Euler: walk closer, neela, we are in a diffent sim :)
Eos Amaterasu: "soft eyes".... that rest, not "wandering eyes"
Neela Blaisdale: weird..
Eos Amaterasu: keeping eyes soft and "rest loose your mind, neither hold it nor permit it to wander" is itself a "practice"
Eos Amaterasu: not anti-detail.... though there is a spectrum
Eliza Madrigal: yes and a settling in/finding balance...
Eos Amaterasu: maybe also taking responsibility for guarding that softness, personally - makes rigid guidelines less necessary
Maxine Walden: agree, Eos
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Maxine Walden: 'guarding the softenss' suggests different 'textures' of experience co-residing

Pema Pera: yes, Eos, and if our conversations of the last couple months can lead to that, they have accomplished their goal -- the fewer rules the better, as long as we do manage to keep that softness in the group, and don't sacrifice it in the name of openness to everybody, no matter how they behave . . . .
Pema Pera: the suggested rules are really a second best . . .
Maxine Walden: yes, some protections of the spaces, within the group as well as within each of us have seemed necessary to establish
Storm Nordwind: It is a whole life skill, to be able to juggle such disparate textures. As with any skill, some people like structured rules and others much less so
Adams Rubble: some people like rules and don't follow them; others hate rules and do follow them (nbot sugggetsing there are two types of people)
Adams Rubble: not
Maxine Walden: :), Adams
Storm Nordwind: Yes, it's a multidimensional spectrum of learning and coping approaches
Maxine Walden: yes, Storm
Eliza Madrigal: Some things come across as rules perhaps, which are just ideas.. things to try to see if they fly on their own and free up some energy/movement
Eliza Madrigal nods
Maxine Walden: and for me when I am fatigued, etc, ideas may seem like rules
Maxine Walden: It is my responsibility to keep myself rested enough to be able to respond to ideas as ideas, rather than rules, it seems to me
Eos Amaterasu: :-)
Adams Rubble: It is important to make sure the focus is on what is the goal. We as a group messed up on the recent two dsitractions but we have done better in the past
Riddle Sideways: seems the difference is your attitude toward it/them/etc.
Pema Pera: speaking for myself, I'm really delighted that in the last two months so many opinions have come forward, through our email exchanges. I feel we have gotten to know each other better, and we have reflected much more deeply on what PaB stands for. Rules or not is almost secondary; the increased involvement and engagement has been great!
Adams Rubble: we need to make sure it is not all opn Pema
SophiaSharon Larnia: ive learned a bit in the last few months, about distractions being learning experiences
Storm Nordwind: Do we perhaps expect the PaB community to operate in different ways to the rest of society? We have extra tools, true. But we will surely have the whole spectrum of humanity with similar challenges.
Eliza Madrigal: Riddle, yes... and the attitude we have with one another too... knowing and trusting intentions, and also putting enough trust in one another to say "Hey, not a good idea", which is goood to see happening
Maxine Walden: agree, entirely, Storm
Pema Pera: I found Vendy's response illustrative, as a new guardian: how she first was surprised and a bit ennoyed at all this discussion, and then very much appreciated it
Wol Euler nods
Eliza Madrigal nods
Pema Pera nods to all that is said :)

Pema Pera: the most wonderful thing about this group is exactly what is happening now, that we can discuss the dynamics of the group in such an open way -- I have never seen any group doing this so harmoniously and honestly
Storm Nordwind applauds the whole group
Pema Pera: with so little in terms of hidden agendas, present in any other group I know . . . .
Maxine Walden: that is interesting, Pema.
Pema Pera: I think what scares some newcomers is that they try mightely hard to find out about our hidden agendas . . . . and get frustrated when they can't find them
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Maxine Walden: :)
Pema Pera: is it a sect?
Pema Pera: what do they want?
Pema Pera: who is the leader?
Pema Pera: what are his secret intentions?
Pema Pera: exploring reality doesn't seem to be good enough as an answer to some . . .
Storm Nordwind: There are fewer holes for their pigeons! ;)
Adams Rubble: :)
Eliza Madrigal nods and admits to having those same questions at first
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Riddle Sideways: :)
Neela Blaisdale: too simple an idea for some:) and yet too rich and complex to ever have the "answer":)
Pema Pera: hahaha, yes, Neela
Eliza Madrigal: And then a breath of fresh air blows through...
Riddle Sideways: is this not as it should be
Storm Nordwind: Bear in mind that it is a compelling need in very many people to "belong". That is the criterion so often forward in the conscious or unconscious mind when they find a new group, as in "Is this something i want to belong to?"
arabella Ella: both belonging and acceptance Storm
Maxine Walden: And 'belonging' begins to make an 'in group' and an 'out group'
Pema Pera: yes, and the danger is real: we all know about questionable sects luring unsuspected newcomers with friendly, sometimes overfriendly invitations
Wol Euler grins. I think our chorus of "hello"s have chased a few away
Pema Pera: hahaha
arabella Ella: he he
Storm Nordwind: Belonging is very often a more driven need arabella. Many people are happy to belong even if they are not accepted
SophiaSharon Larnia: smiles
Neela Blaisdale: too much love., Wol?
arabella Ella: yes
Pema Pera: hey, wanna shortcut to enligthenment? We got it! Just sign this little paper here . . . .
Storm Nordwind: How much Pema? :)
Maxine Walden: hahaha
Maxine Walden: !!!
Pema Pera: just a bit of time, Storm
Lia Rikugun: :)
Pema Pera: timeless time
Storm Nordwind: Nooooo, I want to throw $$$$ at it instead!
arabella Ella: zeroth time Pema?
Pema Pera: hahaha
Pema Pera: yes, Ara
Riddle Sideways: does anybody remember signing the paper?
Storm Nordwind: I have the tattoo - I'll put it on!
Eliza Madrigal: shh, we're not supposed to talk about that
Pema Pera: hehehe
Neela Blaisdale: PaB tatoo? Yes!!!
Neela Blaisdale: Amulet for enlightment.....
SophiaSharon Larnia: laughs
Neela Blaisdale: we could sell them in RL for PaB costs, haha
Wol Euler sees herself with a shaven head at the local airport
Riddle Sideways: lol
Storm Nordwind: ...genuine amulet guv... guaranteed to have been present at a PaB session guv, yours for just...
Riddle Sideways: ya'll are way too good at this play stuff
Pema Pera: we can create a PaB gang . . . .
Pema Pera: making sure we are not tooooo nice to newcomers

