2010.11.27 13:00 - Scrambled eggs

The Guardian for this meeting was Blissful Badger. The comments are by Blissful Badger on behalf of Aphrodite Macbain who is still in limbo.

Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bliss :)
Blissful Badger: Hello Eliza!
Eliza Madrigal: How is Aphrodite, have you heard anything from her?
Blissful Badger: I am hoping I can claim this without being Aphrodite
Blissful Badger: No. She's still hovering after 9 days!
Eliza Madrigal: Hmm, I guess we'll find out about your claiming...
Eliza Madrigal: 9 days, wow
Blissful Badger: Did you have a lovely Thanksgiving?
Blissful Badger: you put in a lot of work I think
Eliza Madrigal: yes in many ways, thank you for asking
Blissful Badger: what were the best bits?
Eliza Madrigal: :) well not as much as in many former years actually but yes a lot, still
Blissful Badger: fewer people round the table?
Eliza Madrigal: Hm... the best bits would have to be talking with my daughter's new boyfriend and balancing my inquisitiveness with humor :)
Blissful Badger: :-)
Blissful Badger: Do you like him?
Eliza Madrigal: yes, I think I do
Blissful Badger: Did he mind your curiosity?  Did your daughter!?
Eliza Madrigal: I like how he makes her feel, and he didn't mind at all...
Eliza Madrigal: she loved it!
Eliza Madrigal: He was inquisitive as well
Blissful Badger: Sounds hopeful to me!
Eliza Madrigal: turned the tables a few times
Blissful Badger: Ha ha. any tricky questions?
Eliza Madrigal: :) Well it is nice now, that's enough
Eliza Madrigal: Well I thought there might be a Buddhist debate for a minute, hahah
Huntress Selenium: Hi Blissful, Eliza!
Eliza Madrigal: but thankfully no :)
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Huntress
Blissful Badger: Thanksgiving is so much more important in the US than in Canada
Eliza Madrigal: Nice to meet you
Blissful Badger: Hi Huntress
Huntress Selenium: nice to meet you
Eliza Madrigal: You must be related to Rhi
Blissful Badger: Please take a cushion
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Huntress Selenium: I am, Eliza
Huntress Selenium: We're very close
Eliza Madrigal: :) Notice a resemblence
Eliza Madrigal: Welcome
Blissful Badger: Have you visited here before?
Huntress Selenium: :)
Blissful Badger: or are you someone's alt?
Huntress Selenium: no, but Rhia has told me all about this place
Eliza Madrigal: Ah, great, so you understand that we record our sessions and place them on a wiki...
Blissful Badger: Welcome. Did she tell you that you are recorded and what you say is posted in our wiki chat log?
Blissful Badger: snap!
Eliza Madrigal: ::;steps off BLissful's toes:::: sorry L(
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Blissful Badger: np:-)
Eliza Madrigal: HI, Sharon :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Eliza, Blissful, Huntress :)
Huntress Selenium: hi Sophia
Blissful Badger: Hello Sharon
Blissful Badger: and shopia!
Eliza Madrigal: Thanksgiving caused me to realize how much 'community' we have here in PaB, as I started recalling conversations from last year....
SophiaSharon Larnia: giggles
Eliza Madrigal: for instance Sharon's peeling potatoes
Blissful Badger: as well as sophia
SophiaSharon Larnia: eh?
Eliza Madrigal: while taking typing breaks :)
Huntress Selenium: i don't see Sophia
Blissful Badger: SophiaSharon
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Hokon :)
Hokon Cazalet: hi =)
SophiaSharon Larnia: as long as you can see the text, im not sure my av is necessary ^^
Blissful Badger: Hello Hokon
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Hokon
Blissful Badger: You are grey to me right now Sharon
Eliza Madrigal will be typing a bit slow as I'm having lunch...
SophiaSharon Larnia: I dont remember the bit about the pototoes :D
Eliza Madrigal: just a silly thing... funny what we take away from these sessions in the long run
Blissful Badger: Hey Hokon
Eliza Madrigal: hah
Hokon Cazalet: =)
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes
Blissful Badger: Huntress - do you mind be recorded? Blissful gives up asking at this point.
Huntress Selenium: hi hokon!
Hokon Cazalet: hellos =)
Huntress Selenium: Don't see hokon either
Hokon Cazalet sees myself
Huntress Selenium: that's the important thing, hokon
Eliza Madrigal: clear to me... sometimes one needs to adjust camera angle just slightly
Blissful Badger: I think she's having a hard time
SophiaSharon Larnia: my viewer was doing funky things the other day, i thought it meant my computer was borked
Blissful Badger: borked and funky - nice neologisms
SophiaSharon Larnia: are you in the US Eliza?
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes sorry :))
Blissful Badger: no reason to apologize.
Eliza Madrigal: yup!
SophiaSharon Larnia: How are you doing?
Huntress Selenium: Where are u sitting?
Eliza Madrigal: haven't left in a while.... did Steve start another rumor?
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
SophiaSharon Larnia: oooh no steve didnt, i dont think :P
Hokon Cazalet: to your right
Eliza Madrigal: Steve likes to make comments about my being in germany or japan whenever someone else is... haha
Huntress Selenium: oh, we discussing new words?
Huntress Selenium: robotics is another; coined by Asimov
SophiaSharon Larnia: :)
Blissful Badger: I was noticing that new words are being made and used at an alarming rate right now
Huntress Selenium: I think new words reflect new realities
Eliza Madrigal: like 'truthiness'?That's my favorite new word :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: in the political arena or in general Blissful?
Eliza Madrigal: :) I'm well, thanks Sharon
Huntress Selenium: Hi Sharon; don't know if you saw me saying high
SophiaSharon Larnia: sounds nice and round Eliza :D
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
Blissful Badger: Yes, new technologies, new folklore, new stories create new words
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Huntress! I did and I thought you responded, i'm sorry :)
Huntress Selenium: i'm going to log off and back on
Eliza Madrigal: good idea
Blissful Badger: OK bye
Huntress Selenium: i'm not seeing all the text and two ppl are invisible to me
Eliza Madrigal: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Truthiness
Hokon Cazalet: hehe
Huntress Selenium: i'll be right back
SophiaSharon Larnia: ok :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: I think she wants a comment on her naked av
Hokon Cazalet: hehe
Blissful Badger: where are you studying philosophy Hokon?
Hokon Cazalet: at northern illinois university, usa; for undergrad
Hokon Cazalet: nowhere special hehe
Eliza Madrigal: :) she says she isn't Rhi... that she's a friend
SophiaSharon Larnia: nods
Blissful Badger: She's Rhi for sure
Hokon Cazalet: hehe huntress is an alt of hers
Hokon Cazalet: lol
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Blissful Badger: I'm going to go and come back as another avi
Hokon Cazalet: hehe
SophiaSharon Larnia: ok Blissful, although I do like Blissful!! :)

