2009.12.23 19:00 - Children Play

The Guardian for this meeting was stevenaia Michinaga. The comments are by stevenaia Michinaga.

stevenaia Michinaga: hello and thanks :)

stevenaia Michinaga: for taking my Sunday slot

Calvino Rabeni: Hello and YVW

stevenaia Michinaga: if you need any assistance with your guardian-ness, just let me know

stevenaia Michinaga: posting logs can be a trial sometimes

Calvino Rabeni: Ok, I think I know the drill, as long it isn't a whole class of (age bias removed )

Calvino Rabeni: NP with the logs

Calvino Rabeni: I was just thinking "i learned much in youth" :)

stevenaia Michinaga: I often think, when will youth end

--BELL--

Calvino Rabeni: It is never too late to have a happy childhood

stevenaia Michinaga: smiles

stevenaia Michinaga: do you see much of your childhood in your everyday life? the spirit of your youth

Calvino Rabeni: hmmm

stevenaia Michinaga: perhaps I refer to "Play", something you are supposed to loose as you "grow up"

Calvino Rabeni: do you have children

Calvino Rabeni: ?

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Calvino Rabeni: No

Calvino Rabeni: Not that I am aware of

Calvino Rabeni: Returning to your question, I've observed many of my early friends losing the Play

stevenaia Michinaga: I have seen many of my son's parents, much younger, appearing more "adult" in life than I

stevenaia Michinaga: son's friends parents, rather

Calvino Rabeni: And sometimes I ask them, do you think that adults become set in their ways, crystallized, unable to learn and be creative

Calvino Rabeni: And there are rationales presented for that point of view

Calvino Rabeni: The evidence is inconclusive

Calvino Rabeni: Some children act like adults at an early age

Calvino Rabeni: It may depend on size of family

stevenaia Michinaga: it is interesting what is lost when you tell someone to "grow up"

Calvino Rabeni: Or be part of character

Calvino Rabeni: Or be a response to the resources available in media

Calvino Rabeni: People do develop, but not from being told to do it

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: children become, not what the parent wants, but usually what the parent is

stevenaia Michinaga: easier to see in others

Calvino Rabeni: there have been some studies - I can't cite - on the view that parents are not as influential as they hope or fear in how their children become what they do

Calvino Rabeni: The best of parents have children who get into big trouble, for instance

stevenaia Michinaga: well there is intended influence and unintended influence

Calvino Rabeni: and influence from factors not within parents' control

Calvino Rabeni: and built-in ...

stevenaia Michinaga: of course

Calvino Rabeni: Some friends have wonderful children, others extremely difficult

Calvino Rabeni: And it seems independent of the care and effort they made

stevenaia Michinaga: perplexing isn't it

Calvino Rabeni: :)

Calvino Rabeni: bold measures are sometimes necessary

Calvino Rabeni: It is surprising, sad too, that parents feel they must make the moral choices without help, on their own resources

stevenaia Michinaga: well it has been done for centuries that way

stevenaia Michinaga: ask Gengis Kahn's parents

Calvino Rabeni: I didn't know them - but surely western individualism and freedom have isolated the parents more than in traditional cultures

Calvino Rabeni: as in the saying "it takes a village" to raise a child

Calvino Rabeni: my mother speaks of when the social fabric was thicker

stevenaia Michinaga: yes

Calvino Rabeni: children roamed more, had more friends, more freedom, less programmed lives

Calvino Rabeni: felt safer

Calvino Rabeni: made their own entertainment through inventive play

Calvino Rabeni: That sounds a bit like a "modern times" rant I suppose.

stevenaia Michinaga: free play happens less and less these days

Calvino Rabeni: Yes I agree

stevenaia Michinaga: it;s a very creative process

stevenaia Michinaga: boxes become space ships

stevenaia Michinaga: dirt becomes a city

Calvino Rabeni: now pixels become a city

Calvino Rabeni: In a way, access to pre-made information may not be good for the imaginative faculties

Calvino Rabeni: I admit to ignorance of what it is like in video-game culture

stevenaia Michinaga: I see it quite a bit

--BELL--

Calvino Rabeni: It's hard to speculate about the future of cultures

Calvino Rabeni: but I suppose it does some good

stevenaia Michinaga: it works for the weatherman

stevenaia Michinaga: and we know often they miss

stevenaia Michinaga: but they persist

Calvino Rabeni: I think the weatherman's future successes are not based on being wrong

Calvino Rabeni: but that is often true for cultural thinking

Calvino Rabeni: What intellectual horizons do you watch, Stevenaia?

stevenaia Michinaga: watch?

Calvino Rabeni: Yes, as in, attend to or have an interest in

stevenaia Michinaga: my work is most engaging, ever changing, adaptable, playful

stevenaia Michinaga: creative

Calvino Rabeni: is it focused, or does it have a wide purview?

Calvino Rabeni: Disciplines vary

stevenaia Michinaga: and for my mind/body I am learning tai CHi

Calvino Rabeni: Remember "geography"?

stevenaia Michinaga: it is focused on a wide purview :)

stevenaia Michinaga: but the focus is like a meditation,

stevenaia Michinaga: reminds me of PaB

Calvino Rabeni: tai chi and jazz have a lot in common

Calvino Rabeni: with PaB and phenomenology

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, all new yet familiar to me

Calvino Rabeni: There's a pretty good tai chi literature

Calvino Rabeni: but it doesn't make any sense unless one practices

stevenaia Michinaga: interesting thing about it there are many variations

stevenaia Michinaga: so the teacher keeps you returning

Calvino Rabeni: I've been asking people - where in their lives do they have a skill that involves improvisation

Calvino Rabeni: Tai Chi is preparation for that

stevenaia Michinaga: I suspect it will take years to get to that point, like jazz

Calvino Rabeni: No, it is best to do it immediately. However, mastery takes years

Calvino Rabeni: The jazz musicians study chords, theory

Calvino Rabeni: but also get "in the zone"

--BELL--

stevenaia Michinaga: yes, a nice place to be

stevenaia Michinaga: goals? it;s only been a year, feels I just stated

stevenaia Michinaga: It shouldn't but that aspect makes me uncomfortable

stevenaia Michinaga: unfortunately, I must go, looking forward to seeing you sunday

stevenaia Michinaga: thanks again