Maxine Walden: Wondering if we can rotate the 'task' of suggesting a topic for this meeting. Just to bring it up while we have time
Qt Core: from PaB to PHB in ten easy moves...
Storm Nordwind: We can tell rival gangs to "BEat it!"
Pema Pera: hehehe
Riddle Sideways: would that be a rule, Maxine?
Pema Pera: :)
Maxine Walden: hah, Riddle!!
Riddle Sideways: I am busy the weekend it is my turn to bring the topic
SophiaSharon Larnia: topics change organically on their own, it seems, but good the have a delinated starting point
Storm Nordwind wonders about the required initiation ceremony...
Storm Nordwind chuckles at Riddle
Maxine Walden: smiled at Riddle as well
Eliza Madrigal: Agreed, Sharon...as Maxine noticed an organic topic and then framed it for us so nicely
Pema Pera: initiation ceremony? drop! sit! be!
SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
Pema Pera: labrador instead of laboratory
Maxine Walden: lol, Pema
Lia Rikugun: wuff
Adams Rubble: :)
Storm Nordwind: A retreat possibility?!!! In a remote eastern corner of Canada!
Pema Pera: it is
Wol Euler wonders whether the former refuelling stop at Gander is still a working airport.
Wol Euler: well, then1
Eos Amaterasu: geese do layovers here
Eos Amaterasu doubts it, but doesn't kn ow
Eos Amaterasu: No
Connecting to in-world Voice Chat...
Neela Blaisdale: Know thw poem Wild Geese by Mary Oliver?
Connected
Maxine Walden: I nominate Storm for our next 'topic' suggester
Riddle Sideways: second

Eos Amaterasu: On that topic, Malta retreat is coming up....
arabella Ella: :)
Eos Amaterasu: http://playasbeing.wik.is/PaB_Retreats/2010-01_Malta
Storm Nordwind: Perhaps UK slang: "Let's have a gander (quick look) at this place over here... no perhaps we'll leave it to someone else..."
Pema Pera: how many retreaters have signed up so far, Eos?
Pema Pera: and Arabella?
arabella Ella: Actually I am not sure
Eos Amaterasu: 7, with 2 possible, but we need to re-email everyone
arabella Ella: but i invite anyone who wishes to ask anything to IM me whether I am on line or off line of to email me if they wish
Maxine Walden: Have to go, all. See you next week
Storm Nordwind waves
arabella Ella: bye Maxine
Eos Amaterasu: bye all!
Adams Rubble: bye Maxine
Pema Pera: bye Maxine, and thank you!
Wol Euler: bye maxine, take care
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye :))
Neela Blaisdale gave you New Note.
Riddle Sideways: bye Maxine
Wol Euler: ty neela
Adams Rubble: ty Neela
Eos Amaterasu: Thanks Neela
Lia Rikugun: ty neela
Pema Pera: shall we add it to the chat log, Neela, the poem you gave us?

Pema Pera: Wild Geese

You do not have to be good.
You do not have to walk on your knees
for a hundred miles through the desert, repenting.
You only have to let the soft animal of your body
love what it loves.
Tell me about despair, yours, and I will tell you mine.
Meanwhile the world goes on.
Meanwhile the sun and the clear pebbles of the rain
are moving across the landscapes,
over the prairies and the deep trees,
the mountains and the rivers.
Meanwhile the wild geese, high in the clean blue air,
are heading home again.
Whoever you are, no matter how lonely,
the world offers itself to your imagination,
calls to you like the wild geese, harsh and exciting--
over and over announcing your place
in the family of things.

© Mary Oliver.

Storm Nordwind will be on retreat elsewhere from January 3rd through the 31st, so will miss Malta
arabella Ella: oh we will miss you too Storm :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: thanks Neela :)
Wol Euler: oh, pity.
Eliza Madrigal: Lovely Neela, Thank you :)
Pema Pera: bye everybody!
Storm Nordwind agrees
Wol Euler: bye pema, take care
Lia Rikugun: bye bye everyone
arabella Ella: bye Pema thanks
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye all, im off too :)) take care
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Everyone, thanks for a wonderful meeting today
Neela Blaisdale: Bye Pema, be well
Adams Rubble: bye Pema, everyone
Yakuzza Lethecus: bye everyone
Neela Blaisdale: Bye Adams
Wol Euler: bye everyone
Neela Blaisdale: Bye Eliza
Riddle Sideways: bye all
Neela Blaisdale: bye all:)
Storm Nordwind: Bye all
Qt Core: bye all