Blissfull evporates: Huntress returns
Hokon Cazalet: wb huntress
SophiaSharon Larnia: wb huntress
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hokon, can I ask you a weird question about your major?
Huntress Selenium: thank you
Eliza Madrigal listens...
Hokon Cazalet: hehe sure
SophiaSharon Larnia: a boring one though :D I always wondered, what kind a field work is there, if any? Or is it purely academic?
Hokon Cazalet: um usually with philosophy there isnt much
SophiaSharon Larnia: for example, do you explore different things in person, and then write about them?
Hokon Cazalet: its mostly academic
SophiaSharon Larnia: nods
Hokon Cazalet: well for analytic philosophers, they will analyze concepts, to try and find solutions
Hokon Cazalet: but yeah its academic, there is collaboration with people in the natural sciences at times, but...
SophiaSharon Larnia: there was a time I wanted to be a student forever
Hokon Cazalet: =)
Huntress Selenium: In academic philosophy, you usually write about other philosophers
Huntress Selenium: Sophia, that's what a professor is; a perpeptual student
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh :) that can get kind of delicate?
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Huntress Selenium: Sophia, yeah, it can; that's why you usually write about dead philosophers. but i did loose a job once cuz one of the professors gave a paper at a conference; i was supposed to give a reply, and ppl found my reply mine more interesting than the original paper
Huntress Selenium: 'Then i went for the job interview...
Hokon Cazalet: yeah i'd be more into original research, i guess i wont end up being academic
Eliza Madrigal: I call myself a perpetual student actually, but mean that I never 'arrive'... in fact it may be a kind of fear of arrival... get close, turn in another direction, hah
Huntress Selenium: Well, there's original research in academia

