2009.12.22 01:00 - Seeing avatars

The Guardian for this meeting was Wester Kiranov. The comments are by Wester Kiranov.

I was a bit late because of computer problems and found Yakuzza Lethecus and Calvino Rabeni already there - although not fully rezzed. We took our time to get started up ourselves.

Yakuzza Lethecus: hey cal
Calvino Rabeni: Hi, Yaku-san
Calvino Rabeni: hmm, still rezzing to myself. You never quite know what SL will do
--BELL--
Yakuzza Lethecus: good morning wester
Wester Kiranov: hi cal
Calvino Rabeni: Wester, good morning
Yakuzza Lethecus: everyone got all presents ?
Yakuzza Lethecus: so christmas can come ?
Calvino Rabeni: This year I do not do the ritual
Wester Kiranov: my computer didn't feel like starting up this morning
Yakuzza Lethecus: i don´t turn my computer off often, but i know the technical issues when he´s not starting up often you have to disconnect the power supply in order to make it work, replug obviously :D
Wester Kiranov: I try to avoid restarting it, but this morning it was so sluggish that I had to
Wester Kiranov: brb
Calvino Rabeni: slow night, tech issues, interruptions ...
Wester Kiranov: back
Yakuzza Lethecus: wb
Yakuzza Lethecus: coffee or tea ?
Wester Kiranov: coffee, thanks
Wester Kiranov: still starting up myself :)
--BELL--
Yakuzza Lethecus: jep, i also need some coffee in the morning
Yakuzza Lethecus: i drink about 10 cups a day
Calvino Rabeni: is that regular or espresso strength?
Wester Kiranov: I drink too much of the black stuff too
Yakuzza Lethecus: just the regular
Yakuzza Lethecus: i only drink espresso in cafe´s sometimes
Calvino Rabeni: It is not hard to kick the habit - I have done that dozens of times :)
Wester Kiranov: :P

We talked a bit about the time workshop.

Yakuzza Lethecus: so to the time workshop, it´s still not clear which book comes next ?
Wester Kiranov: I'm not thinking about what comes next.
Calvino Rabeni: still a ways to go in the current book - it is 1/3 finished?
Wester Kiranov: Maybe we can do this one again after. It's agood one for re-reading
Calvino Rabeni: The second time I might understand it :)
Calvino Rabeni: I agree, could do it again
Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s just arriving for a few ppl, and i have to admit that i also don´t owe a copy so far.
Yakuzza Lethecus: so i was wondering if it still makes sense for me to grab this one
Wester Kiranov: Piet has a pdf file I think
Wester Kiranov: oops, pema
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, I gave him a html version, he can give it I think.
Calvino Rabeni: Do you have a digital copy from him?
Wester Kiranov: I don't I have a hard copy
Wester Kiranov: Held together by a lot of tape
Calvino Rabeni: BRB, technical issues
Wester Kiranov: wb cal

Qt came in too ...

Yakuzza Lethecus: morning qt
Calvino Rabeni: thanks, it is better this incarnation
Yakuzza Lethecus: how´s italy this morning ?
Qt Core: hi all
Wester Kiranov: hi qt
Qt Core: great as i'm home from work, not great as it took me more than 7 hours to drive 19 km yesterday
Qt Core: drive
Wester Kiranov: nice av qt. hope it's a bit comfy in there
Calvino Rabeni: Ah, Qt is still the block
Calvino Rabeni: Or is the av tucked inside?
Qt Core: everybody think that i'm in the cue ... i'm the cube ;-)
Wester Kiranov: there are no insides, didn't we learn that in the tsk session?
--BELL--
Qt Core: well techically speaking there is a "real" av all curled up inside the cube...

and the conversation moved seamlessly from his avatar to television.

Yakuzza Lethecus: hmm, i would prefer certain police boxes to live in, thinking of dr who :)
Wester Kiranov: maybe this box is bigger on the inside too
Qt Core: i think i would like dr. who, but he was never aired here in italy
Wester Kiranov: i am following him on the bbc. and sci fi channel
Yakuzza Lethecus: i love david tennand as the 10th doctor even when i have to admit that i never watched dr who before the new series
Wester Kiranov: same here :)
Calvino Rabeni: I don't have TV - I miss out :(
Qt Core: the changing of dr bodies, beyond being a lame excuse for changing the actor is an interesting exercise about identities ;-)
Wester Kiranov: it does take more time than I like
Wester Kiranov: but I'm not really following anything else. except torchwood, and that's a spinoff so it doesn't count
Calvino Rabeni: A lot of shows seem to be about identities these days
Qt Core: i own one but i'm in control of none ;-) so i end up watching very little
Wester Kiranov: what do you mean cal?
Calvino Rabeni: Programs on television that play with the idea that people could have different identities, "who am I really" questions
Qt Core: isn't all tv about medics and criminal scientific investigations ? ;-)
Calvino Rabeni: The seem increasing in popularity
Qt Core: and big brothers things ?
Wester Kiranov: I don't know what shows you mean cal
Calvino Rabeni: Yes of course, that is the format of the container, but all kinds of things get poured into it.
Yakuzza Lethecus: it´s at his peak right now as i believe, more and more ppl stepping away from watching regular tv
Calvino Rabeni: Well, Dollhouse is one
Calvino Rabeni: People change identities every time
Yakuzza Lethecus: and 3 parallel CSI´s alone can´t be increased further
Calvino Rabeni: Stargate was another that kept switching people
Yakuzza Lethecus: but i don´t watch crime shows anymore
Yakuzza Lethecus: oh, i have to admit i still watch stargate...
Qt Core: but ncis has quite the scientific dept, and bones and crossing jordan (i don't watch much i i keep in touch)
Calvino Rabeni: One time the people were replaced by artificial androids who thought they were real
Calvino Rabeni: and only found out later they were not
Calvino Rabeni: The writers seemed to play with the ideas from philosophy of consciousness
Calvino Rabeni: Red Dwarf did identity switches a lot
Qt Core: quantum leap anyone ? ;-)
Wester Kiranov: blade runner already hints at that, androids not knowing they are
Calvino Rabeni: Yes, another switcheroo example
Wester Kiranov: I read the book, only watched half the film
Wester Kiranov: the book is more philosophical than the film and still only scratches the surface
Yakuzza Lethecus: Did anyone see avatar so far ?
Wester Kiranov: no, but I might
Qt Core: no, i rarely go to the cinema... can't channelsurf there ;-)
Yakuzza Lethecus: It´s great in visual´s the story might not be the best but still provides with many topics which are discussable.
Wester Kiranov: I would like to go to the cinema more, but it's not that easy to get a babysit
Calvino Rabeni: Another older program is "The Pretender"
--BELL--
Qt Core: they called it just Jarod here, better title the english one
Calvino Rabeni: Right, better
Calvino Rabeni: The series "MI-5" what did the brits think of it?