Qt and Willenorf land on the scene

Huntress Selenium: hi Qt!
Eliza Madrigal: Hello Qt, long time no see :)
Huntress Selenium: Hi Willendorf
Qt Core: Hi all,!
Hokon Cazalet: hellos
SophiaSharon Larnia: maybe that why i say i used to never stop being one, although i meant literally
Eliza Madrigal: And Hi Will :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Qt :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: Hi Willendorf
Huntress Selenium: They're behind me right?
Huntress Selenium: I have a sense for these things
Eliza Madrigal: so what is the difference between beginner's mind and perpetual studenthood?
Willendorf Resident: Hi everyone
SophiaSharon Larnia: good question
Eliza Madrigal: do you think that as students, folks need mentors who seem to 'know' something definitively?
Willendorf Resident: ideally they are the same thing
SophiaSharon Larnia: it implies that, by the language that there is a goal, a master or doctorate. Does it?
Willendorf Resident: always open to new ideas
Eliza Madrigal: I wonder, as children often need someone to say definitely 'it will be okay'
Willendorf Resident: yes but not only children
Huntress Selenium: Eliza, yes; a mentor is just a model; and without a model you don't know what to do
SophiaSharon Larnia:  Eliza Madrigal: yes
SophiaSharon Larnia: a beginners mind has no goal
Huntress Selenium: Even when your creating your own system, you need a model
Huntress Selenium: And a goal, yes
Huntress Selenium: a beginner's mind can have a goal
SophiaSharon Larnia: Yes Hokon a model to base your system
Willendorf Resident: what model?
Hokon Cazalet: a mentor or teacher is quite helpful, prevents you from having to figure it all out by yourself all over again, and avoid making the mistakes past thinkers made
Eliza Madrigal: so is it merely a level of sophistication when one can see that the goal isn't definitive...
Huntress Selenium: you need a model to learn, Willendorf
Huntress Selenium: Like Newton's model was Aristotle; my kung fu instructor used Ed Parker as his model, and i'm modelling after him
Willendorf Resident: after aristotle?
Huntress Selenium: Yes, the empirical appraoch
Huntress Selenium: I was using the example of those who come up with their own methodologies or systems; they still model after others
Huntress Selenium: where are you, Willendorf? I don't see you; maybe if i could zoom in on you, i could see you
Willendorf Resident: I'm sitting quietly beside you
Huntress Selenium: which side?
Willendorf Resident: your left
Eliza Madrigal: read a wonderful tweet today: sween Jason Sweeney by syntheticzero " Just realized I learned empirical evidence is better than anecdotal evidence because some guy told me. Now I don't know what to believe. "
Hokon Cazalet: lol eliza
SophiaSharon Larnia: haha
Willendorf Resident: Haha
Eliza Madrigal giggles
SophiaSharon Larnia: maybe that's learned and not realized
SophiaSharon Larnia: oh wait
SophiaSharon Larnia: nvm :)
Willendorf Resident: what is the differenc?
Huntress Selenium: what's learned, Sophia?
Huntress Selenium: hi Bleu
SophiaSharon Larnia: i was substituting one word for another, and it was already there
Bleu Oleander: hi everyone :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Bleu
Hokon Cazalet: hi bleu
Willendorf Resident: Hi Bleu
Huntress Selenium: i don't think i saw your text
Eliza Madrigal: knowledge that one learns as in memorized vs knowledge that comes from within as having been integrated and 'one's own'
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bleu :))
SophiaSharon Larnia: yes exactly Eliza!!! Thats what I meant haha
Qt Core: hi bleu
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Huntress Selenium: well you first learn a skill by memorization
Willendorf Resident: is learning only memorizing?
Eliza Madrigal: it can be at first
Huntress Selenium: Willendorf, no, there is the learning that goes to something you discover or create yourself
Huntress Selenium: You have to grasp the abstracdtions of a subject first though
Willendorf Resident: I often learn by doing. Sometimes the body remembers
Eliza Madrigal: for certain values of 'learning' as Wol might phrase, yes
Huntress Selenium: Then you can chunk up and over to the new application
Huntress Selenium: Will, yes, muscle memory
Eliza Madrigal: it like that surprise one gets when they hear themself explain something they haven't understood themselves to understand...
Huntress Selenium: right, the threshold or "ah, ha" moments
Willendorf Resident chuckles
SophiaSharon Larnia: odd phenomenon, that
Eliza Madrigal: just 'there' complete, yes, odd indeed
Eliza Madrigal: like an egg
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
Eliza Madrigal is obviously quite silly today
SophiaSharon Larnia: :))
Eliza Madrigal: or the hatching sans egg even
Bleu Oleander: sans egg :))
Eliza Madrigal: :)
SophiaSharon Larnia thinks about that
Huntress Selenium: Eliza, i've always thought it sad to hatch, sans egg
Huntress Selenium: That's like when you start to write and you get a blank page staring at you
Huntress Selenium: i try to use glossy screens for that, so i can put my make up on while i wait for inspiration
Eliza Madrigal: well the chicken would have a difficult time then explaining what a shell was, in any event
SophiaSharon Larnia: ha!
Willendorf Resident: she'd need to be outside it
Willendorf Resident: looking in
Eliza Madrigal: to see it
Willendorf Resident: yes
Willendorf Resident: her structure
Willendorf Resident: or enclosure
Willendorf Resident: or organizing principle
Willendorf Resident: please stop me
Huntress Selenium: The chicken?
Willendorf Resident: the chicken's container
Eliza Madrigal: haha
Huntress Selenium grabs Will by the throat and throttles him
SophiaSharon Larnia: that sort of chat isn't appropriate here Huntress
SophiaSharon Larnia: heheh i was thinking about it Will, 10 people describing an elephant
Eliza Madrigal: organizing principle of chikens... inner egg
Huntress Selenium: "The Six Wise men from Indostan"
Willendorf Resident wonders why Huntress thinks she's a man
Eliza Madrigal: chickens* (what is so hard about spelling chicken today)
Huntress Selenium: What are you talking about, Will?
Eliza Madrigal: different parts of the elephant...
Willendorf Resident: chickens and eggs and elephants
Huntress Selenium: I love that poem
Willendorf Resident: I'm Playing with Being
SophiaSharon Larnia: Being is a trickster too :))
SophiaSharon Larnia: imho
Willendorf Resident: :-)
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Eliza Madrigal: I've definitely been more of a trickster since I started hanging around Being
Eliza Madrigal: contageous
Eliza Madrigal: contagious too
Willendorf Resident wonders whether the Venus of Willendorf was a trickster
SophiaSharon Larnia: hehhehe

Willendorf Resident: she was magic for many
Huntress Selenium: Venus of Willendorf?
SophiaSharon Larnia: i love the goddess symbols Willendorf
Huntress Selenium: Ur beginning to confuse me, Will; but I'm easily confused
Willendorf Resident: That's me!
Huntress Selenium: oh, oh, hokon crashed
SophiaSharon Larnia: i have a small but precious collection ^^
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Huntress Selenium: ok, i finally see you, now that ur standing, Will
Huntress Selenium: ur big and white
Willendorf Resident: Big, white, fat and fecund
Willendorf Resident: of venuses Sophia??
Eliza Madrigal: wb Hokon
Huntress Selenium: wb hokon
SophiaSharon Larnia: little round mothers :D Yes, the early venuses
Huntress Selenium: well, i didn't want to use the 'F' word
Willendorf Resident: I'm proud of my body!
Willendorf Resident: Keeps me warm in the winter
SophiaSharon Larnia: in what i think was a culture before this one, but i cant say for sure if that' true
Hokon Cazalet: hi =)
SophiaSharon Larnia: wb Hokon
Willendorf Resident: winter
Eliza Madrigal wonders where winter is this year.. quite hot still in FL
Willendorf Resident: The Venus of W goes back thousands of years
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Mick!
Huntress Selenium: hi Mick!
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Mick
Bleu Oleander: hi Mick
Huntress Selenium gives Eliza a dirty look
Mickorod Renard: Hiyaaaa
Willendorf Resident: How do you do Mick 

Qt Core: here  it's first snow and iced roads already
Mickorod Renard: very well thankyou :)
Qt Core: hi Mick
Mickorod Renard: here too
Eliza Madrigal: If one tried to describe the conversation 'til now Mick it wouldn't work... you'll just have to puzzle it out
Eliza Madrigal: heheh
SophiaSharon Larnia: that's why i wanted to go to Malta so very badly
Mickorod Renard: ok,,he he
Bleu Oleander: still puzzled :)
SophiaSharon Larnia: me too
Eliza Madrigal: :) Bleu
Eliza Madrigal: ooh Malta, yes me too...
Willendorf Resident: check out the wiki later
Mickorod Renard: I dare say its something about wanting to be warm
Huntress Selenium: Well, it went from neologisms, to learning, to modelling, to Willendorf asking to be stopped before she went on to describe something, to winter
Huntress Selenium: There, i did it!
Mickorod Renard: we can all cuddle up
Eliza Madrigal smiles
Willendorf Resident: I'm just warming up
Mickorod Renard: mmmm
Willendorf Resident: That's better
Willendorf Resident: It gets cold in my cave
Hokon Cazalet: brb for a sec
Eliza Madrigal: Okay... back to whether the chicken could describe the egg if it never had one....
Mickorod Renard: owww,,and i thought caves were a regular temperature
Eliza Madrigal: there's a Plato connection in there somewhere... both egg and cave....
Eliza Madrigal: heh
Mickorod Renard: if you hang from the roof of the cave it should be warmer as heat rises
Huntress Selenium: My sister Rhiannon did a discussion on the Allegory of the CAve; well attended
Mickorod Renard: I bet it was cold naked in the cave
Willendorf Resident: yes
Willendorf Resident: freezing
Willendorf Resident: have to hunt a buffalo
Hokon Cazalet: back
SophiaSharon Larnia: @ Eliza, I can't describe a womb, and apparently i was there
Eliza Madrigal: !
SophiaSharon Larnia: if that makes any sense
Eliza Madrigal: yes
Mickorod Renard: Huntress, your sister has similar dress sense too?
SophiaSharon Larnia: at least not with this mind
Huntress Selenium: Mic, yes she does
Willendorf Resident: :-)
Mickorod Renard: :)
Huntress Selenium wonders why no one asks if she's cold
Eliza Madrigal: this mind, yes very good analogy Sharon....
Mickorod Renard: I can usually tell if a naked person is cold
Eliza Madrigal: figures she can take care of herself :) lots of coats for sale in SL
Hokon Cazalet: buffalo hunting . . . i am hungry
Hokon Cazalet: lol mickorod, yeah the goosebumps show easily
Willendorf Resident: These are hot springs Huntress
Huntress Selenium: Rhiannon has a shiver ani, as she gets cold, but i'm pretty tough
Huntress Selenium: i've noticed the vapors, Will
Mickorod Renard: buffalos's..that reminds me of the clouds moving in the sky
Huntress Selenium winks at Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Willendorf Resident: or the other way around
Huntress Selenium: depending on whether ur an earth or air element
Hokon Cazalet: im aether
Hokon Cazalet: cuz im that awesome
Willendorf Resident: the reason I'm so white is that I'm stuck on a glacier
Mickorod Renard: i'm neither
Willendorf Resident: along with the wooly mmmoth
Willendorf Resident: mammoth
Willendorf Resident: mmmm
Bleu Oleander: c u all later :)
Mickorod Renard: bye bleu
SophiaSharon Larnia: bye Bleu :)
Willendorf Resident: bye bye Bleu.
Huntress Selenium: tc Bleu
Eliza Madrigal: Okay... throwing out a huge questions....
Eliza Madrigal: What is awareness?
SophiaSharon Larnia: hi Arabella
Huntress Selenium: hi arabella
Mickorod Renard: Hi Ara
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Ara :) Lovely dress
Huntress Selenium: Awareness?
arabella Ella: Hiya everyone! thanks Eliza!
Willendorf Resident: here?