We tried to discuss this in a more PaBlike way.

Wester Kiranov: does anyone else have the feeling we are going OT just a tiny little bit?
Qt Core: we never go OT here at PaB ;-)
Calvino Rabeni: OK, how would we do "TV Drama" in a PaB-compatible way :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: hmm, it seems we all have had our media addictions in the past or still
Yakuzza Lethecus: so i think it´s related to intoxication by the media
Qt Core: and/or how we hoped/feared world to be/would be
Wester Kiranov: .
Wester Kiranov: (so;llll\]=====r\====ry, that was the cat)
Wester Kiranov: and that too
Calvino Rabeni: For instance, how do you make the decision - to watch, or not to watch, that is the question
Yakuzza Lethecus: for me it´s often habitual to watch something, i obviously don´t have ,,a puprose in watching"
Qt Core: if it is a series the topic and trying a couple episodes, example i lice csi style stories but i hate CSI:all and like Bones
Yakuzza Lethecus: my main problem with media is that i can´t elaborate on ethical questions and other meta questions often even when there are hint´s in some more ,,intelligent shows"
Wester Kiranov: how would you like to elaborate then?
Yakuzza Lethecus: so i try to focus more on the ability to get more into philosophy itself in order to understand the fundermentals
Yakuzza Lethecus: not with the media addiction :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: but i still like many shows, and i still watch too much often
Qt Core: all in all i watch 2/4 hours a week plus motogp races
Yakuzza Lethecus: It´s just that kant,plato,aristotle... aren´t in the media with classics all over.
Calvino Rabeni: But they should be :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: There are trolley problems all over the media but nobody says ,,hey this is the trolely problem, let´s elaborate..."
Calvino Rabeni: I'm interested in Wester's comment
Wester Kiranov: if they were, they would be so popularised they wouldn't be on speaking terms with themselves.
Qt Core: thinking about a Young Aristotles adventures in intelligence series ;-)
Wester Kiranov: like the russell comic strip
Calvino Rabeni: Well, they had a lot of things on the line, other than ideas
Yakuzza Lethecus: or when a company is selling bad products and damage seems calculated everyone just say´s ,,evil company!" not that it´s an issue of business ethics
Calvino Rabeni: All the politics with Alexander the Great - would make a good story
Wester Kiranov: it does try to explain the russell paradox whichj is nice if you haven't heard about it yet
Yakuzza Lethecus: i would like to be able to understand things more differently
--BELL--
Calvino Rabeni: Ah, in that case, don't tell me :)
Yakuzza Lethecus: but things in life and media are very sterotype often while in reality they aren´t, silence now :)
Wester Kiranov: you like having the last word yaku;-)
Calvino Rabeni: TV = temptation, how about that equation?
Wester Kiranov: guys, i will have to leave pretty soon - have a lot of things to do this morning
Wester Kiranov: feel free to go on discussing, I'll just post the log
Yakuzza Lethecus: bye wester
Calvino Rabeni: Good day, Wester
Wester Kiranov: namaste
Qt Core: just a media, but the one that could more easily got under our skin and hook us
Wester Kiranov: bye
Qt Core: Bye Wester
Qt Core: the net may got it even easier but as we are a little more in control about what we get it doesn't (usually)
Calvino Rabeni: Information can be an addiction as easily as TV, I think
Calvino Rabeni: Or temptation, to use an older word
Calvino Rabeni: The makers of TV study how to get you hooked, of course
Qt Core: yes, but at some level it is better as it is (mostly) real while most of the intoxicating tv isn't
Calvino Rabeni: I used to think that
Qt Core: but ...
Calvino Rabeni: Now I think fact vs fiction is not the most important thing
Calvino Rabeni: after all, fiction is informative about many things
Calvino Rabeni: and facts can be of little relevance
Qt Core: yes, but for discovering those information in fiction you should be very "present" and being present not hooked
Calvino Rabeni: agree about that
Calvino Rabeni: but finding the true meaning of facts is a challenge too
Yakuzza Lethecus: i got to go bye qt, night cal
Qt Core: bye yak, have a nice day
Calvino Rabeni: Bye
--BELL--
Calvino Rabeni: Happy new season and returning-of-the-light, QT
Calvino Rabeni: BFNow