Qt Core: hi Ara
SophiaSharon Larnia: sorry have to go :) take care all
Huntress Selenium: oh, another one i can't see; this is getting annoying
Willendorf Resident: be patient huntress, good things take time
Willendorf Resident: hey arabella
Eliza Madrigal: Bye Sharon Nice to see you
Huntress Selenium: TC Sophia
SophiaSharon Larnia: waves
Huntress Selenium: Awareness is the ability to be outside of something and getting information from it; the For Itself of Sartre
Mickorod Renard: bye sophia
Hokon Cazalet: awareness, the intentional activity whereby consciousness "grasps" an object into its attention, when something is an object of thought, it is said that we are aware of this object
Huntress Selenium: It's subjectivity
Huntress Selenium: its then uniqueness; as we can't expeience another's subjectivity
Eliza Madrigal: so no awareness without awareness of others....
Willendorf Resident: it's shaped by subjectivity
Willendorf Resident: not subjectivty in itself
Hokon Cazalet: well i think there are a few cases of non-intentional consciousness, but typically yes, no awareness without an object one is aware of
Hokon Cazalet: but id say awareness is focus, attention, grasping something
Willendorf Resident: what do you mean non-intentional consciousness Hokon?
Hokon Cazalet: to make present
Hokon Cazalet: oh, non-intentional: where the subject/object dichotomy doesn't exist: there is not the setup of a knowing subject vs a known object
Willendorf Resident: to appreciate the appearance of things?
Huntress Selenium: well, even so called non-intentional consciousness has a pre-reflective cogito in it and a transcendence, which implies intentionality of a sort
arabella Ella: Hey Hokon How are you havent seen you in ages :)
Hokon Cazalet: hi arabella =)
--BELL--
Huntress Selenium: hi arabella
Willendorf Resident: I must return to my cave and do some knitting now.
Eliza Madrigal: :) Will
Hokon Cazalet: i think there still is an ego of sorts in non-intentional consciousness (a cogito), but it lacks transcendence, its immanent in the conscious field
Willendorf Resident: Bye all!
Hokon Cazalet: bye =)
Eliza Madrigal: Bye for now
Huntress Selenium: bye Will
Huntress Selenium: nice meeting you
Qt Core: bye Will
Willendorf Resident: Bye
arabella Ella: bye
Qt Core: i have to go too, bye all
Hokon Cazalet: bye qt
Huntress Selenium: bye Qt
arabella Ella: notte Qt!
Mickorod Renard: bye qtwill

and Qt fly away
Hokon Cazalet: sorry my use of the word "intentional" is obscure :Þ
Huntress Selenium: well, its certainly been a wide ranging coversation
Eliza Madrigal: yes... there is something amidst all this that Im deeply interested in, not sure how to excavate it but the philosophical bent is somewhat helpful
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
Hokon Cazalet: its nice to hear somebody say philosophy is useful

Hokon Cazalet: the stereotype of philosophy is sad lol
Huntress Selenium: well, learning, modelling, language as a frame for action and our encounter for reality
Mickorod Renard: that must have been a slip of the tongue
Huntress Selenium: hey, mick could i have you stand up for a moment
Huntress Selenium: it worked with Will; i can't see you
Mickorod Renard: I am more handsome invisible
Eliza Madrigal: :) Mick
arabella Ella: I cannot but agree Mick!
Huntress Selenium: awww, Mick, i don't believe that!
Huntress Selenium: I'm sure ur hot
arabella Ella: and I am sure Eliza agrees with Ara
arabella Ella: :)

The uses of philosophy
Eliza Madrigal giggles at Hokon re useful philosophy
Huntress Selenium: omg!
Huntress Selenium: Is he *that* repulsive, ara
Hokon Cazalet: :Þ
arabella Ella: did i say that Huntress?
Huntress Selenium: Well, there is a division in philosophy now, "Applied Philosophy"
Huntress Selenium: Medical ethics, business ethics, professional ethics, etc.
arabella Ella: yes but philosophy does not have to be applied philo to be useful
Hokon Cazalet: one thing i do like about ancient philosophy, some of it is actually very useful
arabella Ella: neither does it have to be ethics to be useful
Hokon Cazalet: id agree arabella
arabella Ella agrees with Hokon very much
Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
arabella Ella: or as in facebook - likes very much :)
Huntress Selenium: arabella, well depends on your concept of useful; Aristototle pointed out that philosophy appealed to the divine in us precisely because it wasn't useful
Huntress Selenium giggles at ara
Hokon Cazalet: lol arabella
arabella Ella: ok may I have my say then please?
Mickorod Renard: I think Philo is useful, if for nothing else than expanding ones posibilities of posibilities
arabella Ella: may I rant?
Hokon Cazalet: you may rant
arabella Ella: thanks very kind!
Huntress Selenium: but if you believe that the divinity in us *is* useful for our self-actualization, then that can be muddied
Hokon Cazalet: the speaker recognizes the delegate
arabella Ella: philo is useful because
arabella Ella: 1. it opens our mind to new possibilities
arabella Ella: 2. it makes us critical thinkers so we can evaluate things better
arabella Ella: 3. it gives us so many new perspectives which help us to generate more possibilities
arabella Ella: that's it
Hokon Cazalet: id agree with those three
Eliza Madrigal: an awareness tool
Hokon Cazalet: id add more to the list, but i'd agree with those three
Mickorod Renard: I had an inkling that possibilities came into it
arabella Ella: oh and philosophy can make us very interdisiplinary if you wish to view stuff from a holistic perceptive
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Hokon Cazalet: hehe yup thats one thing im liking arabella
arabella Ella: please add more Hokon I am curious
arabella Ella: and am always willing to learn more
Huntress Selenium: well, but to explore whether or not the ultimate substance is mind or body is far from that
Huntress Selenium: i agree there's a practical side to philosophy, but its ideal is pure
Mickorod Renard: I am into all sorts of disciplinarity
arabella Ella: philo does not give us answers to questions it opens up things more than closes them
Hokon Cazalet: actually going with the holism . . . i like philosophy cuz it can be an overall guide to life, and telling us who we are; sure, it never gives absolute answers, but something is way cooler than nothing
arabella Ella: yea go for it Hokon yea!
arabella Ella: it also makes us ask more questions
Hokon Cazalet: like aristotle's three levels of the soul, can be a great guide for human rights for example, and who we are in general, yeah i dont believe in souls, but the basic structure makes alot of sense
Mickorod Renard: I think it gives questions rather than answers
arabella Ella: and teaches us how toadopt a flexible outlook on life
Hokon Cazalet: i think philosophy gives alot of answers, just they arent absolute or definitive
Mickorod Renard: thats true
arabella Ella: yes i like aristotle's ideas too
Mickorod Renard: true even
Hokon Cazalet: =)
arabella Ella: :)
Eliza Madrigal: then why do so many who study philosophy come across as thinking they 'know'
arabella Ella: the more you know the less you know Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Hokon Cazalet: well the past 200 yrs, there has been a desire to make philosophy like the natural sciences, a place of definitive knowledge
Mickorod Renard: I suspect that they know that the answer from someone else may not be right,,but they dont know the what was right
Hokon Cazalet: hasnt worked out really, but i guess some still believe it
arabella Ella: that would spoil it Hokon
arabella Ella: philo can never be like a science
Hokon Cazalet: id agree
arabella Ella: but it also encourages us to learn more about what science says and it kinda polices science too
Hokon Cazalet: yeah
Huntress Selenium: Philosophy is a methodology, a tradition, and an attitude; it can be spiritual or practical, and it's not meant to mirror natural science
arabella Ella: take Popper, Kuhn, Feyerabend for example
arabella Ella: they do meta-science
arabella Ella: and here we have done lots on phenomenology
Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
Hokon Cazalet: i like phenomenology
arabella Ella: Husserl and Heidgger
Hokon Cazalet: Yaaaaayyyyyyyy!
--BELL--
Huntress Selenium: huh, my last comment didn't hit chat
Huntress Selenium: So i'll make it again--philosophy is a methodology, a tradition and an attitude; it has a connection with our souls, that's its primary function, but can be practical too
Hokon Cazalet: yeah, it kinda bugs me when some try and make science something it isnt: an absolute set of truths that explains the totality of reality and human existence
Hokon Cazalet: well i think that it connects with the human spirit makes it automatically practical, even if its not obvious at first
arabella Ella: yes Huntress I think I agree with you there ... and with Hokon too
Eliza Madrigal nodding @ Hokon
arabella Ella: i am in the UK at the moment and it would be a crying shame if the present budget cuts affected the humanities in universities
Hokon Cazalet: =(
arabella Ella: which is a huge risk at the moment
Mickorod Renard: I think it would have been classed a science once upon a time
arabella Ella: i cannot imagine a world without humanities
Hokon Cazalet: yeah i saw on cspan, british parliament wasn't discussing it
Hokon Cazalet: a long time ago it was the science mick
arabella Ella: well Mick Philosophy is the midwife of all disciplines
arabella Ella: all disciplines emerged from philosophy including science
Hokon Cazalet: just our use of the word science has changed, science used to simply mean: a body of knowledge, now we use the word as synonomous with natural science
Hokon Cazalet: yup arabella
Huntress Selenium: ara, they won't eliminate the humanities; they might cut back on them
arabella Ella: well in my country there was one time way back an attempt to eliminate the humanities when the government wanted the USA to be more pragmatic and it was sad

Arisia Vita flies in
Huntress Selenium: hi Arisia!
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Ari, ltns
Hokon Cazalet: eep! o.O
arabella Ella: my country is not england
Arisia Vita: Hi all...
Hokon Cazalet: that wouldd be horrid arabella =(
Mickorod Renard: Hi Ari
arabella Ella: Hey Ari!
Arisia Vita: good to be with you all
Huntress Selenium: ara in the US, instead, the humanities tried to get more pracical; thaqt's when "applied philosophy" was born
arabella Ella nods
Eliza Madrigal: yes sometimes it seems politically necessary to blur lines a bit... prob is that unblurring is often impossible :)
Hokon Cazalet: brb potty
Huntress Selenium: i teach part time writing, and math, although my degree is in philosophy
Huntress Selenium: Well, blurring allows evolution
Huntress Selenium: not necessarily a bad thing
Mickorod Renard: doesn't philosophy just work in discrete undercover groups or social groups outside of uni's in times of suppression?
Huntress Selenium: Mick, don't know about that
arabella Ella: it did to some extent in france in the 60s mick but not always
Eliza Madrigal: yes not meaning to assign judgments... living philosophy can spring from recognition of organizational limitations perhaps
arabella Ella: and it may sometimes work in weird ways ... wont go further there too complicated about world order etc
Huntress Selenium: Again, blurred distinctions, Eliza, when philosophy does that its called sociology. lol
Mickorod Renard: when you have good philo forums here on sl then maybe there is a reduced need to fund and house philo in uni's?
arabella Ella: no Mick
arabella Ella: here it is very informal
arabella Ella: in unis the theoretical aspect is more pronounced
arabella Ella: and that is important too
Mickorod Renard: I see
Huntress Selenium: well, that won't happen; the forums here will never replace the real world
Huntress Selenium: in fact, some professors might have classehere, though
Mickorod Renard: for sure, but they are a good platform,,and without the expenses
Huntress Selenium: There was a Q & A with Noam Chomsky a few weeks ago
Eliza Madrigal: actually I think there is more likely to emerge creative and fresh philosophical language in settings where the risk of embarrassment is not as high
arabella Ella: yes i attended and he answered my question first
Mickorod Renard: yes, I attended that
Huntress Selenium: oh, awesome
arabella Ella: yes it was quite something!
Huntress Selenium: i wanted to but i taught at the time he was here
arabella Ella: oh
Hokon Cazalet: back
Arisia Vita: wb
Hokon Cazalet: =)
Huntress Selenium: but it shows what SL can do
arabella Ella: that is the thing about time zones on SL
arabella Ella: so much i would like to attend but not always possible
Huntress Selenium: The most like rl philosophy forums here in Sl are my sister Rhiannon's
Huntress Selenium: She has a phil topic one day and studies a figure the other
arabella Ella: oh yes we all know Rhi well!
arabella Ella: but here timings at the moment are not very euro friendly
Huntress Selenium: But even so, it's more like a studio audience that a lecture hall
arabella Ella: yes
Eliza Madrigal: I don't care for the philo forums where everyone is talking over one another, only listening to themselves....
Huntress Selenium: Ara, yeah, over the summer she had encores for the Euros
Eliza Madrigal: part of why I ended up here mostly
Mickorod Renard: Hermmans is more a classroom
Huntress Selenium: but she's busy at the moment
Eliza Madrigal: in the beginning
arabella Ella nods
Huntress Selenium: yeah, Herman's is a lecture
Huntress Selenium: And ppl listen
arabella Ella: would love her to have the extra euro sessions again tho so please pass on the message pls
Eliza Madrigal: does it still take place?
Eliza Madrigal: hermans'?
arabella Ella: herman's are very basic tho
Huntress Selenium: i will
arabella Ella: too basic
Mickorod Renard: yes
Huntress Selenium smiles
arabella Ella: i prefer Rhi and Sunfire
Mickorod Renard: Hermans is good for beginers, like me
arabella Ella nods
Huntress Selenium: hi kirin!
Hokon Cazalet: im gonna visit some friends =) have fun peeps, it was a good talk =)
Mickorod Renard: Hi Kirin
Eliza Madrigal: For some reason I was under the impression those sessions were not taking place any longer... nice to know
arabella Ella: bye for now Hokon lovely to see you!
Mickorod Renard: bye hokum
Hokon Cazalet: Weeee! ^.^k

Kirin Writer arrives Hokon leaves
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Kirin and Bye Hokon, nice to see you
Huntress Selenium: yeah, me 2 about Rhi, but i'm a *little* prejudice
Huntress Selenium: Eliza, Rhi's are; Sunfire's aren't
arabella Ella: oh i see
arabella Ella: Hey Kirin have not seen you in ages too how are you?
Huntress Selenium: You may have thought hers weren't as she was kicked out of Philosophy Island, but she's very active in her new venue
arabella Ella: oh great!
arabella Ella: I get Rhi's notifications
Kirin Writer: Doing well Arabella, & you?
arabella Ella: very well thanks :)
Huntress Selenium: hi kirin! Sit by me, not that i can see you; i can only see hokon and Eliza
Mickorod Renard: Hi Kirin
Kirin Writer: readjust your camera, Huntress, I am behind you, & Hokon is gone
Kirin Writer: Hi Mickorod
Mickorod Renard: :)
Kirin Writer: is the topic done?
Eliza Madrigal: the regular meeting is from 1-2ish... but there have been many topics today
Kirin Writer: ohhh ty
arabella Ella: do you still go to Thothica Kirin?
arabella Ella: I havent been there in ages
Kirin Writer: rarely
Huntress Selenium: hokon is gone, i see
Eliza Madrigal: Kirin I need to make sure it is okay with you that we record our sessions and place them on a wiki...
Huntress Selenium: no, hokon is still here, even though she's offline, and i don't see you
Huntress Selenium: or arisia, who's sitting next to me
Kirin Writer: its fine Eliza
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Ewan :)
Eliza Madrigal: thanks Kirin :)
Ewan Bonham: Hi Folks!

Ewan Bonham drops in
Mickorod Renard: Hi Ewan
arabella Ella: Hey Ewan havent seen you in ages!
Huntress Selenium: hi Ewan
arabella Ella: how are you?
Kirin Writer: Hello Ewan
Huntress Selenium: its old home week
Ewan Bonham: Oh, I have been here but at different times..:)
arabella Ella: ah!
Mickorod Renard: I tend to come here at diferent times too
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Mickorod Renard: saves cramming
Mickorod Renard: helps provide a linear perspective to life
Ewan Bonham: I do enjoy the Thursday afternoon meetings at the kira cafe as well..:)

bethy Resident drops in
Huntress Selenium: hi bethy
Eliza Madrigal: Nice Ewan
arabella Ella: which are those Ewan? what topic?
Eliza Madrigal: Hi Bethy :)
Arisia Vita: welcome bethy
arabella Ella: Hiya Bethy!
bethy Resident: heyaa
Arisia Vita: sit by me if you wish
Eliza Madrigal: Welcome to PlayasBeing
Mickorod Renard: Hi Bethy
Eliza Madrigal: I've given you a note about the group with a link to the wiki :)
Ewan Bonham: Hi bethy...Arabella, Eliza may know the particulars..:)
Eliza Madrigal: We record our sessions Bethy, is it okay to include you in those? If not, we can edit your name... no worries at all :)
bethy Resident: okie
Eliza Madrigal: thanks!
Eliza Madrigal: today we've been discussing the practicality of philosophy, and a chicken's awareness of its egg, and hm...
Eliza Madrigal searching memory
Eliza Madrigal: :)
Eliza Madrigal: I need to be going for now everyone, but nice to see you all... have been missing the afernoon session crowd!
arabella Ella: bye Eliza lovely to see you here too!
Kirin Writer: bye Eliza
bethy Resident: bye
Eliza Madrigal: :) Thanks Ara
Mickorod Renard: nite nite Eliza
Ewan Bonham: Bye eliza!

Eliza flies away
Mickorod Renard: take care
Eliza Madrigal: Nite everyone
Huntress Selenium: tc Mick
Kirin Writer: Hello Bethy
bethy Resident: heya
Kirin Writer: welcome to SL
Kirin Writer: They record you here , Bethy, any objections?
bethy Resident: not realy
Mickorod Renard: I have a notecard
Kirin Writer: great
Kirin Writer: I guess it is some kind of formality
Huntress Selenium: i'm going to log out and come back
Kirin Writer: ty Mick
Huntress Selenium: i can only see hokon, and she's gone
Mickorod Renard: for sure, the chat log is recorded and posted on a public wiki
Mickorod Renard: we do edit some things, like bad language etc,,but otherwise its left as it is
Kirin Writer: nice
Mickorod Renard: its good fun reading the past logs,,as it takes place 4 times a day
Arisia Vita: wb Huntress
Kirin Writer: curiosity, what is "bad language"?
Mickorod Renard: well, just something we may presume to be offensive
Mickorod Renard: and bad spelling,he he
Kirin Writer laughs
Huntress Selenium: well, yea, now i see everyone but kirin, who's a cloud
arabella Ella: bad spelling mick?
arabella Ella: LOL
Mickorod Renard: yea
Kirin Writer: Just call me Whitey
Huntress Selenium: ok, Whitey
Mickorod Renard: grin
Kirin Writer: besides, you know what I look like
Huntress Selenium: You may call me Nakey
Huntress Selenium: So we're on to bad language?
Kirin Writer: no, I was just teasing poor Mick
Huntress Selenium: oh, okay
Kirin Writer: I believe he is using the American standard
Mickorod Renard: no point,we are quite articulate enough to be understood without it
Huntress Selenium: no 'u's in color and labor?
arabella Ella: the american standard, what is that?
Mickorod Renard: sound bollocks
Kirin Writer: it isnt bloody likely "bloody" will be considered foul language
Huntress Selenium: yeah, or calling a woman 'a cow'?
Mickorod Renard: we can use that if we say b***dy
Kirin Writer: lmao
arabella Ella: oh come on girls
arabella Ella: provoking poor young Mick now
arabella Ella: LOL
Huntress Selenium: oh, oh, i spoke too soon; i still can't see you Mick
Mickorod Renard: :)
Huntress Selenium: prolly cuz of ur foul language
Mickorod Renard: I am going home now anyway,I dont know who will edit the log
arabella Ella: maybe we should get back to philosophy safer ground?
arabella Ella loves philosophy
Mickorod Renard: ok,I will stand up and do a twirl for you
arabella Ella: LOL
arabella Ella: would look so sexy Mick
arabella Ella: a Micko twirl
Kirin Writer: Ty for your patience , Mick
Mickorod Renard: howz that?
Kirin Writer: nice meeting you
Mickorod Renard: your turn to do a twirl Huntress
Mickorod Renard: Kirin,we met a while ago
Mickorod Renard: and its my pleasure
Huntress Selenium: Mick, u r such a gentleman
Mickorod Renard: :)
arabella Ella giggles
Mickorod Renard: ok,,c ya
arabella Ella: bye Mick
Kirin Writer: brb
arabella Ella: i must go now am so tired tonight
arabella Ella: good night everyone and lovely to see you all!
Arisia Vita: break time for me as well
Huntress Selenium: nite ara!
Arisia Vita: back later...nice seeing you all
Huntress Selenium: hope to see you soon at some of Rhi's discussions
Ewan Bonham: Thank ou all...will see you soon..:)
arabella Ella